Kidd traded to the mavericks

[bigboom]

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=3244102

wow...these last few months of the season are going to be interesting. first the lakers with gasol, then the suns with shaq and now Dallas picking up Kidd.

[icecreamvan]

I'm so happy for the Mavs that I'm going to tip my usual waitress an extra percent tonight.

[5hift]

this is such a stupid trade.

I know everyone will get excited because Kidd is a big name, but this trade makes the Mavs worse. If it does help them, it will only be for the very short term.

Harris, G/F Jerry Stackhouse, C DeSagana Diop, G/F Devean George, G Maurice Ager, $3 million and two future No. 1 draft picks is wayy to much for Kidd and Malik Allen.

He may be a offensive upgrade over Harris, and a better leader, but everyone seems to miss the fact Harris was the best defensive point guard in the league last year, and among the best this year again. Jason wont be able to cover Nash, Parker, Baron Davis and Company with the same effectiveness as Harris has.

[Jlude]

Originally posted by icecreamvan
I'm so happy for the Mavs that I'm going to tip my usual waitress an extra percent tonight.

Wow... you're really letting things get crazy!

Are you gonna have 2% milk with dinner rather than skim?

[bigboom]

Originally posted by 5hift
this is such a stupid trade.

I know everyone will get excited because Kidd is a big name, but this trade makes the Mavs worse. If it does help them, it will only be for the very short term.

Harris, G/F Jerry Stackhouse, C DeSagana Diop, G/F Devean George, G Maurice Ager, $3 million and two future No. 1 draft picks is wayy to much for Kidd and Malik Allen.

He may be a offensive upgrade over Harris, and a better leader, but everyone seems to miss the fact Harris was the best defensive point guard in the league last year, and among the best this year again. Jason wont be able to cover Nash, Parker, Baron Davis and Company with the same effectiveness as Harris has.

i completely agree. Harris is so much more athletic and long that he will be able to give any pg's in the west a fit. the one thing though that he will bring is mental toughness. i hate mark cuban and the mavericks so im hoping this blows up in their face but with Kidd you never know.

and the thing with kidd is being 35 how much more does he have in the tank? i think this is cubans attempt at buying a championship, did you watch the game against the nets? that may have sealed it in cubans mind that needed Kidd.

[bigboom]

Originally posted by icecreamvan
I'm so happy for the Mavs that I'm going to tip my usual waitress an extra percent tonight.

whatever floats your boat

[PGTze]

Originally posted by 5hift
this is such a stupid trade.

I know everyone will get excited because Kidd is a big name, but this trade makes the Mavs worse. If it does help them, it will only be for the very short term.

Harris, G/F Jerry Stackhouse, C DeSagana Diop, G/F Devean George, G Maurice Ager, $3 million and two future No. 1 draft picks is wayy to much for Kidd and Malik Allen.

He may be a offensive upgrade over Harris, and a better leader, but everyone seems to miss the fact Harris was the best defensive point guard in the league last year, and among the best this year again. Jason wont be able to cover Nash, Parker, Baron Davis and Company with the same effectiveness as Harris has.

I agree, Kidd is not that good. Harris George and Diop can all play, but it does say stackhouse is basicly going to have his contract bought out by the nets and then sign with Dallas again in 30 days, weak.

[max_boost]

That's a heavy price to pay for Jason Kidd! Cuban must feel this is the missing link for a title run.:eek:

[beecue]

:rofl: I knew this was going to happen once Shaq got traded .. Cuban wasn't going to sit and do nothing

[5hift]

lets hold up here looks like the trade is on ice for now...

"NBA front-office sources say that Mavericks forward Devean George has unexpectedly exercised his right to block the trade that was expected to make Jason Kidd a Maverick.

The teams had verbally agreed to the deal before George told the Mavericks that he wouldn't consent to it, which is his right based on a rare provision in his one-year contract. George recently complained that the Mavericks weren't playing him enough, so this is somewhat shocking. His decision probably won't kill the deal for good, but we'll have to wait to see how this plays out. "

[max_boost]

And George goes 0-11 from the field tonight against the TrailBlazers haha Awesome! :rofl: :thumbsup:

[bigboom]

Originally posted by max_boost
And George goes 0-11 from the field tonight against the TrailBlazers haha Awesome! :rofl: :thumbsup:

not to mention all of Dallas pretty much hates him now, i wouldnt want to stay on the Mavs after i pull this kind of stunt. if he doesnt take this back i could see avery benching him the rest of the year haha.

[sexualbanana]

Good short term fix, but the Mavs just gave up what little manpower they had at the 4 and 5 spots in a conference full of dominant big men (O Neal, Stoudamire, Gasol, Bynum, Duncan, Horry, etc)

[bulaian]

The New Jersey Nets and Dallas on Tuesday completed a trade sending the all-star to the Mavericks, who now have one of the NBA's best point guards as they look toward the playoffs. This will be Kidd's second stint with Dallas.

The eight-player deal, in the making since before the all-star break, sends Kidd, forward Malik Allen and guard Antoine Wright to Dallas for point guard Devin Harris, centre DeSagana Diop and swingman Maurice Ager, plus retired forward Keith Van Horn and Trenton Hassell. New Jersey also gets two first-round draft picks and US$3 million.

Van Horn and Hassell replace Jerry Stackhouse and Devean George in an original trade proposal. Stackhouse's presence in the deal was muddled by plans to get him back to Dallas - within the rules, although in a way the league frowned upon - and George used his veto power to block his involvement.

[brucebanner]

I guess Dallas just wants Kidd that bad. I dont think they will see a huge improvement and as said above, I dont think that Kidd will be able to stay with the younger, quicker west guards..

[RiCE-DaDDy]

its over for the Mavs haha. I can't wait for shaq to tear the rim down on dirk's head.

[bigboom]

yeah van horn is a pretty big winner in this...all he has to do is pass a physical with the nets and he gets some free money.

[Quinsonaaa]

crazyy trades this past months
shaq
and kiddd
wow

[urbannomad]

^^you forgot the gasol trade?

i honestly think what the mavs did might be considered in the near future as one of the most lopsided trades in history!
kidd is on his way down, and you gave up 2 first rounders???? for shaq, i could understand when he went to MIA, but my god....the mavs royally fucked themselves. They have no big man, nor do they have any defence....diop was their big man defender......:rofl:


I honestly think the lakers are the team to beat....damn, they are so good now! and to watch them....it's like a symphony orchestra, everyone's playing well, and at the same time. Lakers are the team to beat, not the suns, not the mavs, not the spurs.

[brucebanner]

Originally posted by urbannomad
^^you forgot the gasol trade?

i honestly think what the mavs did might be considered in the near future as one of the most lopsided trades in history!
kidd is on his way down, and you gave up 2 first rounders???? for shaq, i could understand when he went to MIA, but my god....the mavs royally fucked themselves. They have no big man, nor do they have any defence....diop was their big man defender......:rofl:


I honestly think the lakers are the team to beat....damn, they are so good now! and to watch them....it's like a symphony orchestra, everyone's playing well, and at the same time. Lakers are the team to beat, not the suns, not the mavs, not the spurs.

Lakers are playing great, what happens come playoff time or near playoff time and someone takes a good wack at Kobe's hand. You know someones going to..

As much as I hate to say it, I still think the Spurs are still the team to beat.

Mavs just screwed up with that trade, they'll come to realize soon enought!

[sexualbanana]

I don't know what Gasol's contract is like (contract year?), but I don't think this will be the Lakers' year. They've been killed by injuries to Bynum (who should be back soon), Ariza, and Mihm, it'll be a tough fight just to win the West. I think it comes down to how Kobe and the Lakers will be handling this.

[bigboom]

Originally posted by sexualbanana
I don't know what Gasol's contract is like (contract year?), but I don't think this will be the Lakers' year. They've been killed by injuries to Bynum (who should be back soon), Ariza, and Mihm, it'll be a tough fight just to win the West. I think it comes down to how Kobe and the Lakers will be handling this.

gasol has a contract through to 2011 i believe. i think a big factor is kobe's finger, not to be dirty but im sure you'll see some teams come playoff time slapping the ball every time kobe has it just to put some pressure on the finger and see how he reacts.

the thing i like about the lakers now is how they can score, like the phoenix game last night, kobe with 41, gasol with 29 and odom with 20 plus...

kurt thomas just got traded to the spurs and now new orleans just picked up mike james and bonzi wells, mike james is useless but provides another option when pargo isnt playing well, wells should be able to provide david west a solid backup along with mo pete.

[sexualbanana]

Originally posted by bigboom


gasol has a contract through to 2011 i believe. i think a big factor is kobe's finger, not to be dirty but im sure you'll see some teams come playoff time slapping the ball every time kobe has it just to put some pressure on the finger and see how he reacts.

the thing i like about the lakers now is how they can score, like the phoenix game last night, kobe with 41, gasol with 29 and odom with 20 plus...

kurt thomas just got traded to the spurs and now new orleans just picked up mike james and bonzi wells, mike james is useless but provides another option when pargo isnt playing well, wells should be able to provide david west a solid backup along with mo pete.

In that case, I think the Lakers will be big favourites next season. But with injuries to key players this year, I think it'll be a rough run for them.

[bigboom]

Originally posted by sexualbanana


In that case, I think the Lakers will be big favourites next season. But with injuries to key players this year, I think it'll be a rough run for them.

i agree with you, i think teh biggest thing though is when will bynum return and how fast can he get accustomed to having pau on the floor. without a big man like bynum they are going to have a hard time dealing with the "bigs" in the west.

i keep going back to the game last night, first game with shaq on the floor and the game was competitive, wait till shaq and amare really learn how to play with each other, thats going to be amazing.

[xin]

Mavs needed a center more than a pg. While Kidd can't guard the faster guards, evident by the game last night. Chris Paul completely tore the Mavs a new one, one steal shy of a triple double. The Mavs are banking on his playoff experience and playmaking abilities. I guess we shall see come playoff time.

Spurs pulled off a big one last night. Kurt Thomas is an underrated defender and a big man that can stretch out the floor. That Hornets-Rockets trade benefits New Orleans more than Houston IMO. Hornets bench gets deeper with the addition of Wells and James. Both can play multiple positions and Wells is a good defender. Bobby Jackson on the other hand is definetly on the decline and is in the latter stages of his career. I am suprised Artest and Miller(s) didn't get moved.

The west is a free for all this year. I can't wait to see how the last 2 months are gonna unfold. Half a dozen games seperate the first place and 9th place teams. You have a .600 club looking in from the outside for the 8th spot. 9 teams on the west projected to win 50+ games this season. A couple 2 game loosing streaks can throw you out of the playoff picture. Its nuts.

[xin]

Sounds like the Raptors have sent Juan Dixon to the Detroit Pistons for Primoz Brezec as well. Not a major move, but Brez did play some decent ball with Charlotte a few years ago. Nevertheless, another big man to to share some minutes at the 5.

[urbannomad]

Originally posted by xin
Sounds like the Raptors have sent Juan Dixon to the Detroit Pistons for Primoz Brezec as well. Not a major move, but Brez did play some decent ball with Charlotte a few years ago. Nevertheless, another big man to to share some minutes at the 5.


wow, really?

i thought they were going to go for another pg? they could've easily traded derrick martin + juan for a big man+pg... maybe colangelo could've gone to seattle? :dunno:

[bigboom]

big three team trade today with the cavs, bulls and seattle getting in it.

Larry Hughes and Drew Gooden to Chicago, Ben Wallace and Joe Smith to Cleveland, Cavs' Ira Newble and Donyell Marshall, and Chicago's Adrian Griffin, to Seattle for Wally Szczerbiak and Delonte West.

ben wallace with bron bron should be interesting give the cavs a bigger rebounding presence. and it looks like the sonics keep getting expiring contracts, should be itneresting to see what the sonics can pull off in the off season.

[wiggaplz]

Good move for the Raps. I couldn't stand Dixon, he doesn't really bring much to the table except a decent 3 point shot. Next year we should definitely get rid of TJ Ford and get a very good 5, who compliments Bosh well. Calderon has shown countless of times that he can handle the load and he should of made the all star team. Dude is one of the smartest players in the NBA and never makes a bad decision.

[urbannomad]

Originally posted by bigboom
big three team trade today with the cavs, bulls and seattle getting in it.

Larry Hughes and Drew Gooden to Chicago, Ben Wallace and Joe Smith to Cleveland, Cavs' Ira Newble and Donyell Marshall, and Chicago's Adrian Griffin, to Seattle for Wally Szczerbiak and Delonte West.

ben wallace with bron bron should be interesting give the cavs a bigger rebounding presence. and it looks like the sonics keep getting expiring contracts, should be itneresting to see what the sonics can pull off in the off season.

damn. beat me to it!

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=3257159

wow, cavs are gonna be fierce!
raptors are done! :whipped:

[bigboom]

Originally posted by wiggaplz
Good move for the Raps. I couldn't stand Dixon, he doesn't really bring much to the table except a decent 3 point shot. Next year we should definitely get rid of TJ Ford and get a very good 5, who compliments Bosh well. Calderon has shown countless of times that he can handle the load and he should of made the all star team. Dude is one of the smartest players in the NBA and never makes a bad decision.

i'll agree that calderon is definetly a good player and has ball smarts but he can't create as well as tj can. tj and jose are both quick but tj is a little more explosive and can get his own shot where jose has to look for teammates. im a huge calderon fan but i still think the raps need tj. should be interesting to see what happens to calderon as he becomes a restricted free agent this year.

[bigboom]

Originally posted by urbannomad


damn. beat me to it!

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=3257159

wow, cavs are gonna be fierce!
raptors are done! :whipped:

i'm not sure the cavs are that much improved to be honest with you, wallace has been a non factor this year, the only thing he can still do decently is board, he doesnt even have the D that he used to. Szerbiak should be a better fit than Hughes though, larry was always more of a run and gun style player whereas wally does a little better in a half court setup which the cavs like to play.

i like the dixon trade for the raps though, get rid of an unproductive player for a big man with an expiring contract this year, leaves colangelo a little more room to play this offseason.

[xin]

Originally posted by urbannomad



wow, really?

i thought they were going to go for another pg? they could've easily traded derrick martin + juan for a big man+pg... maybe colangelo could've gone to seattle? :dunno:

Juan Dixon wanted out of T.O, he was only playing like 6-7 minutes a game and always pouting. So why not just unload him for a big man to help out on the boards. Problem is Brez was averaging only 10 and 5 playing 32 min/game while with Charlotte. So don't expect much in return. At least his contract comes off after this season.


Originally posted by bigboom


i'm not sure the cavs are that much improved to be honest with you, wallace has been a non factor this year, the only thing he can still do decently is board, he doesnt even have the D that he used to. Szerbiak should be a better fit than Hughes though, larry was always more of a run and gun style player whereas wally does a little better in a half court setup which the cavs like to play.

i like the dixon trade for the raps though, get rid of an unproductive player for a big man with an expiring contract this year, leaves colangelo a little more room to play this offseason.

I am interested how this trade will work out. I agree Wallace has been pretty much non-factor this season and seems to be on the decline. Maybe playing with LBJ will spark whatevers left in his tank. They've been trying to unload Hughe and Gooden for some time and they finally do but in return pick up the huge contract from Wallace. Wally should be the corner 3 point guy that they need, and hes from Ohio to kick too. Joe Smith is a veteran PF that can help. Delonte may arguably be best PG left on the trading block after Andre Miller. Newbles a decent defender at best. Marshall, who is replaced by Wally. It all comes down to the play of Wallace. If he fails, then the Cavs downgraded from the trade for sure.

[brucebanner]

Originally posted by bigboom


i'll agree that calderon is definetly a good player and has ball smarts but he can't create as well as tj can. tj and jose are both quick but tj is a little more explosive and can get his own shot where jose has to look for teammates. im a huge calderon fan but i still think the raps need tj. should be interesting to see what happens to calderon as he becomes a restricted free agent this year.

I'm a big fan of both Jose and Tj, but with Tj's back problem and such one would think that he would be up in the air for time to come. Jose can lead the rapts no problem and has proved it this season for sure. The rapts need another proven big man that can help Bosh along with the rest of the team. Tj wants to be more of a scorer then a true PG, I think Jose is more of a true PG that looks for the team first, himself second.

On a side note, Raptors smoked the Magic last night as well:thumbsup:

EDIT: Nothing on nba.com about the Cav's trade yet?

[max_boost]

Is showtime back? The Lakers looked pretty good last night. It didn't take long for Pau to fit right in. That's the kind of trade where you give up players and picks. Dallas should learn. Pau has so many good years in front of him and he's probably excited as hell that he got to leave a bad situation in Memphis. Perennial losers! Change the Grizzlies name!

I hate the Spurs but they play the best team ball and still are the favorites no matter how well the hot shot teams like the Hornets + Lakers are playing. The West is so sick. Can a 50 win team actually miss the playoffs? :eek:

What team do you think is going to miss out from the West?

[5hift]

Originally posted by xin
Mavs needed a center more than a pg. While Kidd can't guard the faster guards, evident by the game last night. Chris Paul completely tore the Mavs a new one, one steal shy of a triple double. The Mavs are banking on his playoff experience and playmaking abilities. I guess we shall see come playoff time.


:werd: Paul undressed Kidd all night. I wonder what Kidd's planning on doing against PG's faster than Paul (Nash, Parker, etc)


Originally posted by bigboom
big three team trade today with the cavs, bulls and seattle getting in it.

Larry Hughes and Drew Gooden to Chicago, Ben Wallace and Joe Smith to Cleveland, Cavs' Ira Newble and Donyell Marshall, and Chicago's Adrian Griffin, to Seattle for Wally Szczerbiak and Delonte West.

ben wallace with bron bron should be interesting give the cavs a bigger rebounding presence. and it looks like the sonics keep getting expiring contracts, should be itneresting to see what the sonics can pull off in the off season.

Wallace's best days are behind him. Your lucky to get a 10 points/game out of him, and while he wasnt traded for to boost the offense, the Cavs traded some of their best offensive players to get him, when offense was their main weakness in the first place.



Originally posted by bigboom

i'll agree that calderon is definetly a good player and has ball smarts but he can't create as well as tj can. tj and jose are both quick but tj is a little more explosive and can get his own shot where jose has to look for teammates. im a huge calderon fan but i still think the raps need tj. should be interesting to see what happens to calderon as he becomes a restricted free agent this year.

Have you actually watched some Raptors games? Calderon is much better than TJ. He shoots better (FG% and does not take stupid shots like TJ), makes players around him better, and rarely turns over the ball (best assist to turnover ratio in the NBA). Thats the defenition of a point guard. TJ has better hops and is a bit more flashy, but does not make the Raps better. He just sits on the bench with a new injury every week, eating up cap space with his overpaid contract. When he is on the floor, he is just looking to pad his own stats rather than help his team win the game.


Originally posted by bigboom


i'm not sure the cavs are that much improved to be honest with you, wallace has been a non factor this year, the only thing he can still do decently is board, he doesnt even have the D that he used to. Szerbiak should be a better fit than Hughes though, larry was always more of a run and gun style player whereas wally does a little better in a half court setup which the cavs like to play.

i like the dixon trade for the raps though, get rid of an unproductive player for a big man with an expiring contract this year, leaves colangelo a little more room to play this offseason.
This man speaks the truth. Wallace is washed up. He's been getting pushed around on the boards, and still cant hit a free throw to save his life. The bulls actually were pulling Wallace late in the game and replacing him with unproven rookie Noah, because Wallace had missed too many free throws and open looks in game deciding situations.

[max_boost]

Jose Calderon quite simply, has exceeded expectations! Who knew? I doubt they would have traded Charie V away for Ford.

[bigboom]

Originally posted by 5hift


Have you actually watched some Raptors games? Calderon is much better than TJ. He shoots better (FG% and does not take stupid shots like TJ), makes players around him better, and rarely turns over the ball (best assist to turnover ratio in the NBA). Thats the defenition of a point guard. TJ has better hops and is a bit more flashy, but does not make the Raps better. He just sits on the bench with a new injury every week, eating up cap space with his overpaid contract. When he is on the floor, he is just looking to pad his own stats rather than help his team win the game.



ill agree that if you need a pure point guard i would definetly play Jose and if i was Colangelo he would be priority signing for this offseason seeing as how he becomes a RFA. All I'm sayign though is that if they also have TJ they can stick him in whenever they need to change up the pace and maybe get someone to create something on offense.

example, last night in the orlando game entering the 4th quarter you got the magic turning a 21 point lead into a 9 point lead, stick TJ in see if he can create some points. but yes if i was Sam, Jose would be my PG, Tj would be the backup. All i was trying to say is that the raps with their team need both players and can use the strengths of both. and if tj starts looking to pass more like his first game back before the break this PG duo could be deadly.

[5hift]

Originally posted by bruceod


On a side note, Raptors smoked the Magic last night as well:thumbsup:

EDIT: Nothing on nba.com about the Cav's trade yet?
The Magic/Raps game last night was amazing ... Bosh vs Howard all night.

NBA.com blows for any sports news, http://www.rotoworld.com/default.aspx is always way ahead of the major sites in terms of breaking news/accurate rumors.


Originally posted by max_boost
Is showtime back? The Lakers looked pretty good last night. It didn't take long for Pau to fit right in. That's the kind of trade where you give up players and picks. Dallas should learn. Pau has so many good years in front of him and he's probably excited as hell that he got to leave a bad situation in Memphis. Perennial losers! Change the Grizzlies name!

The Lakers did look very good last night, but you might have noticed how their inside game was shut down every time Shaq was in the game. I say give Shaq some time to get back into shape and it will be a whole diff story. Last night was the first time in a long time I've seen Shaq diving for loose balls and creating havoc on the boards. Gasol seemed afraid to go inside any time Shaq was there. Also all the space he is taking up is allowing Amare to be a monster on the offensive glass. While Gasol has been playing good ... I'll believe it when he does so for a 7 game playoff series against big men (Shaq,Duncan, West) who will be physical the whole game (and take shots on his weak back when the refs arent watching).

You also cannot compare the Gasol trade to the Kidd trade. The Gasol trade was so one sided, many league GMs are furious the trade went through without the NBA offices rejecting it. It was pretty much West doing his old team a favor.

[brucebanner]

Originally posted by bigboom


ill agree that if you need a pure point guard i would definetly play Jose and if i was Colangelo he would be priority signing for this offseason seeing as how he becomes a RFA. All I'm sayign though is that if they also have TJ they can stick him in whenever they need to change up the pace and maybe get someone to create something on offense.

example, last night in the orlando game entering the 4th quarter you got the magic turning a 21 point lead into a 9 point lead, stick TJ in see if he can create some points. but yes if i was Sam, Jose would be my PG, Tj would be the backup. All i was trying to say is that the raps with their team need both players and can use the strengths of both. and if tj starts looking to pass more like his first game back before the break this PG duo could be deadly.

The Rapts will not be able to keep both, Jose will be offered big money somewhere else at the end of the season, atleast I think so, he is certainly worth it. I do agree in the PG duo, because it was deadly while TJ was healthy. That said, I would keep Jose, get rid of TJ somewhere and pick up a good quality big man for him with an OK backup PG..

[bigboom]

Originally posted by max_boost
Jose Calderon quite simply, has exceeded expectations! Who knew? I doubt they would have traded Charie V away for Ford.

haha the charlie v trade i think was a good trade, charlie v exceeded expectations in his rookie year and has turned into a role player for the bucks. he's unhappy so maybe we will see a trade this offseason involving him to see how he does. but i still like the trade :)

[5hift]

Originally posted by bigboom


ill agree that if you need a pure point guard i would definetly play Jose and if i was Colangelo he would be priority signing for this offseason seeing as how he becomes a RFA. All I'm sayign though is that if they also have TJ they can stick him in whenever they need to change up the pace and maybe get someone to create something on offense.

example, last night in the orlando game entering the 4th quarter you got the magic turning a 21 point lead into a 9 point lead, stick TJ in see if he can create some points. but yes if i was Sam, Jose would be my PG, Tj would be the backup. All i was trying to say is that the raps with their team need both players and can use the strengths of both. and if tj starts looking to pass more like his first game back before the break this PG duo could be deadly.

That's true, but a point guard coming off the bench should not have as big as a contract as TJ. Plus TJ has never gotten over that spinal injury and it looks like it will follow him the rest of his life. IMO even Carlos Delfino would be a better PG than TJ. He shoots lights out whenever he is in the game, yet is always looking to make a pass first. Plus he was a starting PG in the Argentina Superleagues for many years before coming to the NBA, so its not like he doesnt have experience. Dont get me wrong, TJ has talent, but he seems like a swingman who would come off the bench, in the body of a pointguard. Plus I've seen him jack too many long range shots on fast break plays to have any faith in him leading the Raps.

[bigboom]

Originally posted by 5hift


That's true, but a point guard coming off the bench should not have as big as a contract as TJ. Plus TJ has never gotten over that spinal injury and it looks like it will follow him the rest of his life. IMO even Carlos Delfino would be a better PG than TJ. He shoots lights out whenever he is in the game, yet is always looking to make a pass first. Plus he was a starting PG in the Argentina Superleagues for many years before coming to the NBA, so its not like he doesnt have experience. Dont get me wrong, TJ has talent, but he seems like a swingman who would come off the bench, in the body of a pointguard. Plus I've seen him jack too many long range shots on fast break plays to have any faith in him leading the Raps.

delfino played point this summer for Argentina too but he looks a little awkward playing point, he handles too much and doesnt recognize when to pass but maybe with dixon gone, martin injured and tj injured he gets a bit more exposure to prove what he can do, so far though he seems a little turnover prone. ive only seen him play couple times at point but he seems to dribble into trouble ie double teams and tries to penetrate with very little room.

it'll be interesting to see if the injury will change tj's game a bit, i think he is a little scared now to enter the paint.

[bigboom]

gerald green going to houston for kirk snyder. thats interesting how guard heavy houston is now, rafer, gerald, bobby jackson and scola.

[xin]

Jose is a better PG than TJ. As far as pure PGs are concerned he is one of the best. TJ has more offense capabilities and can create shots on his own better than Jose, when healthy. TJ is too injury-prone. Be interesting on what Toronto does this offseason.

I think how the west plays out depends on injuries. Assuming Portland is out of the playoff picture. Currently you have Houston as the 7th seed, Denver as the 8th seed, and GS as the 9th seed. Denver has been consistent and should finish 7th or 8th. T-Mac has been healthy as of late, but can he keep up? Same with Baron Davis. Those 2 guys haven't played a 60+ game season since....well....I don't even know. If one of those guys gets injured they can fall out of the playoff picture right quick. But then again this applies to all teams. When the teams are this close, if you have any one of your superstars go down it could mean vacation in Hawaii in April. Spurs have had there share of injuries to there trio in the first half of the season. Kobe's injured finger can blow up any given game, Bynum may not recover fully this season, etc.

My bet is T-Mac goes down and Houston won't be able to keep up with Denver and GS. It doesn't help that the trade today was a cap relief move and there bench just got thinner.

[xin]

Originally posted by bigboom
gerald green going to houston for kirk snyder. thats interesting how guard heavy houston is now, rafer, gerald, bobby jackson and scola.

And Stevie "Franchise" if you include him:D . But they are all 2 guard in PG bodies. Bobby Jackson may be the closest pure PG they have.

[590221010]

Originally posted by bigboom
gerald green going to houston for kirk snyder. thats interesting how guard heavy houston is now, rafer, gerald, bobby jackson and scola.
Scola's no guard lol but yes they do have a lot, and add Aaron Brooks to that list too.

I think Rockets should be able to make at least 8th seed, yeah Mac is back but he has only had a few good games since his return, aside from those games the rest are pretty bad. I know he brings other things to the table that can't be seen on the scoreboard such as defense and double teams but his shooting has been so terrible but the Rockets are still winning!

[00Celica]

Raptors won't go anywhere without a legit swingman and a good defensive center. They need to improve their rebounding as well. I see another first round exit for them.

Mavs made a great deal for Kidd. They essentially lost Harris and gained Kidd. The draft picks will be 24-30th for the next two years. When Kidd gets comfortable as the PG, the mavs will kill it.

[sexualbanana]

Originally posted by 00Celica
Raptors won't go anywhere without a legit swingman and a good defensive center. They need to improve their rebounding as well. I see another first round exit for them.

Mavs made a great deal for Kidd. They essentially lost Harris and gained Kidd. The draft picks will be 24-30th for the next two years. When Kidd gets comfortable as the PG, the mavs will kill it.

The Mavs have to totally revamp their offensive scheme to accomodate Kidd though.

The Mavs system currently revolves a lot of isolation plays for Nowitzki, inside and out, and for Harris. Those 2 alone were capable of creating their own shots. Harris - with his speed and explosiveness, Nowitzki - with his ability to score inside and an incredible shooting range. This is the main reason why the Mavs are near the bottom of the L in terms of assists.

With Kidd on the team, isolation plays for Kidd won't work because he relies on off-ball movement to create shots for others, and he doesn't have the speed or the arsenal of moves to create a shot for himself. Not to mention the other players on the Mavericks aren't nearly as athletic as the guys on the Nets (VC and Jefferson) for him to lob the ball to, which is his favourite move.

I don't think the Mav's draft pick will be that low either. I think it'll take some time for the Mavericks to be able to fully-integrate a new system that will feature Kidd's abilities, and given the West so tight, there may not be any games that they can spare.

[brucebanner]

Kidd was not a good move by the Mavs, as most people that have posted would agree. Maybe five years ago when he still had some speed. The PGs of the west are going to run Kidd down into the ground, he will not be able to keep up with the speed of a lot of the guards of the west.

As said earlier, Paul walked all over Kidd last night, and that is only the beginning of whats the come. Harris was a great D man and played well into the Mavs system. Not only that, but he is only going to get better as he gets older!

The Nets win in this trade I think, with the exception of Van Horn. VH coming back is just coming for the money that he'll be paid. I think hes washed up, all he will be able to contribute is wide open shots from the corner, or trailing on a fast break.

[590221010]

Originally posted by 590221010

Scola's no guard lol but yes they do have a lot, and add Aaron Brooks to that list too.

I think Rockets should be able to make at least 8th seed, yeah Mac is back but he has only had a few good games since his return, aside from those games the rest are pretty bad. I know he brings other things to the table that can't be seen on the scoreboard such as defense and double teams but his shooting has been so terrible but the Rockets are still winning!
Maybe I should criticize T-Mac more, he's shooting 7-10 right now, but then again they are also playing Miami.

[wiggaplz]

Originally posted by bigboom


ill agree that if you need a pure point guard i would definetly play Jose and if i was Colangelo he would be priority signing for this offseason seeing as how he becomes a RFA. All I'm sayign though is that if they also have TJ they can stick him in whenever they need to change up the pace and maybe get someone to create something on offense.

example, last night in the orlando game entering the 4th quarter you got the magic turning a 21 point lead into a 9 point lead, stick TJ in see if he can create some points. but yes if i was Sam, Jose would be my PG, Tj would be the backup. All i was trying to say is that the raps with their team need both players and can use the strengths of both. and if tj starts looking to pass more like his first game back before the break this PG duo could be deadly.
they can't keep both of them. Both have had solid seasons (although TJ has been injured) and they should unload one of the two (TJ). Then they can play around a little bit in the free agent market and hopefully pick up a monster big man to compliment Bosh or very good shooting guard. No matter what anyone says they need to get rid of TJ...the man is an awesome player but isn't as smart as Calderon and is ALWAYS injured (not saying he's soft.....actually yeah he's kinda soft, lol)

[wiggaplz]

And the Kidd trade was wicked...he's a future HOFer and he still knows how to play. This man is a proffessional (sp?) and its ludicrous to think that the 'quicker' guards will kill him. Kidd is still quick as hell...and even at his old age he is probably quicker then Canada's boy toy Steve Nash. Great move for the Mavs...I never raelly thought much of Harris anyways, he gets stuffed a lot and doesn't have a great jump shot. He is a true point guard though..

[wiggaplz]

Originally posted by sexualbanana


The Mavs have to totally revamp their offensive scheme to accomodate Kidd though.

The Mavs system currently revolves a lot of isolation plays for Nowitzki, inside and out, and for Harris. Those 2 alone were capable of creating their own shots. Harris - with his speed and explosiveness, Nowitzki - with his ability to score inside and an incredible shooting range. This is the main reason why the Mavs are near the bottom of the L in terms of assists.

With Kidd on the team, isolation plays for Kidd won't work because he relies on off-ball movement to create shots for others, and he doesn't have the speed or the arsenal of moves to create a shot for himself. Not to mention the other players on the Mavericks aren't nearly as athletic as the guys on the Nets (VC and Jefferson) for him to lob the ball to, which is his favourite move.

I don't think the Mav's draft pick will be that low either. I think it'll take some time for the Mavericks to be able to fully-integrate a new system that will feature Kidd's abilities, and given the West so tight, there may not be any games that they can spare.
sorry bro you don't know what you're talking about. Any point guard needs movement to be successful, and the ones with the best vision and knack for finding open teammates are usually the best point guards. No exception with Kidd, he is still close to the top of the league in the PG category.

VC and Jeff are both good players but both were dunking machines. Vince is a pure scorer but Jeff isn't really shit...he's soft as hell, and doesnt really have an inside game or outside game - he's just an athletic fuck. Kidd now has Nowitzki (who is probably the best pure scorer in the league and can shoot from anywhere), Josh Howard AND Jason Terry...that's a scary lineup with a sick point guard compared to when Kidd had two soft ass fuckwits to deal with in New Jersey.

[00Celica]

Originally posted by sexualbanana


The Mavs have to totally revamp their offensive scheme to accomodate Kidd though.

The Mavs system currently revolves a lot of isolation plays for Nowitzki, inside and out, and for Harris. Those 2 alone were capable of creating their own shots. Harris - with his speed and explosiveness, Nowitzki - with his ability to score inside and an incredible shooting range. This is the main reason why the Mavs are near the bottom of the L in terms of assists.

With Kidd on the team, isolation plays for Kidd won't work because he relies on off-ball movement to create shots for others, and he doesn't have the speed or the arsenal of moves to create a shot for himself. Not to mention the other players on the Mavericks aren't nearly as athletic as the guys on the Nets (VC and Jefferson) for him to lob the ball to, which is his favourite move.

I don't think the Mav's draft pick will be that low either. I think it'll take some time for the Mavericks to be able to fully-integrate a new system that will feature Kidd's abilities, and given the West so tight, there may not be any games that they can spare.

I don't think there will be drastic changes to their offence. Dirk is better when he is already in a position to shoot. J Kidd can find him in these spots. If you think Devin Harris was the only other person who could create his own shot on the mavs, look again. Josh Howard is a good shooter and a very good slasher who gets his usually 17-22 a game. Jason Terry can also create his own shot and score about 20 a game as well. In a few games, you will see the difference Jason Kidd makes. I think everyone is underrating J Kidds game. If you think his defense is bad, you obviously haven't seen Nash. Probably the worst defensive PG in the West.

[bigboom]

Originally posted by 00Celica


I don't think there will be drastic changes to their offence. Dirk is better when he is already in a position to shoot. J Kidd can find him in these spots. If you think Devin Harris was the only other person who could create his own shot on the mavs, look again. Josh Howard is a good shooter and a very good slasher who gets his usually 17-22 a game. Jason Terry can also create his own shot and score about 20 a game as well. In a few games, you will see the difference Jason Kidd makes. I think everyone is underrating J Kidds game. If you think his defense is bad, you obviously haven't seen Nash. Probably the worst defensive PG in the West.

im gonna have to agree with sexual banana, if you look at how the mavs used to run it required a lot of Dirk iso' sand post up's, they pretty much took him away from using the 3 point shot this year. with kidd he thrives the best when there are slashers and guys that can play above the rim ie, VC, RJ and K-Mart that is where kidd does his best work. When you go from having Rj and VC to having essentially Josh Howard to give his lobs to you eliminate a large part of what makes his game tick. Sure Stackhouse can still dunk but he definetly is older and cant play above the rim like he used to. With the Mavs Dirk is such a big part of what Avery runs and with the half court sets anyone could run the sets as long as Dirk is in position.

I guess what avery coudl do is run j-kidd and jet together, with stack and howard running the 3-4 and dirk running the 5 and play small ball to generate offence. should be interesting but i honestly dont think the mavs are a better team.

and regarding the steve nash comment i agree with that however the suns arent built to play tight defense at the point position they dont want nash getting tired playing D they want all his efforts getting the ball up the court. hence the Shaq trade, shaq wont have to run in that offence all he has to do is board and throw it out while the other 4 guys run the floor.

[sexualbanana]

Originally posted by 00Celica

If you think Devin Harris was the only other person who could create his own shot on the mavs, look again. Josh Howard is a good shooter and a very good slasher who gets his usually 17-22 a game. Jason Terry can also create his own shot and score about 20 a game as well.

Which is my point. I wasn't trying to say Harris was the only guy that could create his own shot. What I was trying to say is the Mav's system revolves around skilled players mostly creating shots for themselves (thus the low APG for the entire team), which doesn't quite fit in Kidd's style of play because he looks to find slashers and cutters in a passing offense geared towards finding holes. Whereas the Mav's offensive revolves around getting the ball to Howard, Terry or Nowitzki on the wing or post, clearing everyone out and letting them create their own shot 1-on-1.

Plus, both Nash and Kidd are huge defensive liabilities, everyone knows that. With Shaq now playing in Phoenix though, I don't think it'll be such a big deal because he'll be clogging up that lane (which he's still very capable of doing). Howard and Nowitzki on the other hand, I'm not too certain about their ability to provide the weakside help to make up for the speed mismatches that will occur with Kidd.

Don't get me wrong, I think Kidd is a great player. I'm just not convinced he's a good fit for Dallas.

[brucebanner]

Yes Kidd is going to be in the HOF, yes he can play good D, no he cant stay with the quicker west guards. Comparing Kidd and Nash? Nash is much more offensively skilled then Kidd is, he is a much better shooter anywhere on the floor, so I think they will forgive that he is not a great defender, especially with Shaq and Amare down low.

It is still a stupid trade for the Mavs, gave up a promising young PG for a declining slower, but better rebounding/passing Kidd, as I have said before, the Nets most certainly came out on top in this deal.

EDIT: Oh and did you forget that Nash was a 2-time MVP and should of been 3 in a row IMO

[bigboom]

Originally posted by bruceod
Yes Kidd is going to be in the HOF, yes he can play good D, no he cant stay with the quicker west guards. Comparing Kidd and Nash? Nash is much more offensively skilled then Kidd is, he is a much better shooter anywhere on the floor, so I think they will forgive that he is not a great defender, especially with Shaq and Amare down low.

It is still a stupid trade for the Mavs, gave up a promising young PG for a declining slower, but better rebounding/passing Kidd, as I have said before, the Nets most certainly came out on top in this deal.

EDIT: Oh and did you forget that Nash was a 2-time MVP and should of been 3 in a row IMO

agreed, dirk did not deserve it last year and if it wasnt for the suspension of amare the suns would have taken it :)

it'll be interesting to see if kidds shooting percentage goes up though with dallas, he may have less pressure on him than NJ where he was a pretty big focus for opponents.

[brucebanner]

Originally posted by bigboom


agreed, dirk did not deserve it last year and if it wasnt for the suspension of amare the suns would have taken it :)

it'll be interesting to see if kidds shooting percentage goes up though with dallas, he may have less pressure on him than NJ where he was a pretty big focus for opponents.

He will still be a focus in Dallas, he was not the #1 go to guy in NJ, VC was, Kidd will be option 2-3 maybe even 4 depending on who is on the floor. Dirk has been playing down low a lot more this season so it may open up more 3pt shots for Kidd with a low post kick out, but he is not a good shooter, average at best..

[wiggaplz]

Originally posted by bigboom


im gonna have to agree with sexual banana, if you look at how the mavs used to run it required a lot of Dirk iso' sand post up's, they pretty much took him away from using the 3 point shot this year. with kidd he thrives the best when there are slashers and guys that can play above the rim ie, VC, RJ and K-Mart that is where kidd does his best work. When you go from having Rj and VC to having essentially Josh Howard to give his lobs to you eliminate a large part of what makes his game tick. Sure Stackhouse can still dunk but he definetly is older and cant play above the rim like he used to. With the Mavs Dirk is such a big part of what Avery runs and with the half court sets anyone could run the sets as long as Dirk is in position.

I guess what avery coudl do is run j-kidd and jet together, with stack and howard running the 3-4 and dirk running the 5 and play small ball to generate offence. should be interesting but i honestly dont think the mavs are a better team.

and regarding the steve nash comment i agree with that however the suns arent built to play tight defense at the point position they dont want nash getting tired playing D they want all his efforts getting the ball up the court. hence the Shaq trade, shaq wont have to run in that offence all he has to do is board and throw it out while the other 4 guys run the floor.
What people are forgetting is Kidd has been a monster his whole career, even without VC and Jefferson. When NJ finished with a great record in 01 he had no 'slashers' as you say other then Kenyon Martin. All he had was Kenyon, Van Horn, and Kerry Kittles. That lineup isn't very star studded but Kidd still did his thing and led that team to the finals.

[brucebanner]

Originally posted by wiggaplz

What people are forgetting is Kidd has been a monster his whole career, even without VC and Jefferson. When NJ finished with a great record in 01 he had no 'slashers' as you say other then Kenyon Martin. All he had was Kenyon, Van Horn, and Kerry Kittles. That lineup isn't very star studded but Kidd still did his thing and led that team to the finals.

Im not taking away from what Kidd does/did, the fact that you bring up '01 is interesting though, considering that it was 7 YEARS ago.

He is only getting older and the east is getting better then it was then, so bringing up 7 years ago is not a great point. No one is trying to take away of what he has done and is doing, it is just easy to see that the west guards are going to run him down.

[bigboom]

Originally posted by bruceod


He will still be a focus in Dallas, he was not the #1 go to guy in NJ, VC was, Kidd will be option 2-3 maybe even 4 depending on who is on the floor. Dirk has been playing down low a lot more this season so it may open up more 3pt shots for Kidd with a low post kick out, but he is not a good shooter, average at best..

im not saying kidd was teh go to guy...obviously last possession you would always see VC with the ball but for defensive pressure if you pressured kidd that would cause trouble for NJ

do you think Kidd was only this good because he was on the east then? all signs seem to point to yes.

[00Celica]

I think everyone is underrating what Kidd can do offensively. Sure, he isn't the best shooter or the fastest guy, but he can get to the rack pretty good. He is also bigger than alot of PG's and uses that to his advantage. He will be playing alot with JT at the 2 and JT is a very good spot up shooter. Kidd's defense is no where near as bad as Nashs. I think the other guards in the West will have to worry about Kidd running THEM down as well.


As for Nash deserving the MVP last year, give me a break. Dirk was averaging 25,9, and 4, while shooting over 50 percent from the field and 40 percent from three point land. Not to mention his team finished higher than Phoenix.

[brucebanner]

Originally posted by bigboom


im not saying kidd was teh go to guy...obviously last possession you would always see VC with the ball but for defensive pressure if you pressured kidd that would cause trouble for NJ

do you think Kidd was only this good because he was on the east then? all signs seem to point to yes.

I dont think that he is only good because he has been in the east for the last number of years. It is just that a lot of the west guards that he will be playing against are younger, quicker and I think that it will be a challenge for him. Maybe he'll prove everything I have said so far wrong, but nothing I have seen yet shows me to think otherwise.

The trade is not going to do the Mavs much good but get a great PG that is on his way down soon in the NBA. He can still play at a high level, and for a few more years I would think. The Mavs picked Kidd up hoping to win a 'ship because of it, I fail to see that he can make that difference for them. That and the fact that they gave up the main big man defender in Diop to get him, the west is far to competitive and I feel that they made the wrong move.

[5hift]

Originally posted by 00Celica
I think everyone is underrating what Kidd can do offensively. Sure, he isn't the best shooter or the fastest guy, but he can get to the rack pretty good. He is also bigger than alot of PG's and uses that to his advantage. He will be playing alot with JT at the 2 and JT is a very good spot up shooter. Kidd's defense is no where near as bad as Nashs. I think the other guards in the West will have to worry about Kidd running THEM down as well.


As for Nash deserving the MVP last year, give me a break. Dirk was averaging 25,9, and 4, while shooting over 50 percent from the field and 40 percent from three point land. Not to mention his team finished higher than Phoenix.

Dirk and the Mavs also got knocked out in the first round by Golden State, and Dirk choked big time in that series.

[wiggaplz]

younger and quicker doesn't matter if you have the skills to match up. Someone like TJ Ford is probably the fastest point guard in the league and can dunk and he's under 5'10 (listed at 6 feet but thats all bullshit). You either have skills or you don't and Kidd has them in bunches.

[DelSoln]

Originally posted by 5hift


Dirk and the Mavs also got knocked out in the first round by Golden State, and Dirk choked big time in that series.

The NBA MVP voting is based on regular season performance.

[wiggaplz]

All you idiots saying it is a bad trade, we will be laughing at you guys in a couple weeks. Kidd > Harris by a long, long, long shot.

[5hift]

Originally posted by DelSoln


The NBA MVP voting is based on regular season performance.

thanks tips I had no idea. I was mentioning playoffs because thats all that counts.


and wiggaplz , no one is aruging that Kidd isnt better than Harris overall. This trade though, is not better for Dallas. No way Kidd is worth two first round picks plus all the other guys.

[PGTze]

What's with all you guys pumping up Jose Calderon so much, he's pretty effective most nights but hes really not as good as most of you are making him out to be. TJ Ford is a better pg when he's heathly, and those of you saying Calderon is a smarter pg are on crack man. I swear everytime Calderon hits a 3 he thinks he's MJ, the next time down the floor he's going to jack up the worst shot possible.He doesn't appear to do all that well under presure either, he was the guy that effectively ended the Raptors season last year when he pretty much threw the ball away in the final seconds of the playoff game when the Raps were bounced in the first round. If Ford wouldn't have gotten hurt this year Calderon would have been traded for sure by now.

[5hift]

Calderon is 5th in assists per game ahead of Baron Davis, Allen Iverson and Chancey Billups ... pretty good company. He has by far the best assist to turnover ratio in the NBA at 5.6. 92% from the line (2nd in NBA) and 55% from the floor (8th in the NBA).

Just imagine he has a fade and 19 tattoos.

[brucebanner]

Originally posted by 5hift


thanks tips I had no idea. I was mentioning playoffs because thats all that counts.


and wiggaplz , no one is aruging that Kidd isnt better than Harris overall. This trade though, is not better for Dallas. No way Kidd is worth two first round picks plus all the other guys.


Originally posted by 5hift
Calderon is 5th in assists per game ahead of Baron Davis, Allen Iverson and Chancey Billups ... pretty good company. He has by far the best assist to turnover ratio in the NBA at 5.6. 92% from the line (2nd in NBA) and 55% from the floor (8th in the NBA).

Just imagine he has a fade and 19 tattoos.


I'm glad I have someone else to agree with in this thread.

Jose is a better overall PG the TJ, he has proved it this year, not to mention TJ is soft. Everyone can say "what if TJ wasn't hurt" all they want. Fact is that he is, and unlikely that he will be fully healthy for some time. Jose has all the stats to back it up too, the Rapts are a good team, but it is not like Jose has a superstar lineup to work with so no one can take away from what he is/has been doing.


Cliffs for this thread:
Mavs make stupid trade.
Jose is a better PG then TJ.

:drama:

[wiggaplz]

Calderon is better....just because he does not have flashy skills like Ford does not mean he is not good. The man DOES NOT turn the ball over, shoot bad shots, or make bad decisions. And he gets a solid 20 pts 5 rebs and 10 assists a night.

[590221010]

15 assists by Kidd tonight out of a team total of 32 assists.

[5hift]

they also played the 14-41 Grizz and he was matched up against rookie Mike Conley

[xin]

No one denies Kidd's playmaking abilities. He even plays better D than Nash. In fact, it was his defense that stood out during there championship run years. I believe he was also on the NBA All-Defensive first team and second team numerous times earlier in his career. However, he is 35 years old. In NJ, Kidd had very atheletic guys in Jeffersona and VC to work with. On there fast break, all they had to do was run with Kidd and he would just toss it up near the rim and usually those 2 guys would be able to finish. Same with Kenyon Martin before he left to Denver. In Dallas its different ball but more weapons to work with. They used to run lots of isolations and likes to overload one side. With the addition of Kidd they will get better looks.

The trade isn't as bad as some might think. But they had to give up Diop, who was the only decent post defender they had. Good luck with Yao, Duncan, and Bynum now. The 2 future first round picks may not hurt them that bad, but it depends on where they end up in the lottery. Loosing 1st round picks is never good. That pretty much means they have to win it all now. Cuban saw the Gasol and Shaq trade and went in the 'oh-shit' mode and gambled hard. Kidd is gonna get his assists and Dallas are gonna get there wins. We shall see if the gamble will produce when playoff comes.

[00Celica]

Originally posted by 5hift
they also played the 14-41 Grizz and he was matched up against rookie Mike Conley

15 assists is still 15 assists. Kidd is the perfect point guard for the team. Look how balanced the scoring was between Dirk, Howard, and Terry. Kidd plays the type of game where he doesnt rely on his athleticism as much as he does on his on court awareness. The first rounders will be in the late 20's anyways. I believe Kidd is under contract for two more seasons and he will be an all star both seasons.

[5hift]

so the game before when he has eight points, five assists, and SIX turnovers against Chris Paul and the Hornets means nothing? Wow I'm glad he can rack up stats against happless teams.

Kidd also leads the league by a wide margin in turnovers per game, right around the 6 mark.

[590221010]

Originally posted by 5hift
so the game before when he has eight points, five assists, and SIX turnovers against Chris Paul and the Hornets means nothing? Wow I'm glad he can rack up stats against happless teams.

Kidd also leads the league by a wide margin in turnovers per game, right around the 6 mark.
Uhh wtf, where did you check your stats on Kidd's turnovers per game? He's averaging 3.64 for the 07-08 season.

[5hift]

^^ Cbsportsline.com - it was an error on their part, because when Kidd was traded, they reset his stats for some reason. He has 6 turnovers in his first game and that is what they listed his average at for some reason.

But anyways ... has anyone noticed how Kidd is averaging great numbers overall, but in the games against shitty teams, he has like 15 assists, and then in games against the Hornets (Chris Paul) he gets just plain embarassed, and then last night against the Spurs (Tony Parker) he was benched for the final 10 minutes in a 2 point game (he finised with 10 and 7 but had no effect on the game whatsoever).

In his first game in NJ, Harris already had the whole crowd chanting his name half way through the game.

[brucebanner]

Originally posted by 5hift
^^ Cbsportsline.com - it was an error on their part, because when Kidd was traded, they reset his stats for some reason. He has 6 turnovers in his first game and that is what they listed his average at for some reason.

But anyways ... has anyone noticed how Kidd is averaging great numbers overall, but in the games against shitty teams, he has like 15 assists, and then in games against the Hornets (Chris Paul) he gets just plain embarassed, and then last night against the Spurs (Tony Parker) he was benched for the final 10 minutes in a 2 point game (he finised with 10 and 7 but had no effect on the game whatsoever).

In his first game in NJ, Harris already had the whole crowd chanting his name half way through the game.

:werd:
The Mavs/Spurs game was real intense last night though!

Harris played well in his first game. ( From what I seen in highlights anyways )

[bigboom]

did anyone also notice that avery kept kidd on the bench for the last posession to get more "shooters" on the floor? looks like Kidd is going to have to earn avery's trust haha.

[590221010]

Originally posted by 5hift
^^ Cbsportsline.com - it was an error on their part, because when Kidd was traded, they reset his stats for some reason. He has 6 turnovers in his first game and that is what they listed his average at for some reason.

But anyways ... has anyone noticed how Kidd is averaging great numbers overall, but in the games against shitty teams, he has like 15 assists, and then in games against the Hornets (Chris Paul) he gets just plain embarassed, and then last night against the Spurs (Tony Parker) he was benched for the final 10 minutes in a 2 point game (he finised with 10 and 7 but had no effect on the game whatsoever).

In his first game in NJ, Harris already had the whole crowd chanting his name half way through the game.
NJ played Milwaukee which happens to be a bad team too, but I do think Harris will have more success with NJ than he did in Dallas.

[5hift]

Milwaukee is weak, but the point guard Harris was matched up against (Mo Williams) isnt. Williams has been lighting it up recently for the Bucks (dropped 37 on the Cavs the game before). Containing a guy like Williams takes a lot of effort (even if he's not scoring, I dont think he ever stops running), and for Harris to still contribute that much offensively is impressive.