Has your office/company laid people off? PART 6 (New Poll Options!)

[killramos]

Originally posted by SkiBum5.0


How many of those people have more than 3-5 years business experience? I think the reason the MBA is becoming less valuable is the number of people taking it so early after undergrad.

hahaha 1, and he's the most useless out of all of them

[bjstare]

Originally posted by SkiBum5.0


How many of those people have more than 3-5 years business experience? I think the reason the MBA is becoming less valuable is the number of people taking it so early after undergrad.

Again, literally every single one. I'm not going to ask a 26 year old MBA grad (someone younger, with less experience than me), how it's benefited them through their career.

The people I've met with were all further along than I am, working anywhere from a similar PM role as I, all the way up to a president of a midsize company. And like Killramos said, I have reliable sources that indicate to move into the senior leadership team at certain companies, it's pretty much a mandatory requirement.

At the end of the day, if I'm not working, this probably would have the most benefit to me, given my career path (and where I want it to go). Less benefit than an MBA would have had 5-10 years ago? Sure. But it's still beneficial.

[suntan]

Believe me just knowing what the hell economic elasticity and NPV is will put you further ahead than 99.99% of all workers out there.

[killramos]

Originally posted by cjblair

At the end of the day, if I'm not working, this probably would have the most benefit to me, given my career path (and where I want it to go). Less benefit than an MBA would have had 5-10 years ago? Sure. But it's still beneficial.

That's the way that I take the concept, at the end of the day do you think the knowledge will benefit you go forward in your career? Do you think the designation will help you in your career?

Do you think its worth the cost/time commitment?

If so then its just a decision for yourself at the end of the day.

Don't worry what anyone else has to say about it. If the program is accepting applicants like candy that's not your problem its the schools. imo the low performers always make themselves apparently quickly enough and it doesn't matter what designation they have they aren't going anywhere. That goes for anything in life.

If the 3 letters even get your foot in the door of a place that wouldn't otherwise look at you that pays for itself right there.

[Type_S1]

Originally posted by killramos


That's the way that I take the concept, at the end of the day do you think the knowledge will benefit you go forward in your career? Do you think the designation will help you in your career?

Do you think its worth the cost/time commitment?

If so then its just a decision for yourself at the end of the day.

Don't worry what anyone else has to say about it. If the program is accepting applicants like candy that's not your problem its the schools. imo the low performers always make themselves apparently quickly enough and it doesn't matter what designation they have they aren't going anywhere. That goes for anything in life.

If the 3 letters even get your foot in the door of a place that wouldn't otherwise look at you that pays for itself right there.

The problem with MBA's, as is with much of education, is that there are literally thousands of schools offering some sort of "MBA" program. Reputation is literally everything when it comes to MBA's and Canadian MBA's are not highly regarded worldwide. Do your research and don't just jump into an online MBA or UofC because you think it's the smart thing to do. Research, research, research on the different schools, what they specialize in, what their students do after the fact, what professors are teaching and if the professors have legit. industry experience or if they are just education muppets. Certain MBA's in the US will automatically get you a $200k+ salary out the gate (Harvard, Yale, etc.) and some are likely to leave you unemployed.

An good MBA is definitely a way to get you out of a technical role or move upwards towards management and also a good way to get out of O&G and into a different industry all together. The problem with a lot of technical folks (see engineers) in O&G is that their skill sets are almost useless in most other industries and are not considered "real" engineers by non-O&G people. An MBA will help you move into one of these other industries much easier.

[bigbadboss101]

Company thinking of converting some of us from contractors to employees. Here is a question. What might be the equivalent as an employee if as a contractor you make $1 per hour? 70% of the money plus your PTO, 3 weeks vacations, benefits, bonus, etc and call it even?

[Darkane]

Originally posted by bigbadboss101
Company thinking of converting some of us from contractors to employees. Here is a question. What might be the equivalent as an employee if as a contractor you make $1 per hour? 70% of the money plus your PTO, 3 weeks vacations, benefits, bonus, etc and call it even?

I always thought it was 2:1. That was during good times, so maybe 55-60% would work.

[Xtrema]

Originally posted by Darkane


I always thought it was 2:1. That was during good times, so maybe 55-60% would work.

Sounds about right but it's also depends on the industry.

The old rule I had was employee total compensation (salary + health + benefits + bonus) + 20% is where a contracting rate should start. Then the rest is all about the market demand for that skill set.

Originally posted by bigbadboss101
Company thinking of converting some of us from contractors to employees. Here is a question. What might be the equivalent as an employee if as a contractor you make $1 per hour? 70% of the money plus your PTO, 3 weeks vacations, benefits, bonus, etc and call it even?

Is your contracting rate over market or under market?

If your rate is market, that's a not bad way to take it.

You are basically taking a 30% pay cut but got pay back 10% for PTO+3weeks paid vacation. 5% on benefits and hoping the remaining 15% in bonus.

Now it could also be a move of cost cutting to covert to employee. So it could be way less than this formula. A lot of companies are firing and rehiring from the talent pool at 30% off. And trust me, there are a lot of people are happy to be working and have a pay check and gladly take it.

So in the end, it's all about leverage. I have seen contractors continues to be contractors and avoided the conversion because of leverage. I have seen contractors turn into employee for less since that's better than nothing. I have also seen some contractors seen the offer as unfair and rather sit it out. It's all about leverages.

Also, I heard summer co-op positions are now starting to turn into unpaid internships. Because that's just a sign of the times. In my 20+ years career, I have never seen it this bad.

[bigbadboss101]

We took 20% cuts back in Feb and their goal is to get us on as employees for cost savings. I wouldn't want much more of a cut so we will see what kind of offer we get when/if it comes. At 70% I think we are close to even. At 60% it will be felt in the pocket book. I think if that is the case I will contact other departments in the company and see if they have a position for me for I sign on.

We are in O&G.

[Xtrema]

Originally posted by bigbadboss101
We took 20% cuts back in Feb and their goal is to get us on as employees for cost savings. I wouldn't want much more of a cut so we will see what kind of offer we get when/if it comes. At 70% I think we are close to even. At 60% it will be felt in the pocket book. I think if that is the case I will contact other departments in the company and see if they have a position for me for I sign on.

We are in O&G.

Start researching what similar position pays right now as employee. Then you have a ball park when negotiation starts. I won't hold my hopes up if motive is cost saving. Because it has to be less than what you're being paid right now.

So at 70% and 5 weeks (PTO + 3 Weeks), you probably will lose out on the bonus for the company to save anything worthwhile to do this move.

[ExtraSlow]

Back in the day when I was hiring a "senior engineer" type role, my HR advisor broke it down for me like this: an employee costs the company about 2x what their base salary is after you count in benefits, time off, bonuses etc. And, the hourly wage is about 2x for the contractor.

Now, depending on your individual situation, you may personally get more value from being a contractor, or employee. But that depends on things like your dependents, your spouses occupation, your vacation plans etc.

In a down economy, one good thing about being an employee is that if you get laid off, you get severance, and qualify for EI. Those can be huge benefits.

Back in the day, kind of around the same time, I had a guy who was working for me as a contractor/consultant. We offered him an employee position, and he refused, because he "couldn't afford the paycut". Five months later, we ran out of work, and he was gone. The guy actually cried in my office when I told him. He had a bunch of kids, and a wife who didn't work. In hindsight, he would have been much better off as an employee.

[idriveabox]

5% reduction today. Large pipeline company. Going to be a fun day...

[adam c]

Originally posted by ExtraSlow
Back in the day when I was hiring a "senior engineer" type role, my HR advisor broke it down for me like this: an employee costs the company about 2x what their base salary is after you count in benefits, time off, bonuses etc. And, the hourly wage is about 2x for the contractor.

Now, depending on your individual situation, you may personally get more value from being a contractor, or employee. But that depends on things like your dependents, your spouses occupation, your vacation plans etc.

In a down economy, one good thing about being an employee is that if you get laid off, you get severance, and qualify for EI. Those can be huge benefits.

Back in the day, kind of around the same time, I had a guy who was working for me as a contractor/consultant. We offered him an employee position, and he refused, because he "couldn't afford the paycut". Five months later, we ran out of work, and he was gone. The guy actually cried in my office when I told him. He had a bunch of kids, and a wife who didn't work. In hindsight, he would have been much better off as an employee.

Would he have stayed if he was an employee though? The chance of being let go would have still been there and because he hadn't worked 52 weeks as a FTE he wouldn't have qualified for EI if my understanding of the system is correct

[Feruk]

Originally posted by adam c
Would he have stayed if he was an employee though? The chance of being let go would have still been there and because he hadn't worked 52 weeks as a FTE he wouldn't have qualified for EI if my understanding of the system is correct

Time frame is definitely shorter than 52 weeks to qualify. Look at all the fishermen in Newfoundland who spend 6 months on "pogey."

[ExtraSlow]

Well, rules are different for fishermen as far as I know, and timeframe to qualify is based on regional employment stats, so it varies.

Anyway, I actually doubt we would have laid him off as an employee, since that was well before this current downturn. At that time, the company wasn't doing employee layoffs.

Anyway, I'm just saying, that there is a hell of a lot more than $/hr wage to consider.

[CompletelyNumb]

Directional Drilling. In my company, most workers took a 50% pay cut. Staff hands now make more than consultants in many cases.

And we are paying guys more than any competitors.

Not sure how they survive.

[jabjab]

5% job cuts getting done at Enbridge today

[schurchill39]

Originally posted by idriveabox
5% reduction today. Large pipeline company. Going to be a fun day...

Safe to assume you're talking about Enbridge?

Originally posted by jabjab
5% job cuts getting done at Enbridge today

[flipstah]

Originally posted by jabjab
5% job cuts getting done at Enbridge today

Probably to remove redundancies from the acquisitions. Godspeed.

[idriveabox]

Originally posted by schurchill39


Safe to assume you're talking about Enbridge?

Yup.