Saskatchewan Gov to ban Lift Kits

[CK4500]

Saskatchewan sets sights on 'monster truck' ban

Canwest News Service
Wednesday, June 11, 2008

Four-by-four truck drivers in Saskatchewan are furious over a decision by the provincial-government insurer that could ban their oversized trucks from the roads.

A newly implemented Saskatchewan Government Insurance (SGI) policy targets "raised vehicles," whose owners buy oversized tires and "lift kits" designed to raise the trucks higher off the ground.

SGI's decision was based on studies showing the after-sale modifications may make the trucks more dangerous for drivers and others on the road, said officials with the Crown-owned insurance company.

"Reasonably raised vehicles have been permitted to operate on Saskatchewan highways, and will continue to be operated on Saskatchewan highways," said Brian Kline, SGI's manager of vehicle standards and inspection.

Four-by-four enthusiast Steve Inverarity says the American studies cited by SGI were inconclusive, and the policy itself casts too broad a net -- nabbing responsible truck owners along with a small minority of "monster truck" lovers.

There is alot of discussion going on in some of the SK forums that have more details on this subject.

SGI Policy Debate (http://www.toontoysforums.ca/viewforum.php?f=21)

My $0.02

I hate the big ass 4x4's operated by jackasses, who think they own the road, and use the size of their vehicles to intimidate smaller vehicles on the road. But, there are 4x4 operators out there who are responsible, and don't drive like assholes.

I have a 6" lift on my 2008 Tacoma, and after having a drunk purposely ram me, I argue SGI's point that "after-sale modifications may make the trucks more dangerous for drivers and others on the road".....My lift saved me for what could've been a serious injury.

SGI is a Crown Corporation that is run by the Government. The way they are changing things in the province, it's more like Communism. They are also in talks of bringing in "air care" which will be stricter than BC's.

[rmk]

How are they going to compensate for their small penis now?

[Xtrema]

http://www.truck-nuts.com/i//IMG_0126.jpg

[dr_jared88]

^^:rofl:

[Jlude]

Originally posted by CK4500
Saskatchewan sets sights on 'monster truck' ban

Canwest News Service
Wednesday, June 11, 2008

Four-by-four truck drivers in Saskatchewan are furious over a decision by the provincial-government insurer that could ban their oversized trucks from the roads.

A newly implemented Saskatchewan Government Insurance (SGI) policy targets "raised vehicles," whose owners buy oversized tires and "lift kits" designed to raise the trucks higher off the ground.

SGI's decision was based on studies showing the after-sale modifications may make the trucks more dangerous for drivers and others on the road, said officials with the Crown-owned insurance company.

"Reasonably raised vehicles have been permitted to operate on Saskatchewan highways, and will continue to be operated on Saskatchewan highways," said Brian Kline, SGI's manager of vehicle standards and inspection.

Four-by-four enthusiast Steve Inverarity says the American studies cited by SGI were inconclusive, and the policy itself casts too broad a net -- nabbing responsible truck owners along with a small minority of "monster truck" lovers.

There is alot of discussion going on in some of the SK forums that have more details on this subject.

SGI Policy Debate (http://www.toontoysforums.ca/viewforum.php?f=21)

My $0.02

I hate the big ass 4x4's operated by jackasses, who think they own the road, and use the size of their vehicles to intimidate smaller vehicles on the road. But, there are 4x4 operators out there who are responsible, and don't drive like assholes.

I have a 6" lift on my 2008 Tacoma, and after having a drunk purposely ram me, I argue SGI's point that "after-sale modifications may make the trucks more dangerous for drivers and others on the road".....My lift saved me for what could've been a serious injury.

SGI is a Crown Corporation that is run by the Government. The way they are changing things in the province, it's more like Communism. They are also in talks of bringing in "air care" which will be stricter than BC's.

I agree completely!!!


Originally posted by Xtrema
http://www.truck-nuts.com/i//IMG_0126.jpg




:rofl: :rofl:

[Godfuader]

Too bad Alberta wont follow suit. Tastefully done lift-kits are nice...but if your headlights are lighting up the roof of my car...time to take it down a couple notches.

[Destinova403]

Originally posted by Godfuader
Too bad Alberta wont follow suit. Tastefully done lift-kits are nice...but if your headlights are lighting up the roof of my car...time to take it down a couple notches.

+1... id really really appreciate it if those drivers would take the time to lower the cut-off on their lights so they arent going right into my mirrors and my back window... its really blinding.

[Benny]

Originally posted by CK4500
I hate the big ass 4x4's operated by jackasses, who think they own the road, and use the size of their vehicles to intimidate smaller vehicles on the road. But, there are 4x4 operators out there who are responsible, and don't drive like assholes.


A few bad apples ruin the bunch in this case. I know tons of jacked-up truck drivers and they don't drive like dicks. Same case with modified import owners, there's always gonna be a couple clowns who have to be irresponsible and rip around on city streets.


Originally posted by rmk
How are they going to compensate for their small penis now?

Fuck off :thumbsup:

[G-Suede]

Originally posted by CK4500
Saskatchewan sets sights on 'monster truck' ban
They are also in talks of bringing in "air care" which will be stricter than BC's.

Good fucking luck with that one. The typical Saskatchewan roach coach is at least 25 years old and held together with duct tape and/or chicken wire.

What are they proposing? The rural commuters drive their cattle to the city and the urbanites ride bicycles when their vehicles are declared unfit polluters?

[heavyD]

Originally posted by rmk
How are they going to compensate for their small penis now?

Buy a BMW?:dunno:

[picmerollin]

awsome!!!

[JRSC00LUDE]

They are already on the radio today back-pedalling on the whole thing because the backlash has been biting them in the ass for putting forward a policy with no thought to actually researching it first. Now all of the sudden they need to review the whole thing and consult with groups etc.

You can buy stock vehicles with a larger tire/wheel diameter than they were allowing as legal under their policy. Fucking idiots.

[heavyD]

Originally posted by JRSC00LUDE
They are already on the radio today back-pedalling on the whole thing because the backlash has been biting them in the ass for putting forward a policy with no thought to actually researching it first. Now all of the sudden they need to review the whole thing and consult with groups etc.

You can buy stock vehicles with a larger tire/wheel diameter than they were allowing as legal under their policy. Fucking idiots.

There is a serious safety issue though. I can't remember if it was 60 Minutes but one US show did a story on how raised trucks would turn a simple rear ender into a fatality due to the car's hood going right under the truck bumper and essentially decapitating the driver and passenger. There were enough cases of this for the governments to take a serious look.

IMO there's absolutely no reason a lifted truck should be used as a daily driver as it diminishes handling and is a potential hazard for drivers of cars. If you really use it off-road it should be treated as a recreational vehicle and not a normal street vehicle.

Also IMO they look ridiculous and nothing screams; "I'm redneck and have a small penis" than a big lifted truck lol.

[JRSC00LUDE]

^

Oh I don't like big lifts anymore than the next guy, I agree with you on that. My beef with SGI is the "as per usual" complete lack of foresight when they decide to do something. They push it through and tell people about it after it's already in effect but they don't actually research it at all? Stupid as per usual.

You just going to go down to the old dodge dealership and tell them the trucks on their sales lot can't be sold because SGI randomly decided the tire/wheel diameter is too big? I mean seriously, how dumb are they? The head of the auto-fund was on talk radio here 20 minutes ago acknowledging that oh "I guess we didn't really look into that closely enough....".

That's why I say fucking idiots. :banghead:

[tirebob]

Now you can hate on all 4x4'ers because there are some dicks out there, just like you can't hate on all sport compact owners because they have have some dicks driving them as well.

Just because a truck is lifted does not make it necessarly unsafe. Driving a lifted truck like a douche makes it unsafe, just like driving a highly modfied compact like a douche is unsafe, but to pull all legitimate owner/drivers off the road is lunacy...

[heavyD]

Originally posted by tirebob
Now you can hate on all 4x4'ers because there are some dicks out there, just like you can't hate on all sport compact owners because they have have some dicks driving them as well.

Just because a truck is lifted does not make it necessarly unsafe. Driving a lifted truck like a douche makes it unsafe, just like driving a highly modfied compact like a douche is unsafe, but to pull all legitimate owner/drivers off the road is lunacy...

It's got nothing to do with the drivers, how legitimate, how well they drive. If the bumper is 5" off the ground it's not really a bumper anymore and there's a reason we have bumpers. The reason a lift kit is installed is to be used off road not to be used on the street. Really what's the point of having a big lift if you are just using the truck as a daily driven street vehicle? Pretty simple if you ask me.

[b_t]

Originally posted by heavyD


It's got nothing to do with the drivers, how legitimate, how well they drive. If the bumper is 5" off the ground it's not really a bumper anymore and there's a reason we have bumpers. The reason a lift kit is installed is to be used off road not to be used on the street. Really what's the point of having a big lift if you are just using the truck as a daily driven street vehicle? Pretty simple if you ask me.

What's the point in installing a set of lightweight 18s, a super stiff coilover suspension, a nice turbo kit, and racing seats if it is a daily driven street vehicle?
People modify their vehicles. Deal with it.

[heavyD]

Originally posted by b_t


What's the point in installing a set of lightweight 18s, a super stiff coilover suspension, a nice turbo kit, and racing seats if it is a daily driven street vehicle?
People modify their vehicles. Deal with it.

Personally I don't car what anyone does with their vehicles as long as it's not going to compromise safety of others. Oh and I don't have to deal with it because I don't drive a lifted vehicle. Don't think this won't make its way into Alberta.

[b_t]

Originally posted by heavyD


Personally I don't car what anyone does with their vehicles as long as it's not going to compromise safety of others. Oh and I don't have to deal with it because I don't drive a lifted vehicle. Don't think this won't make its way into Alberta.

So if someone greatly reduces their vehicle's ground clearance (increasing the likelihood of unpredictable and sudden braking to slow down for potholes and speedbumps, erratic movements to avoid potholes, etc) or puts on tires that get poor traction in wet or cold conditions, they aren't compromising the safety of others? When I was saying "deal with it" I meant "deal with these lifted trucks" which means "use defensive driving and don't crash into them" :thumbsup:
As far as the redneck small penis thing goes, that's ignorant stereotyping and really, who cares what you think?

[The Cosworth]

Originally posted by b_t


So if someone greatly reduces their vehicle's ground clearance (increasing the likelihood of unpredictable and sudden braking to slow down for potholes and speedbumps, erratic movements to avoid potholes, etc) or puts on tires that get poor traction in wet or cold conditions, they aren't compromising the safety of others? When I was saying "deal with it" I meant "deal with these lifted trucks" which means "use defensive driving and don't crash into them" :thumbsup:
As far as the redneck small penis thing goes, that's ignorant stereotyping and really, who cares what you think?

What I drive: '07 Tacoma
:clap:


no wonder he is getting so angry.




I welcome this, reminds me of that 24' lift thread

[dimi]

Originally posted by heavyD


Personally I don't car what anyone does with their vehicles as long as it's not going to compromise safety of others. Oh and I don't have to deal with it because I don't drive a lifted vehicle. Don't think this won't make its way into Alberta.

:werd: Some people claim its not a safety issue? It will be when you get that lifted bumper in your face. I don't feel safe at all driving around lifted trucks.

[heavyD]

Originally posted by b_t
stereotyping and really, who cares what you think?

I do and I think guys with lifted trucks have inferiority complex. The fact that you are getting all defensive and happen to drive a 4x4 pretty well sums up why I feel the way I do about it.

[mazdavirgin]

Originally posted by b_t


What's the point in installing a set of lightweight 18s, a super stiff coilover suspension, a nice turbo kit, and racing seats if it is a daily driven street vehicle?
People modify their vehicles. Deal with it.
:nut: None of those mods are going to cause someone to be decapitated if they run into you on the deerfoot. A lift kit on the other hand... I don't care if you mod your vehicle as long as it doesn't make it a hazzard to the rest of the people on the road.

[Tik-Tok]

Originally posted by heavyD


There is a serious safety issue though. I can't remember if it was 60 Minutes but one US show did a story on how raised trucks would turn a simple rear ender into a fatality due to the car's hood going right under the truck bumper and essentially decapitating the driver and passenger.


This is my biggest, and only beef with raised trucks. I don't think they should outright BAN lift kits, but there should be HARD laws against bumper height, with very large fines/seizure of vehicle.

Even the headlights thing I can get past, as if I happen to be stuck in front of one, with nowhere to go, I just turn my mirror a bit, but I can't do anything about a truck rolling over my car because he couldn't stop in time, or his hitch going right into my eye socket because I couldn't.

[Inzane]

Originally posted by heavyD
IMO there's absolutely no reason a lifted truck should be used as a daily driver as it diminishes handling and is a potential hazard for drivers of cars. If you really use it off-road it should be treated as a recreational vehicle and not a normal street vehicle.

Also IMO they look ridiculous

:werd:

[Doozer]

Originally posted by b_t
So if someone greatly reduces their vehicle's ground clearance (increasing the likelihood of unpredictable and sudden braking to slow down for potholes and speedbumps, erratic movements to avoid potholes, etc) or puts on tires that get poor traction in wet or cold conditions, they aren't compromising the safety of others? When I was saying "deal with it" I meant "deal with these lifted trucks" which means "use defensive driving and don't crash into them" :thumbsup:
As far as the redneck small penis thing goes, that's ignorant stereotyping and really, who cares what you think?
For my two cents here ... I see what you're trying to say, but I think you're missing/avoiding a couple of the most important issues. 1) We're not talking about drivers "swerving to avoid speedbumps" because we're not talking about driving habits. Just like we're not accusing lifted truck drivers of intentionally "driving over other vehicles" or something silly like that. There will always be douchebag drivers in every type of vehicle. Driving habits aren't the issue. 2) Almost everyone who's been in an accident has tried to avoid it, so saying "don't crash into a lifted truck" is pretty silly. No one goes LOOKING for something to crash into. Plus, there's also the POSSIBLY (I know it's unlikely) that the lifted truck might just crash into you. 3) A bumper at head level is a helluva a lot more dangerous than a bumper at ankle level.

I mean, if you want to turn this into a "raised" vs "lowered" vehicle issue, I think any person on this forum (including and especially those with lifted vehicles) would much rather crash into a vehicle that's 2 inches off the ground than one that's 4 feet off the ground.

[rc2002]

I agree with heavyD. It doesn't matter how you drive. The fact that your bumper is not on the same level as everyone else's bumper means that you are a danger on the road.

Even the most careful drivers can be involved in an accident, and it's not fair that a person in a lifted 4x4 will be at an advantage in a collision (especially if they are the one that caused it).

[CK4500]

Originally posted by tirebob
Now you can hate on all 4x4'ers because there are some dicks out there, just like you can't hate on all sport compact owners because they have have some dicks driving them as well.

Just because a truck is lifted does not make it necessarly unsafe. Driving a lifted truck like a douche makes it unsafe, just like driving a highly modfied compact like a douche is unsafe, but to pull all legitimate owner/drivers off the road is lunacy...

:thumbsup:

Nicely put.

I happen to be a douche who owns both. A heavily modified Civic, and a lifted Tacoma. BUT I do not drive like a douche. The dumbass rig pigs who drive their diesel 4x4s around thinking it's a Porsche, and the stupid ricers who go around street racing (fast and furious style) are the ones who make it bad for everyone else.

[b_t]

Originally posted by mazdavirgin

:nut: None of those mods are going to cause someone to be decapitated if they run into you on the deerfoot. A lift kit on the other hand... I don't care if you mod your vehicle as long as it doesn't make it a hazzard to the rest of the people on the road.

Any time you are replacing a factory tested and proven component with one that wasn't stock on the vehicle, you are making it more unsafe. Either ban all mods (good luck!) or don't ban any. As far as people running into you, it takes two drivers to crash. Use some defensive fucking driving and the problem is solved.

[snowboard]

Originally posted by heavyD


I do and I think guys with lifted trucks have inferiority complex.

How? what a retarded statement.
I had a lifted truck. I didn't need to make up for a thing?
i had it cause the thing was badass and fun. I in no way feel inferior to anyone and tried to make it up with a big truck. its pure personal reference no psychological issues, your just talking out of your ass now.

[The Cosworth]

Originally posted by b_t


Any time you are replacing a factory tested and proven component with one that wasn't stock on the vehicle, you are making it more unsafe. Either ban all mods (good luck!) or don't ban any. As far as people running into you, it takes two drivers to crash. Use some defensive fucking driving and the problem is solved.

that is retarded reasoning, that is like banning all sex to stop underage sex.

or banning all computers to stop pirating.




Yes the vehicle isnt as safe. However if my suspension falls off on my stock car. I grind to a halt real quick because I am closer to the ground.

If you lift a truck, your bumper and lights are higher, allowing you to hit higher up on a vehicle, and you also have farther to the ground meaning it takes more time for a failure on your truck to stop.

[b_t]

Originally posted by heavyD


I do and I think guys with lifted trucks have inferiority complex. The fact that you are getting all defensive and happen to drive a 4x4 pretty well sums up why I feel the way I do about it.

My truck isn't lifted and I need it to get to some work of the sites I work at, and it still won't make it to some of them because I don't have enough clearance.
I'm getting defensive because here, as always, you have the idiots who drive tiny cars saying the same shit they have always said about the other idiots who drive huge trucks and engaging in this lowbrow "tiny dick" shit again. Its not a legitimate or logical comment. Shut the fuck up.

[rc2002]

Originally posted by b_t


What's the point in installing a set of lightweight 18s, a super stiff coilover suspension, a nice turbo kit, and racing seats if it is a daily driven street vehicle?
People modify their vehicles. Deal with it.



Originally posted by b_t


Any time you are replacing a factory tested and proven component with one that wasn't stock on the vehicle, you are making it more unsafe. Either ban all mods (good luck!) or don't ban any. As far as people running into you, it takes two drivers to crash. Use some defensive fucking driving and the problem is solved.


I agree with you completely that replacing factory parts with aftermarket parts makes it more unsafe.

But for most sport compact car mods, the person at risk is the owner himself/herself. It's completely different than lifting a truck and putting other drivers at risk.

[The Cosworth]

Originally posted by b_t


My truck isn't lifted and I need it to get to some work of the sites I work at, and it still won't make it to some of them because I don't have enough clearance.
I'm getting defensive because here, as always, you have the idiots who drive tiny cars saying the same shit they have always said about the other idiots who drive huge trucks and engaging in this lowbrow "tiny dick" shit again. Its not a legitimate or logical comment. Shut the fuck up.

then go on dieselplace and bitch about lowered cars. I am sure you will find more of an apathetic ear than here.

[JRSC00LUDE]

Originally posted by b_t
As far as people running into you, it takes two drivers to crash. Use some defensive fucking driving and the problem is solved.

O'rly?

http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20071208/calgary_crash_071208/20071208?hub=CTVNewsAt11

No offence b_t, but reasoning like that makes you sound like a huge fag. ;)

I like a mildly lifted truck (read 6 inches), it's functional, fun, looks good and is safe imo. If your bumper will tear through my roof and rip my head off in a simple UNAVOIDABLE rear-end collision (and don't even try to say every accident is avoidable, if it was they wouldn't call it an ACCIDENT, they'd call it a purpose) then it's unsafe. Period. My problem with the policy is the unnecessary blanket approach they took. Which they've already back-pedalled on.....

[BrknFngrs]

Originally posted by richardchan2002
For most sport compact car mods, the person at risk is the owner himself/herself. It's completely different than lifting a truck and putting other drivers at risk.

:werd: This sums up the whole issue/thread.

[heavyD]

Originally posted by b_t
Its not a legitimate or logical comment. Shut the fuck up.

Why you getting so angry then?:poosie: If you don't agree, move along.

[b_t]

Just in case people think that these guy's don't actually need their lifted trucks for their job
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v654/Sakeido/0524081344a.jpg
That's a 3/4 ton Chev that is completely bottomed out on a road up north.. stock height. A stock height 1 ton Dodge couldn't clear this berm either and got stuck about eight feet further down the road, where it got even deeper. This road wasn't even at its worst when I took this pic.
Thankfully, we had a bobcat around so we could tow it out. But, operators who work on their own do not have that option and getting stuck means 3-4 hours downtime, lost productivity and sometimes wages. So oftentimes, these guys will have trucks with very big lifts and tires to ensure they will be able to get their job done. In the summer, they will use a quad instead.

[b_t]

Originally posted by richardchan2002






I agree with you completely that replacing factory parts with aftermarket parts makes it more unsafe.

But for most sport compact car mods, the person at risk is the owner himself/herself. It's completely different than lifting a truck and putting other drivers at risk.

Well, if you have a car that you then lower 2", that would put a normal Dodge's bumpers at head height... therefore putting your passengers at risk, in addition to yourself.

[b_t]

Originally posted by JRSC00LUDE


O'rly?

http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20071208/calgary_crash_071208/20071208?hub=CTVNewsAt11

No offence b_t, but reasoning like that makes you sound like a huge fag. ;)

I like a mildly lifted truck (read 6 inches), it's functional, fun, looks good and is safe imo. If your bumper will tear through my roof and rip my head off in a simple UNAVOIDABLE rear-end collision (and don't even try to say every accident is avoidable, if it was they wouldn't call it an ACCIDENT, they'd call it a purpose) then it's unsafe. Period. My problem with the policy is the unnecessary blanket approach they took. Which they've already back-pedalled on.....

That was an avoidable collision. A quick check in the rear view would have shown a dump truck closing at high speed, and you could then do any number of things to avoid a crash.. go into the intersection, floor it and dive into the median to get out of his way, all those things they taught you in driver's ed.

[mazdavirgin]

Originally posted by b_t
Well, if you have a car that you then lower 2", that would put a normal Dodge's bumpers at head height... therefore putting your passengers at risk, in addition to yourself.
No... That would simply lower the bumper down 2" on the car... Which means the bumper of the Dodge would likely plow into the trunk which is still unsafe but it won't be the Dodge who will suffer. The problem is not lowering it is raising the truck up until the bumper becomes so high it will impact the cabin of a stock height car. There are some trucks that when I am sitting at the light behind them in my STOCK ride height all I can see is tires... The bumper is right inline with my roof.

[dimi]

Originally posted by b_t


That was an avoidable collision. A quick check in the rear view would have shown a dump truck closing at high speed, and you could then do any number of things to avoid a crash.. go into the intersection, floor it and dive into the median to get out of his way, all those things they taught you in driver's ed.

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

[Doozer]

Originally posted by b_t
That was an avoidable collision. A quick check in the rear view would have shown a dump truck closing at high speed, and you could then do any number of things to avoid a crash.. go into the intersection, floor it and dive into the median to get out of his way, all those things they taught you in driver's ed.
Wow.

So you're saying that a car sitting safely at a red light should be gunning INTO the intersection against the light every time they see a vehicle coming up behind them at high speeds? That's every stoplight in Calgary, with the way people late-brake in this city.

[Tik-Tok]

Originally posted by b_t


That was an avoidable collision. A quick check in the rear view would have shown a dump truck closing at high speed, and you could then do any number of things to avoid a crash.. go into the intersection, floor it and dive into the median to get out of his way, all those things they taught you in driver's ed.

Wow, just... wow.

you have lost ANY credibility you may have had, with this one single post.

I can't believe anyone is this fucking stupid.

It's one thing to defend you enjoyment of lifted vehicles, but to say a crash like that was completely avoidable, and to say that ALL collisions are... just... wow.

[JRSC00LUDE]

Originally posted by b_t


That was an avoidable collision. A quick check in the rear view would have shown a dump truck closing at high speed, and you could then do any number of things to avoid a crash.. go into the intersection, floor it and dive into the median to get out of his way, all those things they taught you in driver's ed.

With reasoning like that, every accident that ever happens is completely avoidable. Give us a break man, you're kind of grasping at some staws here with such simplistic reasoning.

What's going to mess up a pedestrian more, regular height, a lowered vehicle or a bumper in the face?

btw - I'm not arguing about the functionality of a lifted truck as I've already stated. There are just reasonable limits that should be enforced. There's a time and a place for everything and if you need a 20 inch lift on a work truck then it should just be a work truck, it has no business cruising down 17th while you go out for dinner.

[b_t]

Originally posted by Doozer

Wow.

So you're saying that a car sitting safely at a red light should be gunning INTO the intersection against the light every time they see a vehicle coming up behind them at high speeds? That's every stoplight in Calgary, with the way people late-brake in this city.

You are not safe if you are at a red light. You aren't safe if you are on the road, period, and if you think you are, your complacency will lead to an accident eventually. Late braking in a car is a little different than a Mack truck. If they haven't slowed down, their brakes are out - time to get the fuck out of the way. I'll take my chances with a vehicle my size, rather than get smoked by a truck that weighs 20,000lbs plus

[heavyD]

Originally posted by b_t
Just in case people think that these guy's don't actually need their lifted trucks for their job
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v654/Sakeido/0524081344a.jpg
That's a 3/4 ton Chev that is completely bottomed out on a road up north.. stock height. A stock height 1 ton Dodge couldn't clear this berm either and got stuck about eight feet further down the road, where it got even deeper. This road wasn't even at its worst when I took this pic.
Thankfully, we had a bobcat around so we could tow it out. But, operators who work on their own do not have that option and getting stuck means 3-4 hours downtime, lost productivity and sometimes wages. So oftentimes, these guys will have trucks with very big lifts and tires to ensure they will be able to get their job done. In the summer, they will use a quad instead.

You are separating work trucks with daily driven personal vehicles. I've never seen a full blown lifted truck pull up to any gas plant, refiery, or compressor station and I've worked at places like High Level where you have to chopper to certain sites.

[heavyD]

Originally posted by Tik-Tok
you have lost ANY credibility you may have had, with this one single post.


Come on man it's b_t we're talking about here. I don't mind reading some of his banter but there's a reason the mods gave him his own special gear.:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

[Doozer]

Originally posted by b_t


You are not safe if you are at a red light. You aren't safe if you are on the road, period, and if you think you are, your complacency will lead to an accident eventually. Late braking in a car is a little different than a Mack truck. If they haven't slowed down, their brakes are out - time to get the fuck out of the way. I'll take my chances with a vehicle my size, rather than get smoked by a truck that weighs 20,000lbs plus
Wow again. I just don't understand your reasoning here. You seem like a decent enough guy, but you just don't seem to get it.

Sure, I'd rather get in an accident with a pickup than a dumptruck, but how about NOT GETTING INTO AN ACCIDENT. I don't think I'm safe on the road, and I certainly try to drive defensively, but part of that is NOT FLOORING IT INTO THE MEDIAN OR THE INTERSECTION everytime someone speeds up behind me. Good Lord man.

[Tik-Tok]

http://i165.photobucket.com/albums/u64/TykTauk/071001_its_like_talking_to_a_brick_.jpg

[b_t]

Originally posted by Tik-Tok


Wow, just... wow.

you have lost ANY credibility you may have had, with this one single post.

I can't believe anyone is this fucking stupid.

It's one thing to defend you enjoyment of lifted vehicles, but to say a crash like that was completely avoidable, and to say that ALL collisions are... just... wow.

You're right! All accidents are unavoidable! Everyone has their head up their ass and if something bad could happen, it will happen!
People fuck up all the time - driving is all about minimizing the chance that if something does go wrong it will involve you. This, believe it or not, is a full time job when you are on the road. You can't let up for a second. This guy had three kids in his back seat and his gf in the passenger seat. He figured since there was a nice bright red light there, he was safe. He was not. If he had even so much as glimpsed in his rear view mirror, he would have seen he was in for trouble, and acted accordingly. But instead, he was looking at his gf, or lecturing his kids, and now because of his lapse in diligence, they are all gone.
This is a secondary issue here. Vehicles are inherently unsafe. They are all hazards, and you will always be able to avoid a crash. If you are reactionary, maybe not, but if you are proactive, you will always leave yourself a way out of trouble and you will always have an option available to get yourself out of harm's way. End of story.
If a truck's bumper's will come through your cabin, don't hit the truck or let it hit you. Problem solved.

[JRSC00LUDE]

Yes, it's their fault they're dead. We get it. :nut:

http://i95.photobucket.com/albums/l147/JRSC00LUDE/untitled-1.jpg

[b_t]

Originally posted by heavyD


Come on man it's b_t we're talking about here. I don't mind reading some of his banter but there's a reason the mods gave him his own special gear.:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

Yeah, I asked for it (http://forums.beyond.ca/showthread.php?s=&threadid=213840&perpage=40&highlight=&pagenumber=2)

[b_t]

Originally posted by heavyD


You are separating work trucks with daily driven personal vehicles. I've never seen a full blown lifted truck pull up to any gas plant, refiery, or compressor station and I've worked at places like High Level where you have to chopper to certain sites.

Last I checked, for 99% of the subcons that work for us, work truck = personal truck. High Level? holy shit man, try down the road at Rainbow Lake, or in the back country by Fort Nelson, or even way back in the Wildcat region here by Cochrane. High Level was still paved.

[b_t]

Originally posted by mazdavirgin

No... That would simply lower the bumper down 2" on the car... Which means the bumper of the Dodge would likely plow into the trunk which is still unsafe but it won't be the Dodge who will suffer. The problem is not lowering it is raising the truck up until the bumper becomes so high it will impact the cabin of a stock height car. There are some trucks that when I am sitting at the light behind them in my STOCK ride height all I can see is tires... The bumper is right inline with my roof.

Its all about the height of a truck in relation to the height of the car. Why make it so guys can't raise their trucks, if you would still let people lower their cars?

[Tik-Tok]

Originally posted by b_t


Its all about the height of a truck in relation to the height of the car. Why make it so guys can't raise their trucks, if you would still let people lower their cars?

As already stated, the person lowering his vehicle is putting himself at risk, while the person raising his vehicle (and bumper), is putting everyone else at risk.

[heavyD]

Originally posted by b_t
High Level? holy shit man, try down the road at Rainbow Lake.

Where you think I was working? High Level is where you fly& stay when you are working in the Rainbow Lake area. It's nothing but dense trees and shitty dirt roads hence having to take helicopters to certain cites.

[BerserkerCatSplat]

Originally posted by JRSC00LUDE


With reasoning like that, every accident that ever happens is completely avoidable.

I was always under the impression that car collisions are due to human mistakes, not force of Nature or acts of God. Therefore, avoidable. :dunno:

[Ntense_SpecV]

Originally posted by b_t


Its all about the height of a truck in relation to the height of the car. Why make it so guys can't raise their trucks, if you would still let people lower their cars?

You're right it's all about being proportional...so everytime you raise your vehicle up 6" then add 35" tires on it making the bumper height go up almost 8" you should be forced to move it down 8" to stock height. But of course you would still complain because it wouldn't look as good.

It's all about looks and we all know it. Whether it's lowering or lifting a vehicle - all looks.

[Eleanor]

Originally posted by BerserkerCatSplat
I was always under the impression that car collisions are due to human mistakes, not force of Nature or acts of God. Therefore, avoidable. :dunno:

Jesus causes crashes, didn't you read the bible? :D

But seriously though, I agree with heavyD (for once :rofl: ). Lifted trucks are dangerous on the roads. Not even if you hit them, but when I'm trying to make a left turn and I've got a jacked up F-350 in my face trying to make the opposite left, I've got to poke my nose out far just to see what's past him.

And no I don't drive an RHD :bigpimp:

[heavyD]

Originally posted by Eleanor
But seriously though, I agree with heavyD (for once :rofl: ).

Everybody does eventually. Some people are just quicker learners than others.:rofl: :rofl:

[Antonito]

Originally posted by Tik-Tok


As already stated, the person lowering his vehicle is putting himself at risk, while the person raising his vehicle (and bumper), is putting everyone else at risk.

I think this is a matter of natural selection at work :poosie:

[JRSC00LUDE]

Originally posted by BerserkerCatSplat


I was always under the impression that car collisions are due to human mistakes, not force of Nature or acts of God. Therefore, avoidable. :dunno:

Avoidable by one involved party? Of course. Completely avoidable by all parties involved? Not on your life. If they were they wouldn't happen.

It's like someone walking down the street and getting smoked in the back of the head by an errant baseball. Could they have avoided it? Sure, I guess they could have walked backwards so they could see it coming. Oh, wait. What if it came from the other direction? See what I'm trying to say here? You can't possibly be prepared for every contingency every time. That's why there are UNAVOIDABLE accidents that periodically occur. :dunno:

[silviafreek89]

Originally posted by b_t

If a truck's bumper's will come through your cabin, don't hit the truck or let it hit you. Problem solved.


Ummm, no....just NO!

[b_t]

Originally posted by JRSC00LUDE


Avoidable by one involved party? Of course. Completely avoidable by all parties involved? Not on your life. If they were they wouldn't happen.

It's like someone walking down the street and getting smoked in the back of the head by an errant baseball. Could they have avoided it? Sure, I guess they could have walked backwards so they could see it coming. Oh, wait. What if it came from the other direction? See what I'm trying to say here? You can't possibly be prepared for every contingency every time. That's why there are UNAVOIDABLE accidents that periodically occur. :dunno:

If you put yourself in a situation where a lot of unexpected things could happen, you have not done your job driving defensively.

[Ntense_SpecV]

Originally posted by b_t


If you put yourself in a situation where a lot of unexpected things could happen, you have not done your job driving defensively.

Or you are just driving along in mainstream Calgary traffic?!?! Geez. I never knew that if I was just driving alongside a vehicle in the middle lane with traffic on both sides, and that one person decides to lane change beside me with no-where else to go that I put myself in that risk - stupid me. :banghead: :banghead:

[JRSC00LUDE]

Originally posted by b_t

If you put yourself in a situation where a lot of unexpected things could happen, you have not done your job driving defensively.

Well said,

Make sure you never drive on deerfoot while traffic is heavy or has the potential to be.

Make sure you never travel in an area you aren't familiar with, road trips can be full of unexpected things that could happen.

Make sure you never drive a section of highway that is heavily wooded on each side unless it's completely fenced off.

Make sure you never drive through a mountain pass without first having the Rangers fly up and check for avalanche/falling rock danger or erecting a net overhead to protect you.

Make sure you do a full and thorough visual and/or hands on (lug nuts, ball joints etc.) mechanical inspection of your vehicle each and every time you get in it. Even if only going one block.

Make sure you don't ever drive at night without side mounted floodlights illuminating the ditch on either side in case something runs out and startles you.

Do you live up to the unrealistic expectation that you are espousing on here? It's just not possible to not "put yourself in a situation where a lot of unexpected things may happen". If you expected them, they wouldn't be "unexpected" now would they?

Is there a reason you aren't consulting? You'd think insurance and health care companies would be willing to pay you millions in return for the billions you would save them in costs.

[silviafreek89]

Reminds me of something a guy said back home

"the un-prepared must expect the un-expected"

Twist it as you like, I didn't say it!!!

[G-Suede]

You know, insurance companies base their whole financial model on actuarial science. It's just common sense that in the event of an accident, avoidable or otherwise, with a lifted truck having a non standard height bumper, the probability of injury or death to others is increased. You cannot argue this point - it's been proven time and again through sound scientific study.

I remember when semi trucks weren't required to have standard underride guards. Pure carnage when a rear end accident occurred. Well guess what? Same thing happens with a lifted truck with higher than normal bumpers.

http://www.fem.unicamp.br/~impact/Foto883.JPG

Additionally, think of what happens when a pedestrian is struck, even at a low rate of speed. A standard height bumper is designed to reduce the probability (risk) of injury or death. Now think about what will happen in the same case with a lifted truck with a non standard height bumper - mowed down and spit out the back end.

It's not that hard to figure out the reasoning behind issue - the safety and likelihood of survival of others in the event of an accident. Use your head.

[b_t]

Originally posted by JRSC00LUDE
Well said,

Make sure you never drive on deerfoot while traffic is heavy or has the potential to be.


Or just go a different way. If you really do take defensive driving seriously, you will drive less than normal. I solved this whole commute traffic thing at first by taking the LRT :thumbsup: then I got a job in Cochrane.



Make sure you never travel in an area you aren't familiar with, road trips can be full of unexpected things that could happen.


So you drive the speed limit, maintain good following distance, and use Google Maps so you know exactly where to go. You've got other people in the car - they can navigate, leaving you to focus on the road and the cars around you.



Make sure you never drive through a mountain pass without first having the Rangers fly up and check for avalanche/falling rock danger or erecting a net overhead to protect you.


I thought we were talking about vehicle accidents here? Acts of God are beyond the scope of what I am saying.



Make sure you do a full and thorough visual and/or hands on (lug nuts, ball joints etc.) mechanical inspection of your vehicle each and every time you get in it. Even if only going one block.


There is a lot to be said for maintaining your vehicle properly and owning one that is still safe. If you drive an old rust bucket made in the early 80s and the wheels shake, you deserve what comes to you.



Make sure you never drive a section of highway that is heavily wooded on each side unless it's completely fenced off.

Make sure you don't ever drive at night without side mounted floodlights illuminating the ditch on either side in case something runs out and startles you.


You are repeating yourself.. drive the speed limit or lower in both situations and keep a sharp eye and you won't have any problems. Believe it or not, you do not need to go 100 all the time. If the trees are actually only about 6' off the side of the road, or visibility is limited, slow the fuck down. And once again, I was referring specifically to multi-vehicle accidents.



Do you live up to the unrealistic expectation that you are espousing on here? It's just not possible to not "put yourself in a situation where a lot of unexpected things may happen". If you expected them, they wouldn't be "unexpected" now would they?

Is there a reason you aren't consulting? You'd think insurance and health care companies would be willing to pay you millions in return for the billions you would save them in costs.

:dunno:
I am saying, to the idiot who thinks he can drive between two cars and it is totally not his fault when he gets side swiped. If you close yourself off like that, tailgate someone, and then let someone tailgate you, too many things can happen. You have no escape route. If, though, you aren't an idiot, you will always be able to change lanes, have enough room to stop, not have anyone up your ass, etc.
You talk about it like everyone's an idiot who freezes up in traffic.

[silviafreek89]

You obviously did not understand his message correctly....This thread should have ended with G-Suede's post...Afer that, nuff said.

[dimi]

WOW

[JRSC00LUDE]

Originally posted by b_t


I thought we were talking about vehicle accidents here? Acts of God are beyond the scope of what I am saying.


I'm referring to the motorhome that swerves to avoid the pile of rock that came down and creams you head-on because it was that or go over the guardrail. And the other car that plows into you because it happened in a blind corner and the driver didn't stop traffic to let a spotter get out and check the other side of the turn.


Originally posted by b_t


And once again, I was referring specifically to multi-vehicle accidents.


So was I, the other driver that slams into you at the last second while trying to avoid the moose that appeared out of nowhere right in front of him.


I don't understand what it is, I just can't believe you refuse to acknowledge that unavoidable things can sometimes happen. I don't understand why you always have such a burning desire to never be wrong.

I'm sure that no matter the circumstance, if you are involved in a collision you will gladly inform your insurance that even though the guy ran a red light and hit you (or whatever the case may be) the accident is actually your fault since you just happened to be there at that split second in time. If not, you're a hypocrite.

Anyways, I'm done here...... :dunno:

[The Cosworth]

Originally posted by silviafreek89
You obviously did not understand his message correctly....This thread should have ended with G-Suede's post...Afer that, nuff said.

:werd:

[b_t]

There is someone who is still at fault dipshit, so even if I were to fail to get out of the way, he's paying for it. But, I still failed to get out of the fucking way. Getting in an accident is inconvenient.
As far as the motorhome goes, he swerves? Great, take your chances against the median. You could also accelerate past him before he comes into your lane.
Blind corner, they have advisory signs that tell you to go something like 40km/h, 50km/h in those situations for that exact reason - follow it! and if your vehicle has been rendered immobile, yes, that is when an accident FINALLY becomes unavoidable.
And no, I'm not a hypocrite if I claim insurance if I finally do get in an accident. I was hit, so yeah, I fucked up at some point by not looking both ways before crossing the intersection or whatever. The other guy was still more wrong than I was though. The law, also, provides for me in that case. But if I were to totally write it off and not accept any blame, I have failed to learn anything from what has happened and I deserve to be hit over and over until I finally figure out that I need to account for how fucking stupid the other people on the road are.

[dimi]

So you think that lifted trucks are perfectly safe on the road?

[b_t]

Originally posted by dimi
So you think that lifted trucks are perfectly safe on the road?

I think they are no more dangerous than any other vehicle on the road.

[tabouli]

Originally posted by JRSC00LUDE
You can buy stock vehicles with a larger tire/wheel diameter than they were allowing as legal under their policy. Fucking idiots.

Bingo.

This policy is the perfect example of something with good purpose, but TERRIBLE execution.
Every province needs some sort of "lift kit" regulation.

SGI played this worse than the French against Holland today :rofl:

[tirebob]

Again, there are a lot of unsafe modified vehicles on the road period, whether that means lowered, lifted, blown, turbo'd, cut, chopped, channelled, or whatever... Why pick only on trucks?

If done properly, a lifted truck is safe and usable in the hands on a responisble driver. If a lifted truck is going to fuck up a small car by rear ending him, it is not the fault of the truck, but instead it is the fault of the driver of the truck who is following to close, or the fault of a stupid driver who maybe swerves in front of a truck and hammers his brakes before the driver had time to adjust his following distance. Either way, used properly it did not make the truck the dangerous offender, but the driver...

When a vehicle is modified properly it is not usually an issue of the vehicle being unsafe, but instead the it is the driver who is unsafe. Stiffer regulations on beaters done dangerously is one thing, but penalizing responsible vehicle owners and drivers for the actions of douchebags is not the answer.

By the same logic maybe all vehicles should have speed regulators installed so they can't go any faster than 100 kph as we all know that speed is a huge factor in regards to traffic fatalities. If it saves lives, who cares that responsible owners suffer.

[teg_boya]

fuckin wow
i read three posts and that is all i can say...
beyond vs. b_t

[G-Suede]

Originally posted by b_t
Duuuurrrrr

:thumbsup:

[b_t]

Originally posted by G-Suede


:thumbsup:


Originally posted by teg_boya
fuckin wow
i read three posts and that is all i can say...
beyond vs. b_t

Thanks for not lumping me in with these fucking martians

[tabouli]

Originally posted by b_t
Thanks for not lumping me in with these fucking martians

You lump yourself in by spending 20/24 hours on the forums and replying once every minute :rolleyes:

Some of you losers need to get a job.

[b_t]

Originally posted by tabouli


You lump yourself in by spending 20/24 hours on the forums and replying once every minute :rolleyes:

Some of you losers need to get a job.
What do you think, my parents bought my truck? Fuck you.
I was posting from my job :thumbsup:
I like how I mention going out at working at site and you still think I don't have a job. Try harder next time.

[The Cosworth]

^^ B_T this is you buddy!



http://www.worth1000.com/entries/235000/235137ChJG_w.jpg

[G-Suede]

Originally posted by tirebob

If a lifted truck is going to fuck up a small car by rear ending him, it is not the fault of the truck, but instead it is the fault of the driver of the truck who is following to close, or the fault of a stupid driver who maybe swerves in front of a truck and hammers his brakes before the driver had time to adjust his following distance. Either way, used properly it did not make the truck the dangerous offender, but the driver...


Again, it's actuarial science that has provided evidence that regardless of fault the risk of injury or death to others is significant enough to take issue.

Perhaps another way of looking at it is the owners of lifted vehicles should be assessed special insurance rates for driving vehicles likely to cause grievous injury as a result of circumventing collision safety standards.

Why do you suppose young drivers, drivers with histories of moving violations, sports car owners, and so forth are assessed with higher rates? Not because they all drive like asshats, but because they are proven statistical liabilities.

Better yet, perhaps drivers operating lifted trucks on public infrastructure should be made to have underride guards on all sides of their vehicles, thereby maintaining road safety standards. Sure it would look fucking stupid, but at least in the event of an accident people would be less likely to be injured because some wanker wants to sit 8 feet above traffic.

http://www.autosafetyexpert.com/Assets/Images/defect_underride/BB_guard.jpg

Sweet, a 10 foot tall bumper car. Have fun with that one.

[JRSC00LUDE]

Originally posted by b_t


Thanks for not lumping me in with these fucking martians

No, there's another place for people with a futile burning desire to be right.

Welcome the the Flat Earth Society sir. Enjoy your stay and try not to fall off the edge while you're walking with your head in the clouds.

I'm done shovelling through your bullshit, would you like to borrow it to dig your head out of your ass?

Dipshit. :)

[b_t]

Originally posted by JRSC00LUDE


No, there's another place for people with a futile burning desire to be right.

Welcome the the Flat Earth Society sir. Enjoy your stay and try not to fall off the edge while you're walking with your head in the clouds.

I'm done shovelling through your bullshit, would you like to borrow it to dig your head out of your ass?

Dipshit. :)

:rolleyes:
You would blend right in with Americans, who completely refuse to accept any blame for the problems that afflict them. You can blame the other guy as much as you want, but it is going to get absolutely fucking nowhere.
Make as many cracks as you want here - I'm going to stick with my more responsible way of thinking, and you can keep pointing the finger and high fiving yourself in celebration of how smart you think you are.

[G-Suede]

Originally posted by b_t


:rolleyes:
You would blend right in with Americans, who completely refuse to accept any blame for the problems that afflict them. You can blame the other guy as much as you want, but it is going to get absolutely fucking nowhere.
Make as many cracks as you want here - I'm going to stick with my more responsible way of thinking, and you can keep pointing the finger and high fiving yourself in celebration of how smart you think you are.

Oh now that's just fucking rich. You are beyond salvage.

[JRSC00LUDE]

^

Weak, much like the name calling. Where did I say I don't accept blame, I said all accidents aren't avoidable due to things beyond your ability to control. If you're going to be a little bitch about detail at least get it right.

I don't think I'm much smarter than you, I just like how you're so wrapped up in your idyllic little cotton candy and lollipop perceptions of the world that you have trouble seeing the reality of actual situations or the implied point of simple sentences.

But honestly, I'm finding more reward in squeezing the puss out of my knee right now than arguing with you so, until we meet again good sir, I bid you adieu and take my leave of you.

[The Cosworth]

Originally posted by b_t


:rolleyes:
You would blend right in with Americans, who completely refuse to accept any blame for the problems that afflict them. You can blame the other guy as much as you want, but it is going to get absolutely fucking nowhere.
Make as many cracks as you want here - I'm going to stick with my more responsible way of thinking, and you can keep pointing the finger and high fiving yourself in celebration of how smart you think you are.


wait wait wait,

a responsible way of thinking and taking control of your actions is saying that lifted trucks are no more a threat than my dads stock camry??

hypocrite

[b_t]

Originally posted by JRSC00LUDE
^

Weak, much like the name calling. Where did I say I don't accept blame, I said all accidents aren't avoidable due to things beyond your ability to control. If you're going to be a little bitch about detail at least get it right.

I don't think I'm much smarter than you, I just like how you're so wrapped up in your idyllic little cotton candy and lollipop perceptions of the world that you have trouble seeing the reality of actual situations or the implied point of simple sentences.

But honestly, I'm finding more reward in squeezing the puss out of my knee right now than arguing with you so, until we meet again good sir, I bid you adieu and take my leave of you.

Great, fuck off.

And every accident is avoidable. Really, I'll just take the easy way out and say "Every accident is avoidable - just don't drive" bam problem fucking solved.

All this bullshit about making it so that trucks can't be lifted, so in case someone hits them, they might be okay is fucking stupid. You are in an accident. The odds are good you would have been hurt badly anyway, especially if this vehicle was going fast enough it comes into the cabin.

One thing nobody except Bob has mentioned is that a lifted truck is only really dangerous if you rear end it, since their front overhangs are so short, they can't reach the fucking cabin because the tires hit the car and stop it. In a side impact, no matter what hits you, its coming into the cabin because there is no crumple zone, so big fucking deal.

As far as lollipop situations, I'm sick of this whole fucking forum and how no one has ever admit fault in an accident. It is always the other guy. Great, everyone on this forum has their head up their ass and is either paying zero attention to what is going on around them, or saw the accident coming and just sat there and waited to get smoked. Sure, legally its the other guys fault and he gets to pay for it, but I will never believe anyone when they claim there was nothing they could do to avoid it.

Long story short: pay fucking attention. If people actually remembered (or listened) to what their instructors said about defensive driving back in the day, this wouldn't be such a fucking problem. How do you think people in Europe can drive in insane traffic, at higher speeds, with fewer accidents? They Pay Attention.

[b_t]

Originally posted by The Cosworth



wait wait wait,

a responsible way of thinking and taking control of your actions is saying that lifted trucks are no more a threat than my dads stock camry??

hypocrite

wait wait wait
You fucking moron. The whole point of my spiel here, with regards to taking responsibility for my actions, is that I drive defensively so I avoid accidents. That way, I neatly sidestep this whole issue of "crash safety." I don't care what other people are driving - I won't run into them, so fuck it!

And I said they are all equally dangerous, dipshit. We are talking about vehicles made of steel, weighing thousands of pounds, moving at high speed. They will all fuck you up. There is no "degree" of danger. Either shit is safe, in which case you don't have anything to worry about (and absolutely never applies to anything to do with vehicles), or shit is dangerous, in which case you either be careful or gamble with your life.

Applying that to the dump truck example, the guy stopped paying attention. He was left with gambles as a result. You can see a speeding dump truck a long way off - there is no "late braking" with those - and instead, he ignored it, leaving him with the option of sitting there like a Beyond member would and getting smoked, or chancing the intersection.

Go talk to a driving instructor and ask him if there is such a thing as an unavoidable accident, or a company health & safety inspector, or a policeman. They will all tell you the same thing. There is no such thing as an unavoidable accident.

[Eleanor]

Originally posted by b_t
Long story short: pay fucking attention. If people actually remembered (or listened) to what their instructors said about defensive driving back in the day, this wouldn't be such a fucking problem. How do you think people in Europe can drive in insane traffic, at higher speeds, with fewer accidents? They Pay Attention.

So how about we not let these retard drivers have lifted trucks :dunno:

[JRSC00LUDE]

Originally posted by b_t


Great, fuck off.


Guys like you would never talk that way without a keyboard so whatever, enjoy your little e-tantrum.


Originally posted by b_t


All this bullshit about making it so that trucks can't be lifted, so in case someone hits them, they might be okay is fucking stupid.



Funny, I haven't said trucks can't/shouldn't be lifted.


Originally posted by b_t


I'm sick of this whole fucking forum and how no one has ever admit fault in an accident.

I've seen lots of people admit fault on this forum.

Looks like this forum is getting sick of you and your whiny little holier than thou ways today.

I'll wait till we go for a beer to tell you to fuck off in person (although I'd probably like you since you're an opinionated dick like me), have a nice weekend.

[mrbojangles]

Originally posted by Ntense_SpecV


Or you are just driving along in mainstream Calgary traffic?!?! Geez. I never knew that if I was just driving alongside a vehicle in the middle lane with traffic on both sides, and that one person decides to lane change beside me with no-where else to go that I put myself in that risk - stupid me. :banghead: :banghead:

If you ride a motorcycle/scooter/mtn bike/bike, that is called "anticipating other motorists actions." It's part of the training in novice and advanced courses. You lane position yourself so you always have an out - keeping yourself from risk if possible.

Most drivers are "reactive" They just drive then suddenly react because someone has lane changed into them or some other collision path action.

The car guys hate the lifted trucks, the motorcyclists hate anything with 4 wheels....etc, etc.

[ToastiER]

Incredible.

This is like arguing with my mom about the bible, pure blind faith, you will never get anywhere with people like this without medication.

Look what you started CK.

[rice_balls]

In a perfect world with perfect drivers all accident's are avoidable, but this is not a perfect world nor does it inhabit perfect driver's. Not everything can be avoided because not everyone has predictable driving habits. Can an idiot who suddenly switches into your lane very quickly when they are beside you be avoided? I doubt it unless you have a split second reaction time. Could the situation be avoided, probably if you have the mentality of thinking that "Oh if i wasn't beside him at the time" or "If i left home 5 seconds later" But who the hell lives through life with that kind of stuff on their mind all the time? Might as well just dig a hole and go live in it and never come out. But hey you never know, a meteor may strike that hole too.

[The Cosworth]

Originally posted by b_t


wait wait wait
You fucking moron.

thanks for the appropriate and adult response, if you knew me you would understand I am not a moron. I find it interesting that you talk yourself into a circle and then insult the person who calls you on it. :rolleyes:

thanks for coming out though!






edit:


Originally posted by b_t
..........

And I said they are all equally dangerous, dipshit. We are talking about vehicles made of steel, weighing thousands of pounds, moving at high speed. They will all fuck you up. ........

this is why i was calling you a hypocrite. Your telling me that a scooter, smart car, f350, and lifted f350 will do identical damage to a pedestrian assuming identical conditions and speeds?


I am sorry but just based on BASIC physics of F=MA the mass difference of the vehicles already cause you to be wrong, then if you look at the relative contact patch between the F350 and the lifted F350 it is obvious that an equal amount of force coming from the front end of the truck will cause different (and albiet more deadly reactions) the higher the bumper is. Hence the new bumper standards in Europe that cause it to have the lowest contact patch that is possible.

I would rather have broken shins than a fractured sternum or skull

[G-Suede]

Originally posted by rice_balls
In a perfect world with perfect drivers all accident's are avoidable, but this is not a perfect world nor does it inhabit perfect driver's.

Unfortunately, you're not accounting for mechanical failure, or natural hazards that simply can't be predicted - so no all accidents are not avoidable.