PDA

View Full Version : Roof Shingles Help, Anyone?



sdiep
05-06-2008, 07:18 PM
I am in need to replace my shingles, but I am not knowledgeable about anything in regards to this. I have had several estimates from various companies, and most of them are offering to use BP Harmony, or IKO Cambridge. Does anyone which shingles are better?

Basically, the old shingles are going to be removed and be replaced with new shingles. I have basically nailed it down to two estimates:

One is offering the IKO shingles, water and ice shields, paper underlay, vents and a 4" pipe.

The other is offering the BP Harmony with drip edge, grip guard, 15lb felt and 3 new roof vents.

Is anyone willing to shed some light into the necessities and the overall understanding of shingle replacements?

DeeK
05-06-2008, 11:10 PM
when it comes down to it.. shingles dont really makes much of a difference what kind you use. The job of the roof is to keep water out, that is achieved by proper underlay. I have no idea what the vents are for unless they are simply just replacing older vents.. in which I would say what a waste of time. a vent is a vent is a vent. as long as its not damaged, dont fix it. I assume thats what the 4" pvc pipe is for as well. just another vent in the roof. I say again, don't fix it if its not broken.

Water/ice shields are great, paper underlay is a must to pass code.

I've never heard of "grip guard" or "drip edge". sounds like a bunch of gimmicks and crap to me. unless they are referring to drip edge in the sense that it overhangs the roof a bit to leave a proper drip edge into the eaves.


I don't claim to be a roofer, but I have been in the construction industry long enough to know whats what.

From the two quotes you have, so long as they are roughly the same price, I'd say go with the paper underlay, with water/ice shields.

Bimmer88
05-06-2008, 11:17 PM
Word of advice, also check the warranty and perhaps if these shingles witstand weather really well... That's what I 'd look for if I were to get shingles... and yeh most importantly it block out water. Had a roof leak once... and omg was it ever expensive. Had to tear out pratically everything so mold doesn't grow.

s_havinga
05-07-2008, 07:14 AM
The two shingles are baisically the exact same thing. I was a roofing estimator for 3 years and dealt with both of those products, I would say it is more important to research the company, make sure they have a good standing with the BBB and don't have any major complaints against them. There are a lot of sketchy roofing companies out there. 15 lb felt is baisically a minimum, you may consider trying to get them to throw in an upgrade to 30lb. Ice & Water is a great back up under the valleys but like I say in the end it comes down to the install. 95% of all the roof leaks I have seen are due to improper installation, not poor quality. Well just my 2 cents, hope it helps

403Gemini
05-07-2008, 10:36 AM
Also get shingles that are a lighter coloured (white/grey), darker ones absorb more heat and splinter A LOT quicker over time. It also makes it a lot easier to determine when you should replace the shingles vs black ones since darkers ones are usually harder to judge how bad the damage actually is.

DeeK
05-07-2008, 03:30 PM
Originally posted by s_havinga
95% of all the roof leaks I have seen are due to improper installation, not poor quality.

/agree :werd:

USED1
05-07-2008, 09:27 PM
Originally posted by Bimmer88
Word of advice, also check the warranty and perhaps if these shingles witstand weather really well... That's what I 'd look for if I were to get shingles... and yeh most importantly it block out water. Had a roof leak once... and omg was it ever expensive. Had to tear out pratically everything so mold doesn't grow.

You and your fucking warranty, can you not post in a thread without mentioning it. :banghead:

rorah
05-07-2008, 11:20 PM
I prefer the IKO shingles from an installers point of view.
If it were my roof I would make sure the estimate includes felting the entire roof for the full warranty of the shingles(up to a certain slope, 8 and 12 or greater does not need full felt).

Ice and water shield and grip gaurd are the same thing.
I use this stuff in valleys, but these contractor may use it on the perimeter of the roof which is extra protection against ice daming.

Both of your estimates sound the same just with different materials.

sdiep
05-09-2008, 08:17 AM
Thanks for all your replies. They have been quite helpful.

I was also wondering if there is a true difference between the 25 year and the 30 year. Is it worth the extra cost in the long run?

s_havinga
05-09-2008, 08:53 AM
generally the difference is the 30 yr is just a little bit thicker, is it worth it? maybe... but the truth is that most people in calgary will move far before 25 or 30 years, if it is a fairly minor cost difference then go for it but I wouldn't spend too much on it.

Smokem
05-09-2008, 09:07 AM
sdiep,

I've just actually had my roof done last month and I was VERY satisfied with my installer. He came in at a great price, he's a great friendly guy and knowledgeable about his trade. His words were "I'd rather spend the extra money on supplies and get it done right the first time" - that being said, he did give me ice, water protection, double paper, etc. He also gave me a 3 year warranty on labour and a deal if I paid cash. I know you're already narrowed it down to two guys, but let me know if you want his contact info.

He can get a hold of all types of shingles for you. He also told me a story of how a certain type of shingle he sold had a 30 year warranty one year and the next year it was renamed (same shingle) with a 35 year warranty. I would say in cases of a 5 yr difference in shingle, you could probably squeeze in realistically another year or two out of it. An ashphalt shingle roof typically lasts 15 years regardless, and it's usually due to the elements starting to pull on them, not because the shingle is breaking down. And Calgary is bad for weather.

TomcoPDR
05-09-2008, 01:02 PM
Originally posted by USED1


You and your fucking warranty, can you not post in a thread without mentioning it. :banghead:

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: we all have our own little burdens sometimes.

My parents used BP harmony 2 years ago. If you're a member of the Calgary Apartment Association you get a discount from Peddo Roofing.

We used Bricor, owner (old dude) who started it still does the estimates personally, really nice guy. He'll explain everything.

Just don't get suckered into using Aluminum ones in Calgary, we got tricked before doing research, after we signed contract my mom was like: "so there wouldn't be any trace of nails or the old roof on our lawn?"

The SALES guy says: "Oh don't worry we'll just put our thin (pop-can) shingles over the existing ones, saves material from the landfill"

"What about those areas with lifted corners?"... "Oh, we'll nail down each and every single corner" WTF

(thanks to Alberta 15 or 30 day cool-down period)

4bier
05-09-2008, 02:45 PM
shingles never last as long as they use to...... 10-15 years max

frozenrice
05-09-2008, 03:06 PM
IKO is a Calgary owned company with branches throughout Canada and the US as well as a few international branches. Support your local business :D.

Ask if the IKO Cambridge is the LT line. Cambridge LT is a laminated fibreglass based mat as opposed to paper.

2 cents

canuckcarguy
05-09-2008, 05:49 PM
Hey, when they said vents, maybe they were adding extra ventilation? If you've had any problems with ice damning, now's the time to add some extra ventilation - the extra airflow makes ice-damning much less likely.

I prefer the whirly-bird type, as long as they're on the back of the house (look shitty from the street)

Gary-Alberta
09-04-2010, 12:45 PM
Buyer Beware!! Our bad experience with BP Canada:

My father purchased BP Canada shingles with a 25 year warranty. He lives in Edmonton, Alberta Canada. This is the letter we sent to them in May 2010 to which we have had no reply:

"New shingles were installed on my father's roof by B&B Siding & Roofing Ltd on July 30, 1999. For the past two years, my father has been dealing with B&B regarding his defective shingles (pictures were attached showing the shingles clawing and deteriorating). After frequent requests, a visit was made by representatives from your company, one of them being (name removed). My father was told that a sample would be taken and sent to your laboratory and he would be advised of the results. December 8, 2009 a letter was sent indicating the lab results showed that no deficiencies were found. As there was a slight language barrier, I have now taken over dealing with this issue. On May 11, 2010, I contacted BP at the 1-800 number provided on the card requesting to speak with (name removed) and was told that he was unavailable. I was also told that if I provide the file number, the person on the other end of the phone would try to assist as best as possible. Upon providing the file number, he advised that the file indicated a sample was supposed to be taken and sent to the lab, but wasn't, and that a message would be relayed to (name removed) to address this matter and to return my call. This information completely contradicts the December 8th letter. This is very unprofessional to say the least. To date, I have not as yet received a return call. Regardless, as you can see from the pictures, these shingles would not be acceptable by anybody's standards.

Please accept this letter as a demand to have these shingles replaced and installed at today's market value. If not resolved by June 30, 2010, legal action will commence."

We never received any response.

TomcoPDR
09-05-2010, 05:42 PM
Originally posted by Gary-Alberta
Buyer Beware!! Our bad experience with BP Canada:


Please accept this letter as a demand to have these shingles replaced and installed at today's market value. If not resolved by June 30, 2010, legal action will commence."

We never received any response.

So you guys sueing them? Sueing for the ENTIRE house shingles or just the defective ones though? (wonder what the court will award, as maybe for a few shingles, that's what the warranty department will bank on that nobody will bother :dunno: )

sillysod
09-06-2010, 03:39 PM
s_havinga is bang on...

very few people stay in the same house for 15 years. (young ones anyways).

I would just find a reputable installer and get the cheapest shingles you can find. If they are installed properly it will still intact before you move out and into your next home.

rece
09-07-2010, 08:59 AM
Here is a somewhat shameless plug for the company that I work for. Everyone seems to go with asphalt shingles... Why? if you look to our neighbours to the south and most of Europe, they have been using a sustainable, cost effective and long lasting roofing material for a long time.

Concrete roof tile!

While the initial cost is higher, the fact that it will not have to be done for 50+ years makes it one of the cheaper choices based on lifecycle costing.

Unicrete Products is a Calgary company and has done many roofs since 1978.

Check us out.

s_havinga
09-07-2010, 09:07 AM
not to bash a product but the Unicrete Ultra-lite product line is complete garbage. it is like 3/8" thick cement that you can't walk on and can snap it easily with you hands. I would hate to see what the recent hail storms would do to it!

Actual tile on the other hand is a great product but extremely expensive and it isn't even an option for most reroofs as it is too heavy and has to be planned for in the truss design stage.

rece
09-14-2010, 03:11 PM
Originally posted by s_havinga
not to bash a product but the Unicrete Ultra-lite product line is complete garbage. it is like 3/8" thick cement that you can't walk on and can snap it easily with you hands. I would hate to see what the recent hail storms would do to it!

Actual tile on the other hand is a great product but extremely expensive and it isn't even an option for most reroofs as it is too heavy and has to be planned for in the truss design stage.

Well, not to get into a war of words on the forum, but Unicrete's Light Weight tile is absolutely appropriate for re-roofing, and we have installed on thousands of homes through Alberta including many in the Hamptons/Edgemont areas.

While it is a thinner profile than our standard weight tile, you can walk on it, being careful where you step. Part of the point of this product is that you really should not have to be on the roof as it is not a susceptible to damage from hail, wind etc.

With respect to the most recent, as well as last years hail storms, some of the worst in history according to the insurance industry, we (Unicrete) have not had any claims for issues related to these storms. In reality, we have seen a spike in interest in our products due to the performance characteristics.

PS: I will gladly provide you with a lightweight tile sample ... if you really think you can break it by hand.

Really, I would love to discuss what products you feel offer better characteristics as a roofing material that has stood the test of time like concrete tiles.

secol
09-14-2010, 10:57 PM
Originally posted by DeeK
when it comes down to it.. shingles dont really makes much of a difference what kind you use. The job of the roof is to keep water out, that is achieved by proper underlay. I have no idea what the vents are for unless they are simply just replacing older vents.. in which I would say what a waste of time. a vent is a vent is a vent. as long as its not damaged, dont fix it. I assume thats what the 4" pvc pipe is for as well. just another vent in the roof. I say again, don't fix it if its not broken.

Water/ice shields are great, paper underlay is a must to pass code.

I've never heard of "grip guard" or "drip edge". sounds like a bunch of gimmicks and crap to me. unless they are referring to drip edge in the sense that it overhangs the roof a bit to leave a proper drip edge into the eaves.


I don't claim to be a roofer, but I have been in the construction industry long enough to know whats what.

From the two quotes you have, so long as they are roughly the same price, I'd say go with the paper underlay, with water/ice shields.

i heard that vents help reduce heating costs in winter while help keep the house cooler in summers? :dunno:

rece
09-15-2010, 07:44 AM
Originally posted by secol


i heard that vents help reduce heating costs in winter while help keep the house cooler in summers? :dunno:

That is correct in general. The basic function of a roof vent is to attempt to keep the temps in the attic ambient based on the outside temps.

The issue with most roofing materials is that they are applied directly to the deck of the roof causing the heat to transmit into the attic space even on a cold day. This is why many homes get hot on a sunny day, yet the outside temp is cold (say -15).

Know that the insulation in the ceiling of your home is great at keeping the cold out, but the characteristics related to heat transfer into the home are not as good.

There are some roofing products, for example Concrete Roof Tile, that offer an air space between the material and the deck of the roof. This assists significantly in the reduction of heat transferring into the attic space, creating near ambient temps throughout the year which assists in heating and cooling the home.