Hybrid Car ??

[jdawson1960]

I am getting ready to buy another car now. When gas prices were $4 plus, I was really thinking about buying a hybrid. Now with gas prices back down to $2 or less, should I.

I understand the enviorment situation, however with the cost of a hybrid being $5k plus more, I will never make the money back over the life of the 4-5 years I am going to keep the car.

So any feedback of your experience owning a hybrid, or why I should or shoulnt would be appreciated.

[Xtrema]

You just answered you own question.

[badatusrnames]

And we're only paying about a buck for gas up here.... sucker!!

[rp_guy]

currently hybrids are not for 'gas saving' but for eco-friendliness (you can get a fit that does 5.5L/100km on the highway and very good in the city too).. when the volt comes out, that will change of course.. so obviously it's not good to buy a hybrid just yet.

[Ferio_vti]

Originally posted by badatusrnames
And we're only paying about a buck for gas up here.... sucker!!


Pretty sure $2/gallon is still cheaper than $1/L.

[acura_el]

Would you not get more in terms of resale value compared to a gasoline vehicle when you decide to sell 4-5 years down the road? :dunno:

I have no idea what resale values are on hybrids, but I'm fairly certain that gas prices will be back to $4, by summer next year.

[7thgenvic]

Originally posted by badatusrnames
And we're only paying about a buck for gas up here.... sucker!!

fail!!!!!

[Tik-Tok]

Originally posted by 7thgenvic


fail!!!!!


Originally posted by Ferio_vti



Pretty sure $2/gallon is still cheaper than $1/L.


:facepalm:

Error: Sarcasm detector inop.

[bituerbo]

Originally posted by acura_el
Would you not get more in terms of resale value compared to a gasoline vehicle when you decide to sell 4-5 years down the road? :dunno:

I have no idea what resale values are on hybrids, but I'm fairly certain that gas prices will be back to $4, by summer next year.

No, it really wouldn't. As soon as a hybrid is out of mfr's warranty you're screwed with MASSIVE repair bills.
Get a VW TDI or a Honda Fit if you want to save money on gas while maintaining good resale.

[Xtrema]

Originally posted by bituerbo
Get a VW TDI

Diesel prices blows in NA.

1.18 for Diesel
88.4 for gas.

It doesn't save you ANY money right now.

[shin0bi]

Hybrids are a joke in my opinion. They are even more wasteful than regular cars when you factor in all the environmental implications of manufacturing of the batteries. (Mining the ore and other raw materials used for a battery in northern canada, ship it to China on a smoky, leaky failboat to be put together, then shipped to japan to be put into your prius or whatever, then shipped back to north america on another big, polluting boat.)

If you want a car that's good on gas, get a mid nineties Honda, Toyota, or Saturn. Those things weigh less than 2500 lbs, with small displacement 4 cyl engines that all get at least 30 mpg.

With a hybrid, you're stuck with a "Douchebag" label without the privilege of driving a BMW. Whats the point?!

[hypyestoad]

Now that the Canadian and US elections are over, of course gas prices are going to go back up. Are you people so banned that you can't see that gas prices are a just a government scare tactic?

[treg50]

Big power = big pollution almost always. And almost always the safest/ most fuel-efficient bet is a small displacement engine built by a legendary manufacturer (Honda or Toyota) and driven conservatively (no boy racers or high revvers).

Also, do you really think gas prices will be on a downward tendency as oil supplies run out? It may be down for now, but I doubt it will stay this way for very long.


Originally posted by shin0bi
With a hybrid, you're stuck with a "Douchebag" label without the privilege of driving a BMW. Whats the point?!
I disagree. No manufacturer has been able to come close yet.

[shin0bi]

Originally posted by treg50
I disagree. No manufacturer has been able to come close yet. [/B]

Nah, what I meant was that the general populace is going to look at you as just another one of those "pretentious, hybrid-driving, holier than thou's"... hehe just like in that southpark episode.

I figure to each his own, but there's probably nothing that would ever get me into a hybrid.

[hypyestoad]

Originally posted by shin0bi


Nah, what I meant was that the general populace is going to look at you as just another one of those "pretentious, hybrid-driving, holier than thou's"... hehe just like in that southpark episode.

I figure to each his own, but there's probably nothing that would ever get me into a hybrid.

You can't be cereal...

[clem24]

I agree with what was mentioned above.. Hybrids are not for cost savings, but only for "eco-friendliness", which as pointed out, is actually only marketing. I think they figured that the lifetime CO2 emissions from when a hybrid is born to driving it over it's useful life is actually more harmful to the environment than a hummer. Plus in 5 years or so, you'll need to replace the battery. Think about that for a second.

The other issue and why it's not for cost savings is that the premium paid for a hybrid is not worth the cost savings in gas. It takes something like 4-5+ years before a hybrid will even being to pay off. By then you'll probably want something newer.

The third issue was that they actually didn't even find significant savings in some hybrids (i.e. difference in fuel economy was only like 30mpg vs. 35mpg). There was a comparo on Forbes I think where they did the calculation and pretty much in all cases they recommended to just go with the regular non-hybrid model.

Basically, you're better off with something like a Honda Fit or Toyota Yaris than a say, a Prius or even an S.M.R.T if cost savings is your goal.

The other issue that was pointed out was that once you hit about 20mpg, then your savings is significantly reduced as MPG goes up. Hard to put into words, but I'll give you an example. Your savings for going from an SUV with 17MPG to a car with 30MPG is very significant, whereas going from a car with 30MPG to something that is 43MPG is decreased (essentially because your % savings decreases).

My 2 cents.

[alloroc]

Originally posted by clem24
I agree with what was mentioned above.. Hybrids are not for cost savings, but only for "eco-friendliness", which as pointed out, is actually only marketing. I think they figured that the lifetime CO2 emissions from when a hybrid is born to driving it over it's useful life is actually more harmful to the environment than a hummer.

Wrong

http://www.toyota.com/html/dyncon/2007/september/hummervprius.html
"For example, the Prius is assumed in this report to be driven only about 9200 miles a year, and to have a service life of less than 12 years and 109,000 miles. CNW assumes the average Hummer H3 will travel 207,000 miles over a lifetime of 15-plus years. The H1, incidentally, is assumed to have a lifetime of nearly 35 years, with 379,000 total miles."

A 379,000 mile daily driven hummer? ya right.


Originally posted by clem24
Plus in 5 years or so, you'll need to replace the battery. Think about that for a second.


Wrong.
http://www.hybridexperience.ca/Reliability.htm

From 2004 Toyota press release
"The Prius battery (and the battery-power management system) has been designed to maximize battery life. In part this is done by keeping the battery at an optimum charge level - never fully draining it and never fully recharging it. As a result, the Prius battery leads a pretty easy life. We have lab data showing the equivalent of 180,000 miles with no deterioration and expect it to last the life of the vehicle. We also expect battery technology to continue to improve: the second-generation model battery is 15% smaller, 25% lighter, and has 35% more specific power than the first. This is true of price as well. Between the 2003 and 2004 models, service battery costs came down 36% and we expect them to continue to drop so that by the time replacements may be needed it won't be a much of an issue. Since the car went on sale in 2000, Toyota has not replaced a single battery for wear and tear."



Originally posted by clem24
The third issue was that they actually didn't even find significant savings in some hybrids (i.e. difference in fuel economy was only like 30mpg vs. 35mpg). There was a comparo on Forbes I think where they did the calculation and pretty much in all cases they recommended to just go with the regular non-hybrid model.


Maintenance Costs
The City of Toronto Fleet Services Division owns four Hybrids. Their fleet consists of two 2001 Toyota Prius, one 2001 Honda Insight, and one 2002 Honda Civic Hybrid. In their "Greening Our Fleet" Technology Testing Report the Fleet Services Division analyzed the preventative and non-scheduled maintenance costs for the Honda Insight and two Toyota Prius (there was not enough information available on the Honda Civic) compared to their four 2000 Chevrolet Cavaliers. The Hybrids were found to have higher preventative maintenance costs but lower non-scheduled maintenance costs for their Cavaliers.

[clem24]

Originally posted by alloroc


Wrong

http://www.toyota.com/html/dyncon/2007/september/hummervprius.html
"For example, the Prius is assumed in this report to be driven only about 9200 miles a year, and to have a service life of less than 12 years and 109,000 miles. CNW assumes the average Hummer H3 will travel 207,000 miles over a lifetime of 15-plus years. The H1, incidentally, is assumed to have a lifetime of nearly 35 years, with 379,000 total miles."

A 379,000 mile daily driven hummer? ya right.


HAHA completely unbiased source.


Originally posted by alloroc

Wrong.
http://www.hybridexperience.ca/Reliability.htm

From 2004 Toyota press release
"The Prius battery (and the battery-power management system) has been designed to maximize battery life. In part this is done by keeping the battery at an optimum charge level - never fully draining it and never fully recharging it. As a result, the Prius battery leads a pretty easy life. We have lab data showing the equivalent of 180,000 miles with no deterioration and expect it to last the life of the vehicle. We also expect battery technology to continue to improve: the second-generation model battery is 15% smaller, 25% lighter, and has 35% more specific power than the first. This is true of price as well. Between the 2003 and 2004 models, service battery costs came down 36% and we expect them to continue to drop so that by the time replacements may be needed it won't be a much of an issue. Since the car went on sale in 2000, Toyota has not replaced a single battery for wear and tear."

Yet another unbiased source.. Obviously they are admitting their batteries aren't optimal.


Originally posted by alloroc


Maintenance Costs
The City of Toronto Fleet Services Division owns four Hybrids. Their fleet consists of two 2001 Toyota Prius, one 2001 Honda Insight, and one 2002 Honda Civic Hybrid. In their "Greening Our Fleet" Technology Testing Report the Fleet Services Division analyzed the preventative and non-scheduled maintenance costs for the Honda Insight and two Toyota Prius (there was not enough information available on the Honda Civic) compared to their four 2000 Chevrolet Cavaliers. The Hybrids were found to have higher preventative maintenance costs but lower non-scheduled maintenance costs for their Cavaliers.

THIS is the BEST one. They're comparing the maintenance of a Toyota and a Honda to a Cavalier! :rofl: :facepalm:

[QuasarCav]

Originally posted by clem24





THIS is the BEST one. They're comparing the maintenance of a Toyota and a Honda to a Cavalier! :rofl: :facepalm:


What else would they compare it to?

[chkolny541]

Originally posted by alloroc


y Since the car went on sale in 2000, Toyota has not replaced a single battery for wear and tear."




you gotta admit biased or not, this is kinda impressive

[Red90]

Originally posted by Xtrema


Diesel prices blows in NA.

1.18 for Diesel
88.4 for gas.

It doesn't save you ANY money right now.

That is only due to a refinery being down ATM in Alberta. Normally they are pretty equal.

And it is really 1.03 for diesel and 0.809 for RUG ATM in Calgary.