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jesterme2007
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Subaru named world's best automaker, Ford spirals quote:

http://ca.autos.yahoo.com/p/2434/su...omaker-ford-spi


Subaru earned the top score in Consumer Reports automaker report cards for 2012. Honda, which won the past four years, slipped to fourth. But the biggest slide belonged to Ford.

Riding a wave of impressive redesigned models in the last few years, Subaru for the first time has earned the top score in Consumer Reports automaker report cards for 2012. Meanwhile, Honda, which had been the perennial winner for the past four years, slipped two points to fourth place among 13 major automakers, behind Mazda and Toyota.

Subaru's score of 75-two points higher than last year-reflects better test scores for such redesigned models as the Impreza, Legacy, and Outback over the last few years. The 2012 Impreza, which Consumer Reports just tested, now tops the small-sedan class and is the Consumer Reports Top Pick in that category. Subaru's average road-test score of 82 is the highest in Consumer Reports analysis.

Honda has been hurt by several redesigned models-including the Civic and Odyssey-that didn't measure up to their predecessors. Honda models, however, are still among the most reliable on the road overall.

Toyota remains among the top three automakers for the fifth straight year, buoyed by consistently above-average reliability and most vehicles have high test scores.

"While Japanese automakers still hold the top five spots, their lead is shrinking. In some of Honda's and Toyota's recently redesigned models, cost-cutting has become more noticeable," said David Champion, senior director, Consumer Reports Automotive Test Center.

Among all automakers, Ford dropped the farthest, from fifth place last year to 10th. Ford's road-test score improved by two points over last year's, but subpar reliability of some new vehicles, due largely to the troublesome MyFord Touch infotainment system and Power-Shift automatic transmission, hurt its report-card grade.

"GM and Chrysler are building nicer cars with each redesign. Still, their scores are dragged down by several older designs that score low in Consumer Reports testing or have reliability issues," Champion said, "As more new products are introduced, their fortunes could change if they can improve their overall reliability."

Although Chrysler remains in last place, its overall score jumped eight points, making it the second most improved automaker.

Consumer Reports automaker report cards reflect the performance, comfort, utility, and reliability of more than 275 vehicles that CR recently rated, providing a perspective on which manufacturers are building the best all-around models. Each automaker's overall score is based on the average road test scores and reliability ratings for all of its models that CR has tested.

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Old Post 03-03-2012 12:09 AM
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Graham_A_M
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quote:

Consumer reports is the most biased, poorly written publication I've ever read. Having a bunch of analysts that review Blenders & Popcorn makers reviewing cars doesn't hold much sway to me.

The pro's & con's they list for each and every car they review I find to be not only in-accurate but quite laughable. I remember reading a complaint about the rear cupholders of a car. Like... really? So thats your "con" ? The rear cupholders dont "properly" hold a cup of coffee?
For the "Pro" of the exact same car they exclaimed it has 'nice headlights'.


Im more amazed people read that literary crap then anything.

Good for their choices as to whats best & whats not, it wont hold a pinch of influence towards anything I buy, nor will ever buy.

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Last edited by Graham_A_M on 03-03-2012 at 12:22 AM

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kaput
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Re: Subaru named world's best automaker, Ford spirals quote:

Originally posted by jesterme2007
Although Chrysler remains in last place, its overall score jumped eight points, making it the second most improved automaker.



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Old Post 03-03-2012 12:23 AM
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heavyD
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quote:

Originally posted by Graham_A_M
Consumer reports is the most biased, poorly written publication I've ever read. Having a bunch of analysts that review Blenders & Popcorn makers reviewing cars doesn't hold much sway to me.

The pro's & con's they list for each and every car they review I find to be not only in-accurate but quite laughable. I remember reading a complaint about the rear cupholders of a car. Like... really? So thats your "con" ? The rear cupholders dont "properly" hold a cup of coffee?
For the "Pro" of the exact same car they exclaimed it has 'nice headlights'.


Im more amazed people read that literary crap then anything.

Good for their choices as to whats best & whats not, it wont hold a pinch of influence towards anything I buy, nor will ever buy.



Yep. Consumer reports should stick to appliances and home electronics. Anyone that's driven or owned a Subaru knows there is no way in hell they are the best automaker.

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Old Post 03-03-2012 12:34 AM
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xnvy
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quote:

I always thought that Consumer Reports was the golden standard that magazines like Car & Driver and Autobild try to live up to.

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01RedDX
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quote:

Consumer Reports does not print outside advertising, accept free product samples, or permit the commercial use of its reviews for selling products. Its publisher states that this policy allows the magazine to "maintain our independence and impartiality... [so that] CU has no agenda other than the interests of consumers."



Biased bastards. They probably wasted a ton of money collecting data and scientific tests to conclude that Fords suck, when everyone already knew that anyway.

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Old Post 03-03-2012 02:18 AM
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Graham_A_M
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quote:

^ I find those guys to be in bed with the Japanese segment more then anything, very specifically Honda & Toyota. It doesn't matter what MotorTrend says nor proves or any common public knowledge or experience; if its by either two of those companies surely it HAS to be good right, particularly above EVERY competitive model by every other company? Of course!

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Old Post 03-03-2012 02:42 AM
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heavyD
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quote:

Originally posted by xnvy
I always thought that Consumer Reports was the golden standard that magazines like Car & Driver and Autobild try to live up to.



LOL Consumer Reports isn't the golden standard of television reviews let alone cars. Their new car reviews are completely useless to any person that knows cars as more than appliances.

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Hakkola
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quote:

I almost spit my drink out when I saw this thread, Subaru has some cool cars, but best automaker? I don't think so.

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xnvy
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quote:

Originally posted by heavyD


LOL Consumer Reports isn't the golden standard of television reviews let alone cars. Their new car reviews are completely useless to any person that knows cars as more than appliances.

It was a joke lol.

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quote:

Originally posted by heavyD


LOL Consumer Reports isn't the golden standard of television reviews let alone cars. Their new car reviews are completely useless to any person that knows cars as more than appliances.



CR loves cars that are most appliance like. Try true delta for some real world reliability ratings.

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xnvy
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quote:

Originally posted by corsvette


CR loves cars that are most appliance like. Try true delta for some real world reliability ratings.

Look at CR's list of "fun" cars... seriously disappointing.

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Old Post 03-03-2012 03:58 AM
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heavyD
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quote:

Originally posted by corsvette


CR loves cars that are most appliance like. Try true delta for some real world reliability ratings.



I know that. If CR was comparing beers and the best tasting beer by far in their opinion had a crappy twist off cap they would recommend an average tasting beer with the easiest cap to twist off. Their car picks are aimed the simplest, easiest, middle of the road, not the most rewarding or satisfying.

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Old Post 03-03-2012 06:42 AM
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quote:

so, question for you guys then. when you guys want to look for reviews on the cars you want to buy, what website do you frequent most? i look at that site when im looking at cars and ya, its laughable most of the time.

i never know what to expect from the internet as far as accurate reviews, so i read anything i can find on the cars im looking at. for exaample, i read 4 different websites about the SUV i picked up and 3 of them had the wrong horsepower ratings by a fucking mile(240 as opposed to the actual 283)...wtf??

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jesterme2007
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quote:

I have been using http://www.edmunds.com/ for a few years. I only read the consumer reviews ...don't really pay attention to the editors reviews at all.

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Old Post 03-03-2012 06:20 PM
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Graham_A_M
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quote:

Originally posted by 03ozwhip
so, question for you guys then. when you guys want to look for reviews on the cars you want to buy, what website do you frequent most? i look at that site when im looking at cars and ya, its laughable most of the time.

i never know what to expect from the internet as far as accurate reviews, so i read anything i can find on the cars im looking at. for exaample, i read 4 different websites about the SUV i picked up and 3 of them had the wrong horsepower ratings by a fucking mile(240 as opposed to the actual 283)...wtf??



I Like Motortrend & Edmunds, but I also watch the general consensus on forums such as this to see what people are saying. Personal experience plays a big role too. I always pay attention to recalls, public & automotive journal reviews and more or less make my decision based on those.

One thing that really blew my mind was when CR did a review on a some cars & trucks I knew extremely well. They rated them as "very unreliable" among many other bad traits, because (not surprisingly) it wasn't from a Japanese manufacturer.

Every Pro & Con they listed was way off the mark, and considering the fleet of vehicles I was in charge of had (collectively) 2.5 million kms on the lot of them; I found their unreliability comments about those models as out to lunch as they come. Not a single one of them ever broke down the 7 years I was there, nor did they way before I started working there. But of course, their Ford right; so SURELY their very unreliable.

Some of these vehicles were driven extremely (*insanely*) hard, far beyond what the public would ever use them for yet still; no problems.

Im sure they'd have nothing but good things to say there were Toyota badges on them instead.

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Last edited by Graham_A_M on 03-03-2012 at 07:15 PM

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heavyD
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quote:

Originally posted by jesterme2007
I have been using http://www.edmunds.com/ for a few years. I only read the consumer reviews ...don't really pay attention to the editors reviews at all.



Edmunds is pretty good as they do long term road tests where they continuously update and unlike CR they don't play favourites and they actually do performance comparisons as well.

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Old Post 03-03-2012 07:08 PM
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heavyD
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quote:

Originally posted by Graham_A_M

Im sure they'd have nothing but good things to say there were Toyota badges on them instead.



Well CR did effectively bury Isuzu (Japanese) sending them out of the US market with the irrepairable damage they did with their flawed Trooper tests where they claimed the vehicle was unsafe. It went to court and while CR didn't have to pay damages they also didn't escape unscathed;

In the eighth, in which Consumers Union had said that the cars should never have been allowed on the road, the jury found that Consumers Union had spoken with reckless disregard for the truth.



CR like to flex its muscles and influence the industry rather than simply provide unbiased reviews. That's why I disregard their ratings as a whole. There's always a power play in everything they do. It's pretty clear they are attempting to prop up Subaru. Why? I don't know but one can bet that there's behind the scenes changing of hands. I mean Subaru does very well in their little AWD niche but their vehicles are low tech, low on features, weak interior and poor exterior quality, extremely average engines. Anointing them the best automaker in the world is kind of a slap in the face to some of the more esteemed automakers that strive to put out high tech, high quality cars.

Last edited by heavyD on 03-03-2012 at 07:22 PM

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Old Post 03-03-2012 07:16 PM
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Graham_A_M
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quote:

^ Yeah They've been a bit hard on Mazda, Mitsu & Isuzu. Still not nearly as hard and anal as other makes such as the GM or whatever.

Still pisses me off none the less.

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Canmorite
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quote:

Originally posted by heavyD


Yep. Consumer reports should stick to appliances and home electronics. Anyone that's driven or owned a Subaru knows there is no way in hell they are the best automaker.



Man, it took you 3 posts to bash Subaru in a Subaru thread? Disappointed

I guess they didn't include paint quality in that review.

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