The Official 2009 German Grand Prix Thread

[bituerbo]

http://img200.imageshack.us/img200/5507/nurburgring.jpg

Nurburg
Race Date: 12 Jul 2009
Number of Laps: 60
Circuit Length: 5.148
Race Distance: 308.863 km
Lap Record: 1:29.468 - M Schumacher (2004)

Past Winners:

2007 Fernando Alonso McLaren
2005 Fernando Alonso Renault
2004 Michael Schumacher Ferrari
2003 Ralf Schumacher Williams

The Nurburgring returns to the F1 calendar in 2009 after agreeing a deal with Germany's other F1 track, Hockenheim, to alternate hosting the German GP. The Nurburgring first entered the grand prix action in 1984 with a European Grand Prix, but lost out to Hockenheim for the right to stage the German equivalent. The old circuit was 14 miles long and fast and dangerous by many standards. Its demise came soon after Niki Lauda's horrific crash. After progressive improvements the Nurburgring Grand Prix now provides a fast and forgiving venue. There are wide run-off areas and large gravel traps add greatly to the safety feature. The circuit hosted the 1998 Luxembourg Grand Prix.

Because it's never too early to get excited!

[DJ Lazy]

Original Sig... :rolleyes:

[bituerbo]

Originally posted by DJ Lazy
Original Sig... :rolleyes:

Do you knot see wut I did thar?

[DJ Lazy]

Originally posted by bituerbo


Do you knot see wut I did thar?


Yes, you stole my sig and inverted it.... HOW GENIUS of you... :rolleyes:

[Chris Elyea]

I know it is still a ways off, but the long term forecast has taken a turn for the worse. Rain and 13 on Friday, cloudy and 17 on Saturday, and rain and 18 on Sunday. Even if the rain is on Sunday night (which is what they're calling for), is this too cold for the Brawns? We might see a race after all!

[buh_buh]

is it? FP1 is tomorrow.
And by worse I think you mean better. Rain = better.

[Chris Elyea]

Sorry, yeah, been living in Cowtown for 11 years now, so I've developed the habit of not trusting any weather forecast made more than 15 minutes in advance. However, I think even the Germans were predicting more sun when I checked earlier in the week.

Yes, rain is much better! Makes the on-track action as much of a circus as what happens off the track.

[ryanallan]

cool shot. amazing how far we have come :thumbsup:

http://www.motorsport.com/photos/f1/2009/ger/f1-2009-ger-xp-0005.jpg

some promo for Radical. looks a titty but nippley ! haha

http://www.motorsport.com/photos/f1/2009/ger/f1-2009-ger-xp-0092.jpg

[scary_perry]

MINARDI FTW!!!

Is that Force India now?

I like Hockenheim better. :eek:

[DJ Lazy]

I'm down for a wet race!:D We've had a few hot/dry ones lately (minus British)

Amazing the differences in those 2 Mclarens.... Insane advancement in aerodynamics... even if it is the worst aero on the grid...:rofl:

[ryanallan]

New Mega DD for McLaren

http://premium.f1-live.com/f1/photos-hires/2009/gpnurburgring/diapo_653.jpg

RedBull shoulder blades on the Ferrari

http://images.gpupdate.net/large/131222.jpg

[DJ Lazy]

Ham 1st in FP2 today... :D

[rage2]

The last time Hamilton was first in fp2 he qualified on the second last row.

[DJ Lazy]

Originally posted by rage2
The last time Hamilton was first in fp2 he qualified on the second last row.

But they also didn't have 3 big upgrades like he had today..

[Mibz]

I'm happy with the grid:

1. Mark Webber, Red Bull-Renault - 1′32.230
2. Rubens Barrichello, Brawn-Mercedes - 1′32.357
3. Jenson Button, Brawn-Mercedes - 1′32.473
4. Sebastian Vettel, Red Bull-Renault - 1′32.480
5. Lewis Hamilton, McLaren-Mercedes - 1′32.616
6. Heikki Kovalainen, McLaren-Mercedes - 1′33.859
7. Adrian Sutil, Force India-Mercedes - 1′34.316
8. Felipe Massa, Ferrari - 1′34.574
9. Kimi Raikkonen, Ferrari - 1′34.710
10. Nelson Piquet Jnr, Renault - 1′34.803
11. Nick Heidfeld, BMW - 1′42.310
12. Fernando Alonso, Renault - 1′42.318
13. Kazuki Nakajima, Williams-Toyota - 1′42.500
14. Jarno Trulli, Toyota - 1′42.771
15. Nico Rosberg, Williams-Toyota - 1′42.859
16. Robert Kubica, BMW - 1′32.190
17. Sebastien Buemi, Toro Rosso-Ferrari - 1′32.251
18. Giancarlo Fisichella, Force India-Mercedes - 1′32.402
19. Sebastien Bourdais, Toro Rosso-Ferrari - 1′33.559
20. Timo Glock, Toyota - 1′32.423*Glock's at the bottom for impeding Alonso.

I'm cheering for Sutil this race.

Also cheering for Bourdais and Piquet getting canned at the same time.

[Chris Elyea]

Qualifying was worth watching today. Look at the weights! Again Red Bull has way more fuel than Brawn. And 7 through 10, those guys are carrying a lot; looks like they knew they couldn't beat the Red Bulls and Brawns on speed, so they're playing some kind of a pit stop strategy. If we get some rain on Sunday, it's going to be very interesting!

1. Mark Webber, Red Bull, 661kg
2. Rubens Barrichello, Brawn GP, 647
3. Jenson Button, Brawn GP, 644
4. Sebastian Vettel, Red Bull, 661
5. Lewis Hamilton, McLaren, 654.5
6. Heikki Kovalainen, McLaren, 664.0
7. Adrian Sutil, Force India, 678.5
8. Felipe Massa, Ferrari, 673.5
9. Kimi Raikkonen, Ferrari, 674
10. Nelson Piquet, Renault, 676
11. Nick Heidfeld, BMW Sauber, 681
12. Fernando Alonso, Renault, 668.2
13. Kazuki Nakajima, Williams, 683.6
14. Jarno Trulli, Toyota, 683.7
15. Nico Rosberg, Williams, 689.6
16. Robert Kubica, BMW Sauber, 673.5
17. Sebastien Buemi, Toro Rosso, 674.5
18. Giancarlo Fisichella, Force India, 662.5
19. Sebastien Bourdais, Toro Rosso, 689.5
20. Timo Glock, Toyota, 662.3

[buh_buh]

what a save by Alonso from putting it in the kitty litter, and great quali by Sutil. I want to see Webber get his first win tomorrow.

[waiwai]

I bet Sutil will be on top 5

[DJ Lazy]

Well that was a sweet qualifying session... so many last minute decisions. :D

Both Mclarens made Q3, and qualified well!

[tobypaddock]

Holy, McLaren and Force India in Q3 !!

Lots of you guys chose Webber for his first win ! Going to be an interesting race

[Cos]

fuck what a guess my picks were

[Mibz]

I'm hoping for bad weather. Not enough for catastrophe but enough that things could get shaken up. I put my picks in before the weights were released and it's probably gonna bite me in the ass, weather could save me.

[rage2]

My picks are all over the place, mainly because I didn't get time to go through all the practice details and laptimes. Oh well.

Gotta find where to watch the race here too. Don't wanna watch it on the laptop.

[rage2]

Commentary in dutch haha fuck.

What a start by Hamilton, 1st place into turn 1. Too bad Webber took out his rear tire. 1 lap down from that mess. :thumbsdow

At least Kovy is in 3rd. Kovy train haha.

[Mibz]

I was upset seeing that I only got 40 points this round then noticed that everybody else got the same or less.

Eat that Cos!

Serious bummer for Sutil again. Choke-master for sure.

[buh_buh]

Kimi fucks over Sutil again :rofl: I think he's got it out for Sutil.
And how the hell did the Massa train end up on the podium? I guess by fucking up everyone else's strategy he somehow came out on top.

Mibz you want to talk chokemaster? Hamilton hasn't finished in the top 10 since the Spanish GP despite massive upgrades today, Monaco, and Turkey. Monaco last year was 100% Kimi's fault, and I'd say today's incident was just a racing incident and no fault of either Kimi or Sutil. Hamilton probably wouldn't have gotten the puncture if he didn't outbrake himself into turn 1, so I'd say he's a way bigger choker than Sutil.

[Twin_Cam_Turbo]

Its about time Webber.

[Mibz]

Originally posted by buh_buh
Kimi fucks over Sutil again :rofl: I think he's got it out for Sutil.
And how the hell did the Massa train end up on the podium? I guess by fucking up everyone else's strategy he somehow came out on top.

Mibz you want to talk chokemaster? Hamilton hasn't finished in the top 10 since the Spanish GP despite massive upgrades today, Monaco, and Turkey. Monaco last year was 100% Kimi's fault, and I'd say today's incident was just a racing incident and no fault of either Kimi or Sutil. Hamilton probably wouldn't have gotten the puncture if he didn't outbrake himself into turn 1, so I'd say he's a way bigger choker than Sutil. Making mistakes with people surrounding you is a lot easier than flying off track with nobody in sight. That said, you're still right, Sutil only choked once.

[Chris Elyea]

Barrichello has changed his tune. He no longer thinks Brawn is favouring Button. Now he just thinks they're losers.

Barrichello rips Brawn - TSN (http://www.tsn.ca/auto_racing/story/?id=284547)

Kimi and Sutil may have been a racing incident, but it was a Paul Tracy-style racing incident to be sure. No chance he was going to give way.

Did Hamilton out-brake himself into the first turn? I'm not convinced. I think he went wide because the right rear was already flat, tilting up the left front and reducing his ability to slow down. He was pretty anxious to park it at that point. I understand it sucks to be the reigning champ and having to let the whole field drive by under blue flags, but they really did need the data to evaluate the new aero package. I hope he pushed hard enough for McLaren to learn something.

[DJ Lazy]

That was a great race today! One of the best of the year so far IMO... Lots of different teams challenging high up the leaderboard...

Sucks about the puncture on Lewis' car... :(

[buh_buh]

Originally posted by Mibz
Making mistakes with people surrounding you is a lot easier than flying off track with nobody in sight. That said, you're still right, Sutil only choked once. oh you mean kind of like this?
87-eGKj-EBs

or this?

dT6CGO1FxEo


I consider neither of these choke jobs, just mistakes. Regardless of whether the puncture caused him to run deep into the corner or vice versa, my point is Sutil's performances have been far from a choke-master status. One mistake hardly counts as a choke. I'd consider a choke-master status to be more along the lines of having 2 races to finish 6th or higher to win the WDC and failing to do so.

[Mibz]

You're intense like camping buddy.

[DJ Lazy]

Originally posted by buh_buh
I'd consider a choke-master status to be more along the lines of having 2 races to finish 6th or higher to win the WDC and failing to do so.

So similar to how this year will end with Button and Brawn... :rofl:

[buh_buh]

it wasn't meant to be intense. Just pointing out some misconceptions. There's no sense of tone on the internet. Anyway, Alonso almost did the same thing in 2006 and probably would've lost the WDC if Schumacher didn't pretty much start the race in last after a puncture and still ended up 4th, though that was more because of the mass damper ruling. I don't think either are known as choke-master jobs (though some would argue the Hamilton one is up for debate), but if you're calling Sutil a choke-master, then Hamilton should be included in the conversation even more so.

As for Brawn, I think the playing field will be a little more even once the temps start rising again. I think the second half of the season is a bit of a toss up with track temps varying throughout each race. Though I think it was the 3 stopper that killed them in Nurburgring, it was because they had difficulties with tire temps that made them go to the 3 stopper. In a way, this is similar to last year when Ferrari was quicker when it was colder and McLaren better when it was warmer. Its been 2 races and Button's still up by 21 points. I think this is a fundamental flaw in the design in the car rather than a driver-choke job. Maybe this is a design and development choke job if Brawn does end up losing it.

[Mibz]

Originally posted by buh_buh
it wasn't meant to be intense. Just pointing out some misconceptions. There's no sense of tone on the internet. Anyway, Alonso almost did the same thing in 2006 and probably would've lost the WDC if Schumacher didn't pretty much start the race in last after a puncture and still ended up 4th, though that was more because of the mass damper ruling. I don't think either are known as choke-master jobs (though some would argue the Hamilton one is up for debate), but if you're calling Sutil a choke-master, then Hamilton should be included in the conversation even more so. Wurd, my choke-master statement was a bit premature and uninformed. All I could think of was where Sutil went off with like 5 laps left and nobody around him (Videos are blocked at work so I don't know what you linked to).


As for Brawn, I think the playing field will be a little more even once the temps start rising again. I think the second half of the season is a bit of a toss up with track temps varying throughout each race. Though I think it was the 3 stopper that killed them in Nurburgring, it was because they had difficulties with tire temps that made them go to the 3 stopper. In a way, this is similar to last year when Ferrari was quicker when it was colder and McLaren better when it was warmer. Its been 2 races and Button's still up by 21 points. I think this is a fundamental flaw in the design in the car rather than a driver-choke job. Maybe this is a design and development choke job if Brawn does end up losing it. Yeah, everybody's talking about track temps and how the 3 stop was definitely a bad strategy, but a necessary one. Compounded with the fact that Rubens apparently doesn't know how to preserve tires in the first place, you get a Brawn that will never make it during a cool/wet race.

I agree that if Brawn's pace doesn't improve then it's because of stale design. Possibly caused by over-confidence in their original design, but I haven't thought too much about it.

I miss hanging out with you guys for F1, I learn so much more :(

[DJ Lazy]

Just dawned on me, this is the first race of the season where Brawn isn't on the podium! :D

[Eleanor]

Here's a couple of high-speed camera shots from the race in Germany. You can really see the stresses these cars are under in the first one.

http://www.autoblog.com/2009/07/12/amazing-1-500-fps-video-from-german-gp/

[Chris Elyea]

Originally posted by Eleanor
Here's a couple of high-speed camera shots from the race in Germany. You can really see the stresses these cars are under in the first one.

Thanks! I loved seeing those during the race and it's great to have another look. The tires look like they're made out of Jello!