1991 Benz 600SEL V12 & 1991 Soarer TT questions

[Graham_A_M]

Hi guys, I'll be selling my MX6 soon, in my sig and probably be buying a 1991 Mercedes 600SEL. On J-spec imports. They sell for $10k-$15k. And come with a 6.0 Liter V12 485hp.
Whats your opinion on these cars? are they reliable or how are the maintence costs? the 1991 BMW 850I's are disasters to maintain, and blow incredibly amounts of blue smoke after 150k I'm told. So its best to avoid that. But how are the Benz's?

Also, there are these older Soarer's on J-spec also, this one I have in mind is a fixer upper going for $3300 Landed. Its a TT. How are these cars? do the engines have LOTS of potential? What needs to be done to them to get 500hp? The TT sounds great, thus giving me lots of options I know Toyota makes great engines, so whats your opinion on either of these?

[Hakkola]

1991 600SEL is one of the best Mercedes you can buy IMO. You can't go wrong with it.

[Fosgate R]

485HP?
SEEMS A BIT HIGH for 91

[Hakkola]

Yeah, I didn't think they had that much hp either. Great car regardless.

Edit- should be about 390 hp, the 92' had 402... The SEL is a HUGE car so 0-60 is about 6.2 seconds or so.

600SL or preferably 600sec would be the best benz to get around that era IMO. Sounds like you want a 4 door though... :dunno:

[Neil4Speed]

600SELs are fantastic cars. Maintanance is quite expensive however, it is a much better bet than say a 8-Series. One thing that I find about the ones on J Spec is that, well, the JDM models seem to be "less-loaded" (if you can say that about a 600SEL) than the Japanese ones, perhaps because they are imported from Europe.

One thing about a 600SEL well, its a monster of a car. Monster on Gas, monster when it comes to maintance. But with it, you get a monster of an Engine, and a beheamoth of an ego knowing your driving the car that 99% of heads of state are driven in. :poosie:

To tell you the truth, I would not hesitate getting either car. Soarers are RHD which is the only thing preventing me from perhaps getting one myself. TT are quick, but they are not as easy to work with as people commonly percieve.

[Graham_A_M]

Your right about the 400hp. I thought it was 485 for some reason.
here are the specs I came up with
Mercedes-Benz M120 engine

The Mercedes-Benz M120 engine is a V12 automobile piston engine family used in the 1990s and 2000s.

The M120 family is built in Stuttgart, Germany. It has an aluminum engine block lined with silicon/aluminum. The aluminum DOHC cylinder heads are 4 valves per cylinder designs. It uses SFI fuel injection and features forged steel connecting rods.

600SEL

This engine developed 389-402HP and 400-428 lb-ft of torque for the 6.0L version.

Are they THAT bad on gas? What kind of maintenence costs would be expected to lets say a Crown Vic (as a example)?
If their THAT expensive then no thanks, but if its not TOO bad then may as well eh?
heres a pic of one
http://www.japanautodirect.com/stock/AUCTIONS%20JAPANESE%20CARS%20(1).jpg

I know the Soarer's are TOO easy to work on with those turbo's in the way, but is 500hp possble at all.. under $5k?

[nismodrifter]

I didn't even know they were out in 91'....euro's always get stuff first I guess..NA got the W140 as a 92.

I would stay away from it for that reason alone.....91/92 would be the very FIRST year for the W140 S-Class. I'd imagine that there is a isht load of stuff that was improved upon in the later model years.

I am not a W140 expert but I remember reading about electrical problemos...not sure who/what/where/when but just search the MBZ forums and find out about them.

[Hakkola]

They are THAT bad on gas, this car is bigger than any other mercedes S-Class ever made, it's a BEAST. Great car, but very heavy.

If you're looking for road presence, you really can't go wrong with it.

[C4S]

If I am corry .. as I remember .. it was ~380 HP .. similiar output with the 850CSi ... I think you got wrong info from those auction people?

It was a very high power car back then! :D

[Neil4Speed]

Just looking at the orignal brochure (I collect S-Class catalogs from the late 70's to date), 402HP @ 5200, 428lb @3800

Driving an S-Class is Lifes Supreme Automotive Pleasure.

[Hakkola]

Originally posted by Neil4Speed
Just looking at the orignal brochure (I collect S-Class catalogs from the late 70's to date), 402HP @ 5200, 428lb @3800

Driving an S-Class is Lifes Supreme Automotive Pleasure.

Check the date on that, I believe only 1992 and up had 402hp.

[C4S]

Originally posted by Hakkola


Check the date on that, I believe only 1992 and up had 402hp.

May be European date?

Well .. 380 HP .. 400HP .. close enough .. doesn't matter .. :D

[Graham_A_M]

Originally posted by Neil4Speed
Just looking at the orignal brochure (I collect S-Class catalogs from the late 70's to date), 402HP @ 5200, 428lb @3800

Driving an S-Class is Lifes Supreme Automotive Pleasure.

:thumbsup: That sure is cool. The "THAT bad on gas" doesn't sound nice, but this last comment really makes it worth it.
:hitit:

So 15-18MPG is to be expected? If its only that bad I'll probably do it then. but if its 10mpg, or so:barf:
They sure look like big cars, probably on par with a Lincoln Town car

[T-Dubbs]

how soon are u looking to buy a car?
my soarer is due in less than a month, you can come take a look if u like

[Neil4Speed]

Originally posted by Hakkola


Check the date on that, I believe only 1992 and up had 402hp.

Hakkola, you are really sharp! It is a 1992 Catalog. Again not to sure that your JDM one will have the same as it may be Euro Spec for emissions etc etc. Regardless you will have a super powerful car.

I would expect around 13-14MPG on an 600SEL


Consider also how much you will drive into your fuel milage concern. If your the average guy putting on say ~20,000 clicks per year, the extra cost per year for gas is around ~ $500-600 (in comparison to say an Soarer 2.5GT). Extra $50 a month for driving an V12 Sclass is worht every penny if you ask me.

While I am probably the bigger fans of soarers, there is NO BEATING, driving an S-Class, and at that the BEST S-CLASS, from the BEST Chassis. For engines so smooth their power pours forth in a seamless torrent, It is worth the expense.

"The Magnificent V-12 is a work of art" - Road and Track.

[Neil4Speed]

BTW. Note. 600SEL's are LONG cars, make sure it will fit in your garage.
(123.6 Inches for those measuring)