Quantcast
TEDTALKS: T. Boone Pickens: Let's transform energy -- with natural gas (VIDEO) - Beyond.ca - Car Forums
Page 1 of 2 1 2 LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 29

Thread: TEDTALKS: T. Boone Pickens: Let's transform energy -- with natural gas (VIDEO)

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Location
    YYC
    Posts
    1,043
    Rep Power
    0

    Default TEDTALKS: T. Boone Pickens: Let's transform energy -- with natural gas (VIDEO)

    Good idea overall as a bridge solution while we figure out the next best idea. He makes an interesting case for natural gas.


  2. #2
    Join Date
    May 2002
    Location
    The White Ghetto
    My Ride
    Altima Se-R
    Posts
    2,360
    Rep Power
    27

    Default

    He had a really good interview on The Daily Show and he's gotten me interested since. He also used to live in Calgary for awhile, but that was a long time ago and completely irrelevant.
    sig deleted by moderator, click here for info

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Calgary, Alberta
    My Ride
    Bicycle
    Posts
    9,271
    Rep Power
    49

    Default

    He has been pushing for quite awhile. Didn't watch the video but I think getting the trucks converted is a great idea. But key is that we need stable prices. Price is low right now but it may screw with business if it doubles tomorrow.
    Last edited by Xtrema; 03-19-2012 at 10:00 PM.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Jun 2002
    Location
    Calgary
    My Ride
    2008 Z06
    Posts
    3,581
    Rep Power
    39

    Default

    Love that talk.
    Current Cars:
    2019 BMW X3 M40i Stage 2, 12.44 at 110mph
    1972 Chevy Super Cheyenne C10 Pickup 402 big block, 700R4
    2004 GMC 2500HD 8.1L

    Past Cars:
    1970 Chevy Blazer, 2wd
    2003 BMW X5 4.6IS Doushmobile, moneypit
    2015 Ford Fiesta ST | Cobb Stage 1, catless downpipe
    2008 Corvette Z06 - 11.39 at 123.8mph
    2002 Corvette Z06 - 12.10 at 116.5mph
    2005 Jeep Wrangler LJ
    1993 5L Mustang - 12.59 at 108mph
    1989 5L Mustang
    1990 Jeep Cherokee
    1991 Acura Integra RS 403Honda

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Jul 2002
    Location
    calgary, alberta, canada
    My Ride
    Faux X 4 Mall Crawler
    Posts
    5,678
    Rep Power
    42

    Default

    He tried the same talk with wind until it wasn't financially viable for big returns. I remember he was on the daily show a few years ago saying wind would save us all. If natural gas prices go up, how long until he is back to saying "crude is our savior"
    sig deleted by moderator, because they are useless

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Location
    YYC
    Posts
    1,043
    Rep Power
    0

    Default

    Originally posted by finboy
    He tried the same talk with wind until it wasn't financially viable for big returns. I remember he was on the daily show a few years ago saying wind would save us all. If natural gas prices go up, how long until he is back to saying "crude is our savior"
    He addresses this in the talk, in the Q/A section. And no I am not giving you the answer.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Jul 2002
    Location
    calgary, alberta, canada
    My Ride
    Faux X 4 Mall Crawler
    Posts
    5,678
    Rep Power
    42

    Default

    I watched it, his q&a session was mOre unconvincing than his talk, probably Part of why it is getting rated so poorly on Ted.com
    sig deleted by moderator, because they are useless

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Location
    Calgary
    My Ride
    ////M
    Posts
    1,596
    Rep Power
    23

    Default

    I will watch this tonight, but just in case he never mentioned it in the video, he is the owner of Clean Energy Fuels which builds natural gas fueling stations. ie. might be biased towards the use of NG
    Quote Originally Posted by DonJuan View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Yo bro, are you from that goat Calgary car forum that get salty over lawn care, land rovers and circumcisions? That's straight fire.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Jun 2003
    Location
    YWG
    Posts
    3,119
    Rep Power
    24

    Default

    Originally posted by finboy
    I watched it, his q&a session was mOre unconvincing than his talk, probably Part of why it is getting rated so poorly on Ted.com
    It is being rated poorly because TED watchers don't like two things.

    - FRACing
    - Making money

    Something that T. Boone Pickens does both of.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    Only 15min from Aspen!
    My Ride
    Nothing interesting anymore
    Posts
    8,406
    Rep Power
    100

    Default

    Originally posted by Euro_Trash
    I will watch this tonight, but just in case he never mentioned it in the video, he is the owner of Clean Energy Fuels which builds natural gas fueling stations. ie. might be biased towards the use of NG
    He does mention he owns a lot of stock in NG, and he lost a lot of money in wind power. Sputnik called it right.

    I am curious though, how he got his numbers from converting Heavy Duty vehicles. Did it include everything, such as the power loss, and therefore smaller loads/more heavy vehicles required, etc.

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Calgary, Alberta
    My Ride
    Bicycle
    Posts
    9,271
    Rep Power
    49

    Default

    Originally posted by Tik-Tok
    I am curious though, how he got his numbers from converting Heavy Duty vehicles. Did it include everything, such as the power loss, and therefore smaller loads/more heavy vehicles required, etc.
    I think that's just a high level selling point. If you read most studies by transit authorities, switching to natural gas never made sense unless carbon credit is in play. NG cost way more than diesel fleets.

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Sep 2002
    Location
    Valladolid, Spain
    My Ride
    Boeing, Airbus
    Posts
    1,595
    Rep Power
    49

    Default

    Originally posted by Xtrema


    I think that's just a high level selling point. If you read most studies by transit authorities, switching to natural gas never made sense unless carbon credit is in play. NG cost way more than diesel fleets.
    Links to studies?

    Tough to believe that when AECO / Henry Hub is trading at $2, and WTI is $106, that NG won't be cheaper for a long time. Factoring in a 6:1 energy differential, we're then looking at $12 to $106. Gas prices would need to increase nearly 900% to catch up to oil right now.

    I understand there are additional costs / energy inefficiencies associated with gas, but 10x? Doubtful.

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Location
    Calgary
    Posts
    45
    Rep Power
    0

    Default

    I think Pickens has some really smart ideas, but he comes off a bit arrogant and condenscending in this presentation.

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    The Peoples Republic of Albertastan
    Posts
    5,245
    Rep Power
    20

    Default

    .
    Last edited by Cos; 01-01-2017 at 07:55 PM.
    Originally posted by adam c

    Line goes up, line goes down, line does squiggly things and fucks Alberta
    "The stone age didn't end because we ran out of stones"

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Sorrow
    My Ride
    Hatred
    Posts
    3,608
    Rep Power
    22

    Default

    That was a grat little speach he had there. While he does own stocks etc in NG he does make all the right points too. This whole getting off of fossil fuels shit really isn't going to do any good until someone comes up with a viable solution, and if that isn't happening anytime soon we should really be looking at ways to make due with that fuel sources we have available.
    -U

  16. #16
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Calgary, Alberta
    My Ride
    Bicycle
    Posts
    9,271
    Rep Power
    49

    Default

    Originally posted by davidI


    Links to studies?

    Tough to believe that when AECO / Henry Hub is trading at $2, and WTI is $106, that NG won't be cheaper for a long time. Factoring in a 6:1 energy differential, we're then looking at $12 to $106. Gas prices would need to increase nearly 900% to catch up to oil right now.

    I understand there are additional costs / energy inefficiencies associated with gas, but 10x? Doubtful.
    What's cheap is CNG. LNG is a refined product like gasoline. There isn't much saving there.

    C in CNG is compressed. You'll need a bigger tank and carry more weight. I'm not sure if tech had improved but MTA report showed that CNG buses loses about 2 passenger capacity compared to diesel.

    http://www1.eere.energy.gov/vehicles...003_lowell.pdf

    Turn to page 15 and 17 for maintenance items. CNG buses cost more to maintain. While I'm sure CNG is way cheaper now than 2003 but cost of hardware is high.

  17. #17
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Location
    YYC
    Posts
    1,043
    Rep Power
    0

    Default

    It is a bridge solution as he says, might be good for a few decades; buys some time until we figure out a better solution. Frankly the current climate is just moving money and wars over to the OPEC areas. How's this been working for us as a society so far?

    At his age and wealth level, I doubt he cares much about money. Another billion is not going to buy him another week of life and he is smart enough to know this. Read the Wiki bio, he has given a massive amount of money away to universities and hospitals, etc.
    Last edited by CanmoreOrLess; 03-20-2012 at 08:45 PM.

  18. #18
    Join Date
    Sep 2002
    Location
    Valladolid, Spain
    My Ride
    Boeing, Airbus
    Posts
    1,595
    Rep Power
    49

    Default

    Originally posted by Xtrema


    What's cheap is CNG. LNG is a refined product like gasoline. There isn't much saving there.

    C in CNG is compressed. You'll need a bigger tank and carry more weight. I'm not sure if tech had improved but MTA report showed that CNG buses loses about 2 passenger capacity compared to diesel.

    http://www1.eere.energy.gov/vehicles...003_lowell.pdf

    Turn to page 15 and 17 for maintenance items. CNG buses cost more to maintain. While I'm sure CNG is way cheaper now than 2003 but cost of hardware is high.
    Decade old study?

    EnCana shows a reasonable payback period.
    EnCana Study

    When I compared WTI to AECO/HH, they're both 'unrefined'. Not sure how you're saying there isn't much saving there. NG doesn't really need to be 'refined' anyways - it can flow through a separator and be compressed into CNG. A lot cheaper than piping crude to a refinery and then trucking out gasoline & diesel. LNG isn't 'refined' either, it's just cooled to -160C.

    Cost-effectiveness
    TIAX LLC developed a thorough cost comparison report comparing 2010 year heavy-duty commercial diesel and natural gas vehicles. The financial model predicts that the break-even points for CNG for a refuse hauler, transit bus, and short haul heavy-duty truck are $22 barrel, $31 per barrel, and $28 per barrel of crude oil, respectively, in 2010 world oil prices. The world oil price per barrel * has been above $40 in most weeks since early 2005.

    Significant co-funding opportunities may be available from a variety of sources to assist consumers with the purchase of NGVs or the construction of CNG fueling stations.

    High performance
    NGVs often deliver similar horsepower ratings to their diesel and gasoline-powered counterparts. Premium gasoline is 91 octane. Natural gas has an octane rating of approximately 130. This higher octane allows for increased engine compression and combustion efficiency. Because of the clean burning attributes of natural gas, NGVs generally have longer engine life compared to most gasoline-powered vehicles.
    Linky


    Also, with Shale Gas in the East, NG is now close to populated markets and trucking routes.
    Last edited by davidI; 03-20-2012 at 10:46 PM.

  19. #19
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    Pallet Town
    Posts
    809
    Rep Power
    0

    Default

    Natural gas fluctuates too much in price.

    Sure it might be $2.15 per MMBTU today, but one shouldn't forget that it was over $15 just a few years ago.

    I see NG fueled cars to be exactly the same as propane powered cars. Initially, you will have some people that get on early and get cheap energy - but by the time it starts gaining momentum, the price rises to meet or exceed gasoline making it a near worthless endeavor.

    http://www.wheels.ca/Columnists/article/793763

    Besides the fact that you have to spend money to double the infrastructure to support multiple dispensers. It would be a massive undertaking, and in the end may not save any money or resources at all.
    0.5 gram microsd delivered by 12,000 pound combustion vehicle and driver.

  20. #20
    Join Date
    Sep 2002
    Location
    Valladolid, Spain
    My Ride
    Boeing, Airbus
    Posts
    1,595
    Rep Power
    49

    Default

    NG prices were high because there was less supply than demand in the past. Companies were even trying to recover gas from coal seams, an expensive process.



    Frac technologies and shale gas has changed that. Natural gas reserves in the US are massive now. The only thing I can see forcing the price in the future is increased public backlash against fracing and laws or regulations preventing shale gas from being developed.

    I don't necessarily see CNG as being the answer for passenger vehicles, but neither does Pickens. Heavy Trucks & Fleet Vehicles would make a huge difference alone.

Page 1 of 2 1 2 LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. Energy board approves 40% hike in natural gas

    By kobe tai in forum Real Estate / Finance
    Replies: 1
    Latest Threads: 03-29-2014, 09:36 AM
  2. F**k your gigapixel camera - tedtalks

    By syritis in forum Society / Law / Current Events / Politics
    Replies: 2
    Latest Threads: 08-17-2012, 12:59 PM
  3. T. Boone Pickens Loses $33 Million Death Bet (who thinks like this?)

    By CanmoreOrLess in forum Society / Law / Current Events / Politics
    Replies: 4
    Latest Threads: 03-21-2012, 09:06 AM
  4. Watch me transform the gixxer!

    By TurboMedic in forum Bike Talk
    Replies: 29
    Latest Threads: 06-17-2007, 04:18 PM
  5. Can someone help me transform this car PLZ!!

    By teg_star in forum Photoshop Gallery
    Replies: 10
    Latest Threads: 05-14-2003, 05:53 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •