Help picking mirrorless system

[JC522]

Hey guys, my gf is a makeup artist and is trying to showcase her work. I used to shoot her portraits for her and edit them but I just don't have the time for them anymore. I bought her a nikon j5 with the 10-30mm kit lens but she just doesn't seem to like the images from the camera. She says the colors seem muted and that she prefers the jpegs from her iphone 6s. She won't be editing the photos with photoshop and will most likely be using apps to edit them and won't be shooting raw.

I'm not familiar with this segment for cameras so could you guys point me towards what other cameras to look at. The screen must rotate 180 degrees. Low light performance isn't a big priority because we made her an LED ring light so she should have decent lighting. Video capability for vlogs would be great but not a big priority.

Thanks in advance

[D'z Nutz]

Originally posted by JC522
The screen must rotate 180 degrees.

This is going to severely limit your choices for a good camera.

[The_Rural_Juror]

Why not just use the iphone?

Tell her that she doesn't need a screen that rotates 180 degrees. Just a mirror and a messy room.

[JC522]

Trust me, I've tried. Tried explaining that if I showed her a bunch of jpegs, she wouldn't be able to tell which brand of camera it came from. Told her to get a faster lens but then she told me her problem was with the look of the jpegs. Tried telling her to learn photoshop but she countered with her friend's Sony mirrorless looks good straight out of camera. At this point I think she just doesn't like the nikon J5 and confidence in your gear is pretty important I guess.

[taemo]

i would just get her a small m43 or apsc (sony or fuji) and then a small fast lens in the 35-50 FF equiv FL

actually maybe an X100s might work

[finboy]

The camera store just did a review of best jpeg cameras, including the iPhone and Sony lost badly.

Per mirrorless, canon has good skin tones but the m5 is pricey for what it is, and the screen flips down, so she can't use a tripod. Sony doesn't flip, so that isn't an option either, maybe suggest a Panasonic micro 4:3?

[blitz]

Most cameras allow you to output liveciew via HDMI, you could use an old monitor instead of a 180 screen.

Actually, I have a Sony 5" on camera hdmi monitor somewhere I don't use anymore.

[JC522]

Originally posted by blitz
Most cameras allow you to output liveciew via HDMI, you could use an old monitor instead of a 180 screen.

Actually, I have a Sony 5" on camera hdmi monitor somewhere I don't use anymore.

I suggested shooting tethered to her laptop and nikon has an app that lets you use your phone to control the camera. She didn't use that feature much either. From what I gather her 3 main must haves are Articulating screen (180 degrees), jpeg processing must look good, compact (Or else I would have gone with a nikon D5500).

I've tossed around the idea of a Sony a5100, which has a 180 degree screen and a larger sensor than the Nikon. Not sure how the jpegs look from it though. She also found a used Sony Nex F3 that she says she's seen other makeup artists use for 120 body only.

[taemo]

is she going to edit photos on her phone/tablet then instead of using a computer?
so an easy workflow to sync her camera to her mobile device would be another requirement, i take?

i seriously can't think of any mirrorless cameras that can do that other than the 1" sensor cameras.

otherwise a canon 70D or 80D is the only thing I can think of.

I wonder if the Iphone 7 plus with dual lens can activate the portrait mode with the ring light

[JC522]

Originally posted by taemo
is she going to edit photos on her phone/tablet then instead of using a computer?
so an easy workflow to sync her camera to her mobile device would be another requirement, i take?

i seriously can't think of any mirrorless cameras that can do that other than the 1" sensor cameras.

otherwise a canon 70D or 80D is the only thing I can think of.

I wonder if the Iphone 7 plus with dual lens can activate the portrait mode with the ring light

No, it would be handy if she could transfer the photos directly to her phone but I'm sure she'd be okay with putting them on her laptop and then transferring from there.

The LED ringlight we made is about 18" diameter and continuous lighting, so not a strobe which is how she uses it with her phone right now. My concern is if she wants to put together a portfolio, I don't think the image quality from the front facing camera of 6s will stand up to enlargements and I don't have the time to break out the studio gear and shoot her looks anymore.

Also another thing to consider is whatever camera she ends up with will most likely spend most of it's time in Auto mode although I'm trying to teach her to use the semi auto modes like A or S

[taemo]

btw by what im thinking of the 1" sensor camera and canon 70D or 80D is the articulating screen to 180

[rage2]

Originally posted by JC522
I bought her a nikon j5 with the 10-30mm kit lens but she just doesn't seem to like the images from the camera. She says the colors seem muted and that she prefers the jpegs from her iphone 6s.
So it's pretty clear that the both of you have completely different goals for a camera. You're looking for fidelity and bokeh, and she's looking for out of the box processing. iPhone's default image processing is pretty top notch, which is why colors looks so good without editing.

So either mess with the processing modes on the J5, flip it to vivid or portrait to see how the jpg output looks, or get her a iPhone 7 Plus and use portrait mode to make fake bokeh. The fake bokeh realistically is good enough for web work. With good lighting, which sounds like you have, the iPhone can take some pretty serious photos. For print work, fake bokeh won't work. Lots of tiny flaws that shows up at real resolutions.

[D'z Nutz]

Originally posted by JC522
From what I gather her 3 main must haves are Articulating screen (180 degrees), jpeg processing must look good, compact (Or else I would have gone with a nikon D5500).

I can think of many cameras that have any two of her must haves, but I can't come up with a single camera that has all three. Granted, as photogs we're probably a pickier than non-photogs when it comes to JPEG quality so you might be able to skimp on that.

Why not just get her the Sony Nex F3 if that's what she's satisfied with?

[JC522]

Originally posted by rage2

So it's pretty clear that the both of you have completely different goals for a camera. You're looking for fidelity and bokeh, and she's looking for out of the box processing. iPhone's default image processing is pretty top notch, which is why colors looks so good without editing.

So either mess with the processing modes on the J5, flip it to vivid or portrait to see how the jpg output looks, or get her a iPhone 7 Plus and use portrait mode to make fake bokeh. The fake bokeh realistically is good enough for web work. With good lighting, which sounds like you have, the iPhone can take some pretty serious photos. For print work, fake bokeh won't work. Lots of tiny flaws that shows up at real resolutions.

Lol the reason I'm pushing for her to try and like the camera is she came to the conclusion she didn't like the camera AFTER the return period was over so if she decides to switch systems she would have to sell the camera, probably for a small loss and the hassle of selling it. My train of thought was "work with what you have, it's the photographer not the camera"

She switched it to vivid to test it out quickly in natural light and she says it made the lighting look too yellow. I told her to try playing with white balance then, also suggested putting it in manual mode and try messing with the saturation and stuff. Don't think she was pleased wit those results


Originally posted by D'z Nutz


I can think of many cameras that have any two of her must haves, but I can't come up with a single camera that has all three. Granted, as photogs we're probably a pickier than non-photogs when it comes to JPEG quality so you might be able to skimp on that.

Why not just get her the Sony Nex F3 if that's what she's satisfied with?

My concern with that is she's going off what another makeup artist uses that she saw photos of, I'm not sure if the picture she saw was SOOC or touched up giving her the idea that that camera will produce those types of photos. I guess we'll go look at it since she suggested it but I'd prefer to have something from a store where she can put it through it's paces to see if it's a system she would enjoy using.

What suggestions could you make that are 180 degree flip screen and great jpeg processing. If we weren't talking compact I would seriously consider the nikon 5500 because then she could just use my glass instead of having to buy new glass like if she jumped in with a canon dslr

[rage2]

Haha well the problem is you're complicating her workflow by pushing the camera on her. She obviously doesn't want to deal with post processing from the sounds of it, and it's a pain in the ass anyways. I still have 500 photos in my dslr queue to edit, it's such a grind that I find myself taking almost all my photos and videos on the iPhone these days due to a lack of time, so I get her perspective of things.

[dirtsniffer]

She's sounds like a pain in the ass. Why bother helping.

[msommers]

You already answered your own question!


used Sony Nex F3 that she says she's seen other makeup artists use

[Brent.ff]

Originally posted by dirtsniffer
She's sounds like a pain in the ass. Why bother helping.
beyond seems slacking on this one... photos of said makeup artist gf?

[jacky4566]

Originally posted by finboy
The camera store just did a review of best jpeg cameras, including the iPhone and Sony lost badly.


Agreed. The forward facing cameras are typically around 1MP and only designed for WXGA quality.

If she is working with a laptop beside her, why not get a cheaper DLSR Canon and a macro lens. Hook it up USB. You can do live preview and shutter control with thier software.

[Mitsu3000gt]

It sounds like she needs a Colorchecker Passport, not a new camera. 1-click and she will have perfect color and WB every single time. At the absolute bare minimum she should be manually setting WB with a grey card or the color temperature of the LED ring lights. If the "lighting looks too yellow" that is again not a problem with the camera. All she has to do is select all the photos she took that day, and click once on the profile she made for the LED light. Then save them all and she's good to go.

She will never be happy if she refuses to use anything other than out of camera JPEG and AWB. If she's searching for a magical camera with flawless AWB and automatic color profiles she's wasting her time. If she is willing to do 1-click post processing on the computer, she can get perfect color and WB every time with a $100 Colorchecker. Last time I did a makeup shoot it was extremely quick to process.

Nikon already has arguably the best JPEG output, so she will most likely be taking a step backward with almost anything else she chooses. Her complaints seem like they have a lot more to do with her resistance to do anything other than point & click than the equipment she has.

Is this setup not on a tripod the whole time anyway? It probably should be for what she's doing, and at that point the size of the camera is of little concern. It would be so easy to set up a little studio where she could have her clients sit on a stool or something and get consistent output every time.

Sounds like an annoying situation. There are very reasonable, easy solutions available to her. If she doesn't want to pick one, I'd say it's not your problem anymore at that point.

Also what is the end use of these photos? Just Facebook and showing clients? Or does she make prints and such?