CF-18s intercepted Russian plane....

[ICEBERG]

Watch out people, the russians are coming to take over Canada :eek: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

Canadian fighter jets were scrambling to intercept a Russian bomber plane in the Arctic skies.

Obviously what the media saying is that the russians were testing Canadian security.. Really, Why??? So the russians can see how easy it is to take over the Arctic :dunno:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/7915517.stm

[Aleks]

This type of stuff happen pretty frequently it just doesn't make the news all that often. My guess is because it's Obama related it's in the news this time.

[hampstor]

This happens a lot - more often than not it's a Tu-95 Bear. It's a cold war tradition they still do to this day.

The BBC article says:

Russian aircraft regularly probed North American airspace during the Cold War, but such flights ended after the collapse of the Soviet Union.


Which is a load of shit, they still do these.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tupolev_Tu-95#Encounters_in_the_air

[method]

Happened all the time during the cold war. Russia has been attempted to increase its preeminence over the energy regions (Caucasus, Arctic) for a while now. They were just trying to piss us off.

[badatusrnames]

The Bears are fast for a propeller driven aircraft, but I wonder how well the CF-18s would be able to handle one of these coming in at full afterburner:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tupolev_Tu-160

http://www.airforce-technology.com/projects/tu160/images/Tu160_12.jpg

[core_upt]

It's fucking Red Dawn time!

[Wildcat]

Originally posted by method
Happened all the time during the cold war. Russia has been attempted to increase its preeminence over the energy regions (Caucasus, Arctic) for a while now. They were just trying to piss us off.

I would've made an inverted approach to within feet of his cockpit and flipped him the bird.

[n1zm0]

Originally posted by core_upt
It's fucking Red Dawn time!

lol, there are actually cameras with flash (huge assy) mounted on the left side of the forward fuselage on F-18s/CF-18s, i remember one came to SAIT and i was like WTF is that for, teacher says 'to prevent red dawn' lol

[hampstor]

Originally posted by badatusrnames
The Bears are fast for a propeller driven aircraft, but I wonder how well the CF-18s would be able to handle one of these coming in at full afterburner:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tupolev_Tu-160

http://www.airforce-technology.com/projects/tu160/images/Tu160_12.jpg

Looks like they sent one of these as well, or there are conflicting reports on whether it was a Tu-160 or a Tu-95:

http://www.nationalpost.com/news/story.html?id=1335735

[Jlude]

Originally posted by Wildcat


I would've made an inverted approach to within feet of his cockpit and flipped him the bird.

You must feel the need... the need for speed.

[EK 2.0]

Originally posted by Wildcat

I would've made an inverted approach to within feet of his cockpit and flipped him the bird.



Originally posted by Jlude

You must feel the need... the need for speed.


Negative Ghostrider, the pattern is full...

[OH-EIGHT]

they do this all the time, especially lately with putin trying to make russia a power again

theres a whole list on wikipedia

this is russias reply



A Russian government source expressed astonishment on Friday over a statement made by Canada's defense minister over a flight by a Russian strategic bomber near the Canadian border.

Peter Mackay said two Canadian fighters forced the Russian Tu-160 Blackjack to make a U-turn on February 18 as it neared Canadian airspace less then 24 hours before U.S. President Barack Obama was due to visit Ottawa. The Canadian minister said the move was "a strong coincidence."

"The Canadian defense minister's statements concerning the flights of our long-haul aircraft are totally unclear... This was a routine flight. The countries adjacent to the flight path had been notified and the planes did not violate the airspace of other countries. In this light the statements by the Canadian Defense Ministry provoke astonishment and can only be called a farce," the source said.

The Russian Defense Ministry spokesman, Col. Alexander Drobyshevsky, confirmed that all the neighboring states had received prior notification of the flights by Russian strategic aircraft.

Lt. Col. Vladimir Drik, a Russian Air Force spokesman, said earlier the Tu-160 flights were in compliance with international agreements and rules and did not violate Canadian airspace.

http://en.rian.ru/russia/20090227/120351925.html

[Altezza]

I thought Palin was keeping a watchful eye on the Russians from her back yard. Guess she doesn't have our back...

[JRSC00LUDE]

Good morning, gentlemen, the temperature is 110 degrees.


Originally posted by EK 2.0
Negative Ghostrider, the pattern is full...

Johnson, I heard Mav and Goose happened to see a MiG 28 do a 4g negative dive. Can you confirm?

[hampstor]

Originally posted by JRSC00LUDE
Good morning, gentlemen, the temperature is 110 degrees.


Holy shit it's Viper!

[calgarys_finest]

Originally posted by JRSC00LUDE
Good morning, gentlemen, the temperature is 110 degrees.



Viper's up here, great oh shit
Great he's probably saying holy shit it's Maverick and Goose

[Wildcat]

YOU'RE DANGEROUS!

http://ydabondelli.files.wordpress.com/2008/01/topgun.jpg

http://www.gamerevolution.com/images/misc/inverted_finger.jpg

[ChappedLips]

If anything actually happened our air force would get destroyed. Alberta should put their surplus money towards their own private air force!

We can hire Tom Cruise to be in charge.

[OH-EIGHT]

Originally posted by ChappedLips
If anything actually happened our air force would get destroyed. Alberta should put their surplus money towards their own private air force!

We can hire Tom Cruise to be in charge.

what do you mean?
dont we have the snowbirds?

[EK 2.0]

Originally posted by JRSC00LUDE

Good morning, gentlemen, the temperature is 110 degrees.



Johnson, I heard Mav and Goose happened to see a MiG 28 do a 4g negative dive. Can you confirm?



Top Gun rules of engagement are written for your safety and for that of your team. They are not flexible, nor am I. Either obey them or you are history. Is that clear??

[JRSC00LUDE]

EDIT: Don't steal my lines Johnson or I'll unload into that tower, got it?

[USED1]

Originally posted by ChappedLips
If anything actually happened our air force would get destroyed. Alberta should put their surplus money towards their own private air force!


We have some of the best trained pilots in the world. I don't think our air force would be in that much trouble.

[Wildcat]

Originally posted by JRSC00LUDE
EDIT: Don't steal my lines Johnson or I'll unload into that tower, got it?

That's right! Ice... man. I am dangerous.

[JRSC00LUDE]

Originally posted by USED1


We have some of the best trained pilots in the world. I don't think our air force would be in that much trouble.

Damn, this kid is good!

[EK 2.0]

You don't have time to think up there. If you think, you're dead...

[Wildcat]

Originally posted by EK 2.0
You don't have time to think up there. If you think, you're dead...

And let's not bullshit Maverick. Your family name ain't the best in the Navy. You need to be doing it better, and cleaner than the other guy. Now what is it with you?

[JRSC00LUDE]

Originally posted by Wildcat


And let's not bullshit Maverick. Your family name ain't the best in the Navy. You need to be doing it better, and cleaner than the other guy. Now what is it with you?

And if you screw up just this much, you'll be flying a cargo plane full of rubber dog shit out of Hong Kong!

[revelations]

: "whose butt did you kiss to get in here?"
: "well the list is long but distinguished"
: "ya well so is my johnson"

[EK 2.0]

Originally posted by JRSC00LUDE

And if you screw up just this much, you'll be flying a cargo plane full of rubber dog shit out of Hong Kong!


How's it feel to be on the front page of every newspaper in the english-speaking world, even though the other side denies the incident?? Congratulations.

[JRSC00LUDE]

Originally posted by revelations
: "whose butt did you kiss to get in here?"
: "well the list is long but distinguished"
: "ya well so is my johnson"

Hell, I'd be happy to just find a girl that would talk dirty to me.

[EK 2.0]

Originally posted by JRSC00LUDE

Hell, I'd be happy to just find a girl that would talk dirty to me.


Sorry Goose, but it's time to buzz a tower.....

[JRSC00LUDE]

Originally posted by EK 2.0



Sorry Goose, but it's time to buzz a tower.....

I can see it's dangerous for you, but if the government trusts me, maybe you could.

[EK 2.0]

Originally posted by JRSC00LUDE

I can see it's dangerous for you, but if the government trusts me, maybe you could.



The plaque for the alternates is down in the ladies room.....

[JRSC00LUDE]

^

Gutsiest move I ever saw, Mav.

[EK 2.0]

Originally posted by JRSC00LUDE

^

Gutsiest move I ever saw, Mav.



You can be my wingman any time.....

[JRSC00LUDE]

Originally posted by EK 2.0




You can be my wingman any time.....

Bullshit! You can be mine! :rofl:

[EK 2.0]

Originally posted by JRSC00LUDE

Bullshit! You can be mine! :rofl:




He was my R.I.O., my responsibility.....

[dezmarez]

wow!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
ahahaahaha

[Wildcat]

Wolfman: This gives me a hard on.
Hollywood: Don't tease me.

[JRSC00LUDE]

Originally posted by Wildcat
Wolfman: This gives me a hard on.
Hollywood: Don't tease me.

Lines aren't funny if you don't let someone else complete them. People like you just ruin it for everyone. :guns:


:D

[Wildcat]

Originally posted by JRSC00LUDE


Lines aren't funny if you don't let someone else complete them. People like you just ruin it for everyone. :guns:


:D

Hey, Slider.... [sniffs] You stink!

[EK 2.0]

Originally posted by Wildcat

Hey, Slider.... [sniffs] You stink!



It takes a lot more than just fancy flying.....

[Wildcat]

Originally posted by EK 2.0




It takes a lot more than just fancy flying.....

I think I'll go embarrass myself with Goose

[86max]

Goose, even you could get laid in a place like this.

[EK 2.0]

Originally posted by 86max

Goose, even you could get laid in a place like this.



Any of you boys seen an aircraft-carrier around here??

[YamahaV8]

Originally posted by badatusrnames
The Bears are fast for a propeller driven aircraft, but I wonder how well the CF-18s would be able to handle one of these coming in at full afterburner:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tupolev_Tu-160

http://www.airforce-technology.com/projects/tu160/images/Tu160_12.jpg

I could be wrong but I'm pretty sure it has to be sub sonic to launch any ordinance so there would be a window to take it out. But in reality, if Russia sent in any bombers for a real strike it would most likely have a fighter escort.

[86max]

Originally posted by EK 2.0




Any of you boys seen an aircraft-carrier around here??

Goose who's butt did you kiss to get in here anyway?

[hampstor]

That was me laughing, dickhead

[Wildcat]

Originally posted by hampstor
That was me laughing, dickhead

Splash that sucker, yeah!

[sputnik]

ekXxi9IKZSA

[86max]

^^^ Mav has lost that loving feeling...

lol

[jutes]

Originally posted by n1zm0


lol, there are actually cameras with flash (huge assy) mounted on the left side of the forward fuselage on F-18s/CF-18s, i remember one came to SAIT and i was like WTF is that for, teacher says 'to prevent red dawn' lol

They aren't cameras, they are extremely bright ID lights for intercepting aircraft.

[Anomaly]

Originally posted by badatusrnames
The Bears are fast for a propeller driven aircraft, but I wonder how well the CF-18s would be able to handle one of these coming in at full afterburner:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tupolev_Tu-160

http://www.airforce-technology.com/projects/tu160/images/Tu160_12.jpg




AIM-120 AMRAAM Air to Air Missile : Mach 4

Meh

[ZenOps]

Them Russians were trying to rattle Obama.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tsar_bomb

Good old fashioned 1961, drop it from a plane deadweight technology.

I knew we should have called in the anti-aircraft vehicles for his visit. BTW: Do we have any ground base anti aircraft ability, lol?

[jutes]

Originally posted by ZenOps
Them Russians were trying to rattle Obama.


I knew we should have called in the anti-aircraft vehicles for his visit. BTW: Do we have any ground base anti aircraft ability, lol?

AA for what?

[nj2Type-S]

LOL @ the 'top gun' lines :rofl:

[ZenOps]

For a possible attack duh...

Russia has far more fighters than the handful Canada has. A real sabre rattling would have had the bombers escorted with several hundred if not two thousand longer range fighters.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20090227/ts_nm/us_obama_canada_russia

The CF-18's would be able to shoot down - Oh, maybe 40. In a real attack - the brunt of the defense would have to be ground based AA, much like Baghdad on the first night of the bombing.

Never underestimate the sneakyness of ANY nation - back in 1812, the US nearly sucessfully invaded Toronto - with the intent of razing (no survivors, no economic gain, just death.)

PS: Anyone have a report of what make/class of bomber it was? Seriously - if there was an attack on North America, they would use regular bombers as they are time proven, and if one gets shot down over the arctic - the loss of nukes in the water is moot.

[badatusrnames]

Originally posted by Anomaly


AIM-120 AMRAAM Air to Air Missile : Mach 4

Meh

It's not that simple... the Blackjack is faster than the CF-18. You have to get in range first, get a good firing vector, etc.


Originally posted by ZenOps
A real sabre rattling would have had the bombers escorted with several hundred if not two thousand longer range fighters.


Lol Russia doesn't even have 2000 fighters, it's closer to half that. And besides, the real limitation on them would be air-to-air refueling capabilities/capacity.


Originally posted by ZenOps
Russia has far more fighters than the handful Canada has.

The CF-18's would be able to shoot down - Oh, maybe 40. In a real attack - the brunt of the defense would have to be ground based AA, much like Baghdad on the first night of the bombing.

Sure Russia has plenty of fighters, but only a fraction would be able to engage in combat over Canadian airspace because, like I said, of a dearth of air-to-air refueling capacity. Add to that the home field advantage of NORAD radar and command and control, we would probably do pretty good. Not to mention that it would be NORAD defending North American airspace, so the Americans would be lending a helping hand.

As far as you talking about SAMs/AA. Well, they said in the 50s that they would replace manned interceptors entirely and that hasn't happened because they aren't the solution for continent air defense. If I recall correctly, Baghdad was one of the most heavily defended cities against air attack and it didn't do them very well... Wild weasels took care of them...


Originally posted by ZenOps
Anyone have a report of what make/class of bomber it was?

Actually, they were Tu-160's.

[diamondedge]

I'm gonna hit the brakes and he'll fly right by.

[OH-EIGHT]

whats going on with the JSF's?
Canada's getting those right?

[jutes]

Originally posted by ZenOps Russia has far more fighters than the handful Canada has. A real sabre rattling would have had the bombers escorted with several hundred if not two thousand longer range fighters.

2000? Russia's air force has maybe 100 FLYABLE and serviceable fighters at the moment. They aren't exactly ready to launch a full-scale aerial invasion against anyone right now.



Originally posted by badatusrnames
Actually, they were Tu-160's.

Actually, Russian Bears are TU-95's.



Originally posted by OH-EIGHT
whats going on with the JSF's?
Canada's getting those right?

This or the Superbug.


:dunno:

[badatusrnames]

Originally posted by jutes
Actually, Russian Bears are TU-95's.

I'm well aware of that, but apparently it were Blackjack's that were intercepted...

[jutes]

Originally posted by badatusrnames


I'm well aware of that, but apparently it were Blackjack's that were intercepted...

The news sources all mention a "Russian plane" or bomber...no mention of specific aircraft. :dunno:

[ZenOps]

If its that bomber than it wouldn't be hard to identify - its the last and biggest bomber that Russia ever made, one of 16 still in active service.

At peak russia had what? 45,000 nukes? Most arguably on smart missles and submarines, but I'm sure many are slated for good old fashioned dropping.

http://www.nrdc.org/nuclear/nudb/datainx.asp

I sleep with some comfort knowing that the Russian dearmament has reduced their capacity to 15,000 (even though they may be higher bang, and more devastating) the chances of one slipping away to a zealous general are lower.

[badatusrnames]

Originally posted by jutes


The news sources all mention a "Russian plane" or bomber...no mention of specific aircraft. :dunno:

Yeah, earlier today the articles were stating that it was a Tu-160.... now they all seem to either be unsure or state that it was either a Tu-95 or a 160...

[01RedDX]

.

[Anomaly]

Originally posted by badatusrnames


It's not that simple... the Blackjack is faster than the CF-18. You have to get in range first, get a good firing vector, etc.



This is true, but not that much faster

Mach 2.1 vs 1.8, and the CF-18 is more maneuverability and climbs at nearly 3 times the speed of the Blackjack.

[95EagleAWD]

Originally posted by diamondedge
I'm gonna hit the brakes and he'll fly right by.

All right, let's see what you got now, Jester!

[ZenOps]

Hypothetically speaking:

Sneak an aircraft carrier disguised as a cargo or oiltanker (to satellite) behind an icebreaker in the northwest passage...

I could see even shorter range fighters being able to attack Canada with some ease. Heck, if they drop a refuelling station on the 10-foot ice in the arctic, within a week they could have a fully functioning refuelling air base hidden under white camo. Albeit very slippery, mind you - thats no problem when you have miles and miles of flat ice to land on.

This of course begs the question - is Russia all that bad? And moreso - is the US all that good? Maybe its a good thing that we have Russia flying planes over us - keeps the US in check so they don't run over us and take the oil from Alberta and uranium from Sask.

If the Royal Bank of Scotland goes insolvent - I could even see some European nations looking to expand (just like the colonization days) or ramp up their military to keep the economy moving.

[95EagleAWD]

Aircraft carrier's are the Navy's white knight now.

http://www.exile.ru/articles/detail.php?ARTICLE_ID=6779&IBLOCK_ID=35

[YamahaV8]

Originally posted by 01RedDX


LOL that's a bit of a stretch. They have at least a thousand active MiGs and 500 active Su's that we know of, followed by hundreds or possibly thousands of Su bombers.

Besides, a single Su-30MK can outmaneuver a fleet of American planes.

With the largest transport and refueling capacity and hundreds of helicopter gunships, the Russian air force can take a small continent within a couple of days.


LOL. A single aircraft can outmaneuver an entire fleet huh? Dogfighting rarely happens anymore son. Canadian pilots have shown over and over again in competitions that they are some of the best fighter pilots in the world.

[ZenOps]

Dogfighting rarely happens - because the major nations are not at war right now. Its not a question of how good the pilots are, its a simple matter of numbers, you can only place so many missles on a jetfighter.

If Baghdad is any indicator, relying on ground based AA is hugely unreliable and nearly totally ineffective in an invasion scenario. But works well for single suicide bomber type scenarios.

SO.

Russia could technically stomp Canada without even blinking - tomorrow. The only thing keeping them from doing so is the proximity to the US and the worldwide nuclear deterrent (and they are a lot nicer than we give them credit for) One conventional bomb, right smack on the number 1 highway, another on the rail line, and one at the oil pipeline - and the war would be over. Heck, a racially zealous Tibetan monk could probably bring down Canada.

But the main thing that makes Canada vulnerable is the population density - very simply not enough people to specialize in high end military. A country Canada's size 5 million people just to grow enough food, repair the roads and the other civil jobs.

Mechanical engineers build weapons, civil engineers build targets.

The Falklands petty skirmish (IMO not really a war) would probably be more like what a modern war would look like.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Falkland_war

Argentina brought in 220 jet fighters for that one, which is what? Half of their entire airforce?

[sillysod]

NORAD picked them up.... Canadian planes went out to check it out.

If there was anything that indicated there would be a problem the entire airspace would be full of US aircraft and SAM's.

Canada's contribution to NORAD is the equivalent of a fast news helicopter.ouvOoPKZ8XA

[msommers]

You never close your eyes, anymore, when I kiss your, liiips....

[jutes]

Originally posted by 01RedDX


LOL that's a bit of a stretch. They have at least a thousand active MiGs and 500 active Su's that we know of, followed by hundreds or possibly thousands of Su bombers.

Besides, a single Su-30MK can outmaneuver a fleet of American planes.

With the largest transport and refueling capacity and hundreds of helicopter gunships, the Russian air force can take a small continent within a couple of days.

Their Air Force is old and mostly unflyable.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20090206/wl_nm/us_russia_jets

Also, you are forgetting that someone has to fly the things. Russian pilots don't get anywhere near the amount of hours that our pilots get. In the end it's the person flying the aircraft with the better training and experience that will decide the outcome.

Which "small contintent" are they gonna take? It sure won't be North America or Asia.



Originally posted by ZenOps
Hypothetically speaking:

Realistically speaking, the Russians won't get anywhere near our continent with their massive rustic military without us seeing them first. You can't hide an aircraft carrier under a tarp. :rolleyes:


Originally posted by ZenOps
Russia could technically stomp Canada without even blinking - tomorrow. The only thing keeping them from doing so is the proximity to the US and the worldwide nuclear deterrent (and they are a lot nicer than we give them credit for)

What are they gonna stomp? A few inuit towns in the northern part of Canada if they get lucky? How are they gonna get all their bombers and fighters anywhere near populated Canadian cities like Edmonton/Vancouver/Toronto? Hell NORAD can detect a TU-95 in the air the second it takes off from northern Russia. Look at the distance the CF-18's had to fly to intercept the bomber BEFORE it got into our airspace.

Some people make out the Russian Air Force as an unstoppable wave of destruction. This isn't the cold war anymore , their 70's tech won't win them any battles.

[YamahaV8]

Originally posted by ZenOps
Dogfighting rarely happens - because the major nations are not at war right now. Its not a question of how good the pilots are, its a simple matter of numbers, you can only place so many missles on a jetfighter.


Not the point I was making. The guy above me said that one solo aircraft could just school an entire fleet. I called :bullshit:

My comment about dogfighting was simply a statement concerning the nature of air to air combat in these modern days. 90% of it is beyond visual range and a highly maneuverable aircraft is not the bread and butter anymore.

[Hakkola]

Haha, this happens all the time in Europe, Russia is always testing response times.

Anyone know what that huge yellow plane flying low over chinook centre yesterday at 4 was?

[sillysod]

Originally posted by Hakkola
Haha, this happens all the time in Europe, Russia is always testing response times.

Anyone know what that huge yellow plane flying low over chinook centre yesterday at 4 was?

Search and Rescue air craft... probably was out in the golden area looking for those skiers

http://www.defenseindustrydaily.com/images/AIR_DHC-5_Buffalo_CC-115-SAR_BC_Shoreline_lg.jpg
de Havilland Buffalo DHC-5 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/De_Havilland_Canada_DHC-5_Buffalo)

[01RedDX]

.

[Canucks3322]

The funniest part about the whole thing was Peter McKAy snarling on the news HAHA!...."They need to back offf..."....couldn't help but laugh.

[01RedDX]

.

[YamahaV8]

Originally posted by 01RedDX


Where does this say that they are down to 100 planes?

This article mostly talks about aging MiG29's. Nice try though.
:zzz:



You are clinging to a side argument I made regarding one type of plane. Why don't you back up your claims that Canada's air force is superior to Russia's. :rofl:

Keep talking out of your ass, son.

:zzz:


Not once did I say that Canada's Air force is superior. Side argument or not you made the comment. So please explain how I am talking out of my ass.

[01RedDX]

.

[jutes]

Originally posted by 01RedDX


Anyways, that's not the point here, Canadian pilots do get superior training, but they are vastly outnumbered, and with good reason - the Russians know better than to attack America's home continent, so we don't need to maintain a large air force. In this particular incident, it has come to light that Russia gave advance notice, and did not violate Canadian airspace.

Why then, does our government risk making this country into a laughing stock? Perhaps both Canada and Russia want Obama to assert himself and assume a less ambiguous stance in U.S.-Russian relations.

Russia has NEVER given us advance notice, nor do they file flight plans. We only know of their presence when their bombers show up on the scope. They don't breach our airspace because they aren't stupid.

How is the government making this country into a laughing stock?

The only thing Russia has over us are numbers in fighters, thats it.

[01RedDX]

.

[OH-EIGHT]

its okay, if russia ever decided to do anything, canada has palin to back them up with their F-22's :)

[ZorroAMG]

You people with the top gun quotes. Reckless.

Now get your butts above the hard deck and return to base.

[95EagleAWD]

Originally posted by ZorroAMG
You people with the top gun quotes. Reckless.

Now get your butts above the hard deck and return to base.

I want somebody's butt and I want it now! GODDAMMIT! That's twice! I want some butts!

[ZorroAMG]

Maverick, you'll get your rear when you get there. If you don't, give me a call. I'll fly with you.

[ZenOps]

Mckay should have put up his hand in a stop and said "Oh no you didn't!"

Seriously though - Canada should go nuclear. Not with ICBMs or submarines but with anti-navy nukes.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nuclear_Depth_Bomb

Like what Britain deployed around the Falklands from 1982 to 2003. It would be prohibitively expensive for Canada to maintain a ground based ICBM nuke (you need all the accompaning technology to protect it like regular tanks and airforce) If its in the water as a mine - you can always just nuke someone when then get within a few kilometers of it. Noone dare steal it for chance of setting it off, and they are very easy to monitor remotely.

[ZenOps]

Originally posted by jutes


Their Air Force is old and mostly unflyable.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20090206/wl_nm/us_russia_jets

Also, you are forgetting that someone has to fly the things. Russian pilots don't get anywhere near the amount of hours that our pilots get. In the end it's the person flying the aircraft with the better training and experience that will decide the outcome.

Which "small contintent" are they gonna take? It sure won't be North America or Asia.




Realistically speaking, the Russians won't get anywhere near our continent with their massive rustic military without us seeing them first. You can't hide an aircraft carrier under a tarp. :rolleyes:



What are they gonna stomp? A few inuit towns in the northern part of Canada if they get lucky? How are they gonna get all their bombers and fighters anywhere near populated Canadian cities like Edmonton/Vancouver/Toronto? Hell NORAD can detect a TU-95 in the air the second it takes off from northern Russia. Look at the distance the CF-18's had to fly to intercept the bomber BEFORE it got into our airspace.

Some people make out the Russian Air Force as an unstoppable wave of destruction. This isn't the cold war anymore , their 70's tech won't win them any battles.

Strategically speaking from a military point of view - the cities in Canada are not the main target. Northern Alberta and Saskatechewan (with perhaps as little at 200,000 people combined, half natives with nothing more than rocks.) would be the primary target (1.7 trillion barrels of oil and 30% of the worlds uranium, yes 30% of the worlds current uranium production.) Its pretty safe to say that 1 in every 4 nuclear weapons has its initial Uranium coming from Northern Sask (Shouldn't we be proud!)

Breaking the singular highway (supply line) to northern Alberta, and the dirt/ice road to northern Saskatchewan would the the first goal, after disabling the Norad/nato tracking stations along the arctic circle. Disabling communications would also be of paramount (as in any war scenario) which would be harder to do because of Canada's quite impressive satellite technology (Ka band communication)

Submarines would be useless to send - as Canada has no naval strength. They could however double as effective radar jammers and satellite disrupters if properly equipped. One would probably be sent somewhere near Toronto and one off the coast of Vancouver not to shoot anything - but to disrupt satellite and local communications.

I doubt they would even bother with anyone or anything east of Sask. Too much political backlash if they tried to invade Toronto - besides - all they would get is a money losing car plant and some lobsters further east.

[jutes]

Originally posted by ZenOps


Strategically speaking from a military point of view - the cities in Canada are not the main target. Northern Alberta and Saskatechewan (with perhaps as little at 200,000 people combined, half natives with nothing more than rocks.) would be the primary target (1.7 trillion barrels of oil and 30% of the worlds uranium, yes 30% of the worlds current uranium production.) Its pretty safe to say that 1 in every 4 nuclear weapons has its initial Uranium coming from Northern Sask (Shouldn't we be proud!)

Breaking the singular highway (supply line) to northern Alberta, and the dirt/ice road to northern Saskatchewan would the the first goal, after disabling the Norad/nato tracking stations along the arctic circle. Disabling communications would also be of paramount (as in any war scenario) which would be harder to do because of Canada's quite impressive satellite technology (Ka band communication)

Submarines would be useless to send - as Canada has no naval strength. They could however double as effective radar jammers and satellite disrupters if properly equipped. One would probably be sent somewhere near Toronto and one off the coast of Vancouver not to shoot anything - but to disrupt satellite and local communications.

I doubt they would even bother with anyone or anything east of Sask. Too much political backlash if they tried to invade Toronto - besides - all they would get is a money losing car plant and some lobsters further east.

:facepalm:

You make is sound like Canada is there for the taking. How is the Russian Air Force supposed to invade Canada, let alone get enough serviceable aircraft to mount any sort of attack?

Everytime I get news that another Russian aircraft is intercepted I laugh. They are about 20 years too late to really intimidate anyone. We should have shot them down and said what are you gonna do?

They remind me of a 30 year old guy at a college party still trying to act cool and fit in.

[msommers]

I like that analogy hahaha. I'm pretty sure we'd know what Russia was doing before Russia knew what it was doing

[Antonito]

Originally posted by ZenOps



I doubt they would even bother with anyone or anything east of Sask. Too much political backlash if they tried to invade Toronto - besides - all they would get is a money losing car plant and some lobsters further east.

So you what you're saying is that invading Toronto would have too much political backlash, but invading Fort Mac wouldn't? :rofl: :rofl:

I have no delusions that Canada is going to be the big dog and chase off Russia, but I've paid enough attention to know that letting Russians occupy any part of the North American continent is a complete non-starter with the US. They smear entire middle eastern countries off the map just for fucking fun, how do you think they'd react with an actual enemy at the gates, and also taking over a bunch of commodities that America relies on?

To put this in a way that would make sense in your world, imagine if a non-white guy moved in next door to Rob Anders. Now take what you imagine his reaction would be and apply it to America :rofl:

[ZenOps]

Originally posted by Antonito


So you what you're saying is that invading Toronto would have too much political backlash, but invading Fort Mac wouldn't?

If communications were properly broken - Fort Mac could be taken for a week before anyone knew that it had been taken over.

IE: If I said right now that Fort Mac was offering a free sex slave to anyone who showed up at the Fort mac employment office and put down a resume, and broke the road to it - how many people could actually make it there before the end of the week?

Take over the satellites - make a cover story that there was a massive industrial accident causing the explosion of two of the bigger plants.

By the time Canada repairs the one road in, it might already be entrenched with soldiers. Assume 1 soldier needed for every 10 suvillians, and Fort Mac is a definite ground target invasion possibility. Heck - I'd almost say in its own way - Fort Mac was invaded by a local force - Nova Scotia, lol. Revolutions can be internal to the country as well.

There is no way that one could hide an invasion or mount enough ground forces to invade Toronto.

And political backlash is only important to nations that are actually concerned with maintaining an image. For "rogue" states that have no homeland - there is nowhere to nuke in retaliation - so they might as well give invasion a shot. Thing is - when people don't actually own a plot of land in their homeland - they usually tend to not give a rats ass about it.

Its sort of like Somali pirates taking billion dollar tankers and asking for $150 million ransoms - they care nothing if their country gets nuked - its already on the edge of obivion, so they might as well make some money now while they can.

And don't get me wrong - I love my country - I hate Rob Anders. As a matter of fact I've got $30,000 going towards hiring and flying in an all-black Louisiana trumpet band to play "Ding dong the witch is dead" when he kicks the bucket.

[hampstor]

Originally posted by ZenOps


If communications were properly broken - Fort Mac could be taken for a week before anyone knew that it had been taken over.

Take over the satellites - make a cover story that there was a massive industrial accident causing the explosion of two of the bigger plants.

By the time Canada repairs the one road in, it might already be entrenched with soldiers.

There is no way that one could hide an invasion into Toronto.

Unlikely - any successful ground offensive into Canada over the Arctic would require air superiority first and foremost. It is foolish to send in ground forces otherwise.

Any attempts to fly in troops is also futile without air superiority. Air transports will just get shot down, or drop troops in the middle of the arctic before getting blown the fuck up.

Their premiere air superiority fighters do not have enough fuel to to engage in combat over Fort Mac without refueling before entering Canada. Even then, it will be a very quick CAP before having to fly back for more fuel.

That and any attack by Russia would ilicit a NATO response.

[Kloubek]

What is with this fear mongering? Ze Russians are coming!

No... no they aren't. We're safe. :closed:

[ZenOps]

Originally posted by hampstor


Unlikely - any successful ground offensive into Canada over the Arctic would require air superiority first and foremost. It is foolish to send in ground forces otherwise.

Any attempts to fly in troops is also futile without air superiority. Air transports will just get shot down, or drop troops in the middle of the arctic before getting blown the fuck up.

Their premiere air superiority fighters do not have enough fuel to to engage in combat over Fort Mac without refueling before entering Canada. Even then, it will be a very quick CAP before having to fly back for more fuel.

That and any attack by Russia would ilicit a NATO response.

Russia - no probably not.

A ground force by a rogue nation - perhaps.

[EK 2.0]

Originally posted by ZorroAMG

Maverick, you'll get your rear when you get there. If you don't, give me a call. I'll fly with you.



"R.I.O."...not rear...;)

[ZenOps]

BTW For anyone that is wondering why anyone would invade Fort Mac:

Any successful invasion of the US at any level worth mentioning requires that the US forces be imobilized with broken communication. The easiest way to imobilize US military force is to stop the oil from getting there. The primary single area of importance that the US can rely on is Alberta oil if a war should break out (then Texas, then Alaska) Without those three areas actively pumping oil - the US could at most maintian a war of about six months with anything "mechanized", planes, helicopters, tanks, APC, everthing but nuclear subs.

If someone actually managed to bag a refinery in the US - the entire of the US military force might have two weeks worth of fuel - which is incredible that the US has left itself so open to such a glaring deficiency.

While other countries may love Canada - Many dislike the US.

And the most effective way to hurt the US would be to stop the oil flowing.