to anyone in computer firms, regarding uofc

[eur0]

Ok now I have heard and seen quite a few grads from uofc who are still unemployed that came out of comp sci, which kind of worries me. Is it basically worth taking at uofc? Do firms recognize uofc as a good school to receive a BSc (Bachelor of Science) from? Are tech schools like SAIT a better place to be at?

Im not too sure and need some comments from people that have either been through sait or uofc...I just dont wanna waste all my time (and money) doing a 4 year program and not get a job at the end of it. Where I could have done something at SAIT instead.

Comments?

[roopi]

I think its because of the IT industry slow down at the moment. The hottest part of IT right now is security so I imagine a security course would land you a job the quickest right now but then again you would need experience.

[rage2]

I'd hate to be the company to hire a security expert who's expertise was picked up from taking a security course :).

[Shaolin]

a buddy of mine got top of the class at SAIT when he was doing his IT degree and IBM went to him..

but i know alot of cpsc guys unemployed.. guess you gota work on your connections i guess.

[bol]

I have not met a single CPSC who gained a single bit of respectable knowledge from their courses...

they don't have real world experience and are too reliant on people to teach them....

[Khyron]

And I would counter than a degree gives you a much broader range of "how things work" rather than a very specific technical course on say, VB.

However, a company that needed a VB person would be more inclined to hire the 2nd.

I got mine from U of C, but I had to pay my dues with tech support for an ISP for a year before moving into network administration. My buddy who was in my class does contract work for 50+ bucks an hour. I think the key tho is you HAVE to be proactive and learn the cutting edge stuff yourself, and it REALLY helps if you do the Co-op program.

Khyron

[Shaolin]

I think people who studied CPSC or intend to study CPSC should be constantly updating their knowledge.. There's really no excuse to get experience either, especially for entry level positions, the resources are out there, it's just up to the person to go and take advantage of what's being offered. I also think specialization is probably the best thing you can do in order to get any type of work in the CPSC field, whether it's Inet securities, Intranet securities, webdesigner, consultant, whatever.

How hard is it to take apart your computer and put it back together again? Or run your own lan, or mess around with linux, solaris, whatever.. without specialization in this field i think it's very hard to get a job.

[eur0]

that is true, I just think that a coop and then an internship is so important to take

[googe]

how to get good jobs:

1. make friends
2. put buzzwords on your resume
3. put things to make buzzwords sound believable. this is what degrees are good for.

really, its about your networking, assuming you arent totally useless. the piece of paper from your post secondary school is to help you get an interview. it probably wont ever be what gets you the job. think of how smart you are, then think of someone you have talked to that knows less about your field of expertise than you, are less fit for the job than you, and are making double what you make. its cause they knew someone.

[BigMass]

googe is correct.

[kenny]

The simple fact of the matter is, doing a CPSC course at *ANY* institution is not enough to land you a job. Employers are not looking for people who just completed a 2 or 4 year course teaching computer programming. They will look at your extra-curricular activities. Do you program in your spare time? Do you program for the love of programming? or do you program to make money? They will want to hire someone that keeps up to current technologies, etc and not just someone that kept up to a textbook that is already outdated.

If you really have a strong interest in CPSC, then you have nothing to worry about :) If you're doing it just because you thought it may be a good paying career.. then you might want to rethink it.

[atomic]

it's almost impossible to rate a individuals capabilities and performance by an institution ...

some people don't even have diplomas or degrees and have great jobs making real good money . others have lots of degrees and can't get a job .

companies now days, are looking for people with a personal interest beyond their job with technology .

univeristies teach out dated theories and applications/hardware by the time the student has graduated . so the student must be able to continue learning .

if you are passionate about your work and can learn . then heck, we'll hire u now . we can never find people ..

know of someone who wants to work for us?

[sputnik]

Getting and education is less than half required in getting a decent job. Having a good attitude is essential... also experience outside of the school curriculum is benficial... i wouldnt hire someone in which the only coding or networking they did was for a school assignment... also in calgary its all about who you know. Talk to people you know that are working in the IT workforce and see what they say.

Also, if you are in CompSci because you heard that it pays well... but you have no passion for it... quit now while you are ahead... employers can tell the difference between a person who is smart and book-smart.

As for the industry... its pretty slow here in calgary right now... also the people you might be talking about are the people looking for work with no other experience than school.

As for network security. Don't expect to work in that field until you have some serious experience. No course will get you a security job where you will be taken seriously.

[eur0]

theres nothing else that uofc offers that really interests me though, I've been around computers since I was a kid and never get tired of it. It was either business or computers, so I picked the one that appealed to me more. The reason I like both is because I thought of the one job I would love to do and thats to run my own computer company some day. Having to be an entreprenuer I saw taking business as a bonus, if that makes sense heh.

Unfortunately funds wont allow a BComm and BSc so yea...

I just wanted to make sure that I wasnt wasting two more years at uofc versus sait. Also know of any decent low level jobs that will allow me to get my foot in the door? I cant really think of anything that applies to the field that doesnt require some kind of post secondary education.

The best thing I have come up with that requires little knowledge is to start a webhosting company and/or a graphics design company.

[RiCE-DaDDy]

the fact of having a degree from a uni (respectable of course) counts for a lot.

[MerfBall]

It depends on the companies. But with the competition as fierce as it is these days anything you can add to ur resume helps. An applied degree from SAIt and an Bachelor's degree from Univeristy means very little when it comes to getting the job. But I guarantee you that most employers (esp. in larger corporations) will look at a U of C grad over a SAIT grad if all other things are equal.

The part most people miss is not only education and contacts, but also your resume and cover letter needs to be top notch and eye catching (esp. when you lack experience). That gets your foot in the door. The interview is what gets the rest of your body in.

I know for a fact alot of CPSC grads are looking for 45K+ / year jobs and while that is a reasonable salary to be aiming for, in this day and age you are lucky to even be employed in an IT job let alone making 45K (right out of school). I know alot of CPSC grads and 90% are employed. probably about 60% are making >40k. But the lowest salary is 36k which is still decent.

Oh and anyone who really thinks that the things you learn from CPSC degree is completely useless is on crack. Almost everything I learned at CPSC helps alot on the job even that hell bidulok course or the boring, easy walpole classes. Even the algorithimic analysis helps alot when you code and making the code extremely efficient.

[kaput]

.

[eur0]

Originally posted by kaput


Don't worry about money. I find I can make enough over a summer to pay for a year's tuition twice. I was in the same spot as you, trying to pick just one of the things that interested me. It was too hard, so now I'm going to do all three. It'll take 7 years of full time classes, but I'll enjoy it since I'm interested in all of it. I'll finish with undergrad degrees in economics and engineering, as well as an MBA.

props to you for doing that haha, 3 majors is crazy...i feel pretty confident with the degree im doing right now (cpsc). I see BComm as a bonus, and something I would take after I entered the working field and made some decent money.

[kaput]

.

[redec]

Originally posted by RiCE-DaDDy
the fact of having a degree from a uni (respectable of course) counts for a lot.

no it doesn't.....it may get you an interview, but other than that, it counts for absolutly dick.


Originally posted by kenny
The simple fact of the matter is, doing a CPSC course at *ANY* institution is not enough to land you a job. Employers are not looking for people who just completed a 2 or 4 year course teaching computer programming. They will look at your extra-curricular activities. Do you program in your spare time? Do you program for the love of programming? or do you program to make money? They will want to hire someone that keeps up to current technologies, etc and not just someone that kept up to a textbook that is already outdated.

If you really have a strong interest in CPSC, then you have nothing to worry about :) If you're doing it just because you thought it may be a good paying career.. then you might want to rethink it.

couldn't have said it better myself.


speaking as an employer, education really means nothing....the only difference education makes in the hiring process is weeding out all the idiots.....for example, we have a stack of 200 resumes, first, we go through them all and throw out any devry (or pretty much any other private technical school) resumes. Then we look for people who have experience in the area we're hiring for....add them to the 'interview pile', then we look for any wiz kids. Obviously your only hope is to land in this wiz kid pile. What we're looking for is a passion for the work, education is not really a factor at this point. There is an absolute fuckload of people out there right now who are totally useless, and just got into the industry because they heard it pays good, and they graduated from the same school as everyone else.