"Sicko"

[joyridder]

Freedom of Speech my a**
Although some may agree that his views are eccentric in nature, I think this is a little exaggerated.....



LOS ANGELES - Academy Award-winning filmmaker Michael Moore is under investigation by the U.S. Treasury Department for taking ailing Sept. 11 rescue workers to Cuba for a segment in his upcoming health-care documentary "Sicko," The Associated Press has learned.

"Sicko" promises to take the health-care industry to task the way Moore confronted America's passion for guns in "Bowling for Columbine" and skewered Bush over his handling of Sept. 11 in "Fahrenheit 9/11."


The Treasury Department's Office of Foreign Assets Control notified Moore in a letter dated May 2 that it was conducting a civil investigation for possible violations of the U.S. trade embargo restricting travel to Cuba. A copy of the letter was obtained Wednesday by the AP.

"This office has no record that a specific license was issued authorizing you to engage in travel-related transactions involving Cuba," Dale Thompson, OFAC chief of general investigations and field operations, wrote in the letter to Moore.

In March, Moore took about 10 ailing workers from the Ground Zero rescue effort in Manhattan for treatment in Cuba, said a person working with the filmmaker on the release of "Sicko." The person requested anonymity because Moore's attorneys had not yet determined how to respond.

Moore, who scolded Bush over the Iraq war during the 2003 Oscar telecast, received the letter Monday, the person said. "Sicko" premieres May 19 at the Cannes Film Festival and debuts in U.S. theaters June 29.

Moore declined to comment, said spokeswoman Lisa Cohen.

In a statement Thursday, "Sicko" producer Meghan O'Hara said the Treasury investigation might be an attempt to undermine the film.

"Our health-care system is broken and, all too often, deadly," O'Hara said. "The efforts of the Bush administration to conduct a politically motivated investigation of Michael Moore and `Sicko' will not stop us from making sure the American people see this film."

After receiving the letter, Moore arranged to place a copy of the film in a "safe house" outside the country to protect it from government interference, said the person working on the release of the film.

Sept. 11 rescue workers "risked their lives searching for survivors, recovering bodies, and clearing away toxic rubble," O'Hara said. "Now, many of these heroes face serious health issues, and far too many of them are not receiving the care they need and deserve."

Treasury officials would not comment specifically about Moore's case. But department spokeswoman Molly Millerwise said OFAC is "required to investigate potential violations of these programs. In doing so, OFAC issues hundreds of letters each year asking for additional information when possible sanctions violations have occurred."

The letter noted that Moore applied Oct. 12, 2006, for permission to go to Cuba "but no determination had been made by OFAC." Moore sought permission to travel there under a provision for full-time journalists, the letter said.

According to the letter, Moore was given 20 business days to provide OFAC with such information as the date of travel and point of departure; the reason for the Cuba trip and his itinerary there; and the names and addresses of those who accompanied him, along with their reasons for going.

Potential penalties for violating the embargo were not indicated. In 2003, the New York Yankees paid the government $75,000 to settle a dispute that it conducted business in Cuba in violation of the embargo. No specifics were released about that case.

"Sicko" is Moore's followup to 2004's "Fahrenheit 9/11," a $100 million hit criticizing the Bush administration over Sept. 11. Moore's "Bowling for Columbine" won the 2002 Oscar for best documentary.

A dissection of the U.S. health-care system, "Sicko" was inspired by a segment on Moore's TV show "The Awful Truth," in which he staged a mock funeral outside a health-maintenance organization that had declined a pancreas transplant for a diabetic man. The HMO later relented.

At last September's Toronto International Film Festival, Moore previewed footage shot for "Sicko," presenting stories of personal health-care nightmares. One scene showed a woman who was denied payment for an ambulance ride after a head-on collision because it was not preapproved.

Moore's opponents have accused him of distorting the facts, and his Cuba trip provoked criticism from conservatives including former Republican Sen. Fred Thompson, who assailed the filmmaker in a blog at National Review Online.

"I have no expectation that Moore is going to tell the truth about Cuba or health care," wrote Thompson, the subject of speculation about a possible presidential run. "I defend his right to do what he does, but Moore's talent for clever falsehoods has been too well documented."

The timing of the investigation is reminiscent of the firestorm that preceded the Cannes debut of "Fahrenheit 9/11," which won the festival's top prize in 2004. The Walt Disney Co. refused to let subsidiary Miramax release the film because of its political content, prompting Miramax bosses Harvey and Bob Weinstein to release "Fahrenheit 9/11" on their own.

The Weinsteins later left Miramax to form the Weinstein Co., which is releasing "Sicko." They declined to comment on the Treasury investigation, said company spokeswoman Sarah Levinson Rothman.

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AP Economics Writer Martin Crutsinger in Washington, D.C., contributed to this report.

Linky:http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070510/ap_on_en_mo/film_michael_moore;_ylt=AvHwOhG4DmnXx6HIcHLAG.is0NUE

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[kongaj]

I cant believe this guy is still supported by the general population.
Goes to show people cant think for themselves... and see the blatant bias and narrow views of an overweight, stupid director.

[Redlyne_mr2]

Originally posted by kongaj
I cant believe this guy is still supported by the general population.
Goes to show people cant think for themselves... and see the blatant bias and narrow views of an overweight, stupid director.
You know what though man.. he has opened peoples mind to the way the world works. It wasnt long ago that people would believe everything the government said and just go with it. Today politicians have to be much more accountable for the decisions they make. Wether you agree with MM or not it is important to have a voice like his out there. I wonder why Mike is hiding this movie.

[Nissanaddict]

The real question:
Michael Moore traveled to Cuba. This implies that he had to fly. Did he have to pay for 2 seats on the plane? Or did he get 2 for 1 due to his 'illness' ie. obesity?

[Kavy]

Moore is a clown

he prey's on the uneducated public to support his left field views, misquoting and editing interviews to support his movies and beliefs is sad.

[The Cosworth]

I just watched this movie and it was pretty good actually

Makes me happy to be dual citizen with both english and canadian, so that at least if I get sick I am ok. Unreal how the health care in the US is run.

[l8braker]

Originally posted by Redlyne_mr2

You know what though man.. he has opened peoples mind to the way the world works. It wasnt long ago that people would believe everything the government said and just go with it. Today politicians have to be much more accountable for the decisions they make. Wether you agree with MM or not it is important to have a voice like his out there. I wonder why Mike is hiding this movie.

:werd: Can't wait to see this one.

[The Cosworth]

Actually I forgot to add that in england the more patients who are in better health (low blood pressure, non smokers) such things like that, they will actually pay the doctors MORE. So in a practice that the doctors work in make more money if more people are healthy. Not sure how people don't corrupt it by just saying your healthy but I am sure there is a check there.

Unreal! :eek:

[kongaj]

W/e
Michael more is against everything he, himself is.
Hes opposed to wealthy, unhealthy, ruining enviroment type of people. All of which he himself is.
Hes a radical who doesnt understand the way the world really works

[The Cosworth]

Originally posted by kongaj
W/e
Michael more is against everything he, himself is.
Hes opposed to wealthy, unhealthy, ruining enviroment type of people. All of which he himself is.
Hes a radical who doesnt understand the way the world really works

do you want to explain this?

Honestly I want to know where you get that from or if you heard it on TV and thought it sounded good.

He took 9/11 workers to cuba, where cuban doctors helped americans get better in their hospitals. A $120.00 inhaler in the US cost them $0.05 cents down there. Regardless of his personal stance he is right that the US is fucked up in not helping their own people.

The guys who runs the largest anti-michael moore site was having to close it down because his wife got sick and he couldn't afford to keep it going. Moore sent a check to the guy so he could keep it up, as well as I find it ironic that the guy was criticizing him for this movie a few weeks before this all happened.

He came to ontario to a few different towns and saw our health care and I don't know about anyone else but he did not put a positive spin on our health care at all. He showed it to be what I understand of it, so watch the movie and then come back and post what you think

[01RedDX]

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[max_boost]

Originally posted by Redlyne_mr2

You know what though man.. he has opened peoples mind to the way the world works. It wasnt long ago that people would believe everything the government said and just go with it. Today politicians have to be much more accountable for the decisions they make. Wether you agree with MM or not it is important to have a voice like his out there. I wonder why Mike is hiding this movie.

Michael Moore and Toma. Gives me a different perspective on things :D:thumbsup:

[kongaj]

Fair enough
I will make judgement after I watch this movie.
but to me, his previous 2 movies were terrible.

[Gooseberry]

Originally posted by brendankharris


The guys who runs the largest anti-michael moore site was having to close it down because his wife got sick and he couldn't afford to keep it going. Moore sent a check to the guy so he could keep it up, as well as I find it ironic that the guy was criticizing him for this movie a few weeks before this all happened.


This is one thing i do disagree on though. He said the donation was made anonymously then he turns around and puts it in the film that he made the donation.

[The Cosworth]

Originally posted by Gooseberry


This is one thing i do disagree on though. He said the donation was made anonymously then he turns around and puts it in the film that he made the donation.

yeah that is true, i did laugh about that.

[ca18det240sx]

I thought farenheit 911 was an awesome movie, and a great eye opener. It does what its intended to do, get you thinking, and maybe question the authority of the government, be it canadian or american. As far as im concerned, the only good politician is a dead politician. He has the right message as far as im concerned. When is the government going to be responsible for helping their own people, rather than gouging them in every possible way? A good book to read if you liked this movie, is Kevin Trudeau- Natural cures they dont want you to know about.


I think people need to quit being so closed minded and see what is really going on in our society, its deplorable.

[Kona9]

Also don't forget to check out. The Union movie.

http://www.theunionmovie.com/

It looks to be a pretty good documentary in relation to what ca18det240sx was saying with regards to his noted book.

[kertejud]

Apparently this is actually his best documentary, he manages to keep the content as unedited as possible. I won't be seeing it in theatres, I might rent it when it comes out on video (or just watch one of the internet ones) but we'll see how it is.

Bowling for Columbine was pretty good (it sort of lost its way near the end, but it was decent) but Fahrenheit 9/11 was just too biased to be taken seriously, hopefully this one maintains its message without such a malicious tone. Its a subject where his point is hard to disagree with, but lets see if he butchers the delivery.

[Xtrema]

Originally posted by kongaj
Fair enough
I will make judgement after I watch this movie.
but to me, his previous 2 movies were terrible.

When Fox News call it good, you must watch. They bash anything MM.

[ca18det240sx]

There is soooo much stuff under wraps that you dont know about its not even funny. i wont even go into it, read the book, its CRAZY how many things are going on.

[vadeit]

Originally posted by ca18det240sx
There is soooo much stuff under wraps that you dont know about its not even funny. i wont even go into it, read the book, its CRAZY how many things are going on.

lol :nut:


ca18det240sx goes on to say:

Everyone better get on the tinfoil hats and be on the lookout for "stuff" and "things". They might be hard to spot as they are "underwraps". An example is the man is keeping the ca18 down when we all know it is better than the sr20.

[Xtrema]

Not a bad movie. I didn't know the French has even better benefits than we do. Or even Britain for that matter.

MM dropped the personal in your face confrontation bit which is refreshing. Still it does explain why the American systems sucks. They need drug control, $120 inhaler = $0.05 in Cuba? That's fucked up.

[arian_ma]

This film is going to be great! I can't wait till it comes out.
How did some of you see it so early? Torrent? Was it good quality?

[01RedDX]

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[forced_eg]

:rofl:

[CappyMcSlappy]

Originally posted by Xtrema


When Fox News call it good, you must watch. They bash anything MM.

Yeah, when I saw Fox News quoted as giving it a good review I had to do a double take. But actually you have to commend Fox for doing something that seems extremely fair and balanced.

[googe]

Originally posted by ca18det240sx
A good book to read if you liked this movie, is Kevin Trudeau- Natural cures they dont want you to know about.


That guy is a huge scam artist and you can smell the bullshit in your living room leaking out of his infomercials. Dont read that book. Check out his resume on wikipedia:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kevin_Trudeau

I like michael moore's stuff. It's too bad that he can't keep it all above board though, because he gives the conservative parrots some non-issue to repeat, which detracts attention from his legitimate points. He's usually got enough solid material that he doesn't need to do that, so I dunno why he does.

Either way, gets us talking about the issues, so he's doing something right I guess.

[ca18det240sx]

Originally posted by vadeit


lol :nut:


ca18det240sx goes on to say:

Everyone better get on the tinfoil hats and be on the lookout for "stuff" and "things". They might be hard to spot as they are "underwraps". An example is the man is keeping the ca18 down when we all know it is better than the sr20.


yah....youre just one of those ignorant people that just trusts that everything is fine . I didnt say you need to listen, just throwing the facts out.


and ca is better than sr in ways. but i wont thread-jack. Thanks for comin out sport.

[thrasher22]

Originally posted by ca18det240sx



yah....youre just one of those ignorant people that just trusts that everything is fine . I didnt say you need to listen, just throwing the facts out.


and ca is better than sr in ways. but i wont thread-jack. Thanks for comin out sport.

Being cynical doesn't make you smarter.
For example, you missed out on blatant sarcasm in his post.

[ca18det240sx]

Originally posted by thrasher22


Being cynical doesn't make you smarter.
For example, you missed out on blatant sarcasm in his post.

oh relax......he can throw sarcasm around, so can i, altho mine wasnt quite as blatantly sarcastic....and what are you anyways, the "read between the lines" police

and to googe: it says he was a scam artist at one point. I believe that the information you read there is true, but was put out there to discredit him. He talks about alot in his book that makes alot of sense, about chiropractors, how doctors push drugs for the companys, etc.

i have a real life example of the bs we call medicare:

my wife, had a terrible pain in her chest, which sometimes would get so bad it would floor her, went to doctor after doctor, none of them could figure it out, so what did they do? prescribe pill after pill, and every pain killer in the book...in the end it took word of mouth of a friend to tell her what to do. she went to a chiropractor, and it turns out it was a pinched nerve....5 minutes with a chiropractor and the pain went away, hasnt been back since. we find out, doctors will NOT prescribe a chiropractor because they dont believe in it. So....its ok to prescribe drug after drug, but not to prescribe something that is known to work. They didnt even MENTION it.

thats my .02, take it or leave it.

[TimG]

So i was able to see Michael Moore's new movie SiCKO. It's a documentary on the state of the US Health Care system.

The main topic that he addresses is that even if you have insurance in the US, you have a strong chance of having your claim denied for whatever reason.

I take all of Moore's movies with a very large grain of salt, but how much of this is actually true? I was in California last week and i caught an item on the news about how a woman was at an LA Hospital and rolling around on the floor of the ER and nobody helped her and she ended up dying. http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-me-king20may20,0,1577522,full.story


Anyone have any 1st hand experience with this?

This directly affects me because I'm considering a job offer in the US.

Tim

[Euro_Trash]

:repost:
http://forums.beyond.ca/st/175872/-sicko-/

[TimG]

you know what? this isn't a repost. I'm not talking about the movie. I'm talking about the US health care system and people's experience with it.

Thanks for coming out. Have a nice day.

[Euro_Trash]

Guess what, people are discussing health care in that other post too, so why wouldn't you keep it all together? Thank YOU for coming out :thumbsup:

[ken-gsr]

thank you both for coming out.
All i know is that health care in the states is crazy. My Uncle took a job down there, and moved his family to Texas. With in one year the health care system for 6 people bankrupt them (and it wasn't like this was a low end job).

[DepTrotter]

Originally posted by TimG
you know what? this isn't a repost. I'm not talking about the movie. I'm talking about the US health care system and people's experience with it.

Thanks for coming out. Have a nice day.

im a little confused, maybe you can clear this up for me.....you arent talking about the movie but the subject title is Sicko, do you think people think american health care system when they hear the word sicko?

[Masked Bandit]

I have an uncle in Florida (he's been down there for about six years now) and he said as long as you have decent insurance, it's a way better system. Much faster access to care. However, if you can't afford the good / any insurance, you're phucked.

[TimG]

from what I saw, even people with good and comprehensive insurance plans were still being denied.

Dunno if this is the difference between HMO and PMO?

[Toms-SC]

I am sure this movie will be totally unbiased and contrast a private versus public system. Ammirite? :rolleyes:

[Toms-SC]

Originally posted by Masked Bandit
as long as you have decent insurance, it's a way better system.

I can confirm this.

[Toms-SC]

I'll pirate it

[TKRIS]

Here's the problem, as I see it:
Shockingly (given my strong libertarian streak), I'm not against government regulated health care.
The dishonesty and delusion comes from Moore's priase of other country's health care systems (such as Canada).
Let's start with a baseline stat: A citizen in the US pays more for healthcare than a citizen in any other industrialized country with government run healthcare. Based on that, I agree with Moore that the US needs to reevaluate their system. While I do not think that I should be paying for every crack-head moron OD, etc; I'm willing to do so only if it means I actually pay less than I do now. I disagree with paying for the healthcare of bums and addicts and idiots on principle, but if it means saving money in practice, then I'll make than concession. In short, it's cheaper to just have healthcare for everyone.
That's how I can justify being both a libertarian and a supporter of some government regulation.


Moore strikes with stunning hypocrasy here. He's seemingly oblivious to the irony of, in one breath saying that the government is corrupt, not to be trusted, and run by croonies and corporations, while in the next breath advocating that we hand over more control over our lives and needs to the same people he's just finished crucifying.

In the same vein, there are a lot of things I wouldn't mind seeing the government be involved in controlling, but I sure as fuck don't want them anywhere near it until they're shown to have an established system of controls, checks and balances, and accountability.

Moore is essentially advocating giving more power to be people he accuses of abusing their current power.
He's putting the cart in front of the horse.

Now, that said, Canada is a poor example of a heathcare system not only because of the politically correct, socialist, apologetic nature of too many Canadians, that's reflected in our government, but also because of the monopoly the government is running on medical treatment.
IMHO, a few simply, politically incorrect, self-policing policies would do wonders for our healthcare system. Since government reform isn't on the horizon any time soon, how about a $150 fine for hypocondriacts that spend their weekends in the ER?
How about a $15 surcharge for anyone that needs to go to the doctor?
How about we stop picking up the tab for people that end up in the hospital out of sheer stupidity (motorcycle stunts, not wearing a seatbelt, jumping off buildings, etc)?

These wouldn't so much be money makers, as deterrents. If you were facing a $150 fine, you probably wouldn't show up at the ER with a stubbed toe.
If it cost $15, you likely wouldn't go to the doctor because you had the sniffles...

The threat of a $100-$150 fine is going to be enough to make people question if they actually need to go to the ER, or if they've just got nothing better to do and need some sympathy.
A $10-$15 charge at the doctors office is going to keep people from going there for something that could be cured by a few hours sleep and a couple Tylenol.

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[mac_82]

WASHINGTON - Half of all U.S. bankruptcies are caused by soaring medical bills and most people sent into debt by illness are middle-class workers with health insurance, researchers said on Wednesday.

The study, published in the journal Health Affairs, estimated that medical bankruptcies affect about 2 million Americans every year, if both debtors and their dependents, including about 700,000 children, are counted.

"Our study is frightening. Unless you're Bill Gates you're just one serious illness away from bankruptcy," said Dr. David Himmelstein, an associate professor of medicine at Harvard Medical School who led the study.

"Most of the medically bankrupt were average Americans who happened to get sick. Health insurance offered little protection."

The researchers got the permission of bankruptcy judges in California, Illinois, Pennsylvania, Tennessee and Texas to survey 931 people who filed for bankruptcy.

"About half cited medical causes, which indicates that 1.9 to 2.2 million Americans (filers plus dependents) experienced medical bankruptcy," they wrote.

"Among those whose illnesses led to bankruptcy, out-of-pocket costs averaged $11,854 since the start of illness; 75.7 percent had insurance at the onset of illness."

The average bankrupt person surveyed had spent $13,460 on co-payments, deductibles and uncovered services if they had private insurance. People with no insurance spent an average of $10,893 for such out-of-pocket expenses.

"Even middle-class insured families often fall prey to financial catastrophe when sick," the researchers wrote.

Bankruptcy specialists said the numbers seemed sound.

"From 1982 to 1989, I reviewed every bankruptcy petition filed in South Carolina, and during that period I came to the conclusion that there were two major causes of bankruptcy: medical bills and divorce," said George Cauthen, a lawyer at Columbia-based law firm Nelson Mullins Riley & Scarborough LLP.

"Each accounted, roughly, for about a third of all individual filings in South Carolina."

He said fewer than 1 percent of all bankruptcy filings were due to credit card debt. "That truly is a myth," Cauthen said in a telephone interview.

http://www.commondreams.org/headlines05/0202-08.htm

[Xamim]

Originally posted by 01RedDX
Just watched it, definitely worth downloading!

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

[no_joke]

Have you guys heard of these international hospitals in Asia which cater to the "medical tourism" sector?

Such as Bumrungrad International Hospital in Bangkok:
http://www.bumrungrad.com/Overseas-Medical-Care/FAQ-s.aspx

Call me ignorant but I had never even heard of the concept of traveling AWAY from the Western World for medical care until recently, aside from getting a sex change operation in Mexico. Apparently the Bumrungrad offers world class medical treatment at a fraction of the cost. I read an article about an American who saved in the neighborhood of $30 000 - 50 000 USD on medical treatment by flying to Thailand as opposed to staying in the US. It is a simplification of the matter but if your citizens are flying to what is technically a developing country to receive complicated surgeries, that should send a message that something is wrong with the system...

That being said, I have yet to see the movie. I will wait until the DVD-rip hits the torrents.

[Gooseberry]

I didn't really see a big difference from the torrented version of Sicko compared to 'dvd-rips' i have watched.