Still getting paid after I quit my job???

[charmin]

I worked at a company for 4 months (contract from Jan. to Apr.) and left afterwards. But I've received paychecks for another month, even though I don't work there anymore. Should I contact that company to alert them? And is the money still legally mine?

[Spoons]

Originally posted by charmin
I worked at a company for 4 months (contract from Jan. to Apr.) and left afterwards. But I've received paychecks for another month, even though I don't work there anymore. Should I contact that company to alert them? And is the money still legally mine?

Morally, yes.

But fuck ethics, take the money and run!

[w_man]

Sshhh ....

go to vegas and enjoy urself.

[lint]

contracts are typically paid net 30 days. Did you have a month delay for your first paycheck when you started your contract?

[charmin]

nope. I got paychecks every 2 weeks. When i got another paycheck in mid May, i thought there was a 2 week delay in my paychecks until i just received another one. Thats when i checked my account and found out that there was no 2 week delay in my paychecks.

I don't know the legal issues behind all this.. Is it still mine even if i tell the company?

I'm guessing there's some sort of law in saying nothing and keeping the money...

[lint]

If they find an error they have every right to ask for it back. If you don't want to notify the company, keep quiet and don't spend the money in case they ask for it back. the honest thing to do would be to let them know and clear things up.

[top_speed]

If it was a direct deposit,they have you bank info and they can go through your bank account and withdraw it out as soon as they found out there was an error. i know this because my manager told me he wasn't going to pay for my vacation and then when i check my bank account and found out they did pay me, i kept quite and after 1 day it was withdrawn by company (i should have withdrawed it right away). :banghead:

[broken_legs]

When you lost your job did you get a written notice ending your employment?


Has anything been sent to you formally ending your employment?

Maybe you are still working there

Maybe you have a verbal contract with your old manager to do consulting

Maybe he agreed to pay you over an extended vacation

Hard for them to say that you don't work there if they never gave you written notice of termination

[bubbley]

KEEP IT

[01RedDX]

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[anschutz_92]

I see you being taken to small claims court in your future...

[Doozer]

Originally posted by top_speed
after 1 day it was withdrawn by company (i should have withdrawed it right away). :banghead: Oh come on. Either you've got your facts mixed up, or something else isn't right with this story. A company can't go in and simply withdraw funds from your account. Especially without written consent, no matter how they got there in the first place.

If a real company overpaid and needed money back, they would submit a bill/invoice to you for the difference, and then likely send it to a collections agency. For a real company, the paper trail needs to be accounted for or there are huge legal issues for fraud and doctoring their books. They can't just take money back out of a bank account.

Paying you is the same as paying another company for products or services. Can you imagine if Google went into Amazon's bank account and took some money back for some service they overpaid for? Good grief.


For the OP: Honestly, you want to get this cleared up with the company ASAP. This kind of thing cannot turn out well for you. Eventually someone will find out, and you'll be on the hook for the money. Even if there's grey area, this isn't something you want to have come up in 6 months or a year and get dragged into court. Then there could be fraud charges (obviously you know you're not entitled to that money or you wouldn't have made the thread). It's a huge mess - take your chance to set it right before it costs you a lot.

[broken_legs]

^^^ Nah forget that man

If you didn't get written notice of your termination you are still gainfully employed.

Make sure you walk in to the building and stare at the security camera say hi to people a couple times a week.

Maybe park your car there once in a while.

All proof that you were still working there.

[bspot]

Drain your bank account, close it, change your name and move.

Case closed.

[ZorroAMG]

Keep the money if you can afford to pay it back when they ask for it.

They will.

[signature7]

I'd say give it back, it's not worth the probable hassle that will incur.

Look what happened to this couple from a screw up-


http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/australasia/new-zealand-couple-vanish-after-banks-1634m-mistake-1689232.html

Would you take that and GO?

[Grogador]

Contractors live (and die) on reputation. Is it worth risking your career?

[Gooseberry]

Originally posted by signature7
I'd say give it back, it's not worth the probable hassle that will incur.

Look what happened to this couple from a screw up-


http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/australasia/new-zealand-couple-vanish-after-banks-1634m-mistake-1689232.html

Would you take that and GO?

That situation isn't even close to comparable...

[Antonito]

This happened to my wife, and sure enough 6 months later here comes the letter basically saying "pay or go to court to dispute our claim before it goes to collections"

[charmin]

UPDATE:

Just so you guys aren't hanging in suspense :rolleyes: ..I called the company back up and they have to go through a formal process and where they send me a letter requesting that I pay them back. I have a year to pay it back in the event that I spent the money..which I didn't.

Apparently, they would've kept paying me until they rechecked their system in August..so I would have to pay it back eventually.


Oh well..i guess i have to work for paychecks now :rofl:

[superboss]

Just as I was going to say Merry x-mas, damm so close..

[01RedDX]

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[Super_Geo]

http://www.eoinbutler.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/03/bank_error_in_your_favor.jpg

[malcolmk14]

They cannot collect any further back than 6 months. So if they checked their system in August, you still would've had to pay it back.

If they checked their system in December though, the money from May/June would've been all yours.

[Mar]

Should have put it in a high interest savings account and given them back the principle when accounting noticed the error.

[mr2mike]

Originally posted by charmin
UPDATE:


Apparently, they would've kept paying me until they rechecked their system in August..

...they fixed the glitch!

http://dereksemmler.com/images/miltonwaddams.jpg

[Mar]

Originally posted by mr2mike


...they fixed the glitch!

http://dereksemmler.com/images/miltonwaddams.jpg
haha ya, did they ask for their stapler back? If not then you officially still work there.

[JordanEG6]

BUMP, so no new thread required.

I actually ran into this problem recently with the company I work for, except I didn't quit, I switched from "employee" on their payroll to a contractor position.

- Switched to contractor in February.
- Contractor Invoice for February submitted at the end of February.
- Invoice will be paid paid out to me at the end of March (1 month lag).
- I recently got an "extra" bi-weekly employee paycheck for the first half of March, and assumingly again at the end of March, along with the paid out February contractor paycheck.

Same deal here? Let them know? Would I have to pay it back or would it just be deducted off my contractor paycheck? If they deduct it off my contractor paycheck, would they deduct the net or the gross? Because I have automatically paid EI, CPP and income tax already with this "extra" employee paycheck.

[Sugarphreak]

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[revelations]

Originally posted by JordanEG6
BUMP, so no new thread required.

I actually ran into this problem recently with the company I work for, except I didn't quit, I switched from "employee" on their payroll to a contractor position.

- Switched to contractor in February.
- Contractor Invoice for February submitted at the end of February.
- Invoice will be paid paid out to me at the end of March (1 month lag).
- I recently got an "extra" bi-weekly employee paycheck for the first half of March, and assumingly again at the end of March, along with the paid out February contractor paycheck.

Same deal here? Let them know? Would I have to pay it back or would it just be deducted off my contractor paycheck? If they deduct it off my contractor paycheck, would they deduct the net or the gross? Because I have automatically paid EI, CPP and income tax already with this "extra" employee paycheck.

Hope the letters CRA and PSB mean something to you.....:nut:

[Sugarphreak]

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[msommers]

Yeah I think the CRA may be probing Albertan contractors. Guy on our last job got a letter from the CRA about his contractor/consulting status and he's shitting his pants because the tax penalties would be in the tens of thousands. The guys in the field shouldn't be as worried as the guys downtown if they're using all the company's resources like office space, computers, email, phone etc.

[Sugarphreak]

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[JordanEG6]

Originally posted by revelations


Hope the letters CRA and PSB mean something to you.....:nut:

:nut: I am fully aware the differences and consequences of the contractor/PSB/employee scenario. I've been a contractor for 6 years, I've only recently switched to staff temporarily to purchase a home under a 'stable'/verified income. I took possession last year so now I am switching back to something I am more comfortable and flexible with.

My accountant and I try to meet the criteria to stay under the contracting requirements (multiple clients, proper book keeping, personal office equipment and space, also the company that I'm contracting from charges me rent on an hourly basis).

[msommers]

Originally posted by Sugarphreak
They don't have nearly enough resources to do a massive sweep, so the guy either was either flagged by someone or some unusal action, made too many or unreasonable expense claims, or is just unlucky.

Usually it is the accountants that land them in hot water, truth is that most accountants are idiots

I wish I could share the same level of confidence and certainty surrounding the issue.

Jordan if the CRA came after you, you can at least provide that you have real business expenses and a pool of clients. It's people who do "consulting" and the only expense they have is corporate insurance to try and justify they have risk, meanwhile working for the same company and reporting to the same guy for years. It's quite the racket

[busdepot]

Originally posted by msommers
Yeah I think the CRA may be probing Albertan contractors. Guy on our last job got a letter from the CRA about his contractor/consulting status and he's shitting his pants because the tax penalties would be in the tens of thousands. The guys in the field shouldn't be as worried as the guys downtown if they're using all the company's resources like office space, computers, email, phone etc.

THIS. CRA is actually doing a large push in Alberta watching PSB's, and it is very, very directed in Calgary. There have been multiple CRA circulars that accountants should have access with updates to this. They do have a set amount of staff who are dedicated to looking at certain things or trends. Automobile expenses were the "in" issues for a few years now there's a growing push for more effort in finding PSB's. If you don't have criteria met for being a contractor, know that they are actively looking for you.



Originally posted by Sugarphreak
They don't have nearly enough resources to do a massive sweep, so the guy either was either flagged by someone or some unusal action, made too many or unreasonable expense claims, or is just unlucky.

Usually it is the accountants that land them in hot water, truth is that most accountants are idiots

LOL. They do and they are. Clients are the ones with the expenses who tell the accountants what they want to deduct even when advised not to, remember that :thumbsup: There's lots of cowboys out there, notably engineers in Calgary, who think they can play that game and win. Some do, lots don't.

Mom and Pop's Tax Service and H&R block who will do your returns for $50 while you get a slurpee aren't accountants. Most professional accountants I know are actually very bright so I'd be careful about painting a whole profession with that brush.

[Sugarphreak]

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[msommers]

Originally posted by Sugarphreak
It is worth it if you can figure it out, I paid 10.9% total tax on my personal income this year... even getting a 350$ refund :rofl:




This is all true, if there was a quick way to find PSB's CRA would be all over it. However consider that for them, all they can see is your business income and expenses... they acutally don't know where the money (one client or many) is coming from unless they audit you.

So to hide from them, you can tailor your expenses in a way that appears to operate like a legit small business. You shouldn't have zero deductions, but also you shouldn't have more than about 5-7K max. You should use a flat simple GST rate for the simple reason that the less information you give the better.


This said, I've gone back to employee recently

11% ?! Jesus

[Sugarphreak]

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[busdepot]

Originally posted by Sugarphreak

This is all true, if there was a quick way to find PSB's CRA would be all over it. However consider that for them, all they can see is your business income and expenses... they acutally don't know where the money (one client or many) is coming from unless they audit you.

So to hide from them, you can tailor your expenses in a way that appears to operate like a legit small business. You shouldn't have zero deductions, but also you shouldn't have more than about 5-7K max. You should use a flat simple GST rate for the simple reason that the less information you give the better.

This said, I've gone back to employee recently

There are ways many to tell very quickly. Single shareholder or family shareholder companies who pay dividends or salaries to a single person or to family members are easy identifiers. CRA knows who the shareholders are and they know who's getting paid from the corp through T-Slips and your personal tax returns. Then a quick look at what kind of operating expenses you have and the NAICS code you have to fill in on the return can help identify your business as a PSB from miles away. Oh, your corp pays rental expense that's the same amount of your rental income on your personal tax? Oh, your corp's biggest expenses are meals, telephone and vehicle? Oh, you don't pay wages to anyone but family? Sure there will be some false positives turned up, but those people will submit some information and a few questions answered and it goes away. Others though, well they'll be bent over for a deserved fucking from the man. Trust me, you're not the next Jeff Skilling with those "tricks".

There's no golden rule of thumb for expenses and what's reasonable or and what's not. 5-7K is complete bullshit. You earn $200,000 and had 5-7K in expenses in your corp? You sound like a legit business already. Enjoy your CRA audit and $300/hr fees to a CA firm. That's not at all what a "legitimate" small business's taxes look like at all. Using flat metrics like a specific dollar amount is maybe one of the worst tax "tips" you can give. It's that kind of mentality that will put you on the receiving end of a $100,000 reassessment.

You can cheat your friends, you can cheat businesses, you can cheat your boss, you can cheat your staff, you can cheat your wife, but don't try to cheat the government. That's only one that's 100% not worth it. Why not just pay the tax you actually owe?

[msommers]

How far back could they go? I've heard 7 years!

[Sugarphreak]

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[busdepot]

Jeff Skilling is the guy who used the accounting magic to make Enron what it was at its zenith. He really was a brilliant guy, they just got out of control and it came crumbling down. The house of cards got too big.

Every case is different. Riskiness doesn't mean you're eligible for deductions, though. You can be self employed and be 100% legit. There are perfectly reasonable people who should be able to deduct things others can't. Realtors are a good example. They need their phones and their cars for work. Fair play. I don't know what you do, or how you do your finances. I'm sure you've done your homework on the PSB rules and where you stand. I'm talking about the shit ton of people in Calgary who haven't and think they're too cool for school with taxes. My uncle was one of them and lost his house from it.

But lets say you work at Suncor from 8am-5pm during the week at their office, abiding by their rules, using their computers, with no right to sub-out work, getting their benefits under their plans, chances are, you shouldn't be deducting your car, your gas, your phone and your lunch. These are the people who need to check themselves before they get their "expenses" disallowed for 7 years plus penalties and interest. Mmmm, mmm, mmm, I smell a nice long vacation in my future from those fees :)

I'm all for taking what's yours when it comes from taxes. If I can lower my effective tax rates through running my finances a certain way, I'm ready to have a go. I think we can agree there. Do your homework. But there are limits to where the legitimacy ends and the evasion starts.

[mazdavirgin]

Originally posted by Sugarphreak
Absolute worst case scenario… theY reject the tax deduction and in turn deny all of my expense claims. Just so happens I have all of that money sitting in a corporate account… just in case. It makes a nice rainy day fund, and if they never come for it then I will keep it.

I would encourage everybody to take as many tax deductions as they qualify for, it is just the smart and legal thing to do. But hey, If you want to pay more taxes, be my guest.

That's not the worst case scenario. Worst case is they find you guilty of tax evasion and add punitive penalties to the money owed. You might find yourself owing significantly more than the amount you claimed in expenses.

[Sugarphreak]

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[Env-Consultant]

http://www.cra-arc.gc.ca/nwsrm/cnvctns/ab/menu-eng.html

Thought you guys might find these interesting...

[Env-Consultant]

Originally posted by Sugarphreak
Ok... this isn't the US, CRA can't find you guilty of tax evasion, lol. CRA isn't even part of the government, they are a crown corporation acting on behalf of them.

So no, that isn't the worse case scenario... it isn't even a plausible scenario :rofl:

If they feel you deliberately mislead, falsified or filed your taxes incorrectly you can face a 50% penalty on the amount you owe. You have to do something pretty bad to get that.

I think there are a bit harsher penalties than you're relaying - unless I'm missing something?

When individuals are convicted of income tax and goods and services tax (GST) evasion, they must still repay the full amount of taxes owing, plus interest and any civil penalties that may be assessed by the CRA. In addition, the court may fine them up to 200% of the taxes evaded and impose a jail term of up to five years.

http://www.cra-arc.gc.ca/nwsrm/cnvctns/ab/ab130612-eng.html

[Sugarphreak]

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[Sugarphreak]

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