A note to all the n00bs installing stereos

[97'Scort]

I realize that everybody has to start somewhere, but I want you to think long and hard before you go and install that stereo. If it's your first time doing it (amp, sub, head unit, removing trim panels), I'm willing to bet very good money that you will do something wrong or break something. Really, all you want is your tunes, right?

So you go and do your install, and something goes wrong. You plead to the interwebz to help you out, but there's only so much we can do, especially when you don't know your ass from a hole in the ground. Finally, you haul it down to a shop to diagnose the problem. They ding you three hours labour to rip your shitty ass wiring job apart (Note: butt splices are NOT the same as soldering) and build a new harness because you figure attaching the ground wire to the power wire was some brilliant idea (laugh, but I've seen it).

Now, if you'd taken it to somebody who knew what they were doing IN THE FIRST PLACE, you would have got dinged for the install (about ONE hour labour) and you'd have a warranty to go along with it. Do you know most shops warranty their installs to the original purchaser for the life of the car?

Now I honestly don't mind charging you a couple hundred bucks to fix your bad install, but I'm much happier (and you will be too) when I know the job's done right in the first place.

/rant

[soupey]

if someone wants to learn something on their own, in their own car, on their own time, with their own deck, and possibly do damage along the way, and this is all to your advantage when you charge them to fix it....what's your beef?

someone clearly needs a hug.

[tsi_neal]

a proper crimped butt splice is better than solder in an automotive application

[nobb]

I dont see anything wrong with learning to do your own installs. As long as you have a bit of common sense, you should be fine. It's not like professional installers never screw up either. Heck, I rather trust myself on my own car rather than letting some high school kid mess around. You never know how good of a wiring job and what shortcuts they did back there.

[GTS Jeff]

Originally posted by 97'Scort
I realize that everybody has to start somewhere, but I want you to think long and hard before you go and install that stereo. If it's your first time doing it (amp, sub, head unit, removing trim panels), I'm willing to bet very good money that you will do something wrong or break something. Really, all you want is your tunes, right?

So you go and do your install, and something goes wrong. You plead to the interwebz to help you out, but there's only so much we can do, especially when you don't know your ass from a hole in the ground. Finally, you haul it down to a shop to diagnose the problem. They ding you three hours labour to rip your shitty ass wiring job apart (Note: butt splices are NOT the same as soldering) and build a new harness because you figure attaching the ground wire to the power wire was some brilliant idea (laugh, but I've seen it).

Now, if you'd taken it to somebody who knew what they were doing IN THE FIRST PLACE, you would have got dinged for the install (about ONE hour labour) and you'd have a warranty to go along with it. Do you know most shops warranty their installs to the original purchaser for the life of the car?

Now I honestly don't mind charging you a couple hundred bucks to fix your bad install, but I'm much happier (and you will be too) when I know the job's done right in the first place.

/rant How did you get started with installs? You're adopting a pretty anti-DIY attitude here.

[EK 2.0]

Originally posted by soupey

if someone wants to learn something on their own, in their own car, on their own time, with their own deck, and possibly do damage along the way, and this is all to your advantage when you charge them to fix it....what's your beef?

someone clearly needs a hug.



Yeah I am happy Soupey learned all on his own...that way he helped me with mine hahaha...

[88jbody]

Originally posted by tsi_neal
a proper crimped butt splice is better than solder in an automotive application
A butt connector will never be as good as a properly soldered and heat shrunk conection especially in automotive use.

[97'Scort]

What I'm getting at is I'm sick of having people complain about screwing it up. Honest, if you want to go and do it, then be my guest: like I said, everybody starts somewhere, right?

It's when I get the people who DIY'd it and then have the balls to complain to ME when THEY've screwed stuff up and I have to fix it. They seem to think I should do it for free.

I'm saying don't be upset or whiny when it takes me a couple hours to re-wire your car because you screwed up. Accept it and move on.

[Team_Mclaren]

if you are an installer, why would you care if they whine or not? in the end, they still have to pay and you are making money...

As if installers dont screw up...

[theken]

I learned myself. Connecting 10-13 wires is not that hard. Neither is running wires.

[97'Scort]

Originally posted by Team_Mclaren
if you are an installer, why would you care if they whine or not? in the end, they still have to pay and you are making money...

As if installers dont screw up...

Of course they screw up, but then at least you have a warranty. I dunno, I guess it just makes the job less enjoyable when you've got people complaining.

[chkolny541]

A+ thread
you still get paid:werd:

[pinoyhero]

1 hour labour? At what $40? is that all it costs to get goods installed these days?

[Numi]

i learned how to install my system all on my own...
if your not a total idiot its easier than changing brakes.

[97'Scort]

Originally posted by pinoyhero
1 hour labour? At what $40? is that all it costs to get goods installed these days? Shop labour is closer to $65/hour for most audio shops that I know of. But yeah, we can do most head units in about that time.

And yea, I'm aware of the irony of my complaining about this. :P It's out of my system now.

[tsi_neal]

Originally posted by 88jbody

A butt connector will never be as good as a properly soldered and heat shrunk conection especially in automotive use.


negative, a proper crimp will never crack due to vibration, properly dressed and heatshrunk it will never corrode either. A soldered join may crack over time. Im also guessing about 95% of people that solder wires arent doing a great job of it.

IMO a GOOD crimped joint is just as good as a GOOD soldered joint but cant crack (even if its unlikely). The real advantage is your average guy will have a much easier time making a GOOD crimped connection than an OK, let alone good, soldered one.

[tabouli]

Originally posted by 97'Scort
I am an asshole.

Fixed.

*Edit
Post up what shop you work at.

[Grogador]

The one time I let someone else put in my stereo, the high school twat doing it scratched up my old deck's faceplate, cut one of the old wires way too short and bent the shit out of the cage, which I told them I wanted back. A few months later, one of his awesome butt crimps came apart. I called the place, turns out they cant honor their "lifetime warranty" because they got rid of their installation bay.

I'm not color blind and I can solder in my sleep (wearing proper PJs of course, don't solder in shorts!). I'll stick to wiring my own shit, thanks.

Protip: slip on heatshrink, flux, tin through, flux, join thoroughly (not cold), shrink. It's not going anywhere. Cracking? LuLz.

[97'Scort]

Originally posted by Grogador
Protip: slip on heatshrink, flux, tin through, flux, join thoroughly (not cold), shrink. It's not going anywhere. Cracking? LuLz. Exactly. You're only going to crack a solder joint if you cold solder it.

[97'Scort]

Originally posted by tabouli


Fixed.

*Edit
Post up what shop you work at.
Really? How many people over the 4 car forums I post on have I helped over the last five years? Got them discounts at the shop, showed kids who screwed up how to fix it properly, all sorts of stuff. Hell, I've even done some head units for a case of beer for some poor students but I still warranty all my work. And 99% of them were grateful and happy and just made the job fun.

Now more often than not people are demanding things like I owe them something. It seems that most of these people are DIYers and yes, I understand you're frustrated, but if you're just willing to learn a little I'll gladly walk you through it. Don't take it out on me though.

What promped me to write this is some high school kid got a hold of me to fix his system, and did nothing but bitch at me the whole time I was trying to show him things, and then tried to stiff me on the bill. He's not the first by a long shot, but just the most recent in the trend.

[Graham_A_M]

Soupey, you're local in Calgary right? can you install a CD deck for me? I can do everything install related but install CD decks... its just something I loathe doing.

Only one set of pre-outs going to sub amp, and wiring to speakers.... how much? Its for a '99 Saturn. I already have the aftermarket install kit.

[EK 2.0]

Originally posted by Graham_A_M

Soupey, you're local in Calgary right? can you install a CD deck for me? I can do everything install related but install CD decks... its just something I loathe doing.

Only one set of pre-outs going to sub amp, and wiring to speakers.... how much? Its for a '99 Saturn. I already have the aftermarket install kit.


He is actually currently in the U.S. for school...but comes back during breaks...

[Grogador]

Originally posted by 97'Scort
What promped me to write this is some high school kid got a hold of me to fix his system, and did nothing but bitch at me the whole time I was trying to show him things, and then tried to stiff me on the bill. He's not the first by a long shot, but just the most recent in the trend.

Hehe, don't waste your time with highschool kids ;)

[97'Scort]

Originally posted by Grogador


Hehe, don't waste your time with highschool kids ;) Yeah, usually I don't mind because they seem to have cash (probably selling pot out here).

[Ihatetowait]

Scort, as an installer I agree 100 percent. I charge a stupidity fee, sort of. If you can do it yourself and make it proper then kudos! I've seen some great DIY installs before.

The part that pisses me right off is when they wonder why I'm charging them more then a deck install because they chopped off the harness out of reach and broke off 2/3rds of the clips on their dash. I won't leave an install with a hanging dash, I charge them to fix it.

Constantly having people belittle your profession saying its so easy to do and then realizing they can't do it and expected you to save the day is the biggest PITA ever.

Almost as big of a joke as one guy who tried to do a starter in his 04 Jetta diesel standard, with an old viper starter.

Blargh, rant, but trust me scort I know your pain.




.... Now if I could get people to stop parking behind the bay door...

[Graham_A_M]

Yeah you guys are a breed within yourselves. I dont know how you guys can deal with these things day in and day out.
Some of the shit is very technical and difficult to do, to deal with these snot nosed high school kids (the basic target market for car audio) over and above that is too much.
:eek:

Too bad you weren't closer '97 Scort, I wouldn't mind a full 4ch amp and CD deck install.
;)

[97'Scort]

In a heartbeat, man. I'll be in Etown over christmas, dunno if that works for you. If you can do Edmonton, my buddy Garrett can take care of you.

[tabouli]

Originally posted by 97'Scort
Really? How many people over the 4 car forums I post on have I helped over the last five years?

That's fair I suppose.

I'm just not sure why you do things like that to get stomped on and become angry. Trust me, I do the same thing. I have a garage that's incredibly equipped & I learned really fast how to deal with an un-appreciative asshole. Don't lend yourself out like that!

haha I've done oil changes for "friends" only to have them come at me with blown struts or leaking coolant saying I fucked their shit up :rolleyes: That was way back in High School. I bet those losers are still pawning off their misery!

[97'Scort]

All I'm saying is if what you really want is your tunes and you want it right the first time for a fair price, bring it to your friendly neighbourhood installer. You will get the comfort of the warranty plus walk out soon after with your ride sounding great and none of the stress. Plus, if you're nice, we'll show you how.

It's that simple!