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View Full Version : New GM Diesel V8- No Manifolds



iceburns288
01-21-2008, 08:44 PM
http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i188/Philthybenz/x08pt_8c091.jpg

http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i188/Philthybenz/08_455.jpg


General Motors has taken some of the wraps off of its 2010 Duramax diesel V8, revealing clever design features and technologies that clearly push the state-of-the-art in Vee-type compression-ignition engines.

Unveiled during a media briefing at its Milford, MI, Proving Grounds, the new 4.5-L powerplant will be one of the most powerful, lowest-emitting, and package-efficient light-duty V8 diesels in the marketplace, company engineers claimed.

The new Duramax is scheduled to enter production in late 2009 at GM's Tonawanda, NY, engine plant. It will power GM's full-size pickup trucks and utilities, among other potential applications. Rated output is targeted at more than 310 hp (231 kW), for 68 hp/L (51 kW/L), and 520 lb•ft (705 N•m).

The Duramax was designed to fit within the ultra-compact envelope of GM's small-block gasoline V8. Its NVH profile also targets the gas engine. These aggressive requirements drove many of the engine's innovations announced to date.

The new engine's aluminum cylinder heads' exhaust ports face inboard, toward the valley of the cylinder block. This allows the single variable-geometry turbocharger, exhaust-gas recirculation (EGR) cooler, and close-coupled oxidation catalyst to reside within the valley. The layout negates the need for separate exhaust manifolds while reducing overall width.

The reversed-head orientation also means the new diesel does not use a conventional intake manifold. Its intake ports are internal, rather than arrayed along an exterior face of the head as in common practice. The ports are fed pressurized charge directly through the tops of the intake camshaft covers.

The heads' unique two-tiered internal construction segregates the intake route, the chain-driven DOHC valvegear, and water jacket. (The fully dressed engine on display was not sectioned, so no internal details were revealed.)

Compacted graphite-iron (CGI) optimizes the cylinder block's strength and mass. The block's cylinder banks are splayed at 72º to achieve a narrow overall package with even firing, but the narrow vee requires a balance shaft for smooth running. GM studied aluminum block castings but determined that the light alloy would not deliver sufficient long-term durability and could not cope with the cylinder pressures planned for the new engine.

The main bearing caps are precision-fractured ("cracked"). This novel application of a feature that is commonly used for connecting rod big-ends enables closer crank-to-bearing tolerances with greatly improved assembly accuracy.

Piezo-type common-rail fuel injectors operating at 2000 bar (29,000 psi) are one of the keys to the new diesel meeting ultra-stringent U.S. Tier 2 bin 5 and California LEV2 emissions regulations. Another enabler is the engine's urea-based selective catalytic reduction system for reducing engine-out NOx (oxides of nitrogen) emissions.

The Duramax is package-protected for closed-loop cylinder pressure monitoring, a technology GM will introduce on its new 2.9-L turbodiesel V6 next year in Europe.

The initial concept for the new Duramax sprang from impromptu brainstorming sessions between GM's Director of Diesel Engineering, Charlie Freese, and the V8's Chief Engineer, Gary Arvan.

"It was totally clean-sheet," Freese recalled. "Starting with very rough sketches, our path to every technical solution began with a 'what if.' We ended up avoiding traditional approaches."

And Mountain Dew, rather than coffee, was the engineers' preferred beverage during the meetings, which stretched into many late evenings.

According to Arvan, one strategic goal was to eliminate the component duplications that make Vee-type diesels inherently more complex and costly. Hence the single turbocharger and absence of exhaust manifolds.

Another goal was "to shorten the typical long induction and exhaust paths and minimize surface area along the way, to quickly get the hot exhaust out of the heads and into the turbo," he noted.

Eliminating the intake manifold and employing internal exhaust-gas recirculation also reduces the number of noise-radiating surfaces, Arvan said. And the stout CGI block "is stiffer than any competitive cylinder block we've analyzed—and we've analyzed them all," Freese added.

The Duramax's bills of design and materials (BoD and BoM) were developed to achieve some commonality with the current-generation 6.6-L V8. Shared features include the quick-start system with intake air heater, electronic EGR, and some elements of the larger diesel's electronic control system. The 4.5-L engine will employ a new E86 engine controller.

GM will uncloak more of the V8's secrets this year, after the automaker establishes patents in a number of areas, said Freese.

That's very interesting... like BMW's new TT V8, but crazier.

finboy
01-21-2008, 08:45 PM
wonder how the aftermarket will work with it

dimi
01-21-2008, 08:50 PM
well the 335d gets 286 hp so lets see what this V8 will get.

benyl
01-21-2008, 09:12 PM
Is says in the quote, 310hp.

962 kid
01-21-2008, 09:16 PM
that's a horrible hp/L, typical domestic trash

ryanallan
01-21-2008, 09:25 PM
Originally posted by 962 kid
that's a horrible hp/L, typical domestic trash

It's a diesel. Look at the torque

gpomp
01-21-2008, 09:26 PM
ah yes, the next corporate engine for gm trucks and suv's.

ScottysZ
01-21-2008, 09:31 PM
Originally posted by 962 kid
that's a horrible hp/L, typical domestic trash

Hahahahaha good one.

Darkane
01-21-2008, 09:34 PM
Originally posted by 962 kid
that's a horrible hp/L, typical domestic trash

I hope for your sake that was a typo. 520ft/lbs. Domestic trash?

gpomp
01-21-2008, 09:46 PM
give me a diesel h2 now. :eek:

Proboscis
01-21-2008, 09:59 PM
Can I get that in crate version plz. Sweet powerplant for some old GM iron.

DRKM
01-21-2008, 10:55 PM
Good lord when will they get rid of the common rail shit. Direct Injection is the only way to go in Diesels. They have been using this technology for years in heavy duty....

nismodrifter
01-21-2008, 10:59 PM
Originally posted by DRKM
Good lord when will they get rid of the common rail shit. Direct Injection is the only way to go in Diesels. They have been using this technology for years in heavy duty....

What?!

It will be a common rail direct injection engine. The common rail system of fuel delivery does not interfere with the direct injection of fuel into the combustion chamber, it is just a different way of getting the high pressures in the fuel systems to get the most efficient and clean combustion.

Mazstyle
01-21-2008, 11:08 PM
Aluminum heads on a diesel....interesting. I'd really like to see how the intake ports work with the valve covers.

Canadaslowest
01-21-2008, 11:16 PM
Good to see the moved the starter, doing a starter on a duramax now is a 7 hour job (under the intake)

hampstor
01-22-2008, 01:38 AM
Originally posted by 962 kid
that's a horrible hp/L, typical domestic trash

best misinformed post ever :rofl:

Proboscis
01-22-2008, 04:19 AM
350 olds fucked it up. bad head bolts, bad diesel.

heavyD
01-22-2008, 08:52 AM
Originally posted by 962 kid
that's a horrible hp/L, typical domestic trash

I agree. Honda could take that engine and put VTEC on it and it would make 1000 HP and 150 lb/ft.:rolleyes:

b_t
01-22-2008, 09:14 AM
Originally posted by 962 kid
that's a horrible hp/L, typical domestic trash

ahahaa nice


Originally posted by finboy
wonder how the aftermarket will work with it

I hope the aftermarket just doesn't work with it... I hate hearing some guy talking about his new turbo, and I think he's a serious car guy, and then it turns out he's just a serious truck guy who has a quad cab long box chev lifted on 35" tires and thinks it is both fast on road and effective offroad when it is neither

rage2
01-22-2008, 09:26 AM
Originally posted by 962 kid
that's a horrible hp/L, typical domestic trash

Originally posted by ryanallan
It's a diesel. Look at the torque

Originally posted by ScottysZ
Hahahahaha good one.

Originally posted by Darkane
I hope for your sake that was a typo. 520ft/lbs. Domestic trash?

Originally posted by hampstor
best misinformed post ever :rofl:

Originally posted by heavyD
I agree. Honda could take that engine and put VTEC on it and it would make 1000 HP and 150 lb/ft.:rolleyes:
:rofl:

I'm sure he's just poking fun at Honda and BMW fanboys who would've eventually made that post lol.

heavyD
01-22-2008, 10:44 AM
Originally posted by rage2
:rofl:

I'm sure he's just poking fun at Honda and BMW fanboys who would've eventually made that post lol.

I can't take the chance and assume that he isn't a Honda fanboy. I just saw the Jennifer Love Hewitt cellulite pics :barf: and now will not take anything for granted.

benyl
01-22-2008, 11:10 AM
Originally posted by heavyD


I can't take the chance and assume that he isn't a Honda fanboy. I just saw the Jennifer Love Hewitt cellulite pics :barf: and now will not take anything for granted.

Are you kidding? 962kid was going to make a drift car out of a Hyundai! How much more anti Honda can you get?

wjjeeper
01-22-2008, 11:18 AM
I cannot wait for the new 1/2T diesels to hit the market.
Biggest question for me is if I'll be driving a new Dodge, Ford, or Chev. The first one on the market gets my dollars.

403Gemini
01-22-2008, 11:48 AM
Originally posted by 962 kid
that's a horrible hp/L, typical domestic trash

typical import fan boi trash :rofl:

Do you know the difference between regular engines and diesel? Next you'll say TDI golf's are slow because of their hp

finboy
01-22-2008, 12:06 PM
man, so many people in this thread fail at sarcasm

403Gemini
01-22-2008, 12:23 PM
My sarcasm detector is broken :(

katana9x4
01-22-2008, 12:29 PM
torque is for losers

RUQUIKR
01-22-2008, 01:15 PM
Originally posted by katana9x4
torque is for losers

Tell that intelligent piece of info to the guy pulling a 16,000lb trailer and he'll tell you who the loser is.

treg50
01-22-2008, 02:44 PM
^ Your sarcasm detector is broken. Please call Microsoft Technical Support for assistance.

iceburns288
01-22-2008, 04:13 PM
The failboat has quite a crew in this thread...

http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u224/SaneMadness/Failboat.jpg

BerserkerCatSplat
01-22-2008, 05:54 PM
That's a failboatload of broken sarcasm detectors.

finboy
01-22-2008, 05:57 PM
PFT, HORSEPOWER IS BETTA DOMESTIC BOI!!!!!!

Graham_A_M
01-22-2008, 06:12 PM
Originally posted by 962 kid
that's a horrible hp/L, typical domestic trash
jdm fanboy, typical bigot.
:dunno:

EK 2.0
01-22-2008, 06:20 PM
Originally posted by finboy

man, so many people in this thread fail at sarcasm

It's because we USED to use the sarcasm brackets which we no longer do...

iceburns288
01-22-2008, 06:31 PM
Originally posted by Graham_A_M
jdm fanboy, typical bigot.
:dunno:
The boat hasn't sailed yet, boys!

EDIT [the sarcasm brackets rock, we should bring them back] ;)

benyl
01-23-2008, 12:58 AM
Originally posted by 403Gemini

typical import fan boi trash :rofl:

Do you know the difference between regular engines and diesel? Next you'll say TDI golf's are slow because of their hp

Originally posted by RUQUIKR

Tell that intelligent piece of info to the guy pulling a 16,000lb trailer and he'll tell you who the loser is.

Originally posted by Graham_A_M

jdm fanboy, typical bigot.
:dunno:

http://i225.photobucket.com/albums/dd311/ulises2004/doggystylenoob.gif

403Gemini
01-23-2008, 11:11 AM
Originally posted by treg50
^ Your sarcasm detector is broken. Please call Microsoft Technical Support for assistance.

I'm still on hold, its been 24 hours :banghead:

edit: oh shut up benyl i already admitted i missed the sarcasm :thumbsup: lol

ianmcc
01-23-2008, 12:43 PM
It's going in trucks and SUV's, not Cobalts you idiots.

finboy
01-24-2008, 01:12 PM
Originally posted by ianmcc
It's going in trucks and SUV's, not Cobalts you idiots.

[thats because trucks can't handle madd HP, only shitty torque]

H4LFY2nR
01-29-2008, 10:20 PM
They need to release some cut aways. I really want to know how this integrated intake manifold/valve cover works...

....and what the hell was the point of the Mountain Dew plug? "Check out our EXTREME diesel. It's EXTREME!":guns:

EK 2.0
01-29-2008, 11:57 PM
Originally posted by finboy

[thats because trucks can't handle madd HP, only shitty torque]


haha...brackets...

finboy
01-30-2008, 12:17 AM
Originally posted by EK 2.0



haha...brackets...

bringing them back like they were db's (see "buying a suit" thread)