Bear Spray

[Mitsu3000gt]

I was wondering if there are certain kinds of Bear spray that are supposed to work better than others, or are more powerful than others. I've been doing some biking in BC lately and am not particularily fond of the amount of bears (with cubs) I've been seeing very close to the trails lol. I saw 5 on my last trip to Mt. 7 in Golden. Additionally, the next place we will be biking apparently has a Grizzly bear reserve at the bottom of the hill (Kicking Horse). Just in case, if myself or someone I am with encounters a bear I think it would be a good idea to have some sort of defense (maybe bear spray, unless that just makes them angrier lol). Anyways, I'm sure lots of you guys are in bear country all the time, what would you recommend?

Thanks in advance.

[Cooked Rice]

i know MEC has this stuff

http://www.mec.ca/Products/product_detail.jsp?PRODUCT%3C%3Eprd_id=845524442621481&FOLDER%3C%3Efolder_id=2534374302696025&bmUID=1213034956688

[spikerS]

not sure what it was called, but it comes in a red can about 2/3rds of the size of an MSR bottle. Back when i came home from a camping trip, the pin got caught on somthing in the trunk of the car, when i pulled it out, it went off and I instantly went down, barely able to breathe for about 10-15 mins. someone saw me in my driveway like this and next thing the cops and an ambulance showed up.

If i can remember the name i will definatly let you know.

[Oldskool]

You have to look at the capsaicin percentage, I got my bear spray from wholesale sports (by the IKEA) can't remember what the percentage is, but i do think its a little higher that 1%, which is what they offer at MEC(from previous post).

Just get a bear bell or something on your bike to make lots of noise, if they hear you coming, they'll try to get away. They'll only fight if you surprise a bear feeding, or with cubs. Usually hiking I carry a bear bell, bear banger, and bear spray. I never wanna mess with a bear :guns:

**Edit, my bearspray is only 0.857% capsaicin, the MEC stuff is stronger.

[KLCC]

I think nobody on beyond has used enough bear spray to provide you with their insight.

[nickyh]

Originally posted by Oldskool

Usually hiking I carry a bear bell, bear banger, and bear spray. I never wanna mess with a bear :guns:

Where did you get the bear bangers from?

I carry the spray while riding after an encounter with a grizzly a few years back, fortionatly, that's been the only one in about 7 years of being in the mountains. But it would be nice to get my hands on the bangers.

[mucat]

I recommend Doritos...

[snowboard]

the grizz at kicking horse died. and it was a contained reserve, my sister saw it a bunch of times...
the most effect spray to use on a bear would actually be that of a 12gauge pistol grip haha...

[Mitsu3000gt]

Thanks for the replies - I think I will head down to Wholesale Sports sometime this week and have a look around. I think it would be a good thing to have, just incase. The thing with biking is that if a bear is in the middle of the trail, around a corner or something, we could literally run right into it and then I'm not sure if it would run or not - probably not if it had cubs. The chance of surprising one is quite high if its on the trail.

I'd feel much better if I could just stick a Desert Eagle in my Camelback but unfortunately that would be very difficult to obtain.

[rc2002]

+1 for the bear bell. I use one every time I've gone out. I haven't used my bear spray yet. The spray is quite expensive because it expires after a year or two, and you're supposed to do a test spray each time you go out.

From what I've been taught, you're not supposed to spray directly at the bear anyway. You're supposed to spray it on the ground between yourself and the bear and it's suppose to provide a barrier to prevent it from charging you.

[DarkDream]

Bears don't usually come attack you unless they have a reason. These reasons are usually when the bear suprised by you appearance or if threaten their food supply

If you hiking without supplies the best thing to do is to yell out as your hiking... and if you do in fact see a bear don't run.... just slowly back away.

[GREENBOY]

Bear spray works better than anything else including guns...fact. I read a good study from someone at the U of C on this using cases when it was actually used and how effective it was and it definitely came out tops in terms of defending yourself against a bear...over 90 per cent effective if I remember rightly. It's super reliable in cases of people being charged/mauled etc and idiot proof in terms of how to use it...you just have to be able to get to it on time and spray in the rough direction of the bear if it's attacking or charging or just too close. Maybe in the water bottle holder of the bike or on a holster would be best?

I hear bear bells in most circumstances don't work well, especially on a bike.

Shouting before you go round corners or in areas with bad visibility is always a good bet too.

I've seen a few but never had to use the spray...yet.

[Grogador]

Originally posted by GREENBOY
Bear spray works better than anything else including guns...fact. I read a good study from someone at the U of C on this using cases when it was actually used and how effective it was and it definitely came out tops in terms of defending yourself against a bear...over 90 per cent effective if I remember rightly.

Source? Would love to see the methodology and data on this...


Originally posted by GREENBOY
I hear bear bells in most circumstances don't work well, especially on a bike. [/B]

They don't call em dinner bells for nothing! Best is just to have loud conversations with buddy... or yourself...

[Mitsu3000gt]

Originally posted by DarkDream
Bears don't usually come attack you unless they have a reason. These reasons are usually when the bear suprised by you appearance or if threaten their food supply

If you hiking without supplies the best thing to do is to yell out as your hiking... and if you do in fact see a bear don't run.... just slowly back away.

Yeah I did some reading about the do's and don'ts of bear encounters, and surprising it is never good, especially if it has cubs or a food. The reason I'm worried about surprising it is because we'll be riding pretty fast down winding trails - it would be super easy to run right into the bear if it found its way onto the trail. Unfortunately a bell isn't really much of an option on a bike, and the 5 black bears we saw were on the fire road we were shuttling up at Mt. 7 and weren't afraid of 2 huge jacked up diesel dodge ram quad cabs full of people. The fact that we generally ride in a group is probably as effective as any bell or noise maker, I just think it would be good to have an alternative measure.

Thanks again for the replies, I've found them to be quite helpful.

[GQBalla]

i also heard bear bells are worse because the bear hears them and want so investigate what it is because some bears always hears them

[msommers]

For those of you who use bells and are quiet hikers, I would tell you to (A) Start talking and (B) take the bells off. We have been advised at work to not use bells because there are times when not everyone is talking to one another and it is just the bells jiggling. If there is a bear in close proximity, the bear and/or cubs could be curious to the sound and approach you. As for the spray we use, I'll have to go check the equipment room.

[GREENBOY]

When bears attack, spray is your best defense
Study shows can of bear spray works better than a gun
By Brian Maffly
The Salt Lake Tribune
Article Last Updated: 03/25/2008 07:21:51 PM MDT


If you're roaming bear country, your best protection against an
unpleasant encounter is a can of bear spray, not a gun, according to
Brigham Young University wildlife biologist Tom Smith.
Smith's team, which included Stephen Herrero (UofC), a world authority on
bear attacks, has studied 600 bear encounters in Alaska over two
decades. In 72 incidents where bear spray was used properly, the bear
stopped charging more than 90 percent of the time, according to a
study Smith published in the April edition of the Journal of Wildlife
Management. People using guns, by contrast, stood a one in three
chance of failing to deter the bear, according to an earlier study.


"The probability is the bear spray will outperform a firearm and it's
easy to see why. The spray is easy to deploy. The rifle is just
difficult to use," Smith said. Stopping a charging bear with bullets
required, on average, four hits.
Most of the 72 bear spray deployments Smith studied involved
grizzly bears; the rest were black and polar bears. His team studied
newspaper accounts, anecdotes and reports from wildlife agencies to
determine the bears' activity before being sprayed, the distance
involved, time of day, wind effects, mechanical problems and dosage of
spray. Of the 150 people involved, just three injuries were reported
and none required hospitalization.


"Tom is the best person to do this study because he has so much
hands-on experience with bears," said Chuck Bartlebaugh, a vocal bear
spray advocate who leads the Center for Wildlife Information in
Missoula, Mont. "We need a similar study done for the Intermountain
region with inland grizzly bears who tend to be more aggressive
because they don't have the salmon runs."


Last year was the worst on record for human-bear conflicts in
Utah, with 203 black bear encounters, including a fatal mauling in
American Fork Canyon. That total was substantially higher than the
previous four years combined, probably the result of poor natural food
sources and a high number of fledgling juveniles leaving their home
turf, according to Kevin Bunnell, large mammal coordinator for the
Division of Wildlife Resources.


Utah's wet winter bodes well for the coming season, "but it can
turn south in hurry," Bunnell said. "A single late freeze can have a
big impact. So can a hot, dry July or August."


Smith's findings should debunk common reasons for not carrying
bear spray, which Smith calls "an olfactory assault weapon." Although
wind can interfere with spray accuracy, wind rarely reduced the
spray's effectiveness, probably because most discharges occur in
wooded areas and the spray exits the nozzle at 70 mph. His team found
no instances where the spray malfunctioned and only two instances
where the sprayers incapacitated themselves.


"Bear spray diffuses potentially dangerous situations in the short
term by providing the user time to move out of harm's way and allowing
the bear time to reassess the situation and move on," Smith wrote.
"When food or garbage is involved with bear conflict, bear spray is
effective initially, but one can expect bears to continue returning
until these attractants are removed or otherwise secured."


Smith's study, funded by his former employer, the U.S. Geological
Society and the Alaska Science Center, shows that bear spray can help
conserve grizzlies, protected as a threatened species.


Every fall in the lands around Glacier and Yellowstone national
parks, elk hunters kill grizzly bears in self defense. According to
the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service, between 1980 and 2002, 49
grizzlies were fatally shot by people protecting themselves around
Yellowstone (accounting for nearly one in six of all known bear
deaths). Another 23 were shot around Glacier.


"In most cases there are no attempts to carry bear spray, much
less use it. Every time a hunter decides to shoot instead of use bear
spray they are making a decision they are going to set back grizzly
bear recovery," said Brian Peck of the Great Bear Foundation. "Had
those people used bear spray, not only would [the bears] be alive,
they would know that this red hot spray stuff will be really nasty and
to avoid it and they would pass this information on. Bears are
smart."

[silviafreek89]

Originally posted by mucat
I recommend Doritos...


sweet/chilli/heat baby!!!

[G-ZUS]

What happens if you use expired bear mace? does it not work good enough?

[Eleanor]

Originally posted by Oldskool
**Edit, my bearspray is only 0.857% capsaicin, the MEC stuff is stronger.

The MEC stuff is the strongest stuff I've seen available for consumers. It is considered a weapon. However remember that the more effective against the bear it is, the more effective it will be against you. It is nasty stuff, I've needed to use it twice, not much fun.


Originally posted by snowboard
the most effect spray to use on a bear would actually be that of a 12gauge pistol grip haha...

I know you're joking, but for other people I know we're the most redneck city in the country, but this is NOT a good idea.


Originally posted by richardchan2002
+1 for the bear bell. I use one every time I've gone out. I haven't used my bear spray yet. The spray is quite expensive because it expires after a year or two, and you're supposed to do a test spray each time you go out.

From what I've been taught, you're not supposed to spray directly at the bear anyway. You're supposed to spray it on the ground between yourself and the bear and it's suppose to provide a barrier to prevent it from charging you.

You must have gotten some bad information from someone, cause you are not supposed to do a test spray, it is a really bad idea. Bears are attracted to the scent of the spray and there is a very good chance you might get some on yourself or worse in your eyes/mouth/nose if there is any kind of wind. The stuff at MEC was good for 3 years AFAIK and the small bottle costs ~$25. A small price to pay for something that could save your life.

You are right on the method to spray it, you basically want to create a cloud of the stuff between you and the bear so if he/she charges you, it has to run through it, getting it in their eyes/nose/mouth. Check the bottle to see what is the effective distance of the product (I think it's normally about 15', but it will say for sure on the bottle.)


Originally posted by GQBalla
i also heard bear bells are worse because the bear hears them and want so investigate what it is because some bears always hears them

There are different trains of thinking on the bear bell topic, but the best argument I've heard is that if you are a really quiet hiker, it might not be a bad idea. The big thing is make sure the bears know you're there. They don't normally attack people, unless they're startled/surprised. The only other major reason they'll attack is if you got between momma and her cub. If you do get caught in this situation, try to move SLOWLY so that you're no longer between them. Show them you are not a threat, try to avoid eye contact.


Originally posted by G-ZUS
What happens if you use expired bear mace? does it not work good enough?

The big thing I think with expired bear mace is that the propellant will not be as effective, meaning it won't spray as far as you're hoping to.

If you guys want more information:

http://www.mec.ca/media/Images/pdf/factsheets/bear_spray_v1_m56577569830603232.pdf

[BlueGoblin]

Originally posted by Eleanor

There are different trains of thinking on the bear bell topic, but the best argument I've heard is that if you are a really quiet hiker, it might not be a bad idea. The big thing is make sure the bears know you're there. They don't normally attack people, unless they're startled/surprised. The only other major reason they'll attack is if you got between momma and her cub. If you do get caught in this situation, try to move SLOWLY so that you're no longer between them. Show them you are not a threat, try to avoid eye contact.


Good advice - i might add that you might want to hunch down a bit as sometimes height can provoke a competitive response.

I used to be a big advocate of the bear bell and noise approach combined with what i thought was a good understanding of bears.

That changed after a black bear found the bell...intruiging... and made a very deliberate approach to investigate. It scared the crap out of me and ran contrary to what I thought I knew.

A friend of mine who is extremely knowledgeable on bears (years as a Warden + extensive personal experience) told me that the bells do nothing. You are very unlikely to actually surprise a bear in its own habitat - they know you are coming and unless they are standing in a river fishing, they have heard and possibly smelled you long before you spot them. He figures that some bears are going to approach, some are not, and when one does, the possibilities are pretty open. Now I do what he does in the wildnerness: be heads up all the time, and have bear spray rapidly accessible. I practice drawing it from where I carry it too. And I've ditched the bell.

[rc2002]

Originally posted by Eleanor


You must have gotten some bad information from someone, cause you are not supposed to do a test spray, it is a really bad idea. Bears are attracted to the scent of the spray and there is a very good chance you might get some on yourself or worse in your eyes/mouth/nose if there is any kind of wind. The stuff at MEC was good for 3 years AFAIK and the small bottle costs ~$25. A small price to pay for something that could save your life.


The test spray is done in the parking lot or at home in your backyard before you go. And it makes a lot of sense. If you never test it, you'd never know if it really works. The worst thing to do is to pull out the spray when you need it only to find out that it doesn't work.

[sweeks]

How do you tell the difference between black bear crap and grizzly crap?




Grizzly crap has bells in it.

[Eleanor]

^ :rofl: So true


Originally posted by richardchan2002
The test spray is done in the parking lot or at home in your backyard before you go. And it makes a lot of sense. If you never test it, you'd never know if it really works. The worst thing to do is to pull out the spray when you need it only to find out that it doesn't work.

I see where you're coming from and it does make a lot of sense, but we were always told at work that you shouldn't be spraying it unless it is absolutely necessary, that once it's been sprayed once, you are supposed to dispose of the rest and get a new one. Some cans of bear spray are also single use, meaning once you spray, it will empty the entire can.

BTW, the proper way to dispose of bear spray is to discharge it into a bucket (I think there's one FS here somewhere :D )full of water until it is totally empty, then bring it back to the place where you bought it.

If you have to take away one thing out of this whole thread

READ THE INSTRUCTIONS ON THE BOTTLE!!!!!!!!!

You wouldn't believe the amount of cans of bear spray we had returned to us with the safety zip tie still on it :banghead:

[Mitsu3000gt]

^^^ Lots of good info in your posts, thanks!

Would something like this do the trick:

http://www.mec.ca/Products/product_detail.jsp?FOLDER%3C%3Efolder_id=2534374302696025&PRODUCT%3C%3Eprd_id=845524442621481

Or is it ideal to have more than 1% of the active ingredient?

[ScottysZ]

Originally posted by snowboard

the most effect spray to use on a bear would actually be that of a 12gauge pistol grip haha...

Yea... but no. You need to be shooting slugs if a bear of any size is coming at you.

That being said, for the bears around here a gun isnt really necessary, and since most people would just shit their pants and then miss its not really a good idea. The best idea would be bear bangers and bear spray. I cant remember what the brand is but for work we have some thats 2% capsacin, ive seen it in action and it works just as fast as a gun.

[Mitsu3000gt]

Originally posted by ScottysZ


Yea... but no. You need to be shooting slugs if a bear of any size is coming at you.

That being said, for the bears around here a gun isnt really necessary, and since most people would just shit their pants and then miss its not really a good idea. The best idea would be bear bangers and bear spray. I cant remember what the brand is but for work we have some thats 2% capsacin, ive seen it in action and it works just as fast as a gun.

So should I be looking for something higher than 1% capsacin? Also you did you actually see it used on a bear?

[ScottysZ]

Originally posted by Mitsu3000gt


So should I be looking for something higher than 1% capsacin? Also you did you actually see it used on a bear?

Im sure 1% is alright too, but id probably get the strongest stuff I could find. And yes, saw it used on a pretty good sized black bear (~500lbs), after the banger jsut spooked it but failed to scare it away (which is pretty unusual). A coworker sprayed it and it immediately turned around and frantically ran about 50ft away, when i looked back it was just sitting there pawing its eyes like crazy, which were frothing.

After seeing it in action i have no doubt even the 1% stuff would be effective against any of the black or grizzly bears around here.

The only time a gun might be a better option would be if youre in polar bear territory where one might continue to hunt you even after having a run in.

[GREENBOY]

Southeast junior high evacuated because of bear spray
Last Updated: Tuesday, June 10, 2008 | 2:25 PM MT Comments1Recommend0CBC News

Fire crews have evacuated Ernest Morrow Junior High School in Calgary's southeast Tuesday afternoon.

It's believed someone squirted bear spray through the school's hallways. Students and staff were asked to leave the building at 12th Avenue and 42nd Street S.E. so it could be ventilated.

Paramedics are on the scene, but no one has so far been taken to the hospital.



:banghead:

[ExtraSlow]

I was once in a crowded bar in edmonton when some bear spray, or possibly that womens defense stuff was sprayed into the air. I'm athsmatic, and I thought I was going to die, even though i got out of there in probably under ten seconds.

that place emptied out pretty fast, and a lot of people were hacking and coughing, even though they didn't get sprayed directly. Nasty stuff!

I do carry it when hiking.

[RaptorGJC]

Originally posted by ScottysZ


Im sure 1% is alright too, but id probably get the strongest stuff I could find.

The highest percentage of caspaicin I could find is 7.5% but that's on a "human" pepper spray. I always thought bear spray would be a higher concentration.

The one I found was http://www.code09.com/productdisplay.php?pid=210, but thats for personal defense so.... maybe thats better vs. a bear?

[Eleanor]

I've personally had to use bear spray twice, both times it worked, both times it was a black bear, both times it was 0.875% cap

7.5% is overkill I think. One of the times I sprayed I got some coming back at me and it stung my eyes like a MF for about :30.

[ScottysZ]

Agreed, i think that 7.5 would burn the eyballs right out of your head if there was any tiny breeze. Im sure that anything you buy at a respectable store will be alright.