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Thread: Civic Type-R Turbo Mega Thread

  1. #641
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    Wow, if they came out with a similar flash for the Si that would put it more in line with the numbers I was hoping for and might push me over the fence for buying one.

  2. #642
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    Originally posted by Swank
    Wow, if they came out with a similar flash for the Si that would put it more in line with the numbers I was hoping for and might push me over the fence for buying one.
    I read one Honda rep saying the Si engine was literally identical to the other 1.5T's except for software, so it might not be any more than that unless something else in the Sport drive-line is limiting power that the Si improves upon. Regardless it seems to put any of the 1.5T's (6MT) much closer to the range people were hoping for with the Si. I also believe that is WHP unless the Dyno charts are just corrected to show CHP.

    I wanted an Si Hatch, and since that isn't happening this seems to be the next best thing for minimal effort power gains, provided it can be hidden for service.

  3. #643
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    Originally posted by Mitsu3000gt


    I read one Honda rep saying the Si engine was literally identical to the other 1.5T's except for software, so it might not be any more than that unless something else in the Sport drive-line is limiting power that the Si improves upon. Regardless it seems to put any of the 1.5T's (6MT) much closer to the range people were hoping for with the Si. I also believe that is WHP unless the Dyno charts are just corrected to show CHP.

    I wanted an Si Hatch, and since that isn't happening this seems to be the next best thing for minimal effort power gains, provided it can be hidden for service.
    On the civic forums lots of Si info is in the system including parts.

    Some Si exclusive studd off top of my head:

    Block (crv pistons, rods, and something makes it civic Si specific)
    Turbo is crv with 9 blades
    Flywheel
    LSD
    Final drive I think
    Intercooler/piping

    Some other stuff. But the clutch itself is same as the regular civic so the clamping force will limit it to 240tq (hersay on forums).

    Still a exedy 300tq clutch disc and we got a contender. Also leaked guide put it at 2906 for weight or something.
    "The most merciful thing in the world, I think, is the inability of the human mind to correlate all its contents... some day the piecing together of dissociated knowledge will open up such terrifying vistas of reality, and of our frightful position therein, that we shall either go mad from the revelation or flee from the light into the peace and safety of a new Dark Age."

    -H.P. Lovecraft

  4. #644
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    I've seen pictures of CTR's on flatbed trucks in the US so these cars are rolling off the assembly line. I assume the SI is a little behind seeing there's limited information at present time regarding them.

  5. #645
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    Originally posted by heavyD
    I've seen pictures of CTR's on flatbed trucks in the US so these cars are rolling off the assembly line. I assume the SI is a little behind seeing there's limited information at present time regarding them.
    Yeah, think it's accurate? I know the ship stopped at the Halifax port first (according to forums). Also according to dealers/forums Canada is only getting white and black for '17 first batch and the trucks have grey and the other colours. Nobody knows for sure except Honda. For pricing and sale date it's almost , almost as bad as Ford and their new GT. Deliveries were already made and official numbers weren't out yet lol.
    "The most merciful thing in the world, I think, is the inability of the human mind to correlate all its contents... some day the piecing together of dissociated knowledge will open up such terrifying vistas of reality, and of our frightful position therein, that we shall either go mad from the revelation or flee from the light into the peace and safety of a new Dark Age."

    -H.P. Lovecraft

  6. #646
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    Originally posted by Darkane


    Yeah, think it's accurate? I know the ship stopped at the Halifax port first (according to forums). Also according to dealers/forums Canada is only getting white and black for '17 first batch and the trucks have grey and the other colours. Nobody knows for sure except Honda. For pricing and sale date it's almost , almost as bad as Ford and their new GT. Deliveries were already made and official numbers weren't out yet lol.
    No idea. Saw a video yesterday of a black one driving around in the US as well. White and black (maybe red) are the only colors worth getting anyway as there was a blue one on the flatbed truck and it looked awful with all the red accent.

    I'm not a fan of black cars (despite my current car being black) but the video is by far the best the car has looked as black hides all the overwrought black plastic and the overall shape of the car looks more cohesive because of it.

    If this car is all it's cracked up to be I may consider getting one but I would prefer mid-cycle so bugs are ironed out and possibly they refresh the styling to make it look more attractive.
    Last edited by heavyD; 05-03-2017 at 12:24 PM.

  7. #647
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    Originally posted by heavyD


    No idea. Saw a video yesterday of a black one driving around in the US as well. White and black (maybe red) are the only colors worth getting anyway as there was a blue one on the flatbed truck and it looked awful with all the red accent.

    I'm not a fan of black cars (despite my current car being black) but the video is by far the best the car has looked as black hides all the overwrought black plastic and the overall shape of the car looks more cohesive because of it.

    If this car is all it's cracked up to be I may consider getting one but I would prefer mid-cycle so bugs are ironed out and possibly they refresh the styling to make it look more attractive.
    Yeah I've heard of the 18s coming in two trims. The 17s are touring only and therefore most $$.
    "The most merciful thing in the world, I think, is the inability of the human mind to correlate all its contents... some day the piecing together of dissociated knowledge will open up such terrifying vistas of reality, and of our frightful position therein, that we shall either go mad from the revelation or flee from the light into the peace and safety of a new Dark Age."

    -H.P. Lovecraft

  8. #648
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    Originally posted by Mitsu3000gt


    I read one Honda rep saying the Si engine was literally identical to the other 1.5T's except for software, so it might not be any more than that unless something else in the Sport drive-line is limiting power that the Si improves upon. Regardless it seems to put any of the 1.5T's (6MT) much closer to the range people were hoping for with the Si. I also believe that is WHP unless the Dyno charts are just corrected to show CHP.

    I wanted an Si Hatch, and since that isn't happening this seems to be the next best thing for minimal effort power gains, provided it can be hidden for service.
    Some good advise in here from a guy that works at a dealership. Basically if something major happens to the power train there is a good chance they will find a way to tie it back to car having been modified for more power.

    http://forums.beyond.ca/st/403215/mo...ding-warranty/

  9. #649
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    Originally posted by Aleks


    Some good advise in here from a guy that works at a dealership. Basically if something major happens to the power train there is a good chance they will find a way to tie it back to car having been modified for more power.

    http://forums.beyond.ca/st/403215/mo...ding-warranty/
    But can they see that is has been modified, or just that it has been reflashed? Hondata claims they can't tell (you obviously flash to stock before any dealer visits). Others say they can see it's been flashed, but they can't tell the reason, and a dead battery or a dealer firmware update also re-flashes the ECU in the same way. Obviously there is some risk no matter what, but I am having a hard time getting a definitive answer.

  10. #650
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    The definitive answer is that you should not tune your engine in any way or form if you want your warranty guaranteed. If you do enter the grey area (because no tuner will ever truly guarantee anything) of altering or replacing your car's factory tune be prepared for anything from maybe sneaking by and getting warranty or flat out denial.
    Last edited by heavyD; 05-04-2017 at 10:02 AM.

  11. #651
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    Its 2017 man, not the late 90s. Every manufacturer has integrated some way of monitoring the parameters of the power-train, whether it be flash counters/shadow codes etc. that cannot be overridden. A lot of manufacturers will also require a full ecu code analysis before granting warranty on anything over a certain threshold. For something like a coil-pack they might not bother with the hassle of denying warranty, but you blow up your engine, you're paying for it.

  12. #652
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    Originally posted by dimi
    Its 2017 man, not the late 90s. Every manufacturer has integrated some way of monitoring the parameters of the power-train, whether it be flash counters/shadow codes etc. that cannot be overridden. A lot of manufacturers will also require a full ecu code analysis before granting warranty on anything over a certain threshold. For something like a coil-pack they might not bother with the hassle of denying warranty, but you blow up your engine, you're paying for it.
    I get that - I am trying to find out exactly what it is they can see. If they can just see it's been flashed, they can't deny anything because maybe my battery just died. If they can see exactly what caused the flash, then that is a totally different story, but Hondata claims they can't. I am currently trying to find a Honda tech familiar with the 1.5T who can possibly answer my question. Like I said before I completely understand there is always some risk, but I will feel more comfortable if they can't actually see what caused the flash.

  13. #653
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    Originally posted by heavyD
    The definitive answer is that you should not tune your engine in any way or form if you want your warranty guaranteed. If you do enter the grey area (because no tuner will ever truly guarantee anything) of altering or replacing your car's factory tune be prepared for anything from maybe sneaking by and getting warranty or flat out denial.
    Yep. Read the fine print on any tuner. You're on your own once you flash it. Way too many variables for anyone to guarantee anything. And those canned tunes are pretty wonky based on my experience.

  14. #654
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    Originally posted by Mitsu3000gt


    I get that - I am trying to find out exactly what it is they can see. If they can just see it's been flashed, they can't deny anything because maybe my battery just died. If they can see exactly what caused the flash, then that is a totally different story, but Hondata claims they can't. I am currently trying to find a Honda tech familiar with the 1.5T who can possibly answer my question. Like I said before I completely understand there is always some risk, but I will feel more comfortable if they can't actually see what caused the flash.
    Are you asking because you would want Honda to cover your engine if it blows up due to a flash? Or are you worried about them giving you hassle about the flash if non power train issues arise?

  15. #655
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    Originally posted by Aleks


    Are you asking because you would want Honda to cover your engine if it blows up due to a flash? Or are you worried about them giving you hassle about the flash if non power train issues arise?
    I'm more worried about general hassle, or blanket denial of things not related to the flash should an issue arise. I won't even have the car 2-3 years from now, the chances of a major issue is extremely slim, especially if I selected a more modest flash program (which is what I would do regardless).

    It's a calculated risk. I fully understand that yet for some reason everyone keeps telling me the same things I have acknowledged from my first post. Obviously if the engine explodes they will put more effort into figuring out why and I'd never expect that to be covered if it was due to the flash. The risk of hassle will be much lower if they can't tell *why* the ECU was reflashed - that is all I am trying to figure out. Like I said before if they can just plug-in and see what I did even after flashing back to stock, that's very different than if they can just see that it's been flashed period, since many different things also flash the ECU. Most people seem to think they can just see the flash counter with no details - I have not been able to confirm this with a Honda tech yet though.

  16. #656
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    Originally posted by heavyD
    The definitive answer is that you should not tune your engine in any way or form if you want your warranty guaranteed. If you do enter the grey area (because no tuner will ever truly guarantee anything) of altering or replacing your car's factory tune be prepared for anything from maybe sneaking by and getting warranty or flat out denial.
    QFT. You gotta pay to play.

  17. #657
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    From my experience, honda engines are pretty damn stout. My 09 Si with the K20Z3 (hondata flash tuned) lived at 8600 without a single issue. That said, this is a new turbo engine. So those rules may not apply.

  18. #658
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    Originally posted by Hallowed_point
    From my experience, honda engines are pretty damn stout. My 09 Si with the K20Z3 (hondata flash tuned) lived at 8600 without a single issue. That said, this is a new turbo engine. So those rules may not apply.
    Seems to be the case with the new ones too. These comments are from Hondata:

    We threw a tune on three of these Civics. Two from Team Honda Research West and one from Honda Performance Development and raced them for 25 hours last December. The cars are still racing today with the same engines and transmissions they practiced and raced with last year. They have a completely stock engine and MT. I think race proven is an accurate and well earned description.
    We have done this (stress testing) with our 2017 EXT manual. It has been to many track events, had numerous dyno tests with many different products, and in general has been run hard for most of the miles it has on it. The minimum tune it has had is a +6 PSI basemap. Zero engine or transmission problems so far.
    So they have multiple test cars being regularly raced and otherwise beat on, bone stock + tune for many months now without issue. It's still early but it sounds promising for much less aggressive normal/street driving reliability.

    The only thing I have come across so far is some people claiming they may have had momentary clutch slippages on the most aggressive programs (which I wouldn't use anyway), but it always recovered. Hondata claims they have not had this issue under much harsher conditions, so who knows. Definitely going to look into it a lot more - with the amount of Civics out there and how cheap/accessible extra power is, if there are problems it won't take long for them to surface.

  19. #659
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    Originally posted by Mitsu3000gt
    ...with the amount of Civics out there and how cheap/accessible extra power is, if there are problems it won't take long for them to surface.
    And hopefully not much longer to correct the tunes to eliminate the problems

  20. #660
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    Is it confirmed at this point that the Si won't be offered in Hatch form? I'm having troubles finding an official work on the matter.
    Was the #1 Forum Warrior

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