Advice? - Builders lien by sub for garage built by Shaw Renovation & Construction

[lilmira]

Do you usually have hold back on you Dave? Tiles are not exactly cheap. Not saying you would skip paying the supplier but what else can the owner do to protect himself?

[C_Dave45]

Originally posted by lilmira
Do you usually have hold back on you Dave? Tiles are not exactly cheap. Not saying you would skip paying the supplier but what else can the owner do to protect himself?

Most builders will hold back 10%. But I won't deliver material until it's paid for. I used to, but it's risky enough giving a builder 10 or 20 thousand dollars worth of labour and hoping to get paid...never mind adding roughly the same amount for tile. No, tile is all COD.

But for the labour, on big builders it's always "net 30". And depending when their "cut off" is, that can be up to 60 days before I get paid. I don't invoice until the job is finished. So say their cut-off is the 15th. So I'll invoice then, and get a cheque on the following 15th. If it's a big job, I might have started a month earlier...so it's 60 days before I see any money.

Small jobs, it's "due upon completion".

But further to your question: It's tricky for both parties. I've done jobs on private homes where I invoice the builder. He's not paid me, and I usually wait 30 days. If I get "that feeling", I'll contact the homeowner and warn him "I haven't been paid yet....if your contractor doesn't pay me within two weeks, I'll be leining the job". That gets the homeowner on the contractors back, and gives him a heads up not to pay out the contractor.

[blitz]

Let's work on push this thread up the ranking on google.

It's un-acceptable to hold back payment on your job due to issues on another.




Shaw Renovations Calgary

Shaw Renovations Calgary Problems

Shaw Renovations Screwing me over

Shaw Renovations Doesn't Pay Sub Contractors

[malbadon]

Originally posted by Sal0
Why not file a complaint to the Better Business Bureau? They seem to have a good rating, so it will likley be worth their while to fix this.

Thanks, have filed, will see what that does.

Originally posted by 88CRX


So Shaw Renovations is holding back payment to a sub on your garage because of issue on other projects/garages? Or am I reading that wrong?

Your not wrong, basically the sub got handed one big cheque for 7 jobs including mine, then deposited it and had it stop-payment'd. So he's been screwed over on a big amount of $$, not just my job, thus he has liens on all the jobs since he hasn't been paid for any.

Originally posted by AndyL
Did that comment about due to another job happen to be via non verbal?

sadly was over the phone the one and only time we were able to have a conversation with Jon back in October when this first happened.

Thanks for all the advise so far, basically what I'd been assuming sadly. I'm usually the popcorn muncher during these stories....not used to actually being the story.

[C_Dave45]

Originally posted by malbadon


Thanks, have filed, will see what that does.

Absolutely nothing. BBB means nothing now days.

Originally posted by malbadon

sadly was over the phone the one and only time we were able to have a conversation with Jon back in October when this first happened.

Uhh...wait. When was the lien put in place? And when was this guys last day on the job? He has to file within 45 days of his last day of work. Even one day after that and the lien is not valid.

[lilmira]

This is a sticky situation for sure. Do keep us posted. I like to know about good businesses as well as the bad ones.

[Amysicle]

Originally posted by C_Dave45

Absolutely nothing. BBB means nothing now days. [/B]

Yeah but if it helps accurately portray the way Shaw Renovations and how they resolve issues they've caused, it will help future clients to avoid picking them.


Shaw Renovations Calgary

Shaw Renovations Calgary Problems

Shaw Renovations Screwing me over

Shaw Renovations Doesn't Pay Sub Contractors

[C_Dave45]

^ For the life of me, I couldn't seem to find them in the BBB's website. Anyone have a BBB link for their rating?

[spikerS]

Well, it looks like I was proven wrong. Don't tell Baygirl. But it is good to learn new things!

Originally posted by C_Dave45






Uhh...wait. When was the lien put in place? And when was this guys last day on the job? He has to file within 45 days of his last day of work. Even one day after that and the lien is not valid. [/B]

I was wondering that too. assuming a completion date of October 31st, he could not put the lien on the house after December 15th. If it was any time after that, the lien is not valid...

[spikerS]

Originally posted by malbadon
All was great until a month after it was done when the concrete sub filed a builders lien

well, i guess there is our answer.

[C_Dave45]

Originally posted by spikers


well, i guess there is our answer.

Ahhh....lol. Helps if I read the OP a little more carefully.
Thank you sir.

[malbadon]

Originally posted by C_Dave45
^ For the life of me, I couldn't seem to find them in the BBB's website. Anyone have a BBB link for their rating?

http://www.bbb.org/calgary/business-...lgary-ab-35862


A+ rating, don't ask me... I honestly don't understand what is going on with Shaw Renovation. Still not a returned call or reply, screwing over the homeowner to keep a few extra bucks seems to be the new modus operandi...

[AndyL]

They forked over 500$ annually for a bbb membership, that's all that is required to have a good rating with the bbb...

[JustinMCS]

Originally posted by AndyL
They forked over 500$ annually for a bbb membership, that's all that is required to have a good rating with the bbb...

+1

BBB is a giant waste of time and is basically an advertising directory.

[malbadon]

Well the BBB thing at least kicked the hornets nest. No call but did get emailed a copy of a letter Jon from Shaw Renovation was sending me and one he was sending the contractor.

Basically my letter covers that he has issues with the work of the last job the guy did, requires repair, advises that he is committed to getting the liens removed from our houses and tells me going to the BBB won't get this sped up (no, but it sure did get you to finally email me...).

Letter to the sub basically says what is wrong with the work and what he expects done to at the site to reissue him a cheque for all the outstanding jobs.
(Of course from when I talked to the sub I recall him saying he had pictures of the site and it was fine, some I'm sure this thing is going to drag on forever...)

So other than the fact that I still don't think he has a right to not pay this guy for the jobs that were done right and still being ticked at the fact it took this much effort to finally get a response, it does sound like he's committed to getting this resolved, however long that takes... (and now I have it in writing).

/sigh

[blitz]

Keep going with the BBB until this is resolved, sounds like its something he values.

[FraserB]

Is there any way for you to track down the other owners that the sub placed liens against? Having multiple complaints show up at the BB and on their site might motivate him.

I would send an email to both the contractor and the sub saying that the issue will be refered to a lawyer unless they both meet with you to figure out your situation.

Have you looked into having the lien removed as AndyL mentioned now that you have him admitting that the lien was placed becuase of another job?

[AndyL]

Originally posted by blitz
Keep going with the BBB until this is resolved, sounds like its something he values.

BBB is now satisfied, he's a member and he's responded to the complaint, now his rating won't go down...

Now pull out the lawyer referral service, get some free consultations

[Lex350]

My cousin went throught a similar situation. The contractor didn't pay the sub-contractor so the sub out a lien on the house. My cousin then paid the sub to get the lien removed (he was selling the house) and then took the contracotr to court. I won his money plus damages but it was a big big hassle. Just the way it is here.

[malbadon]

Thought I'd just give this one some closure.

After I started this thread end up running into the sub while I'm out bar-crawling. awkward.

The next week in January we got cc'd on a letter sent to the sub saying they wanted the work at this other property fixed by April 15, and a letter to us saying there was no need to involve the BBB or talk to the sub. Apparently there'd been a death in the family over x-mas, thus the lack of getting back to us.

End of Jan we asked if they'd heard back from the sub confirming if he was complying or not. We got an email back stating we were not being patient enough (note, we are at month 4 now) and to stop involving the BBB, it was..colorful.

Replied back reiterating that they'd been paid in full and I had no intention of ending my BBB complaint until the lien is removed and a reminder that I was the injured party, not them. I was as forceful as I get, what being a non-confrontational wuss.

Didn't really hear anything more on it, BBB noted they were closing this unresolved and I got really busy Feb/Mar, until two weeks ago when the BBB emailed me asking if I'd heard anything after the April 15th deadline given to the sub.

So I sent an email and cc'd the BBB person asking for an update and got back an awesome ragemail! Called me stupid, how dare I keep the BBB involved, I was not be cooperative or understanding during this time of bereavement and that I better never call them in the future if I had reason to require them (hey, guess this means my "1 year warranty" is useless, *shock*).

Last line stated it had been more than 180 days and the lien was removed. I guess this means nothing got resolved between them all but some magical timeframe has lapsed where the sub didn't renew it (know autosm mentioned a year, guess its 180).

So I dunno, in the end (assuming the lien really is gone, will have to check that) I'm out nothing but 7 months of annoyance, have an interesting story to tell and know one contractor that will never be suggested by me to a soul I know.