Cardel Homes - Is it a scam?

[int30h]

Hi guys,

My first post on this site and am wondering if someone could guide me in the right direction.

I booked a new house with Cardel Homes in the community of Cranston. The agreement was signed in the first week of September. I paid them $50,000 as down payment and since then I attended all vendor appointments (countless hours) to select tiles, flooring, carpets, cabinets etc. etc.

In the last week of October, I received a letter from Cardel along with a copy of 'Right of First Refusal' agreement which Cardel wanted me to sign. This new addendum basically was to give Cardel Homes rights to re-purchase the house if I wanted to sell it during the first year after taking possession at the same price and in the same condition which they sold me for.

I refused to sign this new addendum contract as I believe that they should've presented this to me at the time of signing the original contract. At that time I had the choice to go to a different builder. I also believe that once I pay full price for an item, I should have full rights on it, whether I sell it, set it on fire or tear it down. By sining this contract means that I still don't own the house for one year as I can't make any changes to it i.e. developing basement etc. etc.

Cardel has their reasons as they wanted to discourage the investors. I am arguing that WHY after three months when they wasted so much of my time and used my money as well.

Two days ago I got a voice message from their Sales Manager that they're going to cancel my agreement and returning my down payment since I refused to sign their other addendum contract.

I am pissed off now, since I am pushed back three months and house prices might have climbed up a bit.

I just need to know what my options are? The original contract says that builder has the right to cancel the agreement at any time (of course its written in their favor).

Should I call it Cardel scam?

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

[Eclipse_Spyder]

call channel global tv and tell them, then they have to listen

[bspot]

Absolutely brutal. This happened to a girl I work with. Is there a provision in there that they have to pay interest on your deposit when they refund it? I sure hope so. I wish everyone could give a big FU to builders doing this, and leave their projects unsold.

What if you get a job transfer?

What if you get married and have a kid and need more room?

What if in the same time your place goes up 100K? That should be your money no matter what.

I wonder how enforceable those clauses are?

[88jbody]

I agree that is BS.

I would be curious to see if they do this every time. if so then I would like to know why they do not put it in the original agreement? I think it is a bit sneaky to get you locked in and most would just sign it.

it is your right to sell it and do whatever you want with it you bought it. and if you want to sell it the day after for a profit or a loss it is your buisness!

I would probably do a letter to editor or something like that to the paper, perhapps even talk to some others that used cardel and see if they did the smae thing with them.

cardel builds good quality but I don't agree with this anti-investor policy

[kaput]

.

[int30h]

Originally posted by bspot
Absolutely brutal. This happened to a girl I work with. Is there a provision in there that they have to pay interest on your deposit when they refund it? I sure hope so. I wish everyone could give a big FU to builders doing this, and leave their projects unsold.

What if you get a job transfer?

What if you get married and have a kid and need more room?

What if in the same time your place goes up 100K? That should be your money no matter what.

I wonder how enforceable those clauses are?

The contract specifically says 'the money will be returned, without interest'. Builder wrote that contract and everyting is in their favor. Had I known that they'll be doing this with me, I would've read the contract in more detail. I just signed it in good faith.

I told them that I can't predict my future, anything could happen, and why should I give you the option to re-purchase my house, they had no answer to any of my questions or arguments. I think what might have happened is that they sold all these lots and houses at a price which was very reasonable and probably other builders gave them heck and then they thought of getting some of these lots back. Discouraging investors is just an excuse.

[int30h]

Originally posted by Eclipse_Spyder
call channel global tv and tell them, then they have to listen

That's a good idea. I'll give t a shot. Thanks,

[int30h]

Originally posted by 88jbody
I agree that is BS.

I would be curious to see if they do this every time. if so then I would like to know why they do not put it in the original agreement? I think it is a bit sneaky to get you locked in and most would just sign it.

it is your right to sell it and do whatever you want with it you bought it. and if you want to sell it the day after for a profit or a loss it is your buisness!

I would probably do a letter to editor or something like that to the paper, perhapps even talk to some others that used cardel and see if they did the smae thing with them.

cardel builds good quality but I don't agree with this anti-investor policy

I know a couple of people who are uildig with Cardel. I'll probe into this. I would also be curious to know if they built any house without having this contract signed.

[autosm]

If the prices are up maybe you should sign it ? Is it a smoking deal or can you get the same deal from another builder ?

Is it a year from possesion?

So more like 2 years from now until you can sell it ?

Does it say any thing about renting it ?

I wonder if they think something is up with the market and are trying to get you to tube the deal so they can sell it to some one else?

Have all the aprovals by the city gone through ? Can construction start now ? Someone else might pay a premium for a house that can be ready next year ?

Might just be something the sales guy over looked and they are being dicks ?



The fuckin builders are in the drivers seat thats why I would hate to build a new house now . Better to get them when they are hurting .

[JordanLotoski]

I have built in cranston and am building right now...we use baywest homes, they have been great to us...if you can aford to go to an estate home there i would reccomend them highly.

[grrrouch]

Originally posted by MIWYFSHOT
I have built in cranston and am building right now...we use baywest homes, they have been great to us...if you can aford to go to an estate home there i would reccomend them highly.

wow sweet response buddy.. this guys about to lose money and your telling him to buy a house from ur shitty company. thanks for coming out :thumbsup:

[93accord]

Originally posted by int30h
Hi guys,

My first post on this site and am wondering if someone could guide me in the right direction.

I booked a new house with Cardel Homes in the community of Cranston. The agreement was signed in the first week of September. I paid them $50,000 as down payment and since then I attended all vendor appointments (countless hours) to select tiles, flooring, carpets, cabinets etc. etc.

In the last week of October, I received a letter from Cardel along with a copy of 'Right of First Refusal' agreement which Cardel wanted me to sign. This new addendum basically was to give Cardel Homes rights to re-purchase the house if I wanted to sell it during the first year after taking possession at the same price and in the same condition which they sold me for.

I refused to sign this new addendum contract as I believe that they should've presented this to me at the time of signing the original contract. At that time I had the choice to go to a different builder. I also believe that once I pay full price for an item, I should have full rights on it, whether I sell it, set it on fire or tear it down. By sining this contract means that I still don't own the house for one year as I can't make any changes to it i.e. developing basement etc. etc.

Cardel has their reasons as they wanted to discourage the investors. I am arguing that WHY after three months when they wasted so much of my time and used my money as well.

Two days ago I got a voice message from their Sales Manager that they're going to cancel my agreement and returning my down payment since I refused to sign their other addendum contract.

I am pissed off now, since I am pushed back three months and house prices might have climbed up a bit.

I just need to know what my options are? The original contract says that builder has the right to cancel the agreement at any time (of course its written in their favor).

Should I call it Cardel scam?

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

the exact same thing happened to my parents. they wasted a lot of time running around the city picking out everything for the house and then cardel mailed us tat effing contract. my parents refused and later we received a check tat was 10 grand short of what we paid. still waiting for our money back!! fucking assholes. my parents searched all over the city and they really liked this house. :thumbsdow

[bspot]

Tell the fuckers you'll sign it if the price goes down if you can sell it back to them for the original price they sold it to you one year later.

[riceboi]

Originally posted by 93accord


the exact same thing happened to my parents. they wasted a lot of time running around the city picking out everything for the house and then cardel mailed us tat effing contract. my parents refused and later we received a check tat was 10 grand short of what we paid. still waiting for our money back!! fucking assholes. my parents searched all over the city and they really liked this house. :thumbsdow

This gives the other builders in Cardel's area a huge boost in sales. All they have to do is stating this requirement as a reason why you should buy from them and not Cardel and you will see Cardel's potential sales plummet. Wow, talking about shooting your own foot. What a stupid idea by whomever from Cardel that came up w/ this idea.

:guns: :banghead:

[noCARbob]

Im building a condo with cardel and have not heard of this at all maby its just with new homes

[/////AMG]

Originally posted by 93accord


the exact same thing happened to my parents. they wasted a lot of time running around the city picking out everything for the house and then cardel mailed us tat effing contract. my parents refused and later we received a check tat was 10 grand short of what we paid. still waiting for our money back!! fucking assholes. my parents searched all over the city and they really liked this house. :thumbsdow

I reckon you should contact int30h over PM something and both of you should go to Global TV together.
Hopefully something will be done

[JordanLotoski]

Originally posted by grrrouch


wow sweet response buddy.. this guys about to lose money and your telling him to buy a house from ur shitty company. thanks for coming out :thumbsup:


actually, since cardel in pretty much going to bow out of building this guy a home, and give his money back, which by law they cant keep if they refuse to build him a home, iam reccomending a builder which i work closely, and know are great.


god i love the little kids on this site.....

[Kloubek]

This is BS man. First, you really should have read the contract more closely. I'm sure you're not going to make that mistake again.

Second, I would consider asking to speak to the sales manager's manager. In fact, don't ask. Demand. And if you don't get anywhere, demand to talk to HIS/HER supervisor. Generally, if you work your way to the top sometimes you'll get your way. But don't be a dink, even if you should be entitled. Be polite, and calm. Only after you get to the top and you're still denied is it time to get anger involved.

Going to the media isn't a bad idea. And you can let the top dog know you plan to do so as well.

In the end, if you don't get the house, then go with another company (obviously). Jayman is a great place, from what I've heard.

Good luck!

[AndrewMZ3]

Originally posted by MIWYFSHOT
I have built in cranston and am building right now...we use baywest homes, they have been great to us...if you can aford to go to an estate home there i would reccomend them highly.

I'm currently building with Bay West too. I've been very happy with their service so far, and they haven't tried pulling anything like this on me.

If you do end up getting your money back I'd suggest you try to purchase again immediately. Last I talked to my sales rep, it's been a pretty slow month (due to seasonality of the market) and a lot of builders are offering a lot of incentives such as free upgrades etc. I believe a month ago or so there was a 2200 sqft floor plan going for 480ish in copperfield...however I think that may have been with Cardel.

Perhaps before deciding whether to sign or not, start looking at your alternatives and see if the extra promotions/incentives make it so you can get a better deal. If you only purchased 3 months ago, I don't believe the house prices have gone up; however, the cheaper lots in new phases may have already been taken. You may actually come out on top here, and with sales slowing down, your possession might not be that far off your original possession.

[calgarys_finest]

also try the better business bearu(sp) and get a laywer to look over the contract

[rc2002]

I don't see what the problem is. If you weren't going to flip the house then you should've just signed the damn addendum.

Either way, I say thumbs up to Cardel for doing something about these speculators driving up the house prices. Now if only the other builders would follow suit...

That said, it probably worked out well for you. House prices have actually come down these last 3 months and you can probably find a comparable house for cheaper.

[badatusrnames]

Originally posted by Kloubek
First, you really should have read the contract more closely.

They hit him with this addendum to the contract 3 months after he initially agreed to purchase the home...

Sounds like underhanded, dirty tactics to me, I imagine that if they were upfront about this policy, it would scare people off from ever agreeing to purchase from them. Instead, they present it to you three months later after people have invested time and given up their down payment in the hopes that you will not want to back out and go through the process all over again for another house with a different builder.

Good on the OP for showing great conviction in telling Cardel to shove it. I think that it is in the public interest for the media to alert all those that are looking to buy a home that if they buy with Cardel this could happen to them.

[AndrewMZ3]

Originally posted by richardchan2002
I don't see what the problem is. If you weren't going to flip the house then you should've just signed the damn addendum.

Either way, I say thumbs up to Cardel for doing something about these speculators driving up the house prices. Now if only the other builders would follow suit...

That said, it probably worked out well for you. House prices have actually come down these last 3 months and you can probably find a comparable house for cheaper.

I don't think anyone would have any issue with this if Cardel was upfront with it. Presenting the addendum after a purchase agreement and selections were made is what is underhanded and unethical in my opinion. The intention to flip or not isn't really the main issue here. I am purchasing without the intention of flipping, but if presented such an addendum I would be quite upset as well. In a years time many things could change, I could move elsewhere, upgrade, downgrade, etc.

Furthermore, although resale housing prices have come down, new house prices have remained constant if not risen (due to lots being purchased). The one thing that is in his favour are the extra incentives that builders are offering now.

[anyone]

Besides the fact that anything might happen, why don't you want to sign it?

I'd just sign it rather than having to go through that whole process. As long as you have enough stability to last that year, I wouldn't worry about it.

If you need a financial reason, assuming everything is equal and homes increase in price, you'll lose the finacial gain of your current house that's being built, you'll have lost the interest potential on the $50k down payment, and you will continue to miss out on a potential gain while you are looking for your new house, plus you're going to end up paying more for your new house. Add those gains together and it's probably worth your time to just sign the ridiculous agreement.

It seems like a waste of time and money to have to get your money back and then buy a new house where, again, anything can happen.

[silvercivicsir]

dumb question, but why did you put 50k down? I thought you only had to put 5% down. unless your building a 1 million dollar house.

[badatusrnames]

^^To reduce his mortgage payment, and ultimately the amount of interest paid over the term of that mortgage.

[93accord]

Originally posted by noCARbob
Im building a condo with cardel and have not heard of this at all maby its just with new homes

you should really talk to cardel before its too late. they might just mail u the contract 1 week before ur possesion date. the contract might not apply to condo's but u shud ask them about it just to be on the safe side.

[urban.one]

Its doesnt have that effect in this situation.

The $50,000 is a deposit with the builder. Assuming this is all from savings, there is not mortgage at this point yet. Youre better off holding on to your money and putting down the lowest possible deposit. When the time comes to pay the builder for the house, then you can put down a large downpayment from savings in order to minimize your mortgage



Originally posted by badatusrnames
^^To reduce his mortgage payment, and ultimately the amount of interest paid over the term of that mortgage.


Originally posted by silvercivicsir
dumb question, but why did you put 50k down? I thought you only had to put 5% down. unless your building a 1 million dollar house.

[grrrouch]

Originally posted by MIWYFSHOT



actually, since cardel in pretty much going to bow out of building this guy a home, and give his money back, which by law they cant keep if they refuse to build him a home, iam reccomending a builder which i work closely, and know are great.


god i love the little kids on this site.....

awsome, and im still calling your company shitty.

kids these days...

[Masked Bandit]

Originally posted by silvercivicsir
dumb question, but why did you put 50k down? I thought you only had to put 5% down. unless your building a 1 million dollar house.

Cardel is currently asking for 15% down. If, in the end you want to run your mortgage with only 5% down, they will refund you the other 10%. Again, this was an attempt to discourage investors.

For what it's worth, we signed a deal with Cardel in Chaparral in December of 2006. We were supposed to be in our new place in the middle of September and it's looking like the middle of February at this point. There is a 3.5 month delay due to their office phuck ups, which they have admitted to, but are not willing to do anything about. CARDEL HAS BEEN ABSOLUTELY TERRIBLE to deal with from a customer service standpoint. I have been trying to get in touch with the construction vice president for two months with no return phone calls.

I wish I could tell you that Cardel is a decent outfit, but that would be a lie. We were treated better by Pointe Of View condo which is just stupid.

[ianmcc]

If you were treated better by POV then Cardel must REALLY suck!!!

[autosm]

Originally posted by Masked Bandit


Cardel is currently asking for 15% down. If, in the end you want to run your mortgage with only 5% down, they will refund you the other 10%. Again, this was an attempt to discourage investors.

For what it's worth, we signed a deal with Cardel in Chaparral in December of 2006. We were supposed to be in our new place in the middle of September and it's looking like the middle of February at this point. There is a 3.5 month delay due to their office phuck ups, which they have admitted to, but are not willing to do anything about. CARDEL HAS BEEN ABSOLUTELY TERRIBLE to deal with from a customer service standpoint. I have been trying to get in touch with the construction vice president for two months with no return phone calls.

I wish I could tell you that Cardel is a decent outfit, but that would be a lie. We were treated better by Pointe Of View condo which is just stupid.


As much as I want a new house I cant even think of it after hearing stories like this . Sorry hope it works out in the end .

[A790]

Originally posted by grrrouch


awsome, and im still calling your company shitty.

kids these days...
Why, because he recommended a different company? Are you fucking hormonal or something?

[grrrouch]

Originally posted by A790

Why, because he recommended a different company? Are you fucking hormonal or something?

yes,
im "hormonal"..............................................................................................................:eek:

[asifka]

Originally posted by richardchan2002
I don't see what the problem is. If you weren't going to flip the house then you should've just signed the damn addendum.

Either way, I say thumbs up to Cardel for doing something about these speculators driving up the house prices. Now if only the other builders would follow suit...

That said, it probably worked out well for you. House prices have actually come down these last 3 months and you can probably find a comparable house for cheaper.

what are the chances they will resell it for orignal price:dunno:

[dezinr]

http://middlecountryrdproject.org/pix/suburbanSprawl.jpg

http://www.emagazine.com/images/0502curr_sprawl.jpg

http://www.divorceinfo.com/images/steps.3.jpg

http://leblog.exuberance.com/images/SameOldSameOld-Exuberance.com-1.jpg

http://www.loe.org/thisweek/030516oregon.jpg

http://img102.imageshack.us/img102/719/city3go2.jpg

^^^
This one is actually Calgary.

Perhaps it's a good thing you are not building in Cranston. Does not seem so appealing after seeing the above photos in my opinion. But for some the long commutes, lack of choice, minimal services, having to drive everywhere, spending less time with family and lack of parkspace amongst others things is the new Utopia.

[JordanLotoski]

^^^ Cranston will be the largest community in the city limits. right now there as as many ammenties around Cranston then any other community in Calgary. within the next 2 years there will a Sobeys, bank and other amenities opeing up right in the heart of Cranston.

Add in the new Hospital and future growth of new amenties and all roads lead to Cranston. ( I maybe bias cause i live on the ridge in cranston and not a starter home backing deerfoot hahaha)

[liquid1010]

Originally posted by MIWYFSHOT

Add in the new Hospital and future growth of new amenties and all roads lead to Cranston. ( I maybe bias cause i live on the ridge in cranston and not a starter home backing deerfoot hahaha)

Debate all you want about the merits of various city locations.... but the above comment is just.... well....childish :dunno:

Your house is bigger than my house... and your dad can beat-up my dad.... :thumbsdow

[A790]

Originally posted by grrrouch


yes,
im "hormonal"..............................................................................................................:eek:
It's the only logical explanation for jumping down the guys throat over nothing. I think there are medications that you can take to balance your hormones :)

[Euro838]

What Cardel is doing is not a scam, it may not be the best practice. What people fail to realize is that it is THEIR responsibility to READ and UNDERSTAND EVERYTHING that is in the contract that they sign. I know it's not the first thing everyone does but the contracts that the builders are coming up with are very clever and only works in their favor. In the past few years, I am sure some builders have been burned for contracts not protecting them and then there are some that have taken advantage of the marketplace to make these ridiculous changes part way through a contract.

To the OP, if there is a clause in there that they can cancel the contract and return your deposit without reason, then you may not have much leverage. Have someone experienced in reading these builders contracts go over it thoroughly to see if there is any options for you. Basically, if they stated it in the contract and you agreed and signed it, you'll have very few choices but to execute the contract as it.

I think this is a very good reminder for everyone to read over and understand any contracts that they sign, whether it be a house or a car, if you didn't write the contract, then chances are the contract will be in their favor. Experience is often an expensive lesson.

[dezinr]

Originally posted by MIWYFSHOT
^^^ Cranston will be the largest community in the city limits. right now there as as many ammenties around Cranston then any other community in Calgary. within the next 2 years there will a Sobeys, bank and other amenities opeing up right in the heart of Cranston.

Add in the new Hospital and future growth of new amenties and all roads lead to Cranston. ( I maybe bias cause i live on the ridge in cranston and not a starter home backing deerfoot hahaha)


I know that Cranston is set to grow with the deveopment of Seton which is to become a secondary "CORE" if you will for Calgary. Unfortunately the elements that most suburban areas lack are the corner stores, the 'mom and pop' shops, the cafes and delis. All elements of true neighborhoods, characteristics not found in todays developments and hence why they are no longer referred to as such. Not too mention the disconect from art, cultural and institutional components that make up a city.

Perhaps that is my bias from a decade of study regarding the importance of design from the macro scale of the city to the micro scale of the places we live.

I long for the day we start building neighborhoods such as these again Sunnyside, Kensignton, Mission, Rosedale, Crescent Heights, Marda Loop and so on.

http://www.metrocouncil.org/profiles/profiles_images/BayHomes400.jpg

http://www.cityofvermillion.com/Vermillion%20misc_6_.jpg

My apologies for hijacking the thread but I hope that people will someday step forward and demand that developers give them more than just a box on a lot.

[riceboi]

Originally posted by Euro838
What Cardel is doing is not a scam, it may not be the best practice. What people fail to realize is that it is THEIR responsibility to READ and UNDERSTAND EVERYTHING that is in the contract that they sign. I know it's not the first thing everyone does but the contracts that the builders are coming up with are very clever and only works in their favor. In the past few years, I am sure some builders have been burned for contracts not protecting them and then there are some that have taken advantage of the marketplace to make these ridiculous changes part way through a contract.

To the OP, if there is a clause in there that they can cancel the contract and return your deposit without reason, then you may not have much leverage. Have someone experienced in reading these builders contracts go over it thoroughly to see if there is any options for you. Basically, if they stated it in the contract and you agreed and signed it, you'll have very few choices but to execute the contract as it.

I think this is a very good reminder for everyone to read over and understand any contracts that they sign, whether it be a house or a car, if you didn't write the contract, then chances are the contract will be in their favor. Experience is often an expensive lesson.


I agree that one must read the contract before signing but builder contracts these days are not fair, particularly Cardel.

Most of the homebuilders contract are one-way. That means it's there to protect their interests and zero for you.

I wish the government will regulate this home-building industry, there are too many crooks out there and zero protection to the consumers.

Blaming the speculators is just another poor excuse. Home builders are speculators. They are the ones who drive up the housing market.

[italianunit]

Originally posted by grrrouch


yes,
im "hormonal"..............................................................................................................:eek:

nope.... you're from peachland.... just your average tree hugger...:poosie:

[int30h]

Originally posted by autosm
If the prices are up maybe you should sign it ? Is it a smoking deal or can you get the same deal from another builder ?

Is it a year from possesion?

So more like 2 years from now until you can sell it ?

Does it say any thing about renting it ?

I wonder if they think something is up with the market and are trying to get you to tube the deal so they can sell it to some one else?

Have all the aprovals by the city gone through ? Can construction start now ? Someone else might pay a premium for a house that can be ready next year ?

Might just be something the sales guy over looked and they are being dicks ?



The fuckin builders are in the drivers seat thats why I would hate to build a new house now . Better to get them when they are hurting .
I think it was a smoking deal. 2370 sq ft for 494,000 that included $30,000 upgrades.

Tentative posession date was Aug 2008 so that means I can't sell it before Aug 2009. Two years from now.

It deson't say anything about the renting and I actually thought about it but decided against it as renters do not normally take good care of the brand new house and damage deposit doesn't always cover the cost if I find something 3 months down the road which needed repair or replacement etc.

Construction didn't start as we were still in the middle of these appointments with vendors. It hapended right after I attended my last appointment.

[int30h]

Originally posted by 93accord


the exact same thing happened to my parents. they wasted a lot of time running around the city picking out everything for the house and then cardel mailed us tat effing contract. my parents refused and later we received a check tat was 10 grand short of what we paid. still waiting for our money back!! fucking assholes. my parents searched all over the city and they really liked this house. :thumbsdow

Can I talk to your parents? PM me as I have gathered a couple of people who went through the same experience with Cardel.

[int30h]

Originally posted by Kloubek
This is BS man. First, you really should have read the contract more closely. I'm sure you're not going to make that mistake again.

Second, I would consider asking to speak to the sales manager's manager. In fact, don't ask. Demand. And if you don't get anywhere, demand to talk to HIS/HER supervisor. Generally, if you work your way to the top sometimes you'll get your way. But don't be a dink, even if you should be entitled. Be polite, and calm. Only after you get to the top and you're still denied is it time to get anger involved.

Going to the media isn't a bad idea. And you can let the top dog know you plan to do so as well.

In the end, if you don't get the house, then go with another company (obviously). Jayman is a great place, from what I've heard.

Good luck!
Thanks. Well I've learned my lesson now. My first house was with Sterling and they were just awesome. I tried to contact Lea William Dorothy but she's on maternity leave. CTV has given me some contacts to follow and I am persuing them at the moment. I am also planning to contact Global TV and Dave Rutherford on CHQR. I am not going to sit quiet on this. Whatever they did to me is absolutely un-ethical and I will raise my voice at every level I can. I am just waiting for my check to arrive.

[int30h]

Originally posted by badatusrnames


They hit him with this addendum to the contract 3 months after he initially agreed to purchase the home...

Sounds like underhanded, dirty tactics to me, I imagine that if they were upfront about this policy, it would scare people off from ever agreeing to purchase from them. Instead, they present it to you three months later after people have invested time and given up their down payment in the hopes that you will not want to back out and go through the process all over again for another house with a different builder.

Good on the OP for showing great conviction in telling Cardel to shove it. I think that it is in the public interest for the media to alert all those that are looking to buy a home that if they buy with Cardel this could happen to them.

This addendum was NOT part of the original contract. They gave it to me after 3 months when I was almost done with all my vendor appointments and after wasting numerous hours running back and forth. They sold me a dream and robbed me.

[int30h]

Originally posted by anyone
Besides the fact that anything might happen, why don't you want to sign it?

I'd just sign it rather than having to go through that whole process. As long as you have enough stability to last that year, I wouldn't worry about it.

If you need a financial reason, assuming everything is equal and homes increase in price, you'll lose the finacial gain of your current house that's being built, you'll have lost the interest potential on the $50k down payment, and you will continue to miss out on a potential gain while you are looking for your new house, plus you're going to end up paying more for your new house. Add those gains together and it's probably worth your time to just sign the ridiculous agreement.

It seems like a waste of time and money to have to get your money back and then buy a new house where, again, anything can happen.

'Fear of unknown' is very killing and not all people would like to take this risk or are comfortable with this plus we're talking two years here. Can't sell it before Aug 2009 if the posession date doesn't creep up. and above all, when I pay the full price, IT IS MINE. Why do I ned someone's permission to sell it or make changes to it? I'll post a copy of this ridiculous contract for your review later.

[clem24]

Originally posted by richardchan2002
Either way, I say thumbs up to Cardel for doing something about these speculators driving up the house prices. Now if only the other builders would follow suit...

WTF?!?!?!? So let's say OP decides he wants to sell within the year. Cardel buys it back for what was paid. The market has gone up. So do you seriously think Cardel is going to sell it at the price they bought it back for, or at market price?

Yeah.. Thanks for coming out.

But to be fair, there is a possibility the market might go down, but that's hard to predict. So in a way, they are also taking a risk as well. House prices have been going down lately, so really, if that were to happen, SELL!!

BTW, we also built with Baywest and they've been very good to us. I have not heard many good things with Cardel in the past 2 years. Not a single positive comment. But there are always bad experiences. I also know of a few that have had bad experiences with Baywest, but comments are generally more positive than negative.

Just talk to a lawyer and see what they say. Heck, Cardel should've paid for a lawyer for you for your possession. You could probably just call him/her up as they know what is going on and is "usually" independent from the builder. Calling CTV or whatever ain't gonna do shit.

[autosm]

They might have something in the original contract that they can apply this at a later date ?

Like I said before if its a good deal sign it .........Sounds ok to me almost 2400 square feet for 500k ?

I agree on the renting but its a option if something goes wrong .

[int30h]

Originally posted by autosm
They might have something in the original contract that they can apply this at a later date ?

Like I said before if its a good deal sign it .........Sounds ok to me almost 2400 square feet for 500k ?

I agree on the renting but its a option if something goes wrong .
Absolutley NOTHING in the original contract that talks about it. I literally rememebr it by now as I've read it upteenth time.

[autosm]

You might have them ,let them tear up the contract .Then talk to a lawyer.

You might be best to get your own lawyer involved .If you do purchase the house use your own lawyer.


Bastards

[Crymson]

Just because something is in a contract, does not neccesarily mean than it's legally viable. I would get a lawyer.

Also, I know that int30h got fucked here, and that DOES suck, but i can't help but partially agree with richardchan2002's comment about it being good to keep the speculators out.

It's like what Nissan is going with the GTR and denying warrantee transferrability so people hoping to quickly resell for profit, will lose the warrantee on the re-sell.

[TurboZombie]

Originally posted by Crymson
Just because something is in a contract, does not neccesarily mean than it's legally viable. I would get a lawyer.

Also, I know that int30h got fucked here, and that DOES suck, but i can't help but partially agree with richardchan2002's comment about it being good to keep the speculators out.

It's like what Nissan is going with the GTR and denying warrantee transferrability so people hoping to quickly resell for profit, will lose the warrantee on the re-sell.

Once again, what does it matter what someone does say, if they BUY a GT-R and want to sell it?!? They would OWN it and should be able to sell it!

[googe]

Wow, this is a SMOKING deal for Cardel. This gives them the OPTION to purchase after 2 years, for the original price? They do that on all of their homes, and the market goes up, they own a shit ton of houses that they can just buy at will at a discount and sell for a profit. If prices go down, they don't exercise their option, and it's no skin off their back. It's a huge risk-free investment for them all because of some slimey paperwork.

Not only that, if you refuse to sign the addundum as OP did, then they can also exercise their option to cancel the sale. How much do you want to bet that if prices had gone down, they wouldn't have axed the deal? That's a second "out" they left for themselves if the market favors them going back on their deal.

And richardchan2002, I know you are bitter about being priced out of houses (you have voiced this many times over the last year or two on this forum) but there is no arguing that this is a dirty slimey move. Give the guy a break.

And yeah, just because it's technically legal, doesn't mean it isn't a scam. Cardel are scammers.

[USED1]

Originally posted by clem24


But to be fair, there is a possibility the market might go down, but that's hard to predict. So in a way, they are also taking a risk as well. House prices have been going down lately, so really, if that were to happen, SELL!!



The only problem with this part is the contract that they want him to sign gives them the right of first refusal. So if the market has dropped, they just don't buy it back. Cardel can only come out on top with this contract.

[clem24]

Originally posted by USED1


The only problem with this part is the contract that they want him to sign gives them the right of first refusal. So if the market has dropped, they just don't buy it back. Cardel can only come out on top with this contract.

Ah yes.. There's no obligation for them to buy it. But my point stands.. This is NOT to keep out speculators, but it's to ensure CARDEL reaps the benefits of all rewards. Still absolute BS. So completely disagree with RichardChan.

Honestly though.. I wonder why Cardel should even care. It's not like they are losing money on their end. So what if someone buys to flip? Maybe when there was still a lottery draw for lots, then yes, I think the rule might have made some sense, but nowadays, lots o' plenty to go around.

And to be fair, I suppose we can hear Cardel's position on why they care about speculators.

[riceboi]

Originally posted by USED1


The only problem with this part is the contract that they want him to sign gives them the right of first refusal. So if the market has dropped, they just don't buy it back. Cardel can only come out on top with this contract.

This is exactly what I was talking about, all Cardel's contracts are one-way with zero protection to the buyers/consumers.

To the people that believe Cardel's move is to prevent speculators, you guys need a reality check. Market prices are driven by supply and demand.

Btw, for the guy who get screwed by Cardel, ask them about holdback and you'll find more surprises. They do not allow hold back which means they can give you the house with incomplete things and you cannot hold a percentage of your payment to protect yourself incase if Cardel defaults on you.

[autosm]

Make sure they offer to buy it back if the market goes down .

Get them to add that to the contract and see if they sign that one.


If they got gready and over sold to speculators its thier own fault . They deserve what they got . When the day comes that they have to kiss ass to sell a house they will deserve that one too .

It was very easy to sell homes with 5k down. A little harder at 50k .



It amounts to, I will sell you somthing but if you want to resell it for a larger amount I get to buy it back at our original price .

Forget about landscaping, fence and added value such as appliances .

Its win win for them

If the price goes down, well thanks for coming out.




I suspect something is up and they have another buyer ?

[SilverGS]

Originally posted by clem24



But to be fair, there is a possibility the market might go down, but that's hard to predict. So in a way, they are also taking a risk as well. House prices have been going down lately, so really, if that were to happen, SELL!!



There is no risk. The have right of first refusal so the would get the first option to buy the house back. They could say they could say thy don't want it so if the market went down they would just say go ahead and sell it yourself and let you take the loss. They would only buy it back if it the value is higher.

My belief is Cardel is doing this only to line their own pockets and not to protect house prices from speculators/investors/flippers. People who do that are taking a risk that the market could go down and they lose money so I don't feel they actually drive up prices all that much. Price eventually comes down to what people are willing to pay for a house and builders set those prices more then any investor would.

Sounds like a very greedy move. Now if it was 2 way so they did buy it back even if the price went down then at least it would be fair

[int30h]

Ok Guys - Here's an update.

I received check from Cardel yesterday with a letter stating that they couldn't continue with the project based on company policies and my option for not signing the 'Right of First Refusal' agreement.

And do you think they paid me the full amount. NO, THEY DID NOT. They kept the realtor's commission and told ME to contact the realtor and tell him to return the commission back to Cardel and then they will give me the remaining amount.

On top of that, they spelt my name wrong on the check.

I haven't called them yet but I will ask them 'Didn't I pay you the full amount'? Why do I have to contact the realtor for this. I am so pissed.

[Masked Bandit]

Un-phucking-believable.

GAWD I wish we would have built with Shane.

[SilverGS]

:thumbsdow to Cardel

[Euro838]

Originally posted by SilverGS
:thumbsdow to Cardel

+1 :thumbsdow to Cardel

[Bimmer88]

Well their gay, but my point is...

Why not sign the damn thing anyways? Cause technically you don't "own" your house either way if you had signed it or signed it, and still went on with the house and after that year. You still have mortgage on top of that!

It's like leasing a car... technically it isn't yours but it is, and you "rent" it basically. Well just to let you know how you worded things.

I personally hate Cardel, and you should bring this upon the media, cause Cardel already has a bad rep.

My gf's house is leaking, and was improperly built, and now they have sooo much problems that Cardel claims "It's not covered under the warranty" This house isn't even a year old!


EDIT:

After reading some post I found this funny "box on a lot"

Someone should like buy a house and have it built, and when your doing the walk through you should say "WHAT THE FAAWK IS THIS!!?? It's a friggin BOX ON A LOT!" LOL!!

[autosm]

Wow what a bunch of clowns .

Media first then lawyer

[riceboi]

If you're curious , here is the copy of the new contract from Can't-deal (Cardel)..

http://www.calgaryandarea.ca/images/Image/reports/Cardel%20Contract%20%282%29.pdf
(taken from findcalgary.com)

[KELSTAR]

Originally posted by int30h
Hi guys,



I am pissed off now, since I am pushed back three months and house prices might have climbed up a bit.

I just need to know what my options are? The original contract says that builder has the right to cancel the agreement at any time (of course its written in their favor).

Should I call it Cardel scam?

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Prices are going up because of increasing construction costs but also because of far too much investor activity trying to make a buck. By putting in these practices about right of first refusal, they are trying to limit the marketing from skyrocketing like it did in 2005. We are finally returning to normal conditions with a fair amount of product on the resale market and new market inventory not being snapped up within seconds of a project launch. I understand your concern but I see the developers reasoning.

[thrasher22]

The developers reasoning? They're a developer, not a charity, they want housing prices to continue to rise. Just because housing costs have gone up 200k in the last couple years doesn't mean the price to build on has gone up the same.
Higher prices=more money for them.

Even if they're doing this to prevent an unstable market, how does this differentiate a flipper from a family buying their first house and getting screwed? It would get sold because it went up, NOT because they're investors. Even if it just prevents selling the house, what if you have to move to Vancouver next year? You're fucked.

This is the developer trying to get you to buy them stock options. They want a risk free opportunity to flip. This contract means in theory if the market goes up 50k on average in the next 6 months, Cardel can buy back EVERY home they built and make 50k off it. They probably won't, but they could.

Shouldn't you talk to a lawyer? This isn't small cash.

[bvanlankvelt]

Originally posted by thrasher22

This is the developer trying to get you to buy them stock options. They want a risk free opportunity to flip. This contract means in theory if the market goes up 50k on average in the next 6 months, Cardel can buy back EVERY home they built and make 50k off it. They probably won't, but they could.

Shouldn't you talk to a lawyer? This isn't small cash.

Although I don't agree with Cardel's program, this is also not entirely accurate. The contract gives a Right of First Refusal to repurchase the home at the original purchase price, but that only comes into effect if the original purchaser is attempting to sell within the first year.

Cardel can NOT repurchase the home if the owner is not offering it for sale. In other words, they can't force a sale if the market has gone up - it is a right of first refusal of an offered sale, not a right to purchase under any circumstances. After 1 year, all is null and void. Like I said, I don't agree and would not build with a builder that requred this, but some seem to not understand exactly what it means.

[CokerRat]

Absolutely unbelievable. FWIW, I too am building right now (thank God not with Cardel!) and my contract has absolutely no clause to let the builder cancel the contract without cause. That's a basic foundation of a legal contract! If they can cancel it at will, what's to stop them from telling you the price just went up by $50,000 and if you don't like it, they'll cancel your job? Incredible the balls these knobs have to screw with their clients. If the contract you signed permits them to do so, your options are limited. If it does not.... then you have some legal options open to you. I suspect you could sue them anyway, but it would take a good lawyer.

One other suggestion: Open a case with the Calgary BBB. It probably won't do anything except be a very visible record of their 'policies'. I checked the BBB for my builder for any open cases, I expect many other people do too and this is a good way to get the word out about Cardel's dishonest business practices.

[bignerd]

Perhaps you should consider yourself lucky that you got out of that ridiculous deal before it was too late. Prices have dropped anyhow from what I have seen. Maybe you should just buy an existing home, then that way you don't have to deal with any of this BS.

[The Cosworth]

unPhucking believeable

I have been following this thread for the last month and it is actually making me angry. Who the hell do they think they are? I hope their upper management gets charged with something and goes to jail

because there is NO WAY this is legal, and if it is then our corporate laws in Canada are just as pathetic as our criminal code... they wont do anything to protect the 'victim'




OP, get your money back from the realtor and move on, if someone was trying to do this to you now, obvisouly it isn't going to stop

[Masked Bandit]

Originally posted by brendankharris
unPhucking believeable

I have been following this thread for the last month and it is actually making me angry. Who the hell do they think they are? I hope their upper management gets charged with something and goes to jail

because there is NO WAY this is legal, and if it is then our corporate laws in Canada are just as pathetic as our criminal code... they wont do anything to protect the 'victim'




OP, get your money back from the realtor and move on, if someone was trying to do this to you now, obvisouly it isn't going to stop

You think it makes YOU mad? Trying being in the position of them already having $85,000 of your money in their pocket and still doing basically anything they want!

lol

[Unknown303]

While i feel bad about the OP losing money from this and going through all the hassles of trying to get it back, i can see where Cardel is coming from. And if they are trying to keep the market a little lower to allow more home owners (Not Flippers) then I commend them for that.

The only problem being that they are doing it in a way that is in poor taste. If that addendum already existed in the contract then what would it matter, seems a little sleazy to add if after although maybe it does exist in new contracts now.

And for someone seriously looking for a home who wouldn't sit in it for a year after possession. Everyones getting up in arms because they lock you in for a year, But thats only a year. I understand that things can change drastically in a year but from the OP it does say they have the right to buy back, it doesn't say that they will. Maybe under certain circumstances they wouldn't force you to sell it back if there was legitimate reasoning behind having to sell.

If this is all to prevent people from scooping up houses to sell in a year then i really can't say that I'm against it. I'm just against the method of delivery.

[freshprince1]

There's no way Cardel would execute this clause(sp?) if you are a legitmate buyer who just wants to build a house and live in it. And it's not like they need the money, they are doing extremely well, they are one of the only builders who have not been hit super hard with the slow-down in new houses. they are doing what they can to keep the market sustainable. And I would bet they would be understanding if extenuating circumstances arose within the first year and you need to get out (i.e. loss of job, death in family...etc.)

But I do agree is was brash of them to bring it in after you signed your contract, most likely someone dropped the ball and did not have the paperwork in order.

I say take your concerns to the General Sales Manager, or VP Sales and see what they say. But what's the harm in signing it if you don't plan on moving?

[JordanLotoski]

Originally posted by int30h
Ok Guys - Here's an update.

I received check from Cardel yesterday with a letter stating that they couldn't continue with the project based on company policies and my option for not signing the 'Right of First Refusal' agreement.

And do you think they paid me the full amount. NO, THEY DID NOT. They kept the realtor's commission and told ME to contact the realtor and tell him to return the commission back to Cardel and then they will give me the remaining amount.

On top of that, they spelt my name wrong on the check.

I haven't called them yet but I will ask them 'Didn't I pay you the full amount'? Why do I have to contact the realtor for this. I am so pissed.



I would call them and tell them your talking to Global news about this matter...see how fast they call you back. No builder nor business wants to be on the city news for doing a customer wrong.

[autosm]

Any up dates ?

My Bank contact says wait until January she has info saying big promos are coming soon from the new home builders .

[Masked Bandit]

To the OP, did you ever get the rest of your money back?

[googe]

Haha, wow. Keeping realtor fees now. Unbelievable.

[riceboi]

Regardless of whether this is a good or bad intention from Cardel. I think this makes people think twice when they buy homes with Cardel. To the PR and marketing guys at Cardel...good job guys, you make other builders in town look so good now!!

[De Dutch]

Fucking mormons, hahahha jj.

[freshprince1]

Originally posted by De Dutch
Fucking mormons, hahahha jj.

Quite the opposite actually. Cardel is one of the only builders who has not slowed down significantly with the current market, I know most builders have...some have not even sold a house since Halloween. Cardel does things right and they are still super busy right now.

But I still think they could have handled the O.P.'s situation better.

[Masked Bandit]

Originally posted by freshprince1

Cardel does things right and they are still super busy right now.



Ya, if you call lying to your customers "doing things right".

[jmc]

If you are serious, talk to a 'good' lawyer that specializes in consumer protection and competition.

If Cardel when 'on the record' and stated the 'only' reason they cancel your original agreement is because you did not sign their 'new addendum' “option to repurchase/right of first refusal agreement”. I believe you have a case.

Basically that 'new' agreement, which is a requirement 'after the fact', entitles Cardel a special modified option*. 'If' this is not a standard industry practice, and they are not paying ‘fair market value’ for that special modified option. Then this gives them an unfair advantage over their competition and more importantly unfair treatment to the customer.

In the general financial market, 'options' are agreements between two parties for a specified time period (up to the expiry date) that give holders the right, not the obligation, to buy or sell something, at a pre-determined price (exercise or strike price).

The option premium is the price the buyer pays the seller for the rights conveyed by the option contract. It is the price of the option.

In this case, it’s a ‘special modified’ derivatives option, where the ‘rights/options’ can only be exercised if 'you' decide to sell before the expiry date.

[Masked Bandit]

I just want to keep this thread on the main page. Cardel has done such a poor job of customer service on our home I want to make sure they get all the "good" publicity they deserve.

[Masked Bandit]

So to keep up with my theme of warning the consuming public of Cardel Homes......

Cardel has now forced us to accept the basement development with no subfloor as they have built the ceiling too low in one of the bedrooms & bathrooms. Unfortunately, I get screwed because in the contract there are no specs for the basement development one way or the other. If the ceiling was another two inches higher, they could do it. To top it all off they have had a general "phuck you, we have your money" attitude.


THANKS FOR NOTHING CARDEL.

There is a good chance that this house will be up for sale soon after we are forced to take it.

[2.0turbo]

I haven't read the whole post cause I just dont want to but if the addendum was not attached to the original contract, It can't be enforced at this point.

The clause that says that they are not able to build your house in a certain amount of time only relates to unforseeable circumstances like acts of god or inability to obtain necessary permits for one reason or another. Not because you won't sign something that they implemented after the fact. If they have accepted the aggreement before this came into play, too bad for them, they can't legally end your contract over it. That doesn't mean that they won't find another reason to cancel.

Builders.....its a wonder why anyone wants to build a house these days. And believe me, my livlyhood depends on people buying new homes as I sell new home, but really, most of these fuckers are just dicks. They think because they buid so many houses that the offers and deals brought in are just files to them, when really its thousands and thousands of dollars from real people. Pisses me off.

[Z_Fan]

I might spend a little time bumping Cardel Homes threads.

:poosie:

Especially if they are in a bad light. Because frankly, Cardel Homes appears to carry out some pretty despicable business practices, and I think all potential New Home purchasers should be aware of other Cardel Homes customer experiences.

TTT