View Full Version : warming up cars?!?!
boi-alien
03-04-2003, 01:49 AM
i read an interesting article in the AMA magazine i received today. so it seems that it's actually bad for fuel injected cars if you let them idle and warm up. it's recommended no longer than 2 minutes then you should get going, even in calgary weather. what is everyone else's thoughts on this?
nismodrifter
03-04-2003, 01:53 AM
I let it warm up about 2 minutes until the idle drops down to normal level after leaving it parked over night (in a garage but its still cold)
girlRACER
03-04-2003, 01:58 AM
I NEVER warm up my car. Is that bad for my car then? :dunno: Am I supposed to wait until the temperature gauge part goes to the middle?
boi-alien
03-04-2003, 01:59 AM
well the article said it's bad to let the car idle for long periods of time. so warming it up would constitute as idling i presume
I heard that a while too.
Anyways I just let it run for a couple minutes, and take it real easy until the temperature warms up.
The car also warms up faster when driving lightly than idling.
GTS Jeff
03-04-2003, 02:33 AM
Originally posted by boi-alien
i read an interesting article in the AMA magazine i received today. so it seems that it's actually bad for fuel injected cars if you let them idle and warm up. it's recommended no longer than 2 minutes then you should get going, even in calgary weather. what is everyone else's thoughts on this? actually, its the other way around. its bad to idle a carbed engine for a long time cuz carbed motors run rich when they are idling...with efi, u are running close to stoich all the time so it aint bad.
logically, the oil covers up everything and begins to lubricate a few seconds after u start your car. however, for the oil to work well it has to be warmed to operating temperature and also the metal components of the engine need to warmed up to operating temperature so that all the sizes are right....this way, theres less friction and unnecessary wear and tear on the engine.
personally, i like to warm my car up totally, until its warm enough inside to be comfortable without a jacket, when the shifter is smooth, and the clutch (mines hydraulic) snaps back quickly. or if im in a rush, ill just wait until i see the temp needle start to move, which just means that the coolant is just starting to warm up, but the engine itself is probably warm enuff.
trust me, if u dont warm up the engine, ure gona start burning oil in a few years.
Originally posted by GTS Jeff
trust me, if u dont warm up the engine, ure gona start burning oil in a few years.
I wouldn't trust you to sit the correct way on a toilet seat.
buh_buh
03-04-2003, 02:37 AM
its not bad to drive it without warming it up. But it is bad for the car if you bag on it without letting it warm up.
GTS Jeff
03-04-2003, 02:38 AM
Originally posted by Ben
I wouldn't trust you to sit the correct way on a toilet seat. ive seen the way u warm up your car in the cold man...6000rpm right off the bat!
5.9 R/T
03-04-2003, 02:54 AM
Originally posted by GTS Jeff
trust me, if u dont warm up the engine, ure gona start burning oil in a few years.
Why should we trust you?
Originally posted by GTS Jeff
i actually know nothing about cars haha.
http://forums.beyond.ca/showthread.php?s=&threadid=5295
:rofl:
If you're using 5W30, you can drive it almost right after starting without harming the engine, like buh-buh said.... But I don't know why letting your EFI car idle for more than 2 mins would be bad for it, but interestlingly related, it takes about 2 mins for your cat to warm up.
I don't know about other components though, Like when I start the daytona up under -10, the shifter feels like its in frozen molasses.
Got a link to the article?
kenny
03-04-2003, 03:10 AM
Originally posted by girlRACER
I NEVER warm up my car. Is that bad for my car then? :dunno: Am I supposed to wait until the temperature gauge part goes to the middle?
Only need to warm up till the RPM drops from the 1200rpm cold start up mark. It drops to 500rpm after about 10 seconds. Car is then ready.
I usually dont push the car until its at about 60C-80C water temp.
Originally posted by kenny
Only need to warm up till the RPM drops from the 1200rpm cold start up mark. It drops to 500rpm after about 10 seconds. Car is then ready.
wow my car usually idles at 700, when its cold its around 1200...but takes about 5-10 minutes for the rpm to drop to normal.
Well probably doesn't that I park outside sometimes.
mrmattyk
03-04-2003, 03:44 AM
Originally posted by GTS Jeff
actually, its the other way around. its bad to idle a carbed engine for a long time cuz carbed motors run rich when they are idling...with efi, u are running close to stoich all the time so it aint bad.
logically, the oil covers up everything and begins to lubricate a few seconds after u start your car. however, for the oil to work well it has to be warmed to operating temperature and also the metal components of the engine need to warmed up to operating temperature so that all the sizes are right....this way, theres less friction and unnecessary wear and tear on the engine.
personally, i like to warm my car up totally, until its warm enough inside to be comfortable without a jacket, when the shifter is smooth, and the clutch (mines hydraulic) snaps back quickly. or if im in a rush, ill just wait until i see the temp needle start to move, which just means that the coolant is just starting to warm up, but the engine itself is probably warm enuff.
trust me, if u dont warm up the engine, ure gona start burning oil in a few years.
:werd:
Except for that one time in the Beast. "Dude I cant see in front of me" :rofl: One of the best nights of my life
Horatio
03-04-2003, 10:22 AM
I seem to recall the owners manual (haven't read it in awhile) in my Honda saying that warming the engine for anything more than 1 min is a waste of fuel (it also said don't push the engine hard for a few minutes worth of normal driving after startup). I've read other articles that point out the main reason people started warming engines up in the first place was that cars at the time had carburetors. For proper fuel mix and vapourization, carbs need to be a little bit warm to run well. FI engines work pretty differently so they don't need long warm up periods in the winter before they run well.
Greg
boi-alien
03-04-2003, 10:41 AM
Originally posted by Horatio
I seem to recall the owners manual (haven't read it in awhile) in my Honda saying that warming the engine for anything more than 1 min is a waste of fuel (it also said don't push the engine hard for a few minutes worth of normal driving after startup). I've read other articles that point out the main reason people started warming engines up in the first place was that cars at the time had carburetors. For proper fuel mix and vapourization, carbs need to be a little bit warm to run well. FI engines work pretty differently so they don't need long warm up periods in the winter before they run well.
Greg that's basically what the article said in a nutshell... i'll get around to scanning it later tonight. i personally don't warm the car up. i'll let it warm up fro about a minute then i'll take off and i'll wait till temperatures go to normal before pushing it.
CRXguy
03-04-2003, 10:47 AM
My car idles at about 1400rpm when I start it up. Usually sit for about 30-45 seconds, and I drive off, shifting under 3k until the temp gauge starts moving.
RiceCake
03-04-2003, 11:11 AM
I usually let it warm for a min or so. I like to see the temp. needle raise from sub cold to the cold line and then drive lightly to allow it to go to normal operating temp before I drive harder.
GTS Jeff
03-04-2003, 11:21 AM
well the colder it is the higher the ecu sets the idle. there have been days when ive idled at 2700rpm before the car warmed up.
ACS-e36
03-04-2003, 11:29 AM
i usually warm up till the temp needle gets outta the blue... or else on the really cold days i wait till it hits dead middle
hinggu
03-04-2003, 11:34 AM
Originally posted by ACS-e36
i usually warm up till the temp needle gets outta the blue... or else on the really cold days i wait till it hits dead middle
same here. I think any car should be warmed, to get the pistons and stuff to the right sizes.
Quic question GTS jeff. Where the hell did you get that pic on your avitar????
lammer
03-04-2003, 12:14 PM
i never knew that..i always started the car for like 5 mins then i blast off.
boi-alien
03-04-2003, 12:40 PM
here's something else that i found off of honda-tech that sheds some light on the topic as well
It is essentially true. The fuel mixture on startup is super-rich - a lot condenses out on the cold cylinder walls, and the mixture would not fire if it were other wise. The condensed fuel drains past the rings into the crankcase, diluting the oil and, if it stays there, eventually breaking down to form an acid.
The longer you 'warm up' sitting idle, the longer the walls remain cold - up to about a minute. If you drive off as soon as the oil pressure lamp goes off, the engine will heat up faster, re-evaporating most of the fuel in a half hour or so of driving. It then gets sucked back to the intake via the breather and PCV valve.
Since cold engine tolerances are not conducive to aggressive driving, just drive mellow until the temp gauge rises to normal.
The worst combination, though is a long warm-up followed by a brief drive. If you drive will be 20 mi. on the freeway, then the only downside to a long warmup is wasted gas and a lot of exhaust sitting around your house. There is no benefit.
Steve
HRD2PLZ
03-04-2003, 12:46 PM
Overnight I don't let my car warm up because its in the garage. After school or work I let it run for anywhere from 2-10 minutes depending how cold it is outside, or until the seats are warm :)
ICEBERG
03-04-2003, 12:47 PM
With new cars you only need couple minutes. Unless your car is parked outside at -25 weathers.
Hakkola
03-04-2003, 01:00 PM
Mine is always parked in the garage, if it's cold I'll let it warm for a minute or 2, never longer than 2, I usually don't let it warm up at all, I just drive slowly for a couple minutes.
syeve
03-04-2003, 01:13 PM
I've basically heard the same thing...that if its really cold out ~-25...its reall bad to let your car sit there for like 20 min. The engine is unable to warm itself, therefore it sits running very cold until you start driving it. There is a fine line though...I've also heard that cold revs is the biggest car killer except insufficient oil changes. So basically what everyone else is saying. Let it warm up for a minute or two, then drive slow till shes warm. (that sounds weird)
It is bad to leave a car warming up for more than a few minutes. All you do is leave the car running in a cold state for an extended amount of time.
Daddymax
03-04-2003, 01:24 PM
that scks, I have a wicked car starter... I like leaving it run for like 5 minutes..... is that bad?
five minutes is fine
but it's bad to leave it for an extended period of time, ie the people who start their car as soon as they wake up and return to it after they'ved showered and dressed 20minutes later...
Ferio_vti
03-04-2003, 02:10 PM
What about plugging in the block heater?? Then you don't even have to bother with warming up the car.
Loose
03-04-2003, 02:19 PM
You can run your car as soon as the oil pump has lubricated the motor. This doesn't take very long, even in the extreem cold. 1-2 minutes is fine. Using 0W-30 oil or a good synthetic will drastically reduce the time also.
I wouldn't recommend more than 1/2 throttle or high revs till the car is fully warmed up.
MerfBall
03-04-2003, 02:43 PM
It's not necessarily bad for a fuel injected car to idle for long periods of time. It just burns a lot of gas. Your car is ready to go once it drops to normal idle RPM range. Your car doesn't actually start warming up until you start to drive it, and it warms up a lot quicker.
In very cold weather it's actually worse for you to not have your block heater plugged in (block heater keeps the liquids warm). No matter how much you warm up your car, the damage is already done on start up if the oil and such is not moving well.
And on a sidenote, if you are driving with a cold engine, it's recommended that you take it east, which means keep the RPM range down and no hard accelerations.
Originally posted by GTS Jeff
ive seen the way u warm up your car in the cold man...6000rpm right off the bat!
pfft! that was one time after It had been parked for like an hour, the motor is still warm an hour later there buck, the beauty of iron blocks!
that and that Jetta was posessed, couldn't seem to do any harm no matter how she was driven, hahaa
RiceCake
03-04-2003, 03:32 PM
Originally posted by Ben
pfft! that was one time after It had been parked for like an hour, the motor is still warm an hour later there buck, the beauty of iron blocks!
that and that Jetta was posessed, couldn't seem to do any harm no matter how she was driven, hahaa
Hahaha, damn I still remember the Jetta last winter. Man that car suck ass when the heat was down:D
Originally posted by RiceCake
Hahaha, damn I still remember the Jetta last winter. Man that car suck ass when the heat was down:D
Oh man, that WAS brutal, when my heater motor went, fawk, that was SOOOOO COLD!!!! That was the night we went to that house party and the cops came, hahaha, I never saw Kenny haul ass so fast!
Glowrider
03-04-2003, 03:57 PM
I let mine warm up 5-7 minutes before I get going.
ACS-e36
03-04-2003, 03:59 PM
im not sure what todo... sure the mixture is rich but the car runs slow when i drive it cold.. in order for mine to run normal it must be dead center
syeve
03-04-2003, 04:21 PM
Originally posted by MerfBall
And on a sidenote, if you are driving with a cold engine, it's recommended that you take it east
I think this should be my new sig.
Originally posted by syeve
I think this should be my new sig.
I'm pretty sure he meant to post 'easy' becaise y and t are so close to each other, that and the fact that even with east, its not funny at all.
MerfBall
03-04-2003, 04:53 PM
Hehe, thanks Benny ya I meant "Take it easy..."
three.eighteen.
03-04-2003, 06:30 PM
Originally posted by Ben
Oh man, that WAS brutal, when my heater motor went, fawk, that was SOOOOO COLD!!!! That was the night we went to that house party and the cops came, hahaha, I never saw Kenny haul ass so fast!
haha, i had the same thing happen this winter, driving around in -20 weather with the window cracked and me scraping the inside of the windshield constantly
syeve
03-04-2003, 06:38 PM
Originally posted by Ben
, its not funny at all.
sorry to dissapoint:thumbsup:
Originally posted by syeve
sorry to dissapoint:thumbsup:
hahaha:thumbsup:
Phats
03-05-2003, 12:29 AM
well, I am pretty sure that warming your car more than a minute is wasteful and bad for the car, this thread says it all warming up (http://www.team-integra.net/forum/display_topic_threads.asp?ForumID=7&TopicID=25539&SearchPagePosition=2&search=warming&searchMode=allwords&searchIn=Thread&forum=0&searchSort=dateDESC&ReturnPage=Search)
kenny
03-05-2003, 12:51 AM
Originally posted by Ben
I never saw Kenny haul ass so fast!
They dont like me, and I dont like them. :rofl:
Originally posted by kenny
They dont like me, and I dont like them. :rofl:
hahahaha, well generally when one guy says "Fuck this I'm getting My gun", its a good sign to HAUL ASS.:D :guns:
GTS Jeff
03-05-2003, 01:42 AM
Originally posted by Ben
hahahaha, well generally when one guy says "Fuck this I'm getting My gun", its a good sign to HAUL ASS.:D :guns: sounds like i missed a good time
James
03-05-2003, 06:19 AM
Originally posted by Ferio_vti
What about plugging in the block heater?? Then you don't even have to bother with warming up the car.
pffftttt. block heaters are for pussy's! lol. j/k. dont think id be saying that if my car actually had one! :tongue:
When its gets pretty cold out i normally let my car warm up for 2-5 minutes, because ive noticed that anymore than that dosnt do anything. When its -10 or colder the revs stay at about 2250 until i start driving, and even after driving, it takes atleast 10-15 minutes for the Nuetral Revs to get to the normal 900-1100 ish range....so i HOPE 2-5 minutes is fine, becuase either way my car take A LONG TIME to warm up.
Summer time....turn the key and let er' rip! :burnout:
GTS Jeff
03-05-2003, 11:43 AM
Originally posted by James
pffftttt. block heaters are for pussy's! lol. j/k. dont think id be saying that if my car actually had one! :tongue:
When its gets pretty cold out i normally let my car warm up for 2-5 minutes, because ive noticed that anymore than that dosnt do anything. When its -10 or colder the revs stay at about 2250 until i start driving, and even after driving, it takes atleast 10-15 minutes for the Nuetral Revs to get to the normal 900-1100 ish range....so i HOPE 2-5 minutes is fine, becuase either way my car take A LONG TIME to warm up.
Summer time....turn the key and let er' rip! :burnout: whoa man, something is wrong with your car! my revs will drop down to 1000ish after 5 minutes no matter how cold it is...the engine is still really sluggish, but it does idle properly.
RiceCake
03-05-2003, 02:49 PM
Originally posted by Ben
hahahaha, well generally when one guy says "Fuck this I'm getting My gun", its a good sign to HAUL ASS.:D :guns:
Hahaha, the funniest thing was that the dood that went go get his gun was g33king on IRC later that night! :nut: :nut: :nut:
shadowz
03-05-2003, 02:54 PM
Always wait till its toasty in the car
bksze
03-05-2003, 03:06 PM
yea man, i start my car up until i feel that it's warm on the inside, who cares about the engine . . . i care about me!!!
shadowz
03-05-2003, 04:00 PM
Originally posted by bksze
yea man, i start my car up until i feel that it's warm on the inside, who cares about the engine . . . i care about me!!!
Ben PM me I have something for you :thumbsup:
tulit
03-09-2003, 08:40 AM
One thing ive been told is if you let your car just sit to warm up, great your warming up the engine. But what about everything else? Its a good idea to drive carefully so that not only your motor gets up to temp, but so does your tranny, diff, etc as well...
ecstasyracer
03-09-2003, 08:18 PM
I wish I could wait until my car was toasty inside. The exhuast is way to loud you can hear it in the basement and it makes the window vibrate so the neighbours get really mad if it idles for a long time. :(
ecstasy_civic
03-09-2003, 08:23 PM
Originally posted by ecstasyracer
I wish I could wait until my car was toasty inside. The exhuast is way to loud you can hear it in the basement and it makes the window vibrate so the neighbours get really mad if it idles for a long time. :(
lol its so true, but thats how i know where you are in the city, i can hear you:clap: hell on a quiet night in the summer i can hear you on deerfoot from my house, in harvest hills:rofl:
ecstasyracer
03-09-2003, 08:25 PM
I should make a home-made silencer or something just to jam in the muffler when its warming up. lol
ecstasy_civic
03-09-2003, 09:13 PM
theres a guy at work who puts a towel in one of his dual exhaust pipes cause its so loud when its cold lol. first time i saw it i searched my car for my camera, it looks so funny:clap:
AzN_SoL
03-12-2003, 10:40 PM
hah ..shit my buddy is screwed.. he leaves his car running for like long periods of time... sometime up to an hour.. or more... and me... i dunno i just auto start it... and usualy around 5 mins i go.... but sometimes i just start it to get nice and warm.... so like 15 mins.. before it shuts itself off...
Glowrider
03-12-2003, 10:53 PM
he leaves his car running for like long periods of time... sometime up to an hour
Why?
GT2NV
03-12-2003, 11:47 PM
Originally posted by AzN_SoL
hah ..shit my buddy is screwed.. he leaves his car running for like long periods of time... sometime up to an hour.. or more... and me... i dunno i just auto start it... and usualy around 5 mins i go.... but sometimes i just start it to get nice and warm.... so like 15 mins.. before it shuts itself off...
yo is this john?
Wildcat
04-09-2003, 10:23 PM
yo is this john?
no its not, i thought it was too
Mr. Grinch
04-11-2003, 10:54 AM
I agree with SZW. Warming up for a minute or two, long enough to get the oil up to pressure, when it's -20 or colder, isn't so bad. Besides it takes me that long to clean the snow off or clear the windshield, etc. Then drive slowly. Some people feel that once the coolant is up to temp that its then OK to go full throttle / max RPM. I don't agree with that. I would rather the oil be up to temp before going full throttle. Besides, it takes a while for the tranny to warm up for smooth shifts too, and for the tires to get warm enough to stick well.
The problem here is that the "Officials" who make these recommendations awlays assume that everyone lives in the same climate. They might thing 0 deg celcius is "cold" when many of us are driving in -40 or colder during the winter. The same rules don't apply.
If you've got 10w30 oil and it's minus 40, you're oil is going to take longer to move around and for the pressure to distribute it. Even if the pressure guage reads the same, the ability for the oil to flow is not the same. The oil is basically a gel at this temperature. Same thing applies to your coolant, tranny fluid, and differential.
If you're running 5w30 or 0w10 synthetic, the oil is going to flow much more easily and the cold start shouldn't take nearly as long to distribute the oil as well.
I've seen people take this advice to not let the car idle at all to an extreme. They don't even bother to clear their windows. They start the car go straight to full throttle. When I used to work at a shop I saw the types of damage this caused. Oil system damage, engine damage, etc. At -40 temps most "all season" tires go "square", people try to drive them fast and they literally seperate from the rim. Standard and automatic transmissions alike don't like to shift when they are this cold.
With the M3 let it idle a minute or two after start, then drive slowly. It has tach lights to let you know what RPM is "Safe" until it warms up, but for the most part they are just coolant temp lights. I ignore them because I prefer to wait until the oil is up to operating temp before going max throttle / max RPM. I don't care as much on the Honda but I still take it easy at first. I don't push it out of the gate when it's -30... it doesn't like that much.
StrokeD z
04-14-2003, 10:03 PM
i cant wait a sec cuz for some dumb reason if i turn my heat on and my car stays in idle my temp starts to go down and cold heat will come out no matter how long i leave it so i have to drive..........i guess thats what you get with a 4 cyl
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