whos's at fault? car accident

[syrous]

hey all.. just want to ask a question bout car accident...

this morning i was driving going to train station going about 30-50km/h really slow due to icy/snowy road, and for some reason i started spinning out... i clear all the guard rail and all and my car came to stop on the right shoulder almost hitting the guard rail. then a truck hit me on the side of my car, and the other car manage to stop. just want to know whos at fault?

thanks and pls dont flame.. :D

[Mr_ET]

he hit you so he would be at fault but it might be 50/50 since you had spun out and were driving too fast for the conditions in the first place.

Did you have winters on?

[syrous]

thats 30-50 on 80 zone... so i was going really slow ... and no winter tires on...:(

[tom_9109]

I think a lot more has to be take into account. How many lanes etc. Can you draw a diagram. I think in any case you should expect to be 100% at fault but who knows. You have to ask yourself what the proximate cause of the collision was and its fair to say that its you lising control of your car.

[Kloubek]

It's kinda all speculation OP.

In my opinion, I would imagine that the other driver would be 100% at fault, since he did not leave enough room to stop on the event something happened like this.

:dunno:

[tom_9109]

Originally posted by Kloubek
It's kinda all speculation OP.

In my opinion, I would imagine that the other driver would be 100% at fault, since he did not leave enough room to stop on the event something happened like this.

:dunno:

I don't really think you can say that, we don't know if the other vehicle was behind the op or if the op was in a different lane and spun across. We need info. And this isn't a rear ending which is a little clearer. We need a diagram. :)

[Masked Bandit]

I'm going to guess that in the end, you will be found at-fault for this as you are the one who lost control.

[TomcoPDR]

Originally posted by Kloubek
It's kinda all speculation OP.

In my opinion, I would imagine that the other driver would be 100% at fault, since he did not leave enough room to stop on the event something happened like this.

:dunno:

Or it might be a situation where the road section is problematic (icy, pluffy snow over ice) at the time being... so everyone was just sliding.

[scat19]

Originally posted by tom_9109


I don't really think you can say that, we don't know if the other vehicle was behind the op or if the op was in a different lane and spun across. We need info. And this isn't a rear ending which is a little clearer. We need a diagram. :)

MS Paint FTW

[Kennyredline]

Hey OP...are you Asian?

[tom_9109]

Originally posted by Kennyredline
Hey OP...are you Asian?

If thats the case you're definitely at fault.:poosie:

[Mr_ET]

Originally posted by syrous
thats 30-50 on 80 zone... so i was going really slow ... and no winter tires on...:(

Next time remember that winters are cheaper than paint and body work.

[ralliart_girl]

Depends, so the dude hit you after you stop spinning right? How long after did he hit you. Where did he hit you? And were you in possession your lane? or was your car kinda sticking out?

[Generic]

if your car wasn't fully in a marked lane, you're at fault

[SRT10Killer]

I'd assume that since he was behind you he had control of what he is doing, but it depends, if you spun into his lane that would be a different story

[Kennyredline]

Originally posted by tom_9109


If thats the case you're definitely at fault.:poosie:
Hey now, I never said that....lol:poosie:

[prae]

like has already been covered it depends on a number of factors but from experience, what it will come down to is the story you give and the story the other party gives... If there were any witnesses it would be prudent to get them involved.

[thinmyster]

Originally posted by syrous
thats 30-50 on 80 zone... so i was going really slow ... and no winter tires on...:(

:facepalm:

please tell me they were at least all seasons.

[asasa]

I was in a similar situation before. Someone spun around on Glenmore and hit the guard rail in front of me. I hit the brakes and stopped a few feet short of the truck. Then I was rear ended by another truck whick pushed me into the first truck that was facing the wrong way on Glenmore. The guy who rearended me paid for damages to the back of my car and the guy who was facing the wrong way paid for the front. It took the different insurance companies 4 months to sort it out though so it must be a grey area as to fault in such situations.

[chkolny541]

Originally posted by Masked Bandit
I'm going to guess that in the end, you will be found at-fault for this as you are the one who lost control.

this is what i was thinking also, but a diagram would deff make tings clearer to understand

[syrous]

i dont know how close that guy following me but.. heres a little diagram hope it help

http://photos-c.ak.fbcdn.net/photos-ak-snc1/v2391/30/103/507774097/n507774097_1329042_8171.jpg

[psycoticclown]

Umm wtf, looks like the truck swerved and hit you. Any witnesses?

[syrous]

yeah that van but that person didnt stay... and i dont know what happen behind me.. all i saw is four light when my car face the other way... then the truck hit me... on the side

[Mr_ET]

the truck left after hitting you?

Pretty sure you're at fault since it looked like he changed lanes to avoid you and you swerved back so he had nowhere left to go.

Any witnesses, did you take any of their info down or the guy the hit you? Did he say it was his fault, was there a police report filed that specifies it was his fault?

[chkolny541]

Originally posted by psycoticclown
Umm wtf, looks like the truck swerved and hit you. Any witnesses?

i dont think the truck swerved in to hit him, its just the lanes he drew in the pic are super huge and it kinda makes it look like that

[Kennyredline]

I'd like to know exactly how you "lost control...."

[D_flore]

2nd

[Shogged]

i bet you'll be at fault

i was a passenger in a crash like this last year, and my buddy got the blame for the crash, and a ticket for unsafe speed in current conditions.

we were maybe rocking 20kms and only lost control because he locked the brakes in panic.

[Generic]

Originally posted by Shogged
i bet you'll be at fault

i was a passenger in a crash like this last year, and my buddy got the blame for the crash, and a ticket for unsafe speed in current conditions.

we were maybe rocking 20kms and only lost control because he locked the brakes in panic.

yup. the only thing to do is hire a lawyer/paralegal and fight it.

[tom_9109]

Just cooperate with the adjusters and they will investigate fully. Your insurance company will work with the other side in determining the fault by looking at the statements and circumstances. I'd be prepared to be 100% at fault as you lost control ended up backwards and got hit.

[japan_us]

Looks like truck driver recently watched Days Of Thunder and thought that he should "drive through" ... lol

Seriously though, from the diagram (good work btw!), it seems as if you lost it, went into the other lane, truck driver thinks that he can go though if he takes the shoulder, and then you end up spinning into his path. I would think that you're at fault because, a) you lost control, and b) the other driver can say that he was attempting to avoid the accident.

I'm no expert though.

[ralliart_girl]

Originally posted by Generic


yup. the only thing to do is hire a lawyer/paralegal and fight it.

Getting a lawyer, will not change how an insurance company determines liability. If you like, go ahead and bust out this card...I guarantee your adjuster won't even blink. Listen to tom_9109, he knows what is talking, this is totally the best way to handle this.

[Generic]

Originally posted by ralliart_girl


Getting a lawyer, will not change how an insurance company determines liability. If you like, go ahead and bust out this card...I guarantee your adjuster won't even blink. Listen to tom_9109, he knows what is talking, this is totally the best way to handle this.

wrong. A proper lawyer can argue whose at fault, and if he wins in court in determining he's not at fault, he can take it to insurance and say "see the Judge said I'm not even at fault" and can get the accident removed from his record. A friend just went through this here.

[ralliart_girl]

Originally posted by Generic


wrong. A proper lawyer can argue whose at fault, and if he wins in court in determining he's not at fault, he can take it to insurance and say "see the Judge said I'm not even at fault" and can get the accident removed from his record. A friend just went through this here.

Dude, this doesn't happen that often, trust me. You are right, it can happen, but this is not the norm. And if you had actually worked in the claims dept of an insurance company...you would know this. Being a dick to your adjuster, will get you no where, the lawyer card was thrown at me at least 10 times a day. There are insurance rules, and that's how claims are settled, and if the judge rules differently, then it will be dealt with at that time, ususally this is months and months down the road. So relaying on this....probably not the best way to handle this.

[tom_9109]

Originally posted by Generic


wrong. A proper lawyer can argue whose at fault, and if he wins in court in determining he's not at fault, he can take it to insurance and say "see the Judge said I'm not even at fault" and can get the accident removed from his record. A friend just went through this here.

No, you're wrong. Here a direct copy from the Standard automobile policy (section A) in Alberta which is the contract between you and the insurance company.



AGREEMENTS OF INSURED
Where indemnity is provided by this section, every person insured by this
Policy:
(a) by the acceptance of this Policy, constitutes and appoints the Insurer his
irrevocable attorney to appear and defend in any province or territory of
Canada in which action is brought against the Insured arising out of the
ownership, use or operation of the automobile;

An insurance company is not gonna accept 100% fault unless they have to. After the fact i guess you can get all the lawyers you want but you'd be wasting your time.

Its almost like I'm somehow involved and educated in insurance. . . . . weird.

[Richjerk]

let the insurance decide

[ralliart_girl]

Originally posted by tom_9109
Its almost like I'm somehow involved and educated in insurance. . . . . weird.

LOL...yea dude, I'm impressed. It is probably all the conversations you have had with adjusters...the best parts are when you bust out the SPF 1, now even I saved that for special days only :rofl:

[tom_9109]

Originally posted by ralliart_girl


LOL...yea dude, I'm impressed. It is probably all the conversations you have had with adjusters...the best parts are when you bust out the SPF 1, now even I saved that for special days only :rofl:

The being an adjuster helps a bit too :)

[ralliart_girl]

Originally posted by tom_9109


The being an adjuster helps a bit too :)

I thought you were an appraiser. I must have remembered wrong. Sorry :D

[tom_9109]

Originally posted by ralliart_girl


I thought you were an appraiser. I must have remembered wrong. Sorry :D

You remembered right, just I never stop trying to improve myself and adjuster was the logical step.

[ralliart_girl]

Originally posted by tom_9109


You remembered right, just I never stop trying to improve myself and adjuster was the logical step.

That's awesome, congrats! And welcome to the other side of the fence.

[Generic]

I think i'm talking about something completely different. I was thinking that if the Police get involved, assign him "at fault" for the accident (which usually includes a careless driving ticket), insurance can mark him on both counts, for the ticket and the accident. However if you fight the ticket in court and win, thus the fault isn't yours anymore, the ticket will be void, and you can take the Judge's remarks to your insurance company. What i'm talking about sounds completely different though because the Police wasn't involved?

[ralliart_girl]

The police can't assign fault, they can sure give tickets. Liability is not determined by what the police said, however, police reports are reviewed and is part of the investigation. Police don't know insurance rules for settling claims.

[Tram Common]

I'm not sure if the swerving comes into effect but if you slam on your brakes and someone rear-ends you, they are 100% at fault for not leaving enough room regardless of weather conditions.

...now if the fact that you lost control has anything to do with it I'm not sure.

[tom_9109]

Originally posted by Tram Common
I'm not sure if the swerving comes into effect but if you slam on your brakes and someone rear-ends you, they are 100% at fault for not leaving enough room regardless of weather conditions.

...now if the fact that you lost control has anything to do with it I'm not sure.

Thats if both companies are signatories to the IBC agreement. Without it you'll find the guy from behind will be at fault in most cases still.

[Generic]

Originally posted by ralliart_girl
The police can't assign fault, they can sure give tickets. Liability is not determined by what the police said, however, police reports are reviewed and is part of the investigation. Police don't know insurance rules for settling claims.

oh. And therein lies the difference between Ontario and Alberta. In Ontario, Police can assign fault to an accident. Its so gay

[Tarrantula]

Originally posted by Generic


oh. And therein lies the difference between Ontario and Alberta. In Ontario, Police can assign fault to an accident. Its so gay

Also, in ontario if your insurance company does an investigation, and you are found to NOT be at fault.. the other insurance company cant fight it.. but in MIGHTY ALBERTA! the other company will not accept blame.. so its ends 50/50.. like last year when i got t-boned.. and it wasnt my fault. FML

[Generic]

Originally posted by Tarrantula


Also, in ontario if your insurance company does an investigation, and you are found to NOT be at fault.. the other insurance company cant fight it.. but in MIGHTY ALBERTA! the other company will not accept blame.. so its ends 50/50.. like last year when i got t-boned.. and it wasnt my fault. FML

trust me man, I'd take Alberta's insurance over Ontario's any day of the fucking week. It's a joke here. See my rant on insurance
"
Originally posted by Generic
you guys have no fucking concept of insurance.
In Toronto, insurance is a bitch. One speeding ticket and it will go up 25%. Accidents are double your insurance easily. There's a real industry here of people who fight tickets and accidents, dedicated lawyers for traffic accidents and incidents even. New male drivers are usually insurable 6000 bucks, hard to find cheaper then 5k. Even the agents on the phone (and i called 25 places here before I found one) told me that as a student with 3 full years of driving experience and no tickets or accidents and drivers ed and full G license, I should be driving > $2000 dollar vehicles that are cheap to repair in accidents and to insure, and they recommended Pontiac Sunflowers and Cavaliers. I couldn't believe it.
I was paying $3200 a year for my 01 Prelude without collision, no vandalism/fire/theft, and basic liability (now I'm looking for my next ride, I just sold it). My sister with one year of driving pays $3900. And these are discounted rates because my whole family is with this insurance company. Unfreaking believable. I was getting quotes for $6500 a year average for my Prelude when I started calling around, with the highest quote being $7700 which is without collision, fire/theft. "

[atgilchrist]

Yet one more reason not to live in Toronto. JK

[bobyo_2001]

he is at fault your were a stoped vehicle in an "emergeny lane"

[tom_9109]

Originally posted by atgilchrist
Yet one more reason not to live in Toronto. JK
Put it on the list right under being neighbors with Quebec.


Originally posted by bobyo_2001
he is at fault your were a stoped vehicle in an "emergeny lane"

Its not that simple, being backwards and half in the next lane has to come into play. Ask yourself what the proximate cause for the collision is? What set off this unbroken chain of events, was it the guy who may have been following too close or the guy who spun across 2 lanes and came to a stop backwards on the shoulder? Think about it people, what makes the most sense, the guy completely out of control or the gut in control who simply could not avoid the out of control driver?

[Tarrantula]

Originally posted by tom_9109

Put it on the list right under being neighbors with Quebec.



Its not that simple, being backwards and half in the next lane has to come into play. Ask yourself what the proximate cause for the collision is? What set off this unbroken chain of events, was it the guy who may have been following too close or the guy who spun across 2 lanes and came to a stop backwards on the shoulder? Think about it people, what makes the most sense, the guy completely out of control or the gut in control who simply could not avoid the out of control driver?

I blame the acid trip thinking about the answer.

[Generic]

Originally posted by atgilchrist
Yet one more reason not to live in Toronto. JK

no kidding. I'm enjoying my plus 5 today, how's -15?
haha