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View Full Version : Immersion President Calls Out Sony



ZEDGE
05-17-2006, 07:00 PM
http://www.shacknews.com/onearticle.x/42160


For years now, Sony has been embroiled in a legal debate with Immersion Corporation, a technology firm which claims that Sony and Microsoft infringed upon Immersion's haptics technology with the force feedback features in PlayStation and Xbox consoles. Microsoft agreed on a settlement with Immersion, and went so far as to purchase a 10% stake in the company. Sony did not agree to a settlement, and last year was ordered by a federal judge to pay Immersion $91M in back royalties and penalties, which Immersion claims still comes out to a lower sum than Sony would have paid had it licensed the technology. Sony launched an appealed to ruling, though Immersion's lawyers have stated that they do not anticipate any problems given the court rulings so far.

At E3 last week, Sony made two surprising announcements about its upcoming PlayStation 3 controller: it will include motion sensing technology, and it will forego the rumble feature present in PS2's current DualShock 2 controller, which is visually almost identical to the new PS3 model. When questioned as to the reasoning for the removal of the feature, Sony's official line was that the rumble technology interfered with the motion sensored. Sony's Phil Harrison also stated that "rumble was last generation, movement is this generation." The explanations given were met with a fair bit of skepticism from the gaming public and press, as the company's unwillingness to show its redesigned controller in recent months was frequently alleged to be connected to the company's bout with Immersion. Furthermore, Nintendo's Wii controller, which includes both motion sensors and a pointer function, does not appear to be adversely affected by its rumble functionality; however, in what may be a related issue, Immersion has never singled out Nintendo for infringing upon its rumble implementations.

In a Gamasutra interview published today, Immersion president Victor Viegas disputes Sony's claims. In regards to the lawsuit, he remains confident, saying "We've already won. In September the jury was unanimous in its defense of our actions." He goes farther, however, claiming that Immersion has in fact offered solutions to Sony for the hardware conflicts they describe, though to take advantage of such solutions would obviously require Sony to drop its current appeal against the latest ruling. Viegas also takes issue with Sony's description of rumble as "last generation" technology.

"If what they're saying is in fact the reason why [the controller will not have vibration], I've offered them numerous solutions to the problem," Viegas said in an interview Tuesday. "I don’t believe it's a very difficult problem to solve, and Immersion has experts that would be happy to solve that problem for them."
"We feel haptic or vibration technology is quite possible in a next gen system," he said. "It can provide greater fidelity, better effects, and a more complete sense of immersion, using a wired or wireless controller."

"When you think about the investments they’re making in improving graphics and sound, these are all meant to try to immerse you or put you in the middle of gameplay," Viegas said. "So to take vibration out of a driving game or a first person shooting game, I can't imagine how people will be able to view that as an advancement in gaming."

Viegas even states he has spoken with numerous developers who were unaware of the removal of rumble, as they had been working with development kits making use of the tech. This claim parallels reports from multiple news outlets (including this one) that most PS3 developers also learned about the system's motion-sensing controller when it was announced to the public at Sony's press conference last week. Only one game at the expo, Incognito's Warhawk, had the feature implemented.



So even some developers were unaware of the rumble being dropped and the new motion sensing... lol

Xtrema
05-17-2006, 08:32 PM
Again, PS3 this christmas seems impossible.

hahahah just found this:

http://www.gizmodo.com/gadgets/home-entertainment/edimensional-gpad-pro-gyroscopic-gamepad-174263.php

3rd parties are doing montion sensor + rumble with license from Immersion.

Looks like Sony branded controller will stay on shelves a bit longer.

TurboMedic
05-17-2006, 08:32 PM
It feels so out of place playing without rumble....what a step back! Sony will die a slow and painful death....

b_t
05-17-2006, 11:43 PM
Sony is continually fucking up with the PS3, over and over and over again...

heavyD
05-18-2006, 07:56 AM
Originally posted by b_t
Sony is continually fucking up with the PS3, over and over and over again...

They were king of the hill for two generations of consoles & its pretty shocking to see them unravel like this. When given the choice to take the high road Sony always takes the backdoor.:thumbsdow

dericer
05-18-2006, 08:13 AM
Sounds like it's time for me to switch back to PC

EnRich
05-18-2006, 08:21 AM
Why would you ever switch from the PC in the first place.... The PC will consistantly delivery better graphics, better game play, and better games... Not to mention the multiplayer is unbeatable.

/////AMG
05-18-2006, 08:29 AM
I'm glad I was going to wait to buy the PS3 anyway, even more reasons. Maybe they can sort everything out by the time I buy it...

ZEDGE
05-18-2006, 08:43 AM
Originally posted by EnRich
Why would you ever switch from the PC in the first place.... The PC will consistantly delivery better graphics, better game play, and better games... Not to mention the multiplayer is unbeatable.

I beg to differ.

Xtrema
05-18-2006, 09:59 AM
Originally posted by EnRich
Why would you ever switch from the PC in the first place.... The PC will consistantly delivery better graphics, better game play, and better games... Not to mention the multiplayer is unbeatable.

I can't imagine playing RTS on any other platform but PC.

But it's not the best multiplayer platform with abundant of cheats and cheaters.

natejj
05-18-2006, 10:07 AM
Originally posted by ZEDGE


I beg to differ.

Lets hear it then.

PC > All

habsfan
05-18-2006, 10:46 AM
pc i agree is better for genres like FPS or RTS, but in every other way i prefer console. you pay 500 or 600 some odd dollars for the system and you're set to play games with, at this point, graphics equal to a PC with the best current hardware that will just happen to cost you thousands of dollars to build. and then in the future when new titles are made, you've got to upgrade your PC again to get the best out of the game whereas with the console the games are developed to work with that set hardware so no upgrades are ever needed. that is until 6 or 7 years pass by and the next generation of consoles come out and you buy another one. plus with xbox live and whatever they do on the ps3, online gaming is just as acessable on consoles. so long story short, i much prefer to spend 600ish dollars on a system every ~7 years rather than spend 3k or more to keep my PC running at top condition for that same amount of time.

Xtrema
05-18-2006, 11:39 AM
Originally posted by habsfan
pc i agree is better for genres like FPS

I slowly think that FPS is better on console as well. Mouse is more accurate but you have access to more buttons/actions with the gamepad.

The only good thing about PC is that you can throw insanely amout of money into it to have 60fps in 1600x1200. That's something you can't do on consoles.

Consoles are Corvettes and PCs are Civics. You can make a Civic to run faster than a Corvette but you'll probably spend more money.

dericer
05-18-2006, 11:41 AM
I only play sports games, and racing games.

I'm not much into RPG, or first person shooters.

I followed EA hockey from genesis, to N64, PS2 so it's all I've known plus GT 1-4, and Tourist Trophy are only on PS2.

I'm just hoping there's going to be a good emulator for the PS2 and 3 that'll allow me to keep up with my favorite games :dunno:

heavyD
05-18-2006, 11:53 AM
The console vs PC debate will go on forever & as long as there are PC's there will be PC games. What can't be denied is that PC's games are small business compared to consoles as is their popularity. The mouse being better for FPS is old too because I have absolutely no issues using a great pad like the 360 game for FPS's in fact it feels strange going back to a mouse for an FPS. WOW has sold incredibly well but once you start going down the list, the sales are weak. Was the PC even mentioned at E3? Well one PC game at E3 got rave reviews (Bioshock) but that game is also available on 360 and like most games made for both console and PC it will sell more on the 360.

Each has its pros & cons but consoles are big business & PC games aren't. Popularity-wise world wide it isn't even remotely close. It's like football comparisons. Some people say the CFL is better & more entertaining than the NFL but that group is small compared to the millions of NFL fans. The PC is the CFL compared to the NFL that is consoles.

b_t
05-18-2006, 11:58 AM
Well, Microsoft is technically bringing consoles and computers closer and closer together, and with this new generation, both ATI and Nvidia - huge players in the PC market - made the graphics chips for the two biggest consoles. I think that eventually it'll all converge into basically the same thing, which is great, because PC games look better, are moddable, and I just enjoy gaming on my PC more.


HeavyD, you are forgetting Crysis and Age of Conan (HA). Crysis was one of the most impressive games of the show, it was far, faaar better looking then ANYTHING shown for consoles... even Gears of War!

ZEDGE
05-18-2006, 09:09 PM
Originally posted by natejj


Lets hear it then.

PC > All

Its just my platform of choice for gaming. I was a hardcore pc gamer for years.. just lost interest in pc gaming. Tired of upgrading components, sitting in front of a little monitor huddled at my desk..

I just prefer popping in a game, sitting back on my couch, headset on playing online on xbox in high def. I also prefer playing fps with the controller now too, the 360 controller is god like imho. :dunno:

BlueFrenzy
05-21-2006, 12:47 PM
No rumble on the PS3? That's a "shock". Ha ha. Man, I remember the first time I played Metal Gear Solid on the PS1, and the controller vibrated when I got hit or when Snake's heart was beating ... I was like "WTF!! Best idea ever!"

If I get PS3, I'll for sure get an aftermarket controller for the rumble. Shame on Sony

eblend
05-21-2006, 01:33 PM
Everyone is saying that they will get aftermarket controller for rumble, isn't rumble programed into the games? What prevents developers from not programing in rumble at all if most of the sony gear won't take advantage of the feature. They can just save money and not worry about rumble at all, therefor rendering aftermarket controllers with rumble useless

b_t
05-21-2006, 02:48 PM
Originally posted by ZEDGE


Its just my platform of choice for gaming. I was a hardcore pc gamer for years.. just lost interest in pc gaming. Tired of upgrading components, sitting in front of a little monitor huddled at my desk..

I just prefer popping in a game, sitting back on my couch, headset on playing online on xbox in high def. I also prefer playing fps with the controller now too, the 360 controller is god like imho. :dunno:

A controller will never replace the mouse.. the only reason the controller feels so good now, is because developers have implemented very well done autoaiming into every worthwhile FPS.

ZEDGE
05-21-2006, 11:32 PM
Originally posted by b_t


A controller will never replace the mouse.. the only reason the controller feels so good now, is because developers have implemented very well done autoaiming into every worthwhile FPS.

In single player maybe.. obviously you dont play any console shooters online, as most do not have any auto aim.. Halo 1 and 2 are the only ones I know of, and its not a true "auto aim".

I play

Ghost Recon Advanced Warfighter - no auto aim ( actually all GR games)
BF 2 Modern Combat - No auto aim
PDZ - no auto aim
COD2 - no auto aim
SWBF2 - no auto aim
Socom 2/3 on ps2 has no auto aim

and so on, none of these games are worthwhile? c'mon..

fact is alot of console gamers are very adept with a controller, mouse and keyboard are not that shit hot anymore..

/can o worms

b_t
05-22-2006, 12:02 AM
not true auto aim in Halo 2? Tell me there hasn't been a time where someone walks out from around a corner under your crosshairs, you start following them exactly lined up, until they disappear. Without touching anything. That is autoaiming at its finest.

Perfect Dark Zero had hands down the worst aiming I've ever experienced since Goldeneye. Even though it was a good looking launch game, I only played it for two days.

Call of Duty 2 was fun, once again, very subtle autoaim.

Haven't played the others much, but they are all pretty slow paced shooters compared with what you have on the PC.. look at how frantic Quake 3 is.. and you cannot help but admit that a console gamer on a gamepad would be shit outta luck trying to aim. With a console and this little joystick, you can only turn so fast - and if you set the sensitivity higher so you turn faster, you lose precision. A mouse is always going to better, since there is no limit to how fast you can move it, and ever since the advent of the optical mouse, precision is no problem.

ZEDGE
05-22-2006, 08:48 AM
Originally posted by b_t
not true auto aim in Halo 2? Tell me there hasn't been a time where someone walks out from around a corner under your crosshairs, you start following them exactly lined up, until they disappear. Without touching anything. That is autoaiming at its finest.

Perfect Dark Zero had hands down the worst aiming I've ever experienced since Goldeneye. Even though it was a good looking launch game, I only played it for two days.

Call of Duty 2 was fun, once again, very subtle autoaim.

Haven't played the others much, but they are all pretty slow paced shooters compared with what you have on the PC.. look at how frantic Quake 3 is.. and you cannot help but admit that a console gamer on a gamepad would be shit outta luck trying to aim. With a console and this little joystick, you can only turn so fast - and if you set the sensitivity higher so you turn faster, you lose precision. A mouse is always going to better, since there is no limit to how fast you can move it, and ever since the advent of the optical mouse, precision is no problem.

Quake 4 on the 360 is very fast paced with no auto aim. And since your playing against people with the exact same controls the mouse/kb comparison means squat. :dunno:

A790
05-22-2006, 09:34 AM
This debate will never end, so it's pointless in trying to make an argument for one side or another.

A mouse/keyboard setup is amazing if you are comfortable with it and know how to utilize it's strengths. In FPS, Sniping on a PC is a breeze and easy to do.

Driving with a mouse/keyboard, however... well, that makes me want to hurt a small animal.

Xtrema
05-22-2006, 09:57 PM
Originally posted by A790
Driving with a mouse/keyboard, however... well, that makes me want to hurt a small animal.

Ture, most BF player compliment with a joystick. Much easier to fly and drive.