For those with engine swaps

[Speed_69]

just out of curiosity, for those of you who have engine swaps..do you tell your insurance company about it? or no?

For those who don't tell their insurance company, i know that insurance company's can deny you coverage if anything happens because you did not disclose material facts at time of application or did not reveal crucial material change during the policy.

[finboy]

step 1, find out how your insurance company feels about modifications, if they say it voids your policy, THEN you lie to them ;)

[cressida_pimpin]

i never told my insurance company..

I dont have collision so why would I?

they dont cover my car anyways.

[Top-Fuel]

Well i'd go find out for sure because I learnt a thing or two int he past week...my car got stolen and i had a B18C5 i put in this year and now I can't even claim that even if i had theft insurance.

[natejj]

I did.... they asked if it was a high performance engine.... since my engine did not have a label on it that read "HIGH PERFORMANCE", I told them it wasnt.

:angel:

hehe, it really wasnt thought, it was a 92 GTI 16valve engine

[Barlow]

Ummmm, I'm pretty sure if you can show valid recipts of work done and completed, and evidence that it went into the car that was stolen then you should be able to get your money for the engine regardless, although I'm sure the insurance company won't care what engine you have in it, they may throw in an extra 500-1000 dollars for the engine.

my $0.02

[Speed_69]

Yup, i'm a part-time insurance broker. I don't know of any insurer that will even insure you if you have an engine swap, not even third party liability. If you have an engine swapped vehicle w/ only third party liability coverage, and you are at an at-fault accident, they can still deny you coverage to the amount of $200,000 instead of $1,000,000 or $2,000,000 if they find out you didn't disclose material information that would give them reason to cancel you or even issue you a policy in the first place. And even if they pay the $200,000, they can subrogate against you after for the amount because it states that you must disclose any material changes in the policy or else they can void your policy. The only company willing to insure someone with a engine swap is called 'facility'. They have to insure anyone and third party liability coverage alone for them is $3,000+.

So that's why i'm wondering if guys tell your insurance company and how many people are risking it.

[Speed_69]

Originally posted by Barlow
Ummmm, I'm pretty sure if you can show valid recipts of work done and completed, and evidence that it went into the car that was stolen then you should be able to get your money for the engine regardless, although I'm sure the insurance company won't care what engine you have in it, they may throw in an extra 500-1000 dollars for the engine.

my $0.02

not true, insurance rates for each vehicle are based on STOCK options, parts and engine. They want to know about the engine swap before you do it or before a claim is made, not after.

[vtec]

just tell them your motor blew and you're going to replace the motor. If they ask what motor just say its another stock honda motor.

[WWJAI]

Originally posted by vtec
just tell them your motor blew and you're going to replace the motor. If they ask what motor just say its another stock honda motor.

but if your car is involved in an accident or gets stolen..its a whole different situation when you want to be claiming the motor especially when you paid much more for it.

[WWJAI]

When I talked to a broker from TD Meloche Monnex, he also told me they cover no car with any different engine other than stock unless its notified but usually they deny those cars. Anything from lowering your vehicle, and rims are all not covered and supposedly they can deny you for any modifications at all. Only thing that is covered is up to 1500 worth of car audio equipment. He was telling me about how a Honda Prelude got into an accident and it had over $30000 put into it and they didn't cover any of his claims afterwards because he did not advise them of the modifications so he got absolutely nothing from them. Harsh but its a risk when you drive modded vehicles.

[Speed_69]

so just some advice, tell your insurance company about your engine swapand any modifications if you have any and be willing to pay the higher premium, at least you know you'll be covered. For those who choose not to, you're basically paying insurance premiums for no coverage, you're just going to be fcuked up the ass by your insurance company when it comes time to put in a claim and they see your vehicle.

[Team Emperor]

Have your own insurance company ;)
*rings up Tony "make them an offer they can't refuse"*
:guns:

Sorry I just watched the Godfather

[_wrx_]

i told my insurance company about my engine mod when i had a 240sx with a sr20 its a must, beucae they can deny liability for your car

[New2Talon]

I told my insurance about my celica with a swapped 3sgte. She asked me if the performance was noticibly greater then stock motor (130hps stock --> 300hp turbo swap) I didnt answer that question directly but told her that the engine (3sgte) does come stock in other model celicas (gt-4/alltrac) and that it had some minor modifications. she told me she would call her head office to see if they had any problems with it. called me a day later and said they didnt have any problems.

edit: btw I never actually told her how much hp i have...

[4DoorGTZ]

My insurance company didnt have a problem with my engine swap as long as I didnt add a Turbo or S/C to a NA car. They also said with pictures/reciepts they would cover wheels and other mods.

Oddly they accept a "mild" engine swap but would deny me the second I "altered the ride height" I understand lifted trucks being a higher risk, but doesnt a lowered car handle better.

[LilDrunkenSmurf]

My insurance company knows... didn't charge more/less. Didn't really care.

[Hash_man]

Oddly they accept a "mild" engine swap but would deny me the second I "altered the ride height" I understand lifted trucks being a higher risk, but doesnt a lowered car handle better.

Could be if you had collision that they knew that just about anything you hit your bumper would probably be lower than the other cars causing a lot more damage then normal?

And you guys whos insurance companies were fine with swaps should post what company you're with... cuz i'm sure others are curious as am I.

[.civictyper.]

i used to have a civic hatch with a zc swap, i told my insurance company about it and i got the same question "Is the new engine have more horsepower then the stock one" i did the same thing and just said it came stock in older model honda crx's from japan. they didnt have an issue with it

[hoamic11]

yeah i'm just wondering how insurance companies deal with stereo's and mods and shit, cause i haven't registar'd my car yet here, cause i haven't been here long enough

i was thinking that i would go with TD Meloche, is it pretty good place or is there somewhere better?

[99atlantic]

if you do an engine swap and don't report it, if you ever get into an accident and they find out your coverage will be void....enjoying finding coverage having to tell insureres that you were dropped for insurance fraud. :thumbsdow


Originally posted by hoamic11
yeah i'm just wondering how insurance companies deal with stereo's and mods and shit, cause i haven't registar'd my car yet here, cause i haven't been here long enough

i was thinking that i would go with TD Meloche, is it pretty good place or is there somewhere better?

I think meloche is okay? I've been with them since I was 16, no accidents, no tickets, 23, 2003 911, 2003 g35 coupe, it's either $1,200 or $1,500 per year, $1k deductible, max liability coverage (?$2M?)

For high price stereo and electronic stuff there's generally an addition they do to the policy for that type of equipement if it isn't in the basic policy. But if it's like most people who throw in a piece of shit $300 stereo, well, no point paying the premium on that.

[thesmackdown]

god i dont missing in alberta, SGI doesn't give one shit if your car is modified just so long as it is safe, concept eh lol.

[99atlantic]

Originally posted by thesmackdown
god i dont missing in alberta, SGI doesn't give one shit if your car is modified just so long as it is safe, concept eh lol.

I bet they do care if you tell them 'oh yea, I just added another 200hp'. Doesn't matter where you're insured, fact is actuaries figure out hte rates based on what the standard use; change the standard use, change the premium :nut:

[dudeman]

The last company i was with was johnson renfrew of something, they offered a "modified vehicle" insurance. Required getting the car appraised independently, and almost ridiculous rates. Depending on whats done to your car though, probably worth it. Otherwise, say your driving a supercharged mustang, get into an accident, gotta run out into the road with a wrench and pull out the s/c before the cops come!

Good luck, if nascar pit crews can do it in 13 seconds, maybe 5 minutes is all itll take you! :nut:

[HiSpec]

Originally posted by dudeman


Good luck, if nascar pit crews can do it in 13 seconds, maybe 5 minutes is all itll take you! :nut:

13 seconds for a S/C? you are kidding right?? :eek:

[WWJAI]

Originally posted by dudeman

Good luck, if nascar pit crews can do it in 13 seconds, maybe 5 minutes is all itll take you! :nut:

:rofl: And good luck trying to explain yourself when they arrive and see you with a whole bunch of internal parts.

[hoamic11]

hahahaha, yeah that be the best situation


well i guess this stuff, who would you go to for OOP inspections for cars that are modded and what is ok here? like is it ok not still not have a cat, or will i not pass inspection w/o one?

[That.Guy.S30]

Originally posted by dudeman
The last company i was with was johnson renfrew of something, they offered a "modified vehicle" insurance. Required getting the car appraised independently, and almost ridiculous rates.

thank god. i was beginning to doubt my new project. at least i know i can insure it now.

[Hash_man]

thank god. i was beginning to doubt my new project. at least i know i can insure it now.

I'm pretty sure melonche monnex offers appraisal insurance too/

[That.Guy.S30]

^ i got a regular quote for my car insurance online at melonche and it was quite expensive.. . i would hate to see what a modified insurance qoute would look like.

[TimG]

anyone who claims that their insurance company 'doesn't care' about engine swaps or other mods is delusional.

don't get your broker's word for it as their word means nothing when you're dealing with the insurance company.

even if you call up your insurance company and speak with a customer server rep about it, i'm willing to bet that they aren't very knowledable about these things. ask to be transfered to the claims dept or to speak with someone adjuster or someone in the underwriting dept. if you can get them to send you something in writing that they will cover an aftermarket turbo kit or a performance engine swap, i'll buy you a beer.

[Speed_69]

The only company that i am aware of that is willing to accept applicants with aftermarket turbo, supercharger, performance engine swaps etc.. is called "Facility Association". The only servicing carriers of "Facility Association" in Western Canada is The co-operators, Nordic Insurance & Royal and SunAlliance. The brokerage i work for uses Nordic Insurance but trust me, anyone who uses Facility will be raped up the ass for insurance but it's still worth it rather then paying for premiums and finding out your policy is void when you have an accident because you didn't tell your insurance company about it.

[Speed_69]

Originally posted by TimG


don't get your broker's word for it as their word means nothing when you're dealing with the insurance company.

even if you call up your insurance company and speak with a customer server rep about it, i'm willing to bet that they aren't very knowledable about these things. ask to be transfered to the claims dept or to speak with someone adjuster or someone in the underwriting dept.

definitely listen to this him! you want to speak to an underwriter yourself about these issues, not a broker. even though i'm a broker myself haha:rofl: they are more knowledgeable about the companys policys then the broker

[dansmith11]

i think you just have to live with the fact that you cant claim your swapped jdm engine to get more money if your car is stolen. its a risk you take for having a swapped car.

as for them denying coverage for a swap, how many insurance companies really know what engine came in an 89 civic? if the motor says honda on it, my guess is they are going to assume its stock, and even if they figure out its not, how are they supposed to prove i knew about it?

"no mr insurance guy i didnt modifiy my car, when i bought it this is how it was, i just assumed thats the engine that came in the car, how should i know?"

unless theres something in my insurance policy which says im required to know the mechanics of my car and which parts are stock and which arent, but i doubt it.

[TimG]

Originally posted by Speed_69
The only company that i am aware of that is willing to accept applicants with aftermarket turbo, supercharger, performance engine swaps etc.. is called "Facility Association". The only servicing carriers of "Facility Association" in Western Canada is The co-operators, Nordic Insurance & Royal and SunAlliance. The brokerage i work for uses Nordic Insurance but trust me, anyone who uses Facility will be raped up the ass for insurance but it's still worth it rather then paying for premiums and finding out your policy is void when you have an accident because you didn't tell your insurance company about it.

Exactly. Facility insures all of the high risk people that nobody else wants to touch like people who have had their liscence suspended for DUI or other infractions.

And pleading ignorance won't work. Read the fine print on the forms that you signed your name to when you got your policy.

Insurance companies base their premiums on risk. Obviously the risk is not the same in a 90hp econobox vs. that same econobox with a 300 hp turbo engine.

There was a guy in Ontario just outside of Ottawa who had a WRX and the only mod that he had on it was a roll cage because he did rally racing. the engine and suspension were completely stock. to make a long story short, he clipped a deer one day and tried to make a claim for a new headlight and some body work on the front bumper and fender. The appraiser saw the roll cage and denied his claim. 1 week later he got a letter from his insurance company (State Farm) saying that they were dropping his insurance policy in 10 days because he breached his contract with them.

you're gambling either way.

[Annoyingrob]

Originally posted by Hash_man


I'm pretty sure melonche monnex offers appraisal insurance too/

Yup, they sure do. I'm pretty sure they will insure just about ANYTHING. They insure my car, and it's imported from Japan.

They wanted to know if it had a turbo. "Yeah, it has a couple"

BTW, my insurance is pretty cheap through Meloche Monnex. As long as the vehicle appraisal is up to date with pictures, and modifications, they should insure it no problem.

[hoamic11]

Originally posted by Annoyingrob


Yup, they sure do. I'm pretty sure they will insure just about ANYTHING. They insure my car, and it's imported from Japan.

They wanted to know if it had a turbo. "Yeah, it has a couple"

BTW, my insurance is pretty cheap through Meloche Monnex. As long as the vehicle appraisal is up to date with pictures, and modifications, they should insure it no problem.

they didn't really increase your insurance for what you have?

well i'm gonn have to start looking into that and seeing how much it'll cost me

[EG_Civic]

thats why u always go one way insurance coverage

[hoamic11]

EG_Civic
thats why u always go one way insurance coverage

how's that work?

do you wanna explain/tell me what one way insurance is, thx

[tony7077]

i just got a sr20 240 2 days ago..i had to lie because they
asked like so many questions about if i had mods on it lol

[Speed_69]

Originally posted by EG_Civic
thats why u always go one way insurance coverage


Originally posted by Speed_69
If you have an engine swapped vehicle w/ only third party liability coverage, and you are at an at-fault accident, they can still deny you coverage to the amount of $200,000 instead of $1,000,000 or $2,000,000 if they find out you didn't disclose material information that would give them reason to cancel you or even issue you a policy in the first place. And even if they pay the $200,000, they can subrogate against you after for the amount because it states that you must disclose any material changes in the policy or else they can void your policy.

Did you not read this??:banghead:
It's funny how some people only think about their car being damaged, you could get injured or a passenger in your vehicle could die. Then you find out you no longer get any accident benefits.

[New2Talon]

So I'm with "facility" (with cooperators) and my broker told me that my car with a swapped turbo engine will be fine. I only pay about $10 a month more for this car than i do on my other car (one is a 94 hatchback, stock motor/ second car is 98 vert with swapped turbo motor). I told her that the motor came stock on some models sold in north american domestic market, she called her head office to check, and told me that I should be fine.

Even though im with facility, should I shill talk to an underwriter/adjuster?

[New2Talon]

Is anyone else with "facility assoc."?

What do you pay a month? For what coverage (liability, fire&theft, collision, glass etc)

Im with cooperators and pay 215/month on a 94 celica hatch full coverage except glass. BTW im 18 and have no tickets/claims

[TimG]

get it in writing from the underwriter. your insurance broker's word it meaningless. even a verbal ok from a representative from your underwriter is meaningless. get it in writing and signed

[WWJAI]

Originally posted by New2Talon
Is anyone else with "facility assoc."?

What do you pay a month? For what coverage (liability, fire&theft, collision, glass etc)

Im with cooperators and pay 215/month on a 94 celica hatch full coverage except glass. BTW im 18 and have no tickets/claims

WTF. That's cheaper than what I pay for a 97 civic with full coverage except glass. And i'm 20 with no tickets or claims and i'm on my father's policy. And i'm not even with facility (not modded car).

[DonJuan]

I asked my insurance agent (AMA) about a swapped engine in my car and he said as long as I didn't drop in a V8 or sumthin that would make the car pass saftey inspection it would be fine. I told him that it was actually going to a smaller Nissan engine and some of these engines come with a turbo. He replied "I don't know why you'd want to put a diesel in that car but at least you'll get good gas milage." :rofl: All he wanted to know about was recipts for stereo stuff (less than $5000 worth) and no hooked up nitrous kits, it can be in there for show "as long the cops don't have a problem with it I don't have a problem with it." Man I love this guy!

[Speed_69]

Originally posted by New2Talon
So I'm with "facility" (with cooperators) and my broker told me that my car with a swapped turbo engine will be fine. I only pay about $10 a month more for this car than i do on my other car (one is a 94 hatchback, stock motor/ second car is 98 vert with swapped turbo motor). I told her that the motor came stock on some models sold in north american domestic market, she called her head office to check, and told me that I should be fine.

Even though im with facility, should I shill talk to an underwriter/adjuster?
Are you sure you're even with "facility"? Just because you're with The Co-operators doesn't automatically mean you're with "facility". The co-operators are just a servicing carrier of facility. They have their own personal lines of insurance as well. And the co-operators doesn't go through brokers, so i don't know who you're talking with :dunno: they have their own agents.

[TimG]

Originally posted by DonJuan
I asked my insurance agent (AMA) about a swapped engine in my car and he said as long as I didn't drop in a V8 or sumthin that would make the car pass saftey inspection it would be fine. I told him that it was actually going to a smaller Nissan engine and some of these engines come with a turbo. He replied "I don't know why you'd want to put a diesel in that car but at least you'll get good gas milage." :rofl: All he wanted to know about was recipts for stereo stuff (less than $5000 worth) and no hooked up nitrous kits, it can be in there for show "as long the cops don't have a problem with it I don't have a problem with it." Man I love this guy!

call AMA's underwriter and ask to speak with an adjuster and ask him the same questions. I can guarantee you won't get the same answer. The insurance agent's word means fuck all. they just want to sign you on as a customer, and judging from his reply to you, he doesn't know what he's talking about.

[New2Talon]

Originally posted by Speed_69

Are you sure you're even with "facility"? Just because you're with The Co-operators doesn't automatically mean you're with "facility". The co-operators are just a servicing carrier of facility. They have their own personal lines of insurance as well. And the co-operators doesn't go through brokers, so i don't know who you're talking with :dunno: they have their own agents.


Alright thanks. Ill try and find out soon who Im actually covered under. I just assumed broker is same as agent, no?

[Masked Bandit]

Originally posted by New2Talon



Alright thanks. Ill try and find out soon who Im actually covered under. I just assumed broker is same as agent, no?

Not quite...

A broker sells many different "brands" (insurance companies) of insurance, an agen will sell for just one (like State Farm / Cooperators / AMA).

It's kind like the difference between Future Shop and the Sony store. The guy at Future Shop can sell you many different brands but the guy at the Sony Store only has Sony.

[Annoyingrob]

Originally posted by hoamic11


they didn't really increase your insurance for what you have?

well i'm gonn have to start looking into that and seeing how much it'll cost me

Nope, my actual insurance quote was nly about $10 higher then they're "Estimated" price before I gave them the report of what the car really was.

My insurance costs me something like $140/mo for liability, theft, vandalism, acts of nature, etc. with a $250 deductible. Everything but collision. Basically if I'm not in my car, anything is covered, if I am in my car, and I get into an accident that is my fault, it's not. This covers my car stereo equipment (up to $1500) too.

I had a vehicle appraisal done about 6 months ago, and was appraised at $7500, which almost covers vehicle cost, AND all the fees to get it here to canada AND dealer brokerage, so I'm coming out ahead if someone were to ever destroy it. I figured it wasn't worth it to get comprehensive insurance on it, as for the extra cost in insurance, I just throw that in a bank account, and have almost covered it's replacement cost.

They know it's a Supra Turbo, from Japan, and have Detailed pictures of the engine bay if they were to ever argue "You didn't say Twin Turbo!", it wouldn't fly.

I think it's a pertty damn good price for insurance. I guess it's one of the joys of owning a 15 year old car that's not stolen very often.