Help with Disruptive Neighbours

[anarchy]

Hey guys,
Hoping for some advice here.

I own a townhouse that I currently rent out and over the last couple months, their neighbours have been causing an extreme amount of noise on a regular basis. My tenants tried to speak to them politely as my tenant is 8.5 months pregnant but the girl next door literally tried to lunge at her and her boyfriend had to hold her back.

I've asked them to log when noise is extreme and even record some of it as possible. I've been in touch with the building property manager and she's sent several warning letters but obviously it's done nothing.

These neighbours are constantly fighting, slamming doors, banging on walls, etc. and it's incredibly frustrating for my tenants, as you can imagine, especially with a baby soon to arrive.

The property manager has informed me that eviction is a possibility but there are several steps it takes to get there. I'm at a loss as to what I should inform my tenants to do as I want to help them as much as possible.

Should they call the police every time there's an issue? What are their options here? I live in Toronto now (moved here a year ago) and this property is in Calgary, so I'm limited physically to helping as well.

Any suggestions would be much appreciated.

[Hallowed_point]

I would say call the police every time and mention the violent response received earlier. This is what we pay tax dollars for. Make it a pain for CPS and they will make it a pain for your white trash neighbors.

[shakalaka]

Well if nothing else has helped, calling the police would seem like the next best choice. If your property manager is willing to evict them, then that process should be started too.

[anarchy]

Originally posted by Hallowed_point
I would say call the police every time and mention the violent response received earlier. This is what we pay tax dollars for. Make it a pain for CPS and they will make it a pain for your white trash neighbors.

That's what I'm thinking too. Basically call the police every time and force the issue. Hopefully the property manager and board take it more seriously as I'm sure they don't want the police coming to the community constantly.

I'm worried about the safety of my tenants and any kind of backlash, either violent or retaliatory in nature so that's a concern for sure. Ever since the Alberta economy took a hit and rental prices went down, I've had to deal with trashy neighbours and tenants now able to afford to live in the community. It's a real pain the ass.

[88CRX]

And this is why being a landlord sucks.

You probably ended up with my old tenant living next door! Apologies and good luck.

[Hallowed_point]

From my experience in the industry, prop managers are mainly bobble heads. They rarely do site visits/get involved in anything hairy. Lot's of liability I guess. For the most part, they collect fees and issue sanctions. Just call the police. Especially if they're violent. I'd be sure to mention that. Tell your tenants to get a vid could be hilarious. :rofl:

[gwill]

the property manager should be fining the owner of the tenant into oblivion until they evict the tenant or the owner goes bankrupt.

Not sure why a problem tenant would be given so many warnings.

[revelations]

Yea definitely shit management from the BOARD ... the board needs to be much firmer with these types of shit heads and get on management to do something about it. Bylaws may have to be changed.

We fined owners like this with escalating fines and they quickly got the message to not fuck around.

[Hallowed_point]

Originally posted by gwill
the property manager should be fining the owner of the tenant into oblivion until they evict the tenant or the owner goes bankrupt.

Not sure why a problem tenant would be given so many warnings. True, but again there are a lot of unattentive prop managers whom simply take on too many buildings $$$$ I'd skip that step and call CPS every single time. Tell them that you feel threatened. They will respond quick.

[gwill]

Originally posted by Hallowed_point
True, but again there are a lot of unattentive prop managers whom simply take on too many buildings $$$$ I'd skip that step and call CPS every single time. Tell them that you feel threatened. They will respond quick.

But that doesnt get rid of the tenant. The op needs to utilize both aspects. OP should try and reach a board member directly in case the property manager is totally useless.

On my boards we are fair but firm. First a warning, second a small fine. After that if there is a continued problem we will issue a maximum fine for every complaint. We try and treat it how we would want it handled if it was us having the same problem.

We had 3-4 owners evict their tenants when they realized theyd be fined into oblivion which saved us from having to start the eviction ourselves. We've never had this many issues with tenants before... in fact never had to ask an owner to evict their tenant before this previous year.

[Mitsu3000gt]

If the complaint is regarding noise, I don't believe you are supposed to call CPS because it isn't a crime. If you worry for their safety (probably the easier route to take for results) then call CPS.

[HiTempguy1]

Originally posted by Mitsu3000gt
If the complaint is regarding noise, I don't believe you are supposed to call CPS because it isn't a crime. If you worry for their safety (probably the easier route to take for results) then call CPS.

Correct.

There are fines levied by Bylaw for this sort of thing. CALL EVERY TIME THERE IS AN ISSUE. Record the noise as they may not get there in time.

Depending on your pushing them, bylaw will usually come and give one or two warnings. After that, the tickets start coming and they rise RAPIDLY.

It'll get them to stop be noisy, it just takes a while. People shut it down when they get a $1k ticket for their 3rd or 4th noise infraction.

[anarchy]

I didn't even realize fines were an option - I'm even more pissed now considering they haven't done that and have only issued warnings (as far as I know).

I don't have the contact info for the board and it's so hard to even get ahold of this damn property manager. If anyone lives in the Lighthouse Landing complex and knows how to get a hold of the Board please let me know!

I'm pretty sure even with noise complaints you still call CPS but I could be wrong. But there was definitely a threat of violence before and my tenants are certainly concerned for their safety and are avoiding directly confronting them.

[Mitsu3000gt]

^^ You CAN call but you're not supposed to. Police --> crime. Noise/disturbances --> bylaw.

[gwill]

go knock on some doors in the complex to help find a condo board member. You might be shocked to find out that they may not even know of the problem and would help push for a fix once they are aware.

Maybe ask your property manager for a board members email. I allow my property managers to give out my email in case an owner needs to vent or ask questions.

[ExtraSlow]

Yeah, it should be a matter of record who the board members are and there should be easily accessible contact info for at least one of them, possibly the whole board.

[anarchy]

Originally posted by ExtraSlow
Yeah, it should be a matter of record who the board members are and there should be easily accessible contact info for at least one of them, possibly the whole board.

I spoke with the property manager's assistant because apparently she's in meetings. He won't provide me with any info to the condo board, I have to go through her. Is this normal? Should I not have any way to contact the condo board if I choose to?

Anyways, he said they have record two issued warnings, despite me complaining about this since November. They do have the ability to fine starting at $250, with apparently no maximum, but no fines have been issued yet.

The process for both fining and eviction are up to the board - there's no steps that lead up to it, if they feel it's necessary they will do it.

[Mitsu3000gt]

If it's like my old board, expect weeks in-between every decision even with a fairly active and conscientious team. I also believe there is nothing forcing the person to pay if the fine is issued by the board and not the city. Outstanding fines can only be enforced when the unit is sold if I remember correctly, so if they rent their unit, the fine will just go to their landlord, and if they own they can probably delay the fines for a long time. It would be best if the city was the one doing the fining if that is possible in this situation. Either way, the more hassle and cost you can throw at them the better.

[Mixalot27]

Originally posted by anarchy
I spoke with the property manager's assistant because apparently she's in meetings. He won't provide me with any info to the condo board, I have to go through her. Is this normal? Should I not have any way to contact the condo board if I choose to?


Members of the condo board are required to file their names with Alberta Land Titles. You should be able to contact an Alberta registry to get the board member's names and info.

You should also be able to get records of the last annual meeting for your building from your property manager. This document would list who is on the board.

[gwill]

It is normal for property managers to deny this info. There are foip laws they need to follow but most of the time they claim the board doesnt want their info released when thats not always the case. Technically every board members info is recorded with the govt but as far as i know this isnt accessible by just anyone.

You'll need to be more pro active as an owner. For example if youve attended your agms you would have met the board members on multiple occassions. Get their info then.. or knock on doors. You need to be more dilligent on complaints and advising your tenants to document the noise, call police/bylaw everytime and to lodge a complaint with your board every single time.

[lasimmon]

When I had a terrible neighbor and the Property manager wouldn't do anything about it, I just found out who was the head of the condo board and anytime I had a noise complaint I knocked on their door and ensured they knew about it. They were annoyed but after coming over a couple times they realized how awful it was and somehow forced the condo owner to evict the terrible renter.

[suntan]

This is why you don't buy property in the NE. ;)

[anarchy]

Originally posted by gwill
It is normal for property managers to deny this info. There are foip laws they need to follow but most of the time they claim the board doesnt want their info released when thats not always the case. Technically every board members info is recorded with the govt but as far as i know this isnt accessible by just anyone.

You'll need to be more pro active as an owner. For example if youve attended your agms you would have met the board members on multiple occassions. Get their info then.. or knock on doors. You need to be more dilligent on complaints and advising your tenants to document the noise, call police/bylaw everytime and to lodge a complaint with your board every single time.

I mentioned in my original post, but unfortunately I live in Toronto now so going door to door is not an option, nor am I able to attend the AGMs. We have logged the noise disturbances over the last 3 months and have already shared that with the property manager. I've also asked them to record the noise on a few occasions although that isn't as clear. The property manager said she didn't need me to send those to her. I've informed my tenants to call bylaw every time now.

Thanks everyone for the info. Just to be clear, the fine is to the owner, not the tenants, which should light a fire under him to deal with the tenants. I actually know the owner when we both lived in these units, he lives in Winnipeg now. I messaged him when this was first an issue and he told me a property company was managing the property for him now and they'd contact me but the never did.

I'm waiting for the property manager to contact me so I can ask her why there has only been two warnings and no fines issued, and to confirm a fine will be issued next. I also will ask her to have the board contact me if possible and if not, pass on my letter highlighting the situation to them. In the meantime, I'm going to email her every day there is an issue and have my tenants call the bylaw with every issue.

Thanks for the advice, I'll share updates as they come, hopefully it'll help whoever else has to deal with garbage like this.

[anarchy]

Just wanted to share an update.

I spoke with the property manager in mid February and she informed me that she would serve eviction but if she did so, it would take effect at the end of the following month. Because it was still mid-month and it wouldn't matter if she served it right away or waited until the end of the month, she said she was going to wait to give the tenants a chance to adjust their behavior. I put my trust in her to handle this appropriately.

I followed up with an email near the end of February and found that she was on vacation and her staff could not help me at all. I just got an email from her now and, of course, she did not serve notice and said she would do it this week. This means now instead of eviction happening at the end of March, it will be happening at the end of April.

I am furious and told her this was unacceptable and she made a commitment to me. She's responded back and is basically calling me a liar and said she made no commitment to me and only told me what actions were available out of courtesy to my tenants because they were having a baby.

That's what she calls a courtesy. My tenants had their baby last week. They are in their mid-20's, their first child, and they haven't had proper sleep since they moved into the place in November. I'm at a complete loss as to what to do next.

[Swank]

For starters, use email correspondence only with your property manager going forward so you can get every commitment in writing.

[That.Guy.S30]

Go to the condo board. They'll make the property management work for their money. Lazy ass property management companies piss me off.

[anarchy]

Originally posted by That.Guy.S30
Go to the condo board. They'll make the property management work for their money. Lazy ass property management companies piss me off.

I can't even do that - I asked for the condo board's contact info and they were unable to give it to me. My only choice is to deal directly with this condo manager.

[lasimmon]

How do you not know who is on the board? Don't you go to the meetings? :confused:

[yellowsnow]

Don't you have the meeting minutes? The condo board should be listed there...

[anarchy]

Originally posted by lasimmon
How do you not know who is on the board? Don't you go to the meetings? :confused:

As I mentioned in a couple posts already, I live in Toronto now so no, I do not attend the meetings. And the minutes do not show the contact information for the board members.

[jwslam]

Ask a friend to go knocking on your neighbours' doors and ask if they are on the board / know who is on the board? :dunno:

There's literally hundreds of ways you can figure out who is on the board even if you don't attend the meetings yourself.

[Mixalot27]

All you have to do is go here:

https://alta.registries.gov.ab.ca/spinii/logon.aspx

enter your condo plan number, order the document called "change of directors" and pay $10. That form should list the names and addresses of all condo board members.

[pironic]

Hey guys... guess what? I'm the chairman of the board for Lighthouse Landing.

We have 511 units in our neighbourhood and we pay the mgmt company to look after the majority of the communications we get because there is just too much to deal with if they didn't. We get a summary communication report at the end of every month that shows the unit number and the subject for why there was a communicaton. We dont get anything further unless we ask for it. There are a couple of things you can do to get around this though. You can ask the mgmt company to forward something you send them to the board directly. We have 10 days to respond but usually respond with something like "we'll talk about this at our next meeting and have a proper response for you after that".

The next time the board meets is on March 9th (This thursday).

If OP wants to get a hold of me directly I have a phone number currently set up with a phone forwarding service. When prompted press 1 and it'll connect you to me. The line is only open mon-fri between 9am-12pm and calls are cut off after 10 minutes. This should still be enough time to get most of OPs concerns addressed. The number to get a hold of me, Michael is (587) 317-1830.

In the case of residential disputes between neighbours we often take the stand of staying out of things, but this particular case might go beyond that. I'd love to talk to OP as I've only skimmed the majority of the comments in this lengthy thread. We'll see if we can at least levy some financial sanctions on their property...

Thanks guys :D

(BTW, that number is only open until March 14th anyway, so i'm fine with it being public)