To Arms To Arms! War Time!

[Zephyr]

March 18 — A defiant Saddam Hussein on Tuesday rejected President Bush’s ultimatum for him and his sons to flee into exile, making war virtually inevitable as nearly 300,000 U.S. and British troops geared up for their second confrontation with Iraqi forces in a dozen years. The White House declared that resisting the United States would be “Saddam’s final mistake.”

msn.com

WASHINGTON (CNN) -- President Bush has been told by senior Pentagon officials that U.S. troops are ready to attack Iraq on his orders, and senior officials say those orders could come as early as Wednesday night.

cnn.com

yep. war time.

[Zephyr]

they also fired a missle today from a miltary base, i saw it when comming home from work. the news says its to show iraq that war is now comming.

[ninjak84]

Haha, time for another 8 pages!
I think I hear Glowrider typing already....

[Zephyr]

At the United Nations Tuesday, Iraq's U.N. ambassador denounced Bush's ultimatum as "illegal, immoral and unjustifiable."

"This is the first time in the history the president of a state ordered the president of another state to leave his own country. It is a mess," Ambassador Mohammed Aldouri said. "We reject totally this madness."

From Baghdad, Iraqi Foreign Minister Naji Sabri called Bush an "idiot" and said his ultimatum "is a expression of frustration and isolation.

-cnn.com

[lammer]

hrmm
i wonder where the gas prices will be tommrow night, i guess im gonna fill er up!

[Ekliptix]

I guess we'll watch it on tv

[bksze]

why don't we keep this as the fact page and the other thread for opinions

no sense in having two

[Zephyr]

Originally posted by bksze
why don't we keep this as the fact page and the other thread for opinions

no sense in having two

DUH! why do u think i made it? :rofl:

[04blackMAX]

hey thanks iam sure we all watch the news

[Zephyr]

Originally posted by vsmSIR
hey thanks iam sure we all watch the news

ok, its called posting news. theres nothing wrong with that, if u dont like it, then dont go on forums.

[max_boost]

The question is, after the Americans control Iraq, what would exactly prevent them from eventually taking over and controlling the entire Middle east region?

Next thing you know, they will be at war with Iran......

[Zephyr]

Originally posted by max_boost
The question is, after the Americans control Iraq, what would exactly prevent them from eventually taking over and controlling the entire Middle east region?

Next thing you know, they will be at war with Iran......

Iran is gonna be the "Axis of sorta evil" turkey is "Axis of screwing with our plans" knowing bush...

[kaput]

.

[FiveFreshFish]

Originally posted by lammer
hrmm
i wonder where the gas prices will be tommrow night, i guess im gonna fill er up!

:werd: Did that this afternoon at 79.4¢/L (91).

[hjr]

No. The us never signed up for international law because they said that an american will never stand trial internationally, so basically no. Bush wont face charges. Besides, who is gonna charge him???

[Glowrider]

LOL. Even if we were breaking international law. Who is going to prosecute? The UN? Riiiight.

[bol]

Originally posted by Glowrider
LOL. Even if we were breaking international law. Who is going to prosecute? The UN? Riiiight.


That is the most arrogant comment I've read from you or any "Peace Loving American" to date. Having pride in your nation is one thing, being blind to World issues is another. Yes, I say World issues. Iraq isn't a World issue. It's an American issue.


If it is found that the USA is breaking international law and nothing is done about it that will lead to the dissipation of the UN and most everything in the name of peace that has been accomplished since World War 2.

I highly suggest you take a long thought about what you just said.

[EstoMax]

why do u guys even give a shit about all this? (unless u have relatives or friends there of course)
i dont and i just act like nothings happening.. thats the easiest.. staying outa debates and protests and such. why waste time on arguing things that u won't affect..

max

[szw]

Originally posted by Lt. Max
why do u guys even give a shit about all this? (unless u have relatives or friends there of course)
i dont and i just act like nothings happening.. thats the easiest.. staying outa debates and protests and such. why waste time on arguing things that u won't affect..

max

sad

[Glowrider]

If it is found that the USA is breaking international law and nothing is done about it that will lead to the dissipation of the UN and most everything in the name of peace that has been accomplished since World War 2.

That's exactly my point. The UN doesn't do ANYTHING.

And I never claimed to be a "peace loving American".

[EstoMax]

Originally posted by szw


sad

yeah. i am too efficient for your world. i dont waste time on stuff

[hjr]

That's exactly my point. The UN doesn't do ANYTHING

well then we midas well go back to WW 1 when all of europe was dragged into the most horrific war to date because of a chess game of alliances and no means of discussing the problem.

Jesus. The past has this funny thing it does. Sometimes it repeats itself if you dont pay attention to what went wrong. Ohh ya. The UN does nothing my ass. Just cause they didnt do what YOU thought they should doesnt mean that it is worthless. Do a little research. Its more that just a war mediator.

[Phats]

I have an Uncle in the Middle East, as well as the fact that this could turn into something the world needs to worry about. You are an American to boot, this is your war.

[max_boost]

Will the Iraqi military surrender peacefully?
How will the Republican Guards hold up?
Urban Warfare, how many civilian casualties?
Will WMD be used?

The next 24 hours is going to be freaking crazy!

[itsalebaron]

Originally posted by Lt. Max


yeah. i am too efficient for your world. i dont waste time on stuff

http://forums.beyond.ca/showthread.php?s=&postid=185084#post185084

:confused:

[driven]

Originally posted by Lt. Max
why do u guys even give a shit about all this? (unless u have relatives or friends there of course)
i dont and i just act like nothings happening.. thats the easiest.. staying outa debates and protests and such. why waste time on arguing things that u won't affect..

max

i know it might be hard for you, but do realise how stupid you sound?

[Glowrider]

Will the Iraqi military surrender peacefully?

LOL. Some groups are already surrendering, and the war hasn't even started yet.

[jdmakkord]

Originally posted by Lt. Max
why do u guys even give a shit about all this? (unless u have relatives or friends there of course)
i dont and i just act like nothings happening.. thats the easiest.. staying outa debates and protests and such. why waste time on arguing things that u won't affect..

max

Maybe you should spend a little more time in social studies class...or poli sci or whatever you have down there.

[Glowrider]

why do u guys even give a shit about all this? (unless u have relatives or friends there of course)
i dont and i just act like nothings happening.. thats the easiest.. staying outa debates and protests and such. why waste time on arguing things that u won't affect..


Debates are a healthy thing. We all know nothing we say on this board or anywhere else will make a difference. But it is healthy for us to exercise our rights, and to have these debates. It's a shame that you take it for granted. There are people in other countries...say like, Iraq for example, that can't have debates like this. Not only that, but it gives us an opporotunity to learn from others, and get an idea of how other people see different issues around the world.

[___2PaC___]

Originally posted by ninjak84
Haha, time for another 8 pages!
I think I hear Glowrider typing already....


:werd: hahaha, damn

[___2PaC___]

Originally posted by ninjak84
Haha, time for another 8 pages!
I think I hear Glowrider typing already....


:werd: hahaha, damn

[rsxrsx]

Originally posted by Glowrider


Debates are a healthy thing. We all know nothing we say on this board or anywhere else will make a difference. But it is healthy for us to exercise our rights, and to have these debates. It's a shame that you take it for granted. There are people in other countries...say like, Iraq for example, that can't have debates like this. Not only that, but it gives us an opporotunity to learn from others, and get an idea of how other people see different issues around the world.


Nicely put Glowrider, i don't think i could have said that any other way:thumbsup:

"Debates help individuals evolve!"

[Dave P]

Glowrider, you sure your american. your sound pretty smart and you do sound like a pimp in your bimmer.


you sure your not canadian?

[Glowrider]

Originally posted by Dave P
Glowrider, you sure your american. your sound pretty smart and you do sound like a pimp in your bimmer.


you sure your not canadian?

It's early in the day. My posts will get stupider and more arrogant as time progresses. Hahaha.

[___2PaC___]

Originally posted by Glowrider


It's early in the day. My posts will get stupider and more arrogant as time progresses. Hahaha.

OH WHAT!?!?!?!?!?:bullshit:

[Glowrider]

OH WHAT!?!?!?!?!?

Uh...not to sure I get that one.

[nismodrifter]

1/2 hour left till it starts

is there going to be some address by president or something on TV?

[Glowrider]

Ari Fleischer (Press secretary), says that we will see one more address from the President, most likely from the Oval Office. An address from the Oval Office is an indicator of action being taken.

[Zephyr]

yessh another stupid speech. all i can do is support the men in uniform, because they are just carrying out orders, most of them do not want to go to war, so i hope they come back.

[Weapon_R]

Originally posted by Glowrider


It's early in the day. My posts will get stupider and more arrogant as time progresses. Hahaha.

That's when the fun begins :rofl:

[rsxrsx]

it looks like they have started to drop some bombs already, i dunno all the details yet...

[Zephyr]

targets were "military opportunities" wtf is with these gay names...... from freedom fries to military opportunities.... wtf

[rsxrsx]

Originally posted by Zephyr
targets were "military opportunities" wtf is with these gay names...... from freedom fries to military opportunities.... wtf


haha, so ture, however, military opportunities is better than freedom fries, the name freedom fries is so whack i still haven't gotten over it,

Yo, the attacks are getting pretty intense now...

[Zephyr]

Originally posted by rsxrsx



haha, so ture, however, military opportunities is better than freedom fries, the name freedom fries is so whack i still haven't gotten over it,

Yo, the attacks are getting pretty intense now...

bombers attacking targets around baghdad, and its gonna take troops 2-3 days to reach baghdad...

[rsxrsx]

Holy f**K, some lady just read off all the targets that they have hit, man that's a pretty big list for just the starting hours, at this rate there going to be invading Bagdad in less then 2 days...

[mwmhong]

CBS is reporting that 3 dozen Tomahawk cruise missiles (@ $1 million a piece) and bunker-busters from F117A Stealth bombers were targetted at some leadership bunker. :nut:

[Zephyr]

Originally posted by rsxrsx
Holy f**K, some lady just read off all the targets that they have hit, man that's a pretty big list for just the starting hours, at this rate there going to be invading Bagdad in less then 2 days...

the B.A.D (bomb assesment damage) has not yet been released, what u probably saw is a false lie. no determined amount of missles has been released.

[rsxrsx]

Originally posted by Zephyr


the B.A.D (bomb assesment damage) has not yet been released, what u probably saw is a false lie. no determined amount of missles has been released.

Yeah, your right, i'm flipping through all the channels and getting all these bits of information at one time, it's confusing the hell out of me, i'm just going to stick with CNN for now on, thanks Zeph:thumbsup:

[kaput]

.

[B18C]

Originally posted by rsxrsx


Yeah, your right, i'm flipping through all the channels and getting all these bits of information at one time, it's confusing the hell out of me, i'm just going to stick with CNN for now on, thanks Zeph:thumbsup:

Try CBC Newsworld. It's a more balanced view.

[Glowrider]

It's about damn time :)

http://mediaservice.photoisland.com/auction/Mar/20033195566468817725506.jpg

I'd also like to take a moment to note that all the protestors and all of their whining, did absolutely nothing. :rofl:

[Glowrider]

1000 US troops, from the 82nd Airborne, have launched an assault in Afghanistan.

Radio transmissions were heard coming from caves coming from villages SE of Kandahar.

[Ben]

Anyone heard Denis Learys experience when He watched the Gulf War on TV...THATS ME!

[Ben]

just got sent this by a friend:

http://www.cs-game.dk/Saddam.html

:dunno:

[Glowrider]

Hhahahahahahhaa

[Glowrider]

This is hilarious. Saddam Hussein, is talking about loving peace, and humanity. Talk about a hypocrite.

[Glowrider]

Iraqi forces fired 3 SCUD missles into Kuwait. SCUD missles that they were not supposed to have. SCUD missles that they claimed they didn't have. SCUD missles that the inspectors didn't find.

...and inspections were working? Riiight.

[rsxrsx]

Originally posted by Ben
just got sent this by a friend:

http://www.cs-game.dk/Saddam.html

:dunno:


HAHAHAHA that's way to funny, good find:thumbsup:

[___2PaC___]

:rofl:sweet vid

[hjr]

ohhhhh, not 4 missles. and they didnt do anything. Maybe cause they are old russian stock shit that has been hidden for the last 12 years and therefor not maintained.

PS> the patriot missle system really did not work very well in its baptism by fire. 1 for 4 is a shitty record

[Glowrider]

Originally posted by hjr
ohhhhh, not 4 missles. and they didnt do anything. Maybe cause they are old russian stock shit that has been hidden for the last 12 years and therefor not maintained.

PS> the patriot missle system really did not work very well in its baptism by fire. 1 for 4 is a shitty record

You missed the point of my post. The point is, that they have weapons they aren't supposed to have. All the while everyone is whining about how the inspections are working. This proves that they weren't. Hussein successfully decieved weapons inspectors, as he has done time and time again for the last 12 years. Logic would dictate, that after so many attempts at diplomacy have failed, that war is the only viable option.

And actually, it was 3 out of 4 that were destroyed by the Patriot missle system. The 4th missle landed in the desert.

[mwmhong]

FOX news had live reports of US/Iraqi ground forces exchanging fire near the border.

It's on. :guns:

[Glowrider]

Yeah, I've been watching FNC since this started last night.

[bksze]

glow - i think you've totally missed the point of a lot of people on this board, unless you weren't referring to the people on this board when you said people were whining . . . the point is that people don't agree with the fact that US is going against the UN and enforcing their own law on their own agenda without the support of the UN nor a resolution justifying so . . . now i know you don't agree with the UN and all but that is what most people believe, well me anyway . . .

but this war has happened already and i am now supporting the troops sent into combat . . . nothing we can do to prevent this war so may as wel support it for a quick and decisive victory, protesting won't get you nowhere especially if you can't even answer a few questions on why you are protesting haha

[Glowrider]

glow - i think you've totally missed the point of a lot of people on this board, unless you weren't referring to the people on this board when you said people were whining . . . the point is that people don't agree with the fact that US is going against the UN and enforcing their own law on their own agenda without the support of the UN nor a resolution justifying so . . . now i know you don't agree with the UN and all but that is what most people believe, well me anyway . . .

12 years of failed diplomacy is to much. How much more time did the UN need, 12 more years? Waste of time.

[Ben]

Originally posted by Glowrider


12 years of failed diplomacy is to much. How much more time did the UN need, 12 more years? Waste of time.
EXACTLY!:werd:

[rsxrsx]

I just got in a huge discussion at work about Saddam's recent address to the world...here's what resulted:

Was that the real Saddam talking or a fake?:dunno: :dunno:

[bksze]

they wanted a couple more months, what's 2 months as opposed to 12 years?

i'd like to see what your views are on North Korea, as well as Syria, Iran, the Israel vs. Palestine conflict and even China, just curious as to see what your opinion is with regards to US diplomacy towards those countries

[Glowrider]

Originally posted by rsxrsx
I just got in a huge discussion at work about Saddam's recent address to the world...here's what resulted:

Was that the real Saddam talking or a fake?:dunno: :dunno:

That's the same question everyone else is asking.

[Glowrider]

Originally posted by bksze
they wanted a couple more months, what's 2 months as opposed to 12 years?

i'd like to see what your views are on North Korea, as well as Syria, Iran, the Israel vs. Palestine conflict and even China, just curious as to see what your opinion is with regards to US diplomacy towards those countries

If we waited 2 more months, the weather would've been to bad to operate in the mid-east. The heat rises into the triple digits, and the sandstorms are more frequent and more destructive. Either way it makes no difference. Hussein's use of SCUD missles proves he has been lying to the UN Security Council, and fooling the inspectors for years and years and years. Logic would dictate, that after more than a decade of inspections not working, two more months would be a waste of time.

I think North Korea is a problem that needs to be dealt with, but it's better to finish what you start, before you start something else. Syria and Iran are shakey at best, IMO. Israel vs Palestine, well that's just a huge mess, we aren't likely to see the end of that in our lifetimes.

[Ben]

This is an Iraq/ US thread.

[bksze]

Originally posted by Glowrider


If we waited 2 more months, the weather would've been to bad to operate in the mid-east. The heat rises into the triple digits, and the sandstorms are more frequent and more destructive. Either way it makes no difference. Hussein's use of SCUD missles proves he has been lying to the UN Security Council, and fooling the inspectors for years and years and years. Logic would dictate, that after more than a decade of inspections not working, two more months would be a waste of time.

I think North Korea is a problem that needs to be dealt with, but it's better to finish what you start, before you start something else. Syria and Iran are shakey at best, IMO. Israel vs Palestine, well that's just a huge mess, we aren't likely to see the end of that in our lifetimes.

you're very right abou tthat heat issue, i'm glad someone picked up on it . . . should help the citizens of the states feel a little more confident in their leaders haha . . . i think the weapons inspectors have made more progress in the last 6 months than they ever had in the last 12 years so wouldn't it also be logical to assume that if given two more months, the pace may have continued in the same direction?

i think the US has started a lot of problems with this war that may have to be addressed further down the road . . .

[Glowrider]

i think the weapons inspectors have made more progress in the last 6 months than they ever had in the last 12 years so wouldn't it also be logical to assume that if given two more months, the pace may have continued in the same direction?

Full disarmament was ordered by the UN 4 days after the end of the first Gulf War, in 1991. Here we are in 2003, and only now, is something being done to effectively disarm Saddam Hussein. 2 more months would've been an insult.

[bksze]

Originally posted by Ben
This is an Iraq/ US thread.

I'm sorry, should i have asked him in PM or start a new thread?

regardless, the countries i asked him about all have ties to the situation and are definitely controversial topics by themselves but i just wanted to see what his POV on the matter was, you don't often get an educated opinion these days . . .

[bksze]

Originally posted by Glowrider


Full disarmament was ordered by the UN 4 days after the end of the first Gulf War, in 1991. Here we are in 2003, and only now, is something being done to effectively disarm Saddam Hussein. 2 more months would've been an insult.

all i'm saying is that i think the US should've given them two more months rather than attack so early because of the fact that if the situation had progressed and the war started with UN backing there would be more benefits

- UN backing means less controversy and less tension between international ties
- UN backing also means more countries will take the brunt of the cost . . . with it being estimated at $75-80 billion, i'm sure your economy would be a lot better if other countries helped to pay for the war, like the Gulf War when so many countries donated to the cause

[Glowrider]

Originally posted by bksze


all i'm saying is that i think the US should've given them two more months rather than attack so early because of the fact that if the situation had progressed and the war started with UN backing there would be more benefits

- UN backing means less controversy and less tension between international ties
- UN backing also means more countries will take the brunt of the cost . . . with it being estimated at $75-80 billion, i'm sure your economy would be a lot better if other countries helped to pay for the war, like the Gulf War when so many countries donated to the cause

Yes, but waiting two more months, would've greatly reduced the ability of the Coalition forces to operate. They could still do it, it would just put them in harms way unnecessarily.

We are not alone in this war. Just because a few countries in the UN didn't want this, doesn't mean the entire world is against us. 34+ countries have joined the Coalition and are providing support in different ways.

I seriously doubt that 2 more months would've made a difference in the eyes of the French and the Germans. The French have veto power, and stated they would use it if we submitted another resolution, no matter what the circumstances. They closed the diplomatic channels, and we pursued the only channel left. The Military channel.

[sexualbanana]

time for me to add a few things.

Bush referred to pre-empting Iraq, otherwise it would be a repeat of WWII. He says that by appeasing to Hussein, we're doomed to repeat the same kind of events that led up to WWII and that it was this kind of indecisiveness that led to the demise of the League of Nations.

One of the main reasons The League of Nations failed was because one of the biggest superpowers of the world didn't sign on. This superpower being the USA. As a result, the USA was essentially acting on its own compared to the rest of the world.

But isn't it amazing how the same thing is sort of happening now? Bush's intent to go ahead with or without UN approval is going to lead to the demise of the UN, UNLESS the UN makes a sudden approval.

[bksze]

i don't know how effective the UN forces would be anyways being that they wear baby blue gear to battle hahaha . . .

actually last i heard, you guys have 40 countries on board now . . . but no one is helpin out with the tab this time . .. if you guys had UN backing, the UN would be obligated to . . .

well who's to say who would do what, but i do know France said they would use their veto if this resolution was put forward because they wanted to give the inspectors more time, Bush also said that regardless of what he thinks the vote turnout will be, he would put a new resolution on the table . . . either way, France later on told the world they would back the US up if WMD are being used and Bush never put through a new resolution . . . one can never be so sure these days

[Glowrider]

The UN is killing itself. It refuses to act in the face of evil and tyranny. What good is an authoritative body that doesn't enforce it's own laws?

[Glowrider]

France later on told the world they would back the US up if WMD are being used and Bush never put through a new resolution . . . one can never be so sure these days

Yeah, I had a feeling that would happen when this all started. They don't want to lose all that money they've invested in Iraq.

[sexualbanana]

it's not refusing to act. it wants more time to get more information. a large chunk of the international community is only opposed to this war because Bush just spears right through everyone and everything. if bush had slowed down, and gotten more information and let Blix do his job, maybe the UN would actually approve

[bksze]

Originally posted by sexualbanana
time for me to add a few things.

Bush referred to pre-empting Iraq, otherwise it would be a repeat of WWII. He says that by appeasing to Hussein, we're doomed to repeat the same kind of events that led up to WWII and that it was this kind of indecisiveness that led to the demise of the League of Nations.

One of the main reasons The League of Nations failed was because one of the biggest superpowers of the world didn't sign on. This superpower being the USA. As a result, the USA was essentially acting on its own compared to the rest of the world.

But isn't it amazing how the same thing is sort of happening now? Bush's intent to go ahead with or without UN approval is going to lead to the demise of the UN, UNLESS the UN makes a sudden approval.

like they say, history repeats itself . . . i don't have very much confidence in the effectiveness of the UN but if you are going to join with them then you should respect the decision of the group, otherwise, don't join in the very first place . . .

i think they should remodel the UN without a rotating security council . . . i think the new Sec. Council should be comprised of the countries with the 15 largest armies and that neither country can possess veto right, they can have the right to abstain but no such thing as veto and the passing vote must be at least 10 votes

just a brief structure that i think would be more effective than having a rotating country basis with 5 vetoing countries . . . i mean, i really doubt it if angola gives two shits about this current war

[Glowrider]

it wants more time to get more information

That's the point. They've had 12 years!

[Glowrider]

Originally posted by bksze


like they say, history repeats itself . . . i don't have very much confidence in the effectiveness of the UN but if you are going to join with them then you should respect the decision of the group, otherwise, don't join in the very first place . . .

i think they should remodel the UN without a rotating security council . . . i think the new Sec. Council should be comprised of the countries with the 15 largest armies and that neither country can possess veto right, they can have the right to abstain but no such thing as veto and the passing vote must be at least 10 votes

just a brief structure that i think would be more effective than having a rotating country basis with 5 vetoing countries . . . i mean, i really doubt it if angola gives two shits about this current war

See...now that sounds like a good idea.

[sexualbanana]

but for those 11.5 years, hussein wasnt cooperating. and just when he starts to cooperate, bush decides to go to war with him

[Glowrider]

Originally posted by sexualbanana
but for those 11.5 years, hussein wasnt cooperating. and just when he starts to cooperate, bush decides to go to war with him

He wasn't cooperating. He was buying time. How is lying about weapons you claim not to have cooperating?

[sexualbanana]

because the inspectors didn't have too much time

[Glowrider]

Do you honestly think less than 150 inspectors could've covered a country the size of California in two more months? I highly doubt it. Not to mention the fact that he kept moving the weapons around, as Colin Powell demonstrated with the satellite photos. Don't forget that the inspectors weren't allowed inside military installations, and other various establishments.

[Weapon_R]

Originally posted by Glowrider
Do you honestly think less than 150 inspectors

:confused:

The UN had over 700 inspectors, and yes, they could have covered the area if given more time.

[Glowrider]

The UN had over 700 inspectors, and yes, they could have covered the area if given more time.

Not all of them were in Iraq. If they couldn't do it in 12 years, I doubt 2 more months would've made a difference.

[hjr]

Its not about hussain. Its about the US. No one ever said that he should be in power or that he is a good guy, there is just a shit load of doubt towards the motives of the US and its "brilliant" leader. If his daddy didnt stop on the iraqi border 12 years ago (cause he needed a reason to keep troops in Saudi Arabia) this would not be happening. But anyways, there is no doubt that tossing saddam out is a good thing, but alot of the informed world sees a problem with how and specifically WHO is doing the tossing. Though the US is the most powerful country in the world, that doesnt give them the right to do what ever they want. (the freakin country is built on freedoms, but apperently they only apply to americans. A little hypocritical me thinks.)

And in closing; America, enjoy your time on top cause it wont last. (canada enjoy it too cause being the friend of the biggest power wont last forever either, and we sure as hell are not going to be the next power!) The signal of the end of a dynasty is hyper-expanded imperialism (in one form or another). Look at the greeks, romans, mongolians, british, germans (very quick) and now the US is in the begining states of this (in a different form though)

[Glowrider]

The signal of the end of a dynasty is hyper-expanded imperialism

We aren't attempting to take over Iraq. We are attempting to remove a dictator.

[hjr]

bull shit

[hjr]

ok ok, ya, on the surface, but the whole freaken middle east is dictators and a fair amount have UN resolutions against them too (most notably Isreal)

[Glowrider]

Originally posted by hjr
bull shit

Wow, that was insightful. I had no idea you were on the inside track when it comes to US foreign policy.

[Glowrider]

Originally posted by hjr
ok ok, ya, on the surface, but the whole freaken middle east is dictators and a fair amount have UN resolutions against them too (most notably Isreal)

One at a time...

[hjr]

you dont have to be smart to see the ends of this situation, frankly im suprised you cant see through all the propoganda. If it turns out differently, then ill admit im wrong, but i seriously doubt it.

[hjr]

Originally posted by Glowrider


One at a time...

Thats what scares me. ohh, and thanks for proving my earlier post. Even you know that it isnt going to stop.

[Glowrider]

Please site an instance of the type of expansionism that you are describing.

[hjr]

Its in a slightly different form, but i believe i had stated that this is the beggining, Not the end. There is still a ways to go, but eventually it'll happen. (maybe in our lifetime, maybe not). But this is a staple of the demise of world powers. I dont see how the US can avoid it. No body else could. So the US midas well just party down while times are good (figuratively).