Few questions about entering industry

[Euro_Trash]

These are coming from someone who is soon going to be entering the oil and gas industry as an engineer, and will be (hopefully) signing for a 5 year+ career.

When a company gives you an offer, how much room do they have to move on this price? Every graduate is different, and I am different in that I have a few years of oil and gas industry in multiple disciplines, so I would require less training etc, so could I negotiate a higher starting salary? Or are they pretty set on these contracts?

What is the best way to find smaller companies to work for? I have only worked for larger corporations, but the idea of a smaller company with a more intimate workplace is also an idea I have been throwing around. It seems like each has their ups and downs... does anyone have any insight on the difference between the two and which they consider better? (I am thinking of starting with a larger company to ensure I get adequate training with whichever discipline I choose to start with)

Any other advice for a new grad?

[Antonito]

As far as the big company vs small company goes, speaking from experience, starting with a big company and going to a smaller company later is better in my view. In a big company there are typically standards and lots of people to help and a uniform way of doing things, and your role will be smaller, so while you are getting experience you don't have to worry as much about whether you are doing thigns the right way. Then when you go to a smaller company where there will be a lot more on your shoulders in terms of figuring out ways to do things, you have all the basics covered.

For work atmosphere, it all depends. In a big company you will be broken down into small groups anyways, and if you don't like the people you are with you can always transfer, whereas in a small company if they suck, you have to leave or hate your job (been there, done that, bleh). There will be a definite disconnect between you and management in a large company, but if the people around you are cool, it doesn't really matter (in my opinion)

[Nufy]

Originally posted by Antonito
As far as the big company vs small company goes, speaking from experience, starting with a big company and going to a smaller company later is better in my view. In a big company there are typically standards and lots of people to help and a uniform way of doing things, and your role will be smaller, so while you are getting experience you don't have to worry as much about whether you are doing thigns the right way. Then when you go to a smaller company where there will be a lot more on your shoulders in terms of figuring out ways to do things, you have all the basics covered.

For work atmosphere, it all depends. In a big company you will be broken down into small groups anyways, and if you don't like the people you are with you can always transfer, whereas in a small company if they suck, you have to leave or hate your job (been there, done that, bleh). There will be a definite disconnect between you and management in a large company, but if the people around you are cool, it doesn't really matter (in my opinion)

I have found than in bigger companies you are pigeon holed into doing the same thing over and over again.

You get real good at it but then when / if you move to a smaller company where your responsibilities increase, you have no back-up for the years of experience you have on your resume.

While it may be harder at first a smaller company will usually allow you to get a good overall knowledge of the processes / equipment instead of just focusing on one thing x 2000.

In terms of experience would you rather be able to talk about the process as a whole or just say "All I did was size separators for 3 years"



Just a different perspective from someone who works at a small company.


As for work atmosphere, like anyplace, it depends on the people you work with.

[Euro_Trash]

Anyone have any opinions on negotiating a salary?

[BananaFob]

Originally posted by Euro_Trash
Anyone have any opinions on negotiating a salary?

I don't have specific advice on negotiating a salary, although that is something you should definitely do as most companies actually budget for this.

I would recommend however that you do NOT negotiate for more vacation time etc. You don't make a very good first impression if the first thing on your mind is more time off.

Hope that helps a bit.

[Proyecto2000]

Originally posted by BananaFob

I would recommend however that you do NOT negotiate for more vacation time etc. You don't make a very good first impression if the first thing on your mind is more time off.

Hope that helps a bit.

I tried negotiating for an extra week of vacation and instead I was given more money :rofl:

[ExtraSlow]

Usually salary has some wiggle room, espeically if you are a particularly experienced compared to your "peers."

However, I strongly advise you to conisder quality of expereince more than salary for your first ten years of work. There are companies out there that pay ridiculous cash, but will pigeon-hole you. Then after five years when you get burnt out, you don't have the variety of expereince needed to get a better job.

Some large companies have programs where they rotate thier young engineers though a few different departments, which is a great plan. Working in a smaller company, you may not change your job title, but you'll have to deal with a wider variety of problems every day.

BTW, anyone looking for Prouduction/Operations engineer with 5 years expereince? I'm looking . . . .

[Antonito]

Originally posted by Nufy


I have found than in bigger companies you are pigeon holed into doing the same thing over and over again.

You get real good at it but then when / if you move to a smaller company where your responsibilities increase, you have no back-up for the years of experience you have on your resume.

While it may be harder at first a smaller company will usually allow you to get a good overall knowledge of the processes / equipment instead of just focusing on one thing x 2000.

In terms of experience would you rather be able to talk about the process as a whole or just say "All I did was size separators for 3 years"


It all depends on the small company though. If they have the time to teach you the basics, then yes, it'll work well, but if they are absolutely swamped, they may just dump stuff on you and let you sink or swim.

To be honest I'm just bitter about my experience starting off with a small company when I was in Construction Management. On my first week straight out of school they said "ok, here's all your projects, hop to it, and try not to ask too many questions". That place almost gave me ulcers. Meanwhile my friend started at a large CM company and they eased him into everything. I may know more than him simply because I had to learn, but there were a lot of mistakes made that shouldn't have been if I hadn't been left to figure things out with zero resources or support.

When I got into the engineering side of things (after I quit my CM job in disgust), I went to a large company, and there was ample time to get things figured out, and if person A didn't know or want to help, out of persons B thru Z one would have an answer, whereas in a small company there is persons A and B only, and if they are both jerks, you're boned. I just switched to a small company, and I do have more responsibilities, but it's way easier to figure out more technical responsibilities since I'm not trying to figure out how to use basic software and industry standards as I go at the same time.

edit: this is all just anecdotal really, if there is anything to take away from my ranting, it's to find out as much about the company as you can. Beyond is a good resource, there is bound to be someone that has worked there or at least knows about the company, it's a smaller industry than you'd think

[Nufy]

Different experiences I guess.

I've been with my small company for 7 years now.

Pay raise every year (so far), 4 weeks of vacation, flex days, flexible hours etc...



No real reason to look elsewhere..........

[rc2002]

As a new grad you really don't have the power to command higher salary right off the bat. You won't have enough experience to actually be that valuable to a company. Keep in mind that all things being equal - you might lose the job to a competing graduate who didn't negotiate for more money.

[Euro_Trash]

Yeah I have heard a couple of arguments about not negotiating for a higher salary. Earlier (I will leave the name out since he pm'd me, so not too sure if he wants to be heard from) someone pointed out that during slow times a company would likely try to get rid of a new grad who is getting paid more than any other of the grads. I think this is a pretty valid point as well.

I do agree that there tons of different things that are much more important than the pay. In the last couple years none of the new grads I kept in touch with negotiated a single aspect of their contract, every single one just took what they were offered.

[Antonito]

Originally posted by Euro_Trash
Yeah I have heard a couple of arguments about not negotiating for a higher salary. Earlier (I will leave the name out since he pm'd me, so not too sure if he wants to be heard from) someone pointed out that during slow times a company would likely try to get rid of a new grad who is getting paid more than any other of the grads. I think this is a pretty valid point as well.

I do agree that there tons of different things that are much more important than the pay. In the last couple years none of the new grads I kept in touch with negotiated a single aspect of their contract, every single one just took what they were offered.

One way around this if you don't get the salary you want to start, try to make it clear that you want a 3 month review of your pay vs performance. You only have to wait 3 months, so it's not that big of a hit in your wallet, and it gives you a chance to prove yourself. And if they don't want to give it to you after 3 months, it means you aren't worth it (at least in their minds). So even if you'd gotten more to start, they'd probably fire you anyways

[Euro_Trash]

Great idea

[broken_legs]

If you feel uncomfortable negotiating for more money, negotiate for more benefits.

When I left one company for another it was clear they wanted to hire me. I didn't feel comfy pushing about pay but I did get an extra weeks vacation.

Most companies will match your un-vested pension or stock options if they are stealing you too, or at least consider it.

[FiveFreshFish]

Check the APEGGA salary survey and make sure what they offer you is in the ballpark.

http://www.apegga.org/members/publications/salarysurvey.html

[ryeguy252]

anyone have a link for an accounting grad entry level oil and gas salaries? or know what the average compensation is?

[silvercivicsir]

what kind of accounting Grad ? always a/p jobs available.