E92 M3 vs W204 C63 AMG

[rage2]

Well looks like we're in for an epic battle between these 2 cars. The 08 M3 gets a 420hp V8, while the 08 C63 AMG gets the high revving 460hp V8.

M3 Reviews:
Top Gear (http://www.topgear.com/blogs/drives/079-bmw-m3/)
Edmunds (http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do/Drives/FirstDrives/articleId=121566?)
Piston Heads (http://www.pistonheads.com/roadtests/doc.asp?c=100&i=16457)
Car Online (http://www.carmagazine.co.uk/first_drive.php?sid=841&page=1)
Autoweek (http://www.autoweek.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20070706/FREE/70706014/1024)
Autocar (http://www.autocar.co.uk/CarReviews/FirstDrives/BMW-M3-4.0-V8/226432/)
Channel 4 (http://www.channel4.com/4car/rt/bmw/m3/2182/9)

C63 Reviews:
Motor Trend (http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/sedans/112_0709_2008_mercedes_benz_c63_amg)
Edmunds (http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do/Drives/FirstDrives/articleId=121540?tid=edmunds.il.home.photopanel..1.*)
Autoweek (http://autoweek.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20070704/FREE/70702012/1065)

The last battle, E46 M3 vs W203 C55, the M3 won the hearts of all the reviewers. The M3 was more edgy, a bit faster around a race track, while the C55 was more civilized in day to day driving.

This time around... everything's backwards. It's like the M3 became more of a C55, and the C63 became more of a E46 M3. Kinda weird, but so far the reviewers are actually LIKING the C63 more than the M3.

From company estimates, the M3 is getting owned by the C63. All the problems with the "63" platform that I didn't like was addressed... The 7 speed tranny can finally get smooth downshifts thanks to throttle blip, and the C63 gets optional LSD, as well as a 3 stage traction control system. The M3, well, seems overpriced to me for what you get (kinda like the E46 M3). And with only 6 speed at launch, not terribly appealing. The C63 seems like a very complete car.

When it comes to mods, the C63's "detuned" motor is easily unlocked to 510hp with an ECU upgrade. Cheap and reliable power... 50 hp just like the other 63's. Not sure about the new M3's V8 yet. Based on the V10 of the M5, the M5 has a few ECU upgrade options that give you a whopping 8hp. In V8 terms, that's a whopping 6.4hp :). A 510hp C63 is going to utterly destory a 426.4hp M3 lol.

Can't wait to drive both cars. Your thoughts?

[schocker]

I have to say that what I have read about the E92 is dissapointing. It has lost its rawness as they have said in the reivews. The C sounds very interesting though I just wish it was available with a stick aswell. The power is very interesting though, as I am a big fan of the AMG motors. But also Audi will soon bring out their new contenders, with the S5 and revised S4, but the price of the new M3 is also getting into RS4 range so there is quite a bit of competition in this segment now. But with all these high revving V8's, it will be very interesting.

[SilverRex]

anyone know if the C63 AMG will fall under 100k? at least same if not similar to the pricing of M3? I would wonder if its easily to order a C63 than it is to order a M3.

[Tuner1]

No doubt the C63 will be a great machine but until they offer a shift-it-yourself tranny I will keep my deposit on the M3 :)

Rob

[rage2]

Originally posted by Tuner1
No doubt the C63 will be a great machine but until they offer a shift-it-yourself tranny I will keep my deposit on the M3 :)

Rob
There's a button to shift it yourself... :rofl:

I'm guessing you're not a fan of SMG either? hehe

[benyl]

Optional LSD on the C63 may be an Euro only option. I don't know that it has been confirmed for NA.

Traffic wasn't that bad this morning... but SMG FTW!

[rage2]

Originally posted by benyl
Optional LSD on the C63 may be an Euro only option. I don't know that it has been confirmed for NA.

Traffic wasn't that bad this morning... but SMG FTW!

LSD has been confirmed for NA.

Ya, SMG is so awesome, dunno how some ppl find it annoying. I have a blast everyday driving right now. It's taking a toll on my fuel economy tho... I'm averaging only 15.5mpg thanks to non stop rev matched downshifts everywhere haha.

[TNation]

wow disappointing reviews for the M3
my favorite M3 is E46
like Rage's... :burnout:

[Hakkola]

Originally posted by TNation
wow disappointing reviews for the M3
my favorite M3 is E42
like Rage's... :burnout:

E46 homie.

I always liked the M3 better, but the gap has been getting smaller with each generation, the last C-class AMG was close to M3 performance, and not quite as good looking. I think this time around AMG has the winner with the C63. :thumbsup:

[LongCity]

When is the new season for Top Gear start or has it done so already?

[Hakkola]

Originally posted by LongCity
When is the new season for Top Gear start or has it done so already?

"Autumn 2007"

[E36M3]

I'm excited about driving both. I find it hard to believe that the C63 will be harder edged, but I would love to see it. I still would much rather have a DSG or SMG gearbox than an automatic, so it does make the BMW much more appealing since there will likely be a real manual box and an SMG/DSG available at some point.

[962 kid]

Originally posted by E36M3
I'm excited about driving both. I find it hard to believe that the C63 will be harder edged, but I would love to see it. I still would much rather have a DSG or SMG gearbox than an automatic, so it does make the BMW much more appealing since there will likely be a real manual box and an SMG/DSG available at some point.

7 speed automatic with throttle blips sounds fantastic... imo AMG has always made the best automatic transmissions (far far better than benz manual). On top of that, BMW is not using the DSG/PDK system (which has been used in race cars and has been in development for decades), they're having getrag develop one, so who knows how it'll compare.

C63 ftw :thumbsup:

[rage2]

Originally posted by 962 kid
On top of that, BMW is not using the DSG/PDK system (which has been used in race cars and has been in development for decades), they're having getrag develop one, so who knows how it'll compare.
It's the exact same concept as DSG/PDK, just BMW's own version. The question is will it employ dry clutches (I think it will) instead of wet clutches in the DSG system, resulting in much less drivetrain slack. The DSG system almost feels like an automatic in some ways because it employs wet clutches. I can't see BMW being happy with that on an M car.

[962 kid]

Originally posted by rage2

It's the exact same concept as DSG/PDK, just BMW's own version. The question is will it employ dry clutches (I think it will) instead of wet clutches in the DSG system, resulting in much less drivetrain slack. The DSG system almost feels like an automatic in some ways because it employs wet clutches. I can't see BMW being happy with that on an M car.

Concept is just that, a concept which was my whole point. I don't doubt getrag's engineering abilities, but it's taken a hella long time for DSG to evolve and I wonder if the system in the M3 will be as well-developed as DSG.