Science Minister wont say if he believes in evolution

[kertejud2]

Canada's science minister, the man at the centre of the controversy over federal funding cuts to researchers, won't say if he believes in evolution.

“I'm not going to answer that question. I am a Christian, and I don't think anybody asking a question about my religion is appropriate,” Gary Goodyear, the federal Minister of State for Science and Technology, said in an interview with The Globe and Mail.

A funding crunch, exacerbated by cuts in the January budget, has left many senior researchers across the county scrambling to find the money to continue their experiments.

Some have expressed concern that Mr. Goodyear, a chiropractor from Cambridge, Ont., is suspicious of science, perhaps because he is a creationist.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20090317.wgoodyear16/BNStory/National/home


So while Obama appoints an actual scientist to the same position, we're the ones with a guy who thinks a question about a fundamental aspect of science is an attack on his religion?!

So he's not a scientist, he's hardly a real fucking doctor, and he gets this position? What the fuck? Now while him resigning and having somebody actually qualified to run the position is what should happen, I can't imagine it will. He's likely qualified for many cabinet spots, ones where his religious bias wouldn't get in the way, but why the hell would we put a damn creationist as Minister of Science and Technology?

[ninefourfour]

:facepalm:

[hash]

Originally posted by kertejud2
but why the hell would we put a damn creationist as Minister of Science and Technology?

Looking at your post, he's likely more intelligent than you are.

[Eleanor]

Only in America






















;)

[kertejud2]

Originally posted by hash


Looking at your post, he's likely more intelligent than you are.

What can I say, I'm just the way God made me.

[R154]

If there should be a man to govern scientific progress, I would think he should be educated in the fundamental 3, and should be fairly transparent with his views, considering the greatly effect the decisions he makes.

[TKRIS]

He should be fired.

EDIT: A bit of reading on more on what actually happens indicates I should change my opinion to "He should probably be fired".

[DayGlow]

How does one's belief in origin effect their decision on disease research?

[kertejud2]

Originally posted by DayGlow
How does one's belief in origin effect their decision on disease research?

I'd like to know how someone who isn't willing to make a stance on evolution and play the religion card would like to explain drug resistant bacteria.

[mazdavirgin]

Originally posted by DayGlow
How does one's belief in origin effect their decision on disease research?

Am I the only one more outraged that we have a Chiropractor being the minister of Science and Technology :\ Chiropractors are a form of quackery. Never mind his views on evolution a bloody Chiropractor?!

[eljefe]

Originally posted by kertejud2


I'd like to know how someone who isn't willing to make a stance on evolution and play the religion card would like to explain drug resistant bacteria.


In a March 2009 interview, the Globe and Mail asked Goodyear if he believed in evolution. He responded, "I am a Christian, and I don't think anybody asking a question about my religion is appropriate." While some scientists and educators expressed shock at this, others defended the minister, citing statistics that show a majority of Canadians believe God played a role in creation. Later that day, however, Goodyear admitted to believing in evolution

Rest easy- he is a believer in evolution

edit for link- http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20090317.wevol0317/BNStory/politics/home

[berbatov]

Originally posted by kertejud2
What can I say, I'm just the way God made me.

Originally posted by kertejud2
I'd like to know how someone who isn't willing to make a stance on evolution and play the religion card would like to explain drug resistant bacteria.
Why would someone who believes in creationism waste time explaining it to you ? You do not provide anything in return.

[BlueGoblin]

Originally posted by mazdavirgin


Am I the only one more outraged that we have a Chiropractor being the minister of Science and Technology :\ Chiropractors are a form of quackery. Never mind his views on evolution a bloody Chiropractor?!


Trust me, you are not the only one here thinking the same thing.

[kertejud2]

Originally posted by berbatov


Why would someone who believes in creationism waste time explaining it to you ? You do not provide anything in return.

What would I provide? A gift? Or are you suggesting I explain to the Minister of Science how science works in order to get his viewpoint?

[method]

If you watched CTV just now, he said he believes in evolution, but wouldn't answer the question at the time because he didn't think it was relevant.

Danced around it for quite a while, though.

Total BS lol

[Thomas Gabriel]

What if God created life, and within life was the inherent trait of evolution?

[kertejud2]

Originally posted by method
If you watched CTV just now, he said he believes in evolution, but wouldn't answer the question at the time because he didn't think it was relevant.

Danced around it for quite a while, though.

Total BS lol

So we're either stuck with a Science and Tech minister who is so afraid at upsetting his God-fearing constituents he's willing to pass of the acknowledgement of evolution as irrelevant, or he is actually that clueless.

Obviously its the former, but it still doesn't give me much confidence in the man. Now he's managed to piss off people on both sides.



Originally posted by Thomas Gabriel
What if God created life, and within life was the inherent trait of evolution?

Evolution still exists then. God and evolution are not exclusive, religious belief in creation and evolution seem to be, judging by the sidestepping of the question.

[BlueGoblin]

Originally posted by Thomas Gabriel
What if God created life, and within life was the inherent trait of evolution?

If that's what you believe then you are probably a Deist. It's not an uncommon notion of belief.

[TKRIS]

Originally posted by mazdavirgin


Am I the only one more outraged that we have a Chiropractor being the minister of Science and Technology :\ Chiropractors are a form of quackery. Never mind his views on evolution a bloody Chiropractor?!

Did not know this.
I'll go back to my initial position. He should be fired.

[berbatov]

He is not a Deist by what was said. Not a modern nor a classic one.

Why would he be fired ? L:ook at the most important position in Canada - Governor General - she was a tv anchor - do I recall correctly ?

[BlueGoblin]

Originally posted by berbatov
He is not a Deist by what was said. Not a modern nor a classic one.

Why would he be fired ? L:ook at the most important position in Canada - Governor General - she was a tv anchor - do I recall correctly ?

The notion of a Prime Motivator setting into play the actions of the natural world is Deist...

[Antonito]

Originally posted by berbatov

Why would he be fired ? L:ook at the most important position in Canada - Governor General - she was a tv anchor - do I recall correctly ?

Lol. Most important position in Canada?

Yeah, I'd imagine it must take a lot of talent to visit cities. And then visit other countries. And then visit some more countries. And then visit a city

Oh and once in a generation or two, make a decision that actually matters.....by simply putting off the decision until other people make it for her.

So yeah, a TV anchor is pretty good.

[mazdavirgin]

Originally posted by berbatov
Why would he be fired ? L:ook at the most important position in Canada - Governor General - she was a tv anchor - do I recall correctly ?

:thumbsup: She is doing a great job as far as I am concerned. She hasn't said anything stupid and does well in front of the cameras. I think she was an excellent pick for someone who represents Canada on the world scene. She is fluent in both our official languages and well spoken what more could we ask? Her position is purely ceremonial in any case but she does make a good ambassador.

[TKRIS]

He should be fired because the man in charge of science and technology in this country should be a scientist. Chiropractic treatment is, at it's best, unscientific, and at it's worst, dangerous, unethical, and potentially fatal. Additionally, this guy has a fellowship in fucking acupuncture. That's right, goddamned acupuncture!. You don't get any more quacky and unscientific than acupuncture. That's about a fucking hair away from the crystal light bed morons.

This is the guy who gets to decide what science is worth investing in, and what science funding gets cut? Jesus titty fucking christ.

[Eleanor]

Sounds like there's going to be a lot more money invested into placebo effects :D

[sputnik]

Are we really suggesting here that only Atheists should be in control of science and the decisions surrounding it?

A better question he should be asked is if he believes in the separation of church and state.

If he answers "yes"... leave him alone.

[szw]

Originally posted by sputnik
Are we really suggesting here that only Atheists should be in control of science and the decisions surrounding it?

A better question he should be asked is if he believes in the separation of church and state.

If he answers "yes"... leave him alone.

Why does everybody always say that you can't be religious and believe in evolution? I thought even the pope himself said that they can exist together.

[TKRIS]

Originally posted by sputnik
Are we really suggesting here that only Atheists should be in control of science and the decisions surrounding it?

Ummm. No. No one is suggesting that. Nice try though.

[vadeit]

Couple of us wrote up a quick form letter at work to send to our MPs

Find your MP using
http://www2.parl.gc.ca/Parlinfo/Compilations/HouseOfCommons/MemberByPostalCode.aspx?Menu=HOC

Form Letter:

Mr. MP,

I was extremely disturbed to read about your peer Federal Science Minister Gary Goodyear. His cabinet position demands an understanding of the principles of modern science, and his interpretation of a question on evolution as a question of personal religion concerns me greatly. Although he has since stated that he does in fact believe in evolution such a confusion implies he is unable to separate his personal worldview from the demands of the real world, and I do not believe this is acceptable in an elected official.

How does his personal view align with that of the Conservative Party? Can I assume that his position is that of the Conservative Party? How are cabinet positions assigned, and does experience or expertise play any role? What does your party intend to do about this?

Thank you for your time, and I look forward to your response.

Sincerely,

vadeit
101 Somewhere Street
Calgary AB

http://www.cbc.ca/technology/story/2009/03/17/tech-090317-gary-goodyear-evolution.html

http://www.cbc.ca/technology/story/2009/03/18/tech-090318-gary-goodyear-evolution.html

[Eleanor]

Originally posted by szw
Why does everybody always say that you can't be religious and believe in evolution? :werd: It really bothers me when people are convinced that being religious and believing in evolution are exclusive. Who's to say that God didn't create evolution?

[sputnik]

Originally posted by Eleanor
:werd: It really bothers me when people are convinced that being religious and believing in evolution are exclusive. Who's to say that God didn't create evolution?

:werd:

Evolution is not necessarily the issue.

Perhaps we should ask everyone if they believe in the Big Bang or not. You know. Since it is pretty much fact and stuff. Isn't it?

[GingeRRRBeef]

Originally posted by sputnik


:werd:

Evolution is not necessarily the issue.

Perhaps we should ask everyone if they believe in the Big Bang or not. You know. Since it is pretty much fact and stuff. Isn't it?

The big bang isn't fact as much as some believe the bible to be 'fact'

[Crymson]

http://www.cbc.ca/technology/story/2009/03/18/tech-090318-gary-goodyear-evolution.html

He backtracked pretty quickly. In a country as secular as Canada, it must've been obvious there was going to be outrage.

[sputnik]

Originally posted by Silver_SpecV
The big bang isn't fact as much as some believe the bible to be 'fact'

That depends on who you talk to.

At the end of the day there is still a pretty big gap when we try to figure out where the "beginning" of time was and how everything intially came to exist.

What was here before there was anything?

Where did everything initially come from?

[Eleanor]

Originally posted by Crymson
In a country as secular as Canada, it must've been obvious there was going to be outrage. Isn't it great that up here in Canada, politicians are getting heat for not believing in evolution and down in the States they have the other problem? (well, on the Republican side anyway) :rofl:

[Crymson]

Originally posted by sputnik


That depends on who you talk to.

At the end of the day there is still a pretty big gap when we try to figure out where the "beginning" of time was and how everything intially came to exist.

What was here before there was anything?

Where did everything initially come from?


Yes but isn't the answer "we don't know, lets go find out"

not

"for some reason that we're incapable of understanding, a man who lives in the clouds made it happen, and now he cares about what we do naked so we'd better revere him and believe in him without question for fear of our souls spending eternity in agony"

?

[GingeRRRBeef]

Originally posted by sputnik

That depends on who you talk to.


Exactly my point :D

[kertejud2]

Things don't seem to be getting better, the more this guy talks the more incompetent he's becoming...

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20090317.wevol0317/BNStory/politics/home


OTTAWA — Science minister Gary Goodyear now says he believes in evolution.

“Of course I do,” he told guest host Jane Taber during an appearance on the CTV program Power Play. “But it is an irrelevant question.”

“I do believe that just because you can't see it under a microscope doesn't mean it doesn't exist. It could mean we don't have a powerful enough microscope yet. So I'm not fussy on this business that we already know everything.… I think we need to recognize that we don't know.”

Evoking religion in response to a question about evolution drew heavy criticism from people like Brian Alters, an expert in evolution at McGill University in Montreal, and Jim Turk, executive director of the Canadian Association of University Teachers.

On Tuesday, Mr. Goodyear said twice during the CTV interview that he did believe in evolution.


“We are evolving every year, every decade. That's a fact, whether it is to the intensity of the sun, whether it is to, as a chiropractor, walking on cement versus anything else, whether it is running shoes or high heels, of course we are evolving to our environment. But that's not relevant and that is why I refused to answer the question. The interview was about our science and tech strategy, which is strong.”

The fact he still calls it an irrelevant question is what is pissing me off, but what the hell was this? Is this the "evolution" he believes in?

So now I'm basically convinced he's a nut, and a sidestepping and dishonest one at that. But what can you expect from a chiropractor.

[dragonone]

someone post a link to bill maher's 'religous' so this thread can save 10 pages

i still don't understand the hatred towards chiropractors tho

[canuckcarguy]

Originally posted by dragonone
someone post a link to bill maher's 'religous' so this thread can save 10 pages

i still don't understand the hatred towards chiropractors tho

Chiropractic medicine is a scam. And it's dangerous. But it's politically correct, so you won't see him get a bunch of media criticism for being a "doctor" of chiropractic "medicine".

But you harangue him as much as you like for being a Christian, because that's what passes for clever investigative journalism nowadays.

[eljefe]

Originally posted by TKRIS
He should be fired because the man in charge of science and technology in this country should be a scientist.

Well.....

Minister of Environment - Jim Prentice Occupation- Lawyer (no education or degree in meterology or environment)

Minister of Finance - Jim Flaherty Occupation Lawyer (never educated in accounting)

Minister of Health - Leona Aglukkaq Not a Doctor

Minister of Fisheries - Gail Shea Not a fisherman or marine biologist

Minister of National Defense - Peter McKay - a Lawyer, never served in the military

etc.


By your reasoning should they all be fired?

[TorqueDog]

Originally posted by eljefe
Minister of Finance - Jim Flaherty Occupation Lawyer (never educated in accounting)That is rather worrying.

[atgilchrist]

^That's why they have many, many accountants on staff. The Minister himself merely sets priorities.

[eljefe]

Originally posted by atgilchrist
^That's why they have many, many accountants on staff. The Minister himself merely sets priorities.

Exactly! That was my point in posting-




Well....
Minister of Environment - Jim Prentice Occupation- Lawyer (no education or degree in meterology or environment)

Minister of Finance - Jim Flaherty Occupation Lawyer (never educated in accounting)

Minister of Health - Leona Aglukkaq Not a Doctor

Minister of Fisheries - Gail Shea Not a fisherman or marine biologist

Minister of National Defense - Peter McKay - a Lawyer, never served in the military

in response to-



Originally posted by TKRIS
He should be fired because the man in charge of science and technology in this country should be a scientist. Chiropractic treatment is, at it's best, unscientific, and at it's worst, dangerous, unethical, and potentially fatal.

[creeper]

It's not appropriate having someone religious in this position.

[kertejud2]

Originally posted by creeper
It's not appropriate having someone religious in this position.

Its fine having somebody religious, it isn't fine having somebody use religion when it wasn't brought up to dodge questions regarding science and then finally come up with a stupid response void of any comprehension of the issue at hand when being followed up by the press.

[VWEvo]

There are religions out there that embrace evolution. By referring to religious, it seems like everyone is referring to Christians. There are other religions out there in case everyone forgot.



So saying that you can't be relifious and be Minister of Science and Technology is an absurd comment.

[HiTempguy1]

By referring to religious, it seems like everyone is referring to Christians.

You can also be Christian/catholic and still believe in evolution. The guy's just an idiot himself.

[brandon]

Originally posted by Crymson



Yes but isn't the answer "we don't know, lets go find out"

not

"for some reason that we're incapable of understanding, a man who lives in the clouds made it happen, and now he cares about what we do naked so we'd better revere him and believe in him without question for fear of our souls spending eternity in agony"

?

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: Holy hell I almost spit out my food.

[911fever]

I'm still waiting to see the half-chimp, half-human skeleton. Haven't seen it yet.. and oh yeah, Bigfoot doesn't count.
:rofl: