Earls.67 implementing a mandatory 16% hospitality charge.

[Mitsu3000gt]

Originally posted by jwslam

^ has not worked in a customer service job where people get pissed at you for things out of your control.

I have for many years, and I was making $7/hr for it at the peak. Fact of the matter is literally anyone could do the job with no experience or education - IMHO that justifies the minimal compensation. Everyone puts in their time with a crappy job like that, and ideally makes it to something better.

I probably would stop tipping for all but the best service if servers start making $15/hr, especially since restaurants will probably raise prices to compensate. If people keep giving 20%, not only is the server making a much higher base rate, but their percentage based tips will be higher as well due to the higher menu prices - quality of service in Calgary will go down even further, if that's even possible, because the server's minimum guaranteed pay will be WAY higher so there will be no incentive to even try.

As for mandatory tipping charges like the OP, what happens if your service is crap? (quality of service only goes down with mandatory charges) Do you have to call over a manager and make a big deal about it? Very few people are going to do that, and would much prefer to simply leave a smaller tip/no tip. It just guarantees more money for the restaurant.

[max_boost]

do a minimum 5% tip to cover the tip out and leave it at that. consumers are used to getting dinged anyway.

[colinxx235]

I'm assuming something will change with minimum wage here. My experience is with earls, joeys, keg personally and then friends/ex's worked at other places which only difference is tipout % really.

But in the last 10 years min wage as gone from 7.50? 8? iirc? and will approach 15.
Earls/Joeys have had a 5.5 -> 6.25 - 7.25 ish % tipout (earls tin is very high). In that time the price of quite a few dishes has gone up probably between 30-50% on most dishes and maybe more in some cases. This also gets countered with them constantly reducing portion sizes in between price increases to distract.

That chain is pretty greedy in terms of what it wants to see for profits, hence such a high tipout system as they use it as a built in for manager/leaders/kitchen/support staff wages. So with wage going up as significant as they have more than likely so will the prices. As was, I used to want to throw up at what some of the lounge girls pull in for tips, it makes your head shake. Funny how many of them would get a degree in bcomm or w/e and come back after realising that taking a 50% paycut to work in an office sucked. Or plenty still worked part time shifts just because the cash was that good.

This designated 16% is very odd as lots of the girls there used to bitch about "only 15/18%" at times. Maybe with the downturn they are experiencing more no tips or dine and dash etc and the staff aren't happy with it and finally reformatting the system? The only way to really beat it is to go out less. As leaving a no tip in a social setting is quite the faux pas in our society

[max_boost]

hot girls are recession proof? yes? no? lol

[Neil4Speed]

Originally posted by Mitsu3000gt

As for mandatory tipping charges like the OP, what happens if your service is crap? (quality of service only goes down with mandatory charges) Do you have to call over a manager and make a big deal about it? Very few people are going to do that, and would much prefer to simply leave a smaller tip/no tip. It just guarantees more money for the restaurant.

Its actually better for everyone I think. Good for the restaurant as they get some feedback on how to improve, gives them the opportunity to "make it right" (by comping, gift card etc) which in the end is better for the person dining. Leaving a bad tip is just passive aggressive in its message and doesn't permit for any resolution.

I like this initiative, lots.

Originally posted by max_boost
hot girls are recession proof? yes? no? lol

From my Stampede observations this weekend, yes.

[Mitsu3000gt]

Originally posted by Neil4Speed


Its actually better for everyone I think. Good for the restaurant as they get some feedback on how to improve, gives them the opportunity to "make it right" (by comping, gift card etc) which in the end is better for the person dining. Leaving a bad tip is just passive aggressive in its message and doesn't permit for any resolution.

I like this initiative, lots.

What do you think will happen to the quality of service though? The quality of service (which is already pretty terrible at many Calgary restaurants compared to elsewhere in the world) will go even lower when servers have no incentive to perform above minimum standards since their guaranteed base wages (soon to be $15) AND tips are secured? I don't feel like forcing people to tip 16% is a good solution personally.

[msommers]

Originally posted by max_boost
hot girls are recession proof? yes? no? lol

Absolutely yes lol.

[msommers]

Originally posted by Mitsu3000gt


What do you think will happen to the quality of service though? The quality of service (which is already pretty terrible at many Calgary restaurants compared to elsewhere in the world) will go even lower when servers have no incentive to perform above minimum standards since their guaranteed base wages (soon to be $15) AND tips are secured? I don't feel like forcing people to tip 16% is a good solution personally.

It's honestly hard to say what will happen. I don't think things will magically go to absolute shit over night or at all. Some people still care about their minimum wage job (to varying degrees) even if tips were never part of the equation but still have to put up with people's bullshit.

I would guess that there would be an initial spike of turn-over and then things would settle. Business owners aren't going to put up with super lazy workers. As you've said, there are more or less no prerequisites to be a server, so there are plenty of others who would be willing to take over those positions.

I'm always surprised how much girls who've worked at Cactus, Earls, Joeys etc complain about how they get treated like meat, have to wear short skirts, wear heels for 6+ hours and yet still work there willingly as if there are no other jobs. It's basically selling your body for money but in a "classier" way than being a stripper!

[C_Dave45]

Originally posted by Mitsu3000gt


What do you think will happen to the quality of service though? The quality of service (which is already pretty terrible at many Calgary restaurants compared to elsewhere in the world) will go even lower when servers have no incentive to perform above minimum standards since their guaranteed base wages (soon to be $15) AND tips are secured? I don't feel like forcing people to tip 16% is a good solution personally.

^^THIS!!

I don't want to drop 16% for crappy service. I'll gladly tip more when I get a great server. Compared to the service industry in places where jobs are scarce, our service here is terrible! The whole time I was in San Diego, everyone from the 50 year old working at Denny's to the doorman at the resort gave absolutely amazing service!

For this reason alone I will refuse to go to that restaurant. I don't think it will stick.

[RealJimmyJames]

I will go there just to see how the service works out. I would prefer a flat fee than the current system. I would prefer that this becomes successful and is emulated around the province.

Will see how the service is though. If the management can get servers to buy into the concept, it could be great. I've heard of some higher end places that give benefits and paid vacations to their serving and kitchen staff. Seems to me you'd end up with some true professionals. Sure, the management would need to perform some kind of performance appraisal and review, but that's difficult in every business, and not impossible in a restaurant.

[msommers]

My GF brought this up tonight and also thought that nothing will really change. But something I didn't really think about is if minimum wage goes to $15 and no one tips anymore, servers will be pissed and not give a shit about service. She was saying that on a very average night when she started at Boston Pizza, making $20/hr after tips was normal. When she worked at the pub, it could be $35-40+ on a weekend evening. Then consider how much of that money is untaxed...For bringing drinks and food. Boggles my mind, but anyways.

Interestingly, she thought opposite on how I felt about them more or less avoiding taxes. Admittedly making a general statement by her, a lot of server staff are students and would be making even less money with no tips and extra taxes. Maybe if more tuition was subsidised it wouldn't impact their debt load as much? Maybe the tax breaks given to students could increase instead?

I dunno, different mindset than mine for sure.

[dirtsniffer]

Anyone who thinks servers get paid what they deserve is obviously in the industry.

[spikerS]

I think everyone in this thread has missed the point here.

If I understand it right, the article states that at Earls.67 (where is this anyways?) will have menus priced at 16% higher than that of other Earls location during this test. In return, they are increasing the wages of the staff there by some amount, but they don't say by how much.

I think a lot of you are confused, thinking that this 16% is an automatic tip, when it's not, it is just a bump to their hourly wage, which of course gets reported to revenue canada...

IE: bill at Earls on 16th ave would be $100 with your server making $10/hour, and then you add your tip versus, your bill at Earls.67 would be $116 with no tip and your server makes $11.60/hour..

[dirtsniffer]

A coworker of mine is familiar with the situation and the restaurant expects the servers to make around $25 an hour.

[Sugarphreak]

...

[C_Dave45]

Originally posted by spikerS
I think everyone in this thread has missed the point here.

If I understand it right, the article states that at Earls.67 (where is this anyways?) will have menus priced at 16% higher than that of other Earls location during this test. In return, they are increasing the wages of the staff there by some amount, but they don't say by how much.

I think a lot of you are confused, thinking that this 16% is an automatic tip, when it's not, it is just a bump to their hourly wage, which of course gets reported to revenue canada...

IE: bill at Earls on 16th ave would be $100 with your server making $10/hour, and then you add your tip versus, your bill at Earls.67 would be $116 with no tip and your server makes $11.60/hour..

Uh...I don't think you've got that right. It will be identical to the way restaurants currently add a typical 18% tip on large groups. It's added to the bill.

From Earl's:

One of our newest test policies is the addition of the addition of the 16% hospitality charge...

Q : Why didn’t you just make the food and drink prices higher to pay your staff a higher wage?

A : 100% of the hospitality charge is being distributed to all staff in the form of higher consistent wages. If we were to raise our menu prices, a portion of the fee would have to be taken to go towards operational fees such as royalties and rent to landlords, versus going to the staff or charging the guest a higher % than 16%.

[btimbit]

I think fears of the service being crap now because they have no incentive are way overblown. I think I said it a few pages back (or maybe it was on CP) but most servers aren't constantly thinking along those lines, they just know it averages out anyway so a bad tip offsets a good tip, etc. That, plus they still have managers. You think if a manager is getting complaints about a server, or constantly notices bad habits, they're just going to go "oh well, she's not earning tips so who cares." No, that bitch is going to get canned

[spikerS]

Originally posted by C_Dave45


Uh...I don't think you've got that right. It will be identical to the way restaurants currently add a typical 18% tip on large groups. It's added to the bill.

From Earl's:

I stand corrected. The way I was reading it was that it was being built into the prices.

Carry on....lol

[Mitsu3000gt]

Originally posted by msommers
My GF brought this up tonight and also thought that nothing will really change. But something I didn't really think about is if minimum wage goes to $15 and no one tips anymore, servers will be pissed and not give a shit about service.

In my experience, and I honestly don't think I'm picky at all when it comes to service, the majority of the servers I get already don't give a shit about service haha. They haven't been to the table in ages and I see them texting or chatting even at higher end places. When they are now guaranteed $15/hr + 16% tax free (in the case of Earls), I can only see that getting far worse, but who knows.

When minimum wage goes up to $15, I think a lot of people will stop tipping, or drop it to 5-10% for good service. At that point they are already making a pretty decent wage for that type of work IMHO.

Coincidentally, and to build on Dave's comment, some of the best service I've ever had was in San Diego - everywhere from TGI Friday's to high end restaurants, the service was 10/10 and they work for their tips. In Calgary, I feel like most (not all) servers just know they are getting their 15-20% from most tables so they care way less. I'm not talking garbage service that you would complain about, but just generally very average service where they do the bare minimum.

[max_boost]

Originally posted by btimbit
I think fears of the service being crap now because they have no incentive are way overblown. I think I said it a few pages back (or maybe it was on CP) but most servers aren't constantly thinking along those lines, they just know it averages out anyway so a bad tip offsets a good tip, etc. That, plus they still have managers. You think if a manager is getting complaints about a server, or constantly notices bad habits, they're just going to go "oh well, she's not earning tips so who cares." No, that bitch is going to get canned

IMO for a place like Earls, 16% is a good number. Let's see how it goes.

I will scale back my tipping too. I've been going 18 to 25% too often, 16 will save me money.