Opinions? AWD/RWD luxury cars

[yellowsnow]

I'm looking to buy a used car soon, and want to get something with more luxury and comfort. would prefer 4 doors, but can do a 2 door with ample rear seating space. I want something good in mileage, then performance, and then luxury features.

I've narrowed my choices down to the following, and would appreciate some feedback. my budget is under $30g

1. Lexus IS300
2. BMW 325i
3. Mercedez C230
4. Audi A4 quattro
5. ??

i'm outta ideas... not thinking of the g35, as my friend is gonna get that...

thanks! :D

[snowboard]

You mean mercedes c240/320..

[pinoyhero]

I would recommend the G for sure, but if your against that you best net is the IS, you'll be able to see from my autosig that I've been through this before.

[dj_rice]

2 or 3 for me....

IS300 is a girls car...Audi's are hard to maintain


Maybe put a Acura TL...those are pretty nice and good price

[dino_martini]

Subaru Legacy. Its not exactly luxury...but close enough

[Zephyr]

Originally posted by dj_rice
2 or 3 for me....

IS300 is a girls car...Audi's are hard to maintain


Maybe put a Acura TL...those are pretty nice and good price

IS isnt a girl's car.

Get a IS250 AWD :thumbsup:

[bituerbo]

bleh, stick to a RWD IS300, manual transmission.

[lexIS300]

How is a IS a girls car?

same choices i went with the IS. but imo if you are able to get a G35C do it. im going to be selling my IS for a G

[AllGoNoShow]

TL is FWD.

go for a 330 over the 325, you will be pleased with the power more then the 325.


Benz is nice as well, I would choose the Bimmer o rBenz over the Lexus or Audi myself.

[Evro]

hahaha all the IS 300 owners: "It's not a girls car!"

I agree with guy above ^^^ 330 ftw

[tentacles]

You mean Zephyr isn't a girl?

[4doorj]

i would go with the is300:thumbsup:

[GC84ever]

Originally posted by dino_martini
Subaru Legacy. Its not exactly luxury...but close enough

+1
you might be even able to transfer some of your STi mods to your Legacy.

[BoS_DC2]

Originally posted by GC84ever


+1
you might be even able to transfer some of your STi mods to your Legacy.

+2 for Subaru Legacy

[yellowsnow]

Originally posted by Zephyr


IS isnt a girl's car.

Get a IS250 AWD :thumbsup:

If you can find me a IS250 for under $30g pm me quick! :D i was close to putting down a deposit for an IS250, but decided i shouldn't tie all my money down on a car :p

I don't want anything with too many miles on it. preferbly under 100000kms. the 330 would be nice, but it's probably over my budget.

and no, i mean the c230 coupe krompessor... don't really like the styling of the other years

the legacy eh? i'll look into it, but if it's anything like the interior of an sti... i'm looking for something a little nicer.

[sh0ko]

cadillac cts ftw in my opinion.. its but thats a fwd i believe

[Annoyingrob]

Get an IS300, and throw a twin turbo supra engine in it (bolts right in).

Luxury, and performance :)

[yellowsnow]

^^ lol... but gas mileage would suck big time

[GTS Jeff]

Originally posted by yellowsnow
the legacy eh? i'll look into it, but if it's anything like the interior of an sti... i'm looking for something a little nicer. The Legacy has an interior fitting of its price tag.

[ZorroAMG]

Originally posted by snowboard
You mean mercedes c240/320..

No. He means C230. Thanks.

[gp36912]

well i think a audi s4 b5 gen, (around 2000,2001) the price is roughly 25gs but you get luxury, performance, and decent milage

[Rarasaurus]

bmw 528 or 530 is rwd decent power and somewhat economic.

[tentacles]

CTS/CTS-V are RWD.

CTS-V with LS2 is 90% of an M5 or E63 AMG for about 65% of the price.
:thumbsup:

[AllGoNoShow]

Yah but the question to that tentacles would be are the new Caddys up to the build quality and craftsmen ship of a BMW or MB product?

[Aleks]

Subaru Legacy GT Spec B

[Cruz]

Originally posted by gp36912
well i think a audi s4 b5 gen, (around 2000,2001) the price is roughly 25gs but you get luxury, performance, and decent milage

:thumbsup: :thumbsup:

[tentacles]

build quality and craftsmen ship of a BMW or MB product?

You mean the mechanical/electrical reliability of modern BMW or MB that is worse than Hyundai?

I think GM has left the Euro brands in the dust some time ago when it comes to reliability and build quality.. :D

[ZorroAMG]

Oh, yes, let's jump on the media bandwagon.:rolleyes: The main reason why there are more complaints about the BMW/AUDI/MB brands for quality is because the owners of thos vehicles are much more picky. Every little minor problem gets them a negative rating. Owners of your beloved GM and Hyundai are just too redneck to know how a car should drive/operate so they let little bugs go unmentioned much more than the discerning euro buyer.

Who in their right mind would buy GM/Ford anyhow??


Don't beleive the hype.

[GTS Jeff]

Originally posted by ZorroAMG
Oh, yes, let's jump on the media bandwagon.:rolleyes: The main reason why there are more complaints about the BMW/AUDI/MB brands for quality is because the owners of thos vehicles are much more picky. Every little minor problem gets them a negative rating. Owners of your beloved GM and Hyundai are just too redneck to know how a car should drive/operate so they let little bugs go unmentioned much more than the discerning euro buyer.

Who in their right mind would buy GM/Ford anyhow??


Don't beleive the hype. haha that's the first time I've heard that argument...you have a point too, but then again, I think the Euro owners SHOULD be more picky...after all, they ARE paying a premium.

[That.Guy.S30]

Originally posted by Aleks
Subaru Legacy GT Spec B

im with this guy!
6speed with SI-drive and navi

[benyl]

Originally posted by tentacles
CTS/CTS-V are RWD.

CTS-V with LS2 is 90% of an M5 or E63 AMG for about 65% of the price.
:thumbsup:

Until you destroy the rear diff. Then it isn't near 90% as it doesn't move.

[benyl]

Originally posted by ZorroAMG
Oh, yes, let's jump on the media bandwagon.:rolleyes: The main reason why there are more complaints about the BMW/AUDI/MB brands for quality is because the owners of thos vehicles are much more picky. Every little minor problem gets them a negative rating. Owners of your beloved GM and Hyundai are just too redneck to know how a car should drive/operate so they let little bugs go unmentioned much more than the discerning euro buyer.

Who in their right mind would buy GM/Ford anyhow??


Don't beleive the hype.

Right, cause the build quality of the MB ML series is so awesome! The coilpack failures that the Audi's had were just an urban myth.

The typical owner of a BMW/MB/Audi is not an enthusiast. They are either rich and don't give a shit, or they are a poseur... Most rednecks know when their tires are flat, they don't need a tire pressure monitoring system to tell them that.

:drama: :drama:

[tentacles]

haha that's the first time I've heard that argument...you have a point too, but then again, I think the Euro owners SHOULD be more picky...after all, they ARE paying a premium.

You must not go to many BMW/Benz dealerships then? Any salesman at any MB dealers can give you a 45min lecture on why both Consumer Reports and Edmunds are full of shit, and that a MB is more reliable than a Buick despite what they say. :rofl:

[soloracer]

Didn't Mercedes have to announce that they had one billion dollars in recalls last year alone? It got so bad that they had to tell everyone publicly what they were going to do to correct the problem. Their quality has steadily gone downhill ever since the early 90's.

[AllGoNoShow]

Yes but you got to remember, when Mercedes recalls everything, just about all the MB owners I know have it fixed within a week at the dealership. Which makes for more MB's getting fixed right away then say another company.

How many freinds drive say cavaliers with $150 recalls persay?

For every 4 Cavaliers thats $600
1 Mercedes Recall could be $500

But how many of the Cavalier owners actually KNOW about it in the first plae or if they do know about it, take it in to get fixed?

Most people who buy cavaliers are looking for a cheap, fuel efficent car to last them a little bit of driving to an from work. They care fuck all about the build quality, how shit should work, make sure everything is working at once, and so on because they never bought acar they thought would do that, they bought a Manufacture beater.

So if there is 5000 Cavaliers in the city, only 100 of them watch recalls, tell freinds with cavaliers about recalls, makes about lets say 300 people know about the recalls, and probably 50 get them fixed.

Mercedes Benz owners get alerted *or should* of any recalls on their cars when they bring it in for service. And yes some people who drive Benz's know absolutly fuck all about automobiles, but a recall from factory is enough in their brains to click and say hey maybe I should get that fixed before my car blows up and I'm out 70,000. Thats the difference.

[ZorroAMG]

Originally posted by benyl


Right, cause the build quality of the MB ML series is so awesome!

Right, cause where is the ML/R class built? That's right good ole ALABAMA.

Seriously, I thought you knew more than that. More proof that it only takes americans to ruin a good idea...LOL:whocares:

[tentacles]

Right, cause where is the ML/R class built? That's right good ole ALABAMA.

So how come Hondas built in Alabama (Pilot, Odyssey) don't suck? Every single 2006 Odyssey is built in Alabama and it's the best minivan in the fucking world. I guess those vibrating air conditioned seats are just too much technology for stupid American workers to handle? :rofl:

[soloracer]

Originally posted by AllGoNoShow
Yes but you got to remember, when Mercedes recalls everything, just about all the MB owners I know have it fixed within a week at the dealership. Which makes for more MB's getting fixed right away then say another company.

How many freinds drive say cavaliers with $150 recalls persay?

For every 4 Cavaliers thats $600
1 Mercedes Recall could be $500

But how many of the Cavalier owners actually KNOW about it in the first plae or if they do know about it, take it in to get fixed?

Most people who buy cavaliers are looking for a cheap, fuel efficent car to last them a little bit of driving to an from work. They care fuck all about the build quality, how shit should work, make sure everything is working at once, and so on because they never bought acar they thought would do that, they bought a Manufacture beater.

So if there is 5000 Cavaliers in the city, only 100 of them watch recalls, tell freinds with cavaliers about recalls, makes about lets say 300 people know about the recalls, and probably 50 get them fixed.

Mercedes Benz owners get alerted *or should* of any recalls on their cars when they bring it in for service. And yes some people who drive Benz's know absolutly fuck all about automobiles, but a recall from factory is enough in their brains to click and say hey maybe I should get that fixed before my car blows up and I'm out 70,000. Thats the difference.

Sorry I didn't mean recalls I meant warranty claims. I mispoke in my previous post. MB had to adjust their earnings forecast due to their dismal warranty record. And don't give me the BS about Cavalier owners, etc. If the car doesn't run or something is broken it doesn't matter if the make and model is Mercedes, BMW or Chevrolet because you can be sure that the owners will take them back. Even Hyundai offers 10 year warranties so don't bring up any "well the BMW/MB warranty is better" stuff either. I have a friend whose father owned a MB and was a good friend with the dealer guys. They told him that MB actually sent a notice out to their service departments to "manage their warranty claims more effectively" which basically means deny, deny, deny and hope people won't persist in getting something fixed. His E55 was in the shop a ton more than it should have been. Their quality has gone downhill and the statistics back it up.

[black_2.5RS]

IS250

[soloracer]

As for the original post - have you thought about the Lexus GS430 or any of the GS cars for that matter? You get 4 doors, a nice V8 and high quality luxury ride. I would even bet that the mileage is pretty decent.

[dino_martini]

Originally posted by Aleks
Subaru Legacy GT Spec B

Show me a Spec. B for 30k. A brand new one in Canada starts at 44k. :eek: You can almost import an STi for that much.

[ZorroAMG]

Originally posted by tentacles


So how come Hondas built in Alabama (Pilot, Odyssey) don't suck? Every single 2006 Odyssey is built in Alabama and it's the best minivan in the fucking world. I guess those vibrating air conditioned seats are just too much technology for stupid American workers to handle? :rofl:

Oh, YES, a year old minivan is a great comparison :rolleyes: It's not even enough time to say whether it's that great or not. . Anyway, Testicles, let's just agree to disagree. You go drive your buicks and sunfires and I'll stick to my overpriced, underbuilt german cars.:rofl:

[tentacles]

Oh, YES, a year old minivan is a great comparison

Well what is the M-class supposed to be, aside from a minivan with bigger wheels? :) I said 2006 Odyssey because I think 2006 was the year they stopped making them elsewhere and shifted ALL production to the Lincoln AL plant, they've actually been producing the Odyssey there for years.
You can't dispute that the Odyssey is the best minivan in the world, can you?

Bottom line is that Honda has been making good cars in Alabama for 13 years, so saying that the M-class sucks because it's built in Alabama isn't very convincing, is it?


Anyway, Testicles, let's just agree to disagree. You go drive your buicks and sunfires and I'll stick to my overpriced, underbuilt german cars.

Come on now, there's no need for name-calling, I appreciate the help you gave in the other thread on MB mechanics, I started it because I just bought one(heh), and I figure I'll be needing a good mechanic.

So I REALLY REALLY hope you're right about the build quality. :D

[soloracer]

Originally posted by ZorroAMG


Oh, YES, a year old minivan is a great comparison :rolleyes: It's not even enough time to say whether it's that great or not. . Anyway, Testicles, let's just agree to disagree. You go drive your buicks and sunfires and I'll stick to my overpriced, underbuilt german cars.:rofl:

What I find funny is the fact that you own the two more reliable German cars - a new Porsche and an old Mercedes. Go trade your old Benz in on a newer model why don't you? You might be surprised at how far down the quality has gone.

[ZorroAMG]

Originally posted by tentacles




Come on now, there's no need for name-calling,

Simple typo :D

Solo: I won't sell my MB, unless I find a good 92-93 500E, but I will buy a newer benz anyday as another vehicle.....it's been all MB in my family and new or old, the problems are no more than other makes....personal experience is better than stats IMO.

As far as the MB built in Alabama, it's a known fact that the ML and R class are the worst built in the mb lineup....now how can that NOT be geographically influenced?

[Nite_Rydah]

Go for the A4 :thumbsup: (but then again I'm biased)

[Aleks]

Originally posted by dino_martini


Show me a Spec. B for 30k. A brand new one in Canada starts at 44k. :eek: You can almost import an STi for that much.

None of the cars on that list as under 30K brand new. Nowhere near that. Subaru fits with those cars, in the same price range. Might be harder to find (ie import from states used).

[yellowsnow]

Originally posted by Aleks


None of the cars on that list as under 30K brand new. Nowhere near that. Subaru fits with those cars, in the same price range. Might be harder to find (ie import from states used).

i believe the very first sentence i used was "I'm looking to buy a used car" :)

[Mitsu3000gt]

There is a 2003 330i M sport in the marketplace right now for like $31,000 and it has 2 sets of wheels and low KM. Definately get the 330 over the 325/328 as others have suggested if you choose BMW.

I would for sure suggest a 2000-2002 S4 as my #1 pick. They are great on their own but for $2000 you can get a chip and coilovers and now you have height adjustment, amazing handling, and 310hp/370 ft/lb of torque. All this with 4 doors of practicality, every luxury feature (only options were better stereo, sunroof and NAV), and AWD for the winter time. There is no car around $30K that can touch it for performance/practicality/Quality/Features IMO.

If i were you, I'd go drive an Audi S4, Audi A4, BMW 330i, Infinity G35X, Subaru Legacy GT, BMW 540i and a Lexus GS400 and buy the one you like the best.

I think alot of the people here who say German cars are unreliable have never owned them (some probably have). I have an S4 and my dad has a 540i and neither of us have ever had a single problem, only regular maitenence. I know a ton of people with german cars (audi and bmw mostly, some VW) and none of them have had problems. They are built like tanks and have amazing drivetrains. Just shutting the 100lb door in one and listening to the sound it makes compared to most other vehicles should help you understand how its built.

I also think the "problems per 100 cars" ratings are useless because they count EVERYTHING as a problem and don't rank the severity. For example, a Mercedes Benz gets a new cup holder under warranty, thats counted as a "problem". Then you have your american car getting a new engine or tranny and that is also one "problem". Take a drive in front of National Transmission and Mister Transmission on McLeod, the ONLY cars I have seen in their parking lots since may (drive by twice a day) have been American (except a first gen honda oddesey one day). Additionally the german cars generally have more options/features/gadgets so there are more things to go wrong in the first place. Obviously this would not refer to every single sample ever made but the vast majority of them. American cars are just a collection of parts and plastics from the lowest bidders. It costs less to build american cars than any other brand out there as well. I've also never seen bare metal in a car interior before except in american cars (even newer ones, like 2002++). Every car magazine I've ever read in my life has also agreed they are lower quality. Also, if you've ever seen the top gear episode on the Cadillac Escalade (a 80,000+$$ vehicle) all they do is make fun of how poorly its built and the amount of plastic in it. These are guys who drive european stuff all day long so it really stood out to them when an american car came rolling in. There is a rats nest of wires under the driver's seat, the roof is that super fuzzy material, there is plastic EVERYWHERE, all buttons/switches are extremely cheap, etc. etc and this thing costs $80,000+. I know you dont need an escalade but its just one example.

Anyways back on topic, just take a whole morning/afternoon and go drive 5 or 6 of your top choices back to back and then make a decision. If you have any specific questions about the 540i or S4 I would be happy to help you out.

[Aleks]

Originally posted by yellowsnow


i believe the very first sentence i used was "I'm looking to buy a used car" :)

I know. I was just stating that a Used Subaru Legacy GT spec B would be in the same price range as any of the other cars everyone has mentioned. :)
They came out in the States last year, and this year in Canada.

[bigboom]

if i had to choose from your list id have to go with an IS300, i loved mine and still regret selling it. lexus build quality and service is second to none and once i have another chance im definetly going back to lexus.

[wheelz]

Have you considered the mazda Speed6. Much nicer interior than the Legacy, more room, and pretty quick to boot. When I was looking for a new car it was the best blend of luxury and performance I coul find. The only thing close was the Audi A3 and it wasnt that close in price (way more with options) and didnt have the power or AWD. It seems to get good gas milage all things considered. I have been averaging 25mpg pure city driving. Finding one for $30k right now might be a stretch, but the financing rate through mazda is really good, might help you go new.

[wheelz]

Originally posted by Mitsu3000gt

Anyways back on topic, just take a whole morning/afternoon and go drive 5 or 6 of your top choices back to back and then make a decision.

Good advice. Thats exactly what I did but it took more than one morning to try them. Once you drive a few you will be suprised how easy it is to cross them off your list.