North Korean nuke test #2

[ZenOps]

http://www.nytimes.com/reuters/2009/05/24/world/international-korea-north-test.html?hp

Last night. Still waiting on Richter scale measurement. Its gotta be hella unnerving to be in South Korea or Japan right now, and being able to feel the manmade earthquake that these things put off.

[GQBalla]

they are just ronery

[mazdavirgin]

I don't see the big deal anyways. They can't deliver their nukes via missiles and well the second they act up the world will turn Pyongyang to glass.

[ZenOps]

Missles are only important because they are 90%+ effective.

If they do what the US did for its two nukes (using good old fashioned airplane bombers) then Kim Jong could technically use a Cessna single prop plane if hes got the nuke down to less than two tons (highly probable)

Of course - you run the risk of a bomber being shot down. Thats the main reason for using a 52 kilogram capable missle.

Theres also a 1/100 chance of simply "mailing it in" - IE: Smuggling it in a cargo ship that can take weeks - but hit any port city in the world. Weight would not matter at all in that scenario.

Early reports say its was a 20 kiloton, and not a 1 kiloton like the first test.

[Tik-Tok]

Originally posted by mazdavirgin
I don't see the big deal anyways. They can't deliver their nukes via missiles and well the second they act up the world will turn Pyongyang to glass.

:facepalm:

[nonlinear]

Originally posted by ZenOps
Missles are only important because they are 90%+ effective.

If they do what the US did for its two nukes (using good old fashioned airplane bombers) then Kim Jong could technically use a Cessna single prop plane if hes got the nuke down to less than two tons (highly probable)

Of course - you run the risk of a bomber being shot down. Thats the main reason for using a 52 kilogram capable missle.

Theres also a 1/100 chance of simply "mailing it in" - IE: Smuggling it in a cargo ship that can take weeks - but hit any port city in the world. Weight would not matter at all in that scenario.

Early reports say its was a 20 kiloton, and not a 1 kiloton like the first test.

dude, you are seriously a freak sometimes. er... all the time haha.

[sputnik]

Wow. Looks like quite a few people are forgetting the relationship North Korea has with China.

[95EagleAWD]

Originally posted by mazdavirgin
I don't see the big deal anyways. They can't deliver their nukes via missiles and well the second they act up the world will turn Pyongyang to glass.

They can't hit us, but there's plenty of other targets around the Korean peninsula.

[nonlinear]

stop being so alarmist. these days nukes are designed and intended as deterrents - not as weapons.

[ghust]

Originally posted by nonlinear
stop being so alarmist. these days nukes are designed and intended as deterrents - not as weapons.

they just wanted to join the club

[you&me]

Originally posted by ghust


they just wanted to join the club

So they won't be ronery any more?

[B4tMan]

Originally posted by mazdavirgin
I don't see the big deal anyways. They can't deliver their nukes via missiles and well the second they act up the world will turn Pyongyang to glass.

Ignorance is bliss. There's a reason the people you would call "edumacated" are worried about this and the local markets took a small dip.

[TKRIS]

Someone really should sit Kim Jong-Il down and explain to him that all this is futile.
No matter how many nuclear tests he performs, or how advanced a delivery system he's able to develop, none of it matters.
Nothing he does, or will ever do, will successfully eclipse the images of puppets, comically large glasses, and a nonsensical musical number, that the mere mention of his name evokes.


It is inevtible.

[Sugarphreak]

....

[mazdavirgin]

Originally posted by B4tMan
Ignorance is bliss. There's a reason the people you would call "edumacated" are worried about this and the local markets took a small dip.

No it is not ignorance it is simply the realization that all this saber rattling is pointless. In any case the true mark of lack of education would be ad Hominem attacks... There is no real reason to worry simply because a nuclear launch is a non zero sum game. Simply put everyone loses regardless when the nukes fly. So why are we sitting here worrying about a non event?

If Kim is insane enough to launch or to provoke warfare you can be assured the Korean peninsula will be transformed into a glassy wasteland. The solution to this is to simply keep up the embargo and stop sending them any aid whatsoever. There is no point negotiating with them just let them sit in their corner. Russia and China can feed them with aid but I can guarantee if North Korean provokes any military response it will be standing all alone.

[Toma]

Yeah, big fucking deal.

Everyone should have nukes, or no one should have nukes. End of story.

The only Nuke nations that will use their nukes for first strike are the US and Israel.

N Korea, iran etc are the last of my 'worries'.

[Canmorite]

Originally posted by TKRIS

Nothing he does, or will ever do, will successfully eclipse the images of puppets, comically large glasses, and a nonsensical musical number, that the mere mention of his name evokes.


It is inevtible.

Ya, everytime I hear NK or Kim Jon Ill I immediately think of Team America and start laughing. I just can't take him seriously, even know how fucking busy he is.

[Xtrema]

Remember NK shipment of weapons to middle east?

are you scare now?

It doesn't need missiles to be dangerous.

[Hakkola]

Originally posted by Toma

The only Nuke nations that will use their nukes for first strike are the US and Israel.


Life is purple.

Citation or argument is not necessary.

[ZenOps]

Originally posted by TKRIS
Someone really should sit Kim Jong-Il down and explain to him that all this is futile.
No matter how many nuclear tests he performs, or how advanced a delivery system he's able to develop, none of it matters.
Nothing he does, or will ever do, will successfully eclipse the images of puppets, comically large glasses, and a nonsensical musical number, that the mere mention of his name evokes.


It is inevtible.

A lot of people said the same thing for the planned US man to the moon mission.

It was a completely useless endeavor - really only used to boost morale of the nation at extreme cost. Other than the technology that was gained by its development (which arguably would have happened to any sector that much money was put into) it was a complete waste of money, time and resources that could have been put to better use.

If the best joke that can be found against him is the size of his glasses then we are all in serious trouble.

[Antonito]

Originally posted by ZenOps



If the best joke that can be found against him is the size of his glasses then we are all in serious trouble.

Well, there's also the fact that his country is in a complete shambles and he's one of the worst leaders ever short of those who commit wholesale genocide on their own people.

But hey, don't let me stop you from idolizing this guy like in all the other threads about N Korea

[B4tMan]

Originally posted by Antonito


Well, there's also the fact that his country is in a complete shambles and he's one of the worst leaders

Was thinking we're talking N Korea, why did we switch to US ? :nut:

[Gibbons]

Originally posted by B4tMan


Was thinking we're talking N Korea, why did we switch to US ? :nut:
I just sharted. :)

[Hakkola]

Originally posted by B4tMan


Was thinking we're talking N Korea, why did we switch to US ? :nut:

ZenOps + Toma = Guaranteed mention of the U.S of A.

[thetransporter]

north korea is the least of our worries..

israel has illegal "nukes" as lemmings call them.

[gatorade]

why exactly is anyone here worrying about N Korea, any agression from them is going to be directed at South Korea or Japan

[Sugarphreak]

....

[ApexDrift]

Originally posted by gatorade
why exactly is anyone here worrying about N Korea, any agression from them is going to be directed at South Korea or Japan

:facepalm:

[alloroc]

Originally posted by gatorade
why exactly is anyone here worrying about N Korea, any agression from them is going to be directed at South Korea or Japan

Don't you know?

North Korea is going to invade Fort Mac!

[ZenOps]

Originally posted by gatorade
why exactly is anyone here worrying about N Korea, any agression from them is going to be directed at South Korea or Japan

Ok, that makes two nukes, if they use one on each. They supposedly have immediate capacity for six - with more as the years pass.

[alloroc]

Originally posted by ZenOps


Ok, that makes two nukes, if they use one on each. They supposedly have immediate capacity for six - with more as the years pass.

wow ... just wow.

You were smoking up again this weekend weren't you?

[Xtrema]

Originally posted by gatorade
why exactly is anyone here worrying about N Korea, any agression from them is going to be directed at South Korea or Japan

OMG! where am I going to get my tentacle porn without Japan?

[ZenOps]

Originally posted by alloroc


wow ... just wow.

You were smoking up again this weekend weren't you?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yongbyon_Nuclear_Scientific_Research_Center

Its well known that North Korea has enough Plutonium and Uranium for at least six nukes right now. It is derived from the uptime of the Plutonium breeding capacity of their one main reactor YongByon.

Plutonium core nukes are the ones capable of 20 kiloton+ yeilds.

They however - do take some time to assemble, even when they may actually have the refined materials to create six right this very day - it will take them at least a few months to assemble it into an actual bomb.

Assuming the first test was a pure uranium nuke of maybe 800 kilograms (1 kiloton) the second being much more like the second 'Fat Man' nuke that the US made (plutonium core, 20 kiloton) A third mostly plutonium nuke with thin uranium shell - will probably be made before years end with possibly an 50 kiloton yeild.

Still a far cry from the 50 Megaton Tsar bomb from Russia.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tsar_bomb

But 20KT is definitely adequate for a frying a city of a million people.

BTW: I'm fascinated by Kim Jong Il - hes not quite as racially, linguistically and religiously zealous as Rob Anders is *Zing, badoom boom*

And: Technically, North Korea probably wouldn't ever make a 500kiloton test nuke, as the testing site they have would not be sufficent size to contain the blast - and they don't have the luxury of blowing up an island offshore IE: You don't test a megaton nuke in your own country, even underground.

[Legless_Marine2]

Originally posted by ZenOps


It was a completely useless endeavor - really only used to boost morale of the nation at extreme cost. Other than the technology that was gained by its development (which arguably would have happened to any sector that much money was put into) it was a complete waste of money, time and resources that could have been put to better use.


No entirely. "Monunmentalism", or the showcasing of great achievements, is a necessary activity in one's inter-state relations. It shows that you have sufficient surplus wealth to entice others to trade with you, but also that you have sufficient surplus wealth that they should not attack you.

Same goes for pyramids, colossus, nuclear weapons, etc.

[alloroc]

I ask this question ...

Originally posted by alloroc
You were smoking up again this weekend weren't you?


Note the answer is either yes or no ... and you post.


Originally posted by ZenOps




http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yongbyon_Nuclear_Scientific_Research_Center

Its well known that North Korea has enough Plutonium and Uranium for at least six nukes right now. It is derived from the uptime of the Plutonium breeding capacity of their one main reactor YongByon.

Plutonium core nukes are the ones capable of 20 kiloton+ yeilds.

They however - do take some time to assemble, even when they may actually have the refined materials to create six right this very day - it will take them at least a few months to assemble it into an actual bomb.

Assuming the first test was a pure uranium nuke of maybe 800 kilograms (1 kiloton) the second being much more like the second 'Fat Man' nuke that the US made (plutonium core, 20 kiloton) A third mostly plutonium nuke with thin uranium shell - will probably be made before years end with possibly an 50 kiloton yeild.

Still a far cry from the 50 Megaton Tsar bomb from Russia.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tsar_bomb

But 20KT is definitely adequate for a frying a city of a million people.

BTW: I'm fascinated by Kim Jong Il - hes not quite as racially, linguistically and religiously zealous as Rob Anders is *Zing, badoom boom*

And: Technically, North Korea probably wouldn't ever make a 500kiloton test nuke, as the testing site they have would not be sufficent size to contain the blast - and they don't have the luxury of blowing up an island offshore IE: You don't test a megaton nuke in your own country, even underground.

So I can only conclude that you were not only smoking weed but using LSD this weekend as well.

[ZenOps]

Originally posted by Legless_Marine2


No entirely. "Monunmentalism", or the showcasing of great achievements, is a necessary activity in one's inter-state relations. It shows that you have sufficient surplus wealth to entice others to trade with you, but also that you have sufficient surplus wealth that they should not attack you.

Same goes for pyramids, colossus, nuclear weapons, etc.

Yes, you are absolutely right there, but it only works for a certain period of time.

Noone dared attack the Egyptians back in the Pyramid days. The Hanging Gardens also was a great achievement that pretty well made other nations cringe at the thought of invading - but later on actually encouraged them to invade (plundering a now decadent and militarily lazy society that would be unwilling and unprepared to fight.)

I imagine its much the same with the Great Wall.

[ZenOps]

The US had a whole bunch of islands to test on:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pacific_Proving_Grounds

105 nukes, all the way up to 15 Megatons were tested on those poor little islands.


The greatest fear I have - is that North Korea is basically done with their testing now, because they really don't have adequate physical space to test the higher yeilds. Especially considering the local earthquake damage.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:US_fallout_exposure.png

Which means the next nuke made - will probably be made for deployment.

[Legless_Marine2]

Originally posted by ZenOps
The US had a whole bunch of islands to test on:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pacific_Proving_Grounds

105 nukes, all the way up to 15 Megatons were tested on those poor little islands.


The greatest fear I have - is that North Korea is basically done with their testing now, because they really don't have adequate physical space to test the higher yeilds. Especially considering the local earthquake damage.

Which means the next nuke made - will probably be made for deployment.

What happened to the polynesians serves to show what happens when you *can't* defend yourself. Not having anything the Americans wanted to steal, America settled for using Polynesia as their nuclear testing range.

That being said, Polynesia got far worse from the French.

I disagree that Korea will be testing their nuke abroad.. they don't have any defenseless colonies abroad that they can use for testing.

It's pretty clear to me that these shows are just for deterrence...

[Nismorphed]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v15/obsidian/funnays/i20has20a20missel.jpg

[71car]

One thing I knew for sure - Kimmy boy is crazy enough to go for another nuke test. They still haven't solved the problem of fitting a nuke small enough inside one of their missiles. It's logical that they'd want a 20-Kt nuke warhead to be as small enough to use for their attacks.

What a joke when US and other nations are just all talks and no action, even the sanctions aren't good enough. What next - little Kimmy boy plans to get new bigger glasses? :rofl: