Need some advice/tips on buying a new car for family

[r0g3r]

Hey so I'm getting a new car for the family, I am gonna get it financed. Right now alota dealerships are havnig different deals and things.


I wanted to get your opinion and help on which dealership would be the best to find reasonable deals and pretty much best bang for my buck lol.


Thanks for your help =]

Note: so far have gone to Charlesglen Toyota and Crowfoot Honda

[FullMetal]

What is ur heart leaning too? and is it a car like/ SUV / or a VAN

[r0g3r]

car

[FullMetal]

have u looked at VWs?

[roopi]

Budget?

[r0g3r]

No I haven't looked into VW.

I'm looking more along the lines of Japanese cars.

So far checked the Toyota Corolla and Honda Civic. Think civic would end up costing me a bit more. But still looking out.


Budget..well lol least expensive but most reliable? <20000

since i do intend to finance it

[livinlarge89]

realistically you might want to check out ford too, a focus would be around your price range and im sure you could get a lot of options vs what would probably be a base civic. you gotta live with the vehicle so you might as well check out all the options

Edit: I dunno what the financing rates are for the imports, but a parent just bought a ford from the dealership by fish creek and they have 0% financing over 5 years as well, and the service was also quite good

[sputnik]

I would take a good hard look at the Ford Fusion.

[Tomaz]

The vehicles I have tested under $20k:

-Ford Focus
-Chevy Cobalt/G5
-Chevy Aveo/Wave
-Mazda 3
-Mitsubishi Lancer
-Suzuki SX4
-Hyundai Accent
-Dodge Caliber
-Honda Civic
-Honda Fit

Suggested buys:

-Ford Focus

The car felt solid. You could drive this car with confidence. The steering was tight. The car handled bumps without giving the feeling you were going to lose body panels. Overall, the feeling I got from driving this car was summed up by the words "solid quality".

-Mazda 3

This is the car I bought. It gave me the fuel economy I was looking for, fit the budget, it drove the way I liked, had enough room for my crap, and was quite well loaded! I was most impressed by this cars function and form. Couldn’t be happier! The dealership experience at Kramer was above what one would expect! Treated like royalty! The new car manager is amazing, talk to Ken Nhan of you decide on checking it out.

-Mitsubishi Lancer

Cheap, well loaded, impressive warranty and cool looks. When you sit in it, you realize right away that the car has a really cheap interior. The road noise I got gave me a sense of driving a tin can. Despite the flaws it fit the budget, good mileage, options, impressive warranty, and cool looks still made me debate buying this car.

-Honda Civic

Very good car. Reliable, fuel efficient, power options, excellent past (common, there is a metric fuck-ton of civics out there). This car was quiet; suspension is well suited for comfort while still feeling solid in turns. You can get a lot of features for the car, the only problem being you are going to bust the budget before you are satisfied.

In the end, I would drive every car mentioned on that list looking for the reasons you would be buying it. You might be looking for something completely different than what I was looking for reliability, fuel efficiency, good looks, sunroof, lots of options/features, and enough room for my friends, school bags, and golf clubs. Take your time and pick the car right for your needs. When you like the car, then you can find the dealership that seems to give to the least amount of hassle. It helps if you have friends working at the dealership!

[Jlude]

Originally posted by Tomaz
The vehicles I have tested under $20k:

-Ford Focus
-Chevy Cobalt/G5
-Chevy Aveo/Wave
-Mazda 3
-Mitsubishi Lancer
-Suzuki SX4
-Hyundai Accent
-Dodge Caliber
-Honda Civic
-Honda Fit

Suggested buys:

-Ford Focus

The car felt solid. You could drive this car with confidence. The steering was tight. The car handled bumps without giving the feeling you were going to lose body panels. Overall, the feeling I got from driving this car was summed up by the words &quot;solid quality&quot;.

-Mazda 3

This is the car I bought. It gave me the fuel economy I was looking for, fit the budget, it drove the way I liked, had enough room for my crap, and was quite well loaded! I was most impressed by this cars function and form. Couldn’t be happier! The dealership experience at Kramer was above what one would expect! Treated like royalty! The new car manager is amazing, talk to Ken Nhan of you decide on checking it out.

-Mitsubishi Lancer

Cheap, well loaded, impressive warranty and cool looks. When you sit in it, you realize right away that the car has a really cheap interior. The road noise I got gave me a sense of driving a tin can. Despite the flaws it fit the budget, good mileage, options, impressive warranty, and cool looks still made me debate buying this car.

-Honda Civic

Very good car. Reliable, fuel efficient, power options, excellent past (common, there is a metric fuck-ton of civics out there). This car was quiet; suspension is well suited for comfort while still feeling solid in turns. You can get a lot of features for the car, the only problem being you are going to bust the budget before you are satisfied.

In the end, I would drive every car mentioned on that list looking for the reasons you would be buying it. You might be looking for something completely different than what I was looking for reliability, fuel efficiency, good looks, sunroof, lots of options/features, and enough room for my friends, school bags, and golf clubs. Take your time and pick the car right for your needs. When you like the car, then you can find the dealership that seems to give to the least amount of hassle. It helps if you have friends working at the dealership!

As mentioned a coupel times above, I would also take a long hard look at Ford.

I rented a new focus a while ago for a road trip down to the US and it was unreal. I actually liked it. If I had to buy an eco car, that would be it. Hands Down.

I haven't drive the fusion, but I've heard it's just as good and has more room.

Good Luck OP

[aram1000]

I've driven a fusion and wasn't impressed by it, I would say its ok at best. Also have driven a couple of Mazda 3's and they are impressive, well made, pleasure to drive, lots of options, and a good bang for your buck car IMO, if I were to buy a fuel efficient compact type car, I would go with a Mazda 3 as I think while Honda's are great cars, the new civics are pricey IMO. As stated above, take some cars for a spin, from there figure out which one you like, and then shop around to find the best deal. Good luck with your search.

[freshprince1]

I owned a 2001 Focus for 4 years and loved it, and they've improved a ton since the first Gen. Solid little car, good on gas, and pretty strong for it's size. Great safety options and a killer stock stereo.

[Masked Bandit]

Originally posted by Tomaz
The vehicles I have tested under $20k:

-Ford Focus
-Chevy Cobalt/G5
-Chevy Aveo/Wave
-Mazda 3
-Mitsubishi Lancer
-Suzuki SX4
-Hyundai Accent
-Dodge Caliber
-Honda Civic
-Honda Fit

Suggested buys:

-Ford Focus

The car felt solid. You could drive this car with confidence. The steering was tight. The car handled bumps without giving the feeling you were going to lose body panels. Overall, the feeling I got from driving this car was summed up by the words &quot;solid quality&quot;.

-Mazda 3

This is the car I bought. It gave me the fuel economy I was looking for, fit the budget, it drove the way I liked, had enough room for my crap, and was quite well loaded! I was most impressed by this cars function and form. Couldn’t be happier! The dealership experience at Kramer was above what one would expect! Treated like royalty! The new car manager is amazing, talk to Ken Nhan of you decide on checking it out.

-Mitsubishi Lancer

Cheap, well loaded, impressive warranty and cool looks. When you sit in it, you realize right away that the car has a really cheap interior. The road noise I got gave me a sense of driving a tin can. Despite the flaws it fit the budget, good mileage, options, impressive warranty, and cool looks still made me debate buying this car.

-Honda Civic

Very good car. Reliable, fuel efficient, power options, excellent past (common, there is a metric fuck-ton of civics out there). This car was quiet; suspension is well suited for comfort while still feeling solid in turns. You can get a lot of features for the car, the only problem being you are going to bust the budget before you are satisfied.

In the end, I would drive every car mentioned on that list looking for the reasons you would be buying it. You might be looking for something completely different than what I was looking for reliability, fuel efficiency, good looks, sunroof, lots of options/features, and enough room for my friends, school bags, and golf clubs. Take your time and pick the car right for your needs. When you like the car, then you can find the dealership that seems to give to the least amount of hassle. It helps if you have friends working at the dealership!


That's a very well written review. There's a reason why there is a "metric fuck-ton" of Civic's & Mazda 3's on the road. They're good bang for the buck.

[r0g3r]

Thanks for your input everyone.

I'm gonna be going to alota dealerships today.


Can I get some tips on haggling? lol I know the salesman can cut a deal but I don't know how much and how to get the best deal.


Thanks for ur help again :-)

[pathwaydon]

Originally posted by r0g3r
Thanks for your input everyone.

I'm gonna be going to alota dealerships today.


Can I get some tips on haggling? lol I know the salesman can cut a deal but I don't know how much and how to get the best deal.


Thanks for ur help again :-)

Hi there. I can give you some tips on this. I have a thread going called ask the car guy.

Or you can PM me. Good luck.

[Aleks]

Originally posted by r0g3r
Thanks for your input everyone.

I'm gonna be going to alota dealerships today.


Can I get some tips on haggling? lol I know the salesman can cut a deal but I don't know how much and how to get the best deal.


Thanks for ur help again :-)

www.carcostcanada.com

this has saved me thousands so far and cuts down in time spent at dealers. It's $40 but well worth it.

[r0g3r]

Hey aleks,

what exactly is that website??? My browser froze trying to go to it lol

btw how does it help cut down the $$??

[Tomaz]

Personally, i would find the top 3 vehicles you like first. Then you research them for problems, maintainance schedules, recalls.

After you narrow down and know what you want, then you can go into attack mode! lol

[Aleks]

Shows all the available incentives on the car you're interested in. Also shows how much the invoice price is vs the msrp so you have a rough idea of how much markup there is on a new car.

Then you just go and offer a fair profit on the car up from invoice not down from msrp...


Originally posted by r0g3r
Hey aleks,

what exactly is that website??? My browser froze trying to go to it lol

btw how does it help cut down the $$??

[pathwaydon]

Originally posted by Aleks
Shows all the available incentives on the car you're interested in. Also shows how much the invoice price is vs the msrp so you have a rough idea of how much markup there is on a new car.

Then you just go and offer a fair profit on the car up from invoice not down from msrp...



Great post. As a sales rep I wish more people used this website and/or even knew about it.

The problem now is that far too many people have now convinced themselves that the invoice cost isn't the invoice cost.

Ahhh...my life in sales

[r0g3r]

Originally posted by Aleks
Shows all the available incentives on the car you're interested in. Also shows how much the invoice price is vs the msrp so you have a rough idea of how much markup there is on a new car.

Then you just go and offer a fair profit on the car up from invoice not down from msrp...




So what would be a fair profit? Would it be ther MSRP?? Sry still confused about the whole thing.

[Aleks]

Originally posted by r0g3r



So what would be a fair profit? Would it be ther MSRP?? Sry still confused about the whole thing.

It varies from car to car. If you're after something very rare and that's hard to get you probably won't be getting any discount or not much anyways. But for most cars under 40K cost + $300 to $1000 is acceptable right now.

Basically invoice is what the dealer paid for the car vs msrp what they want you to pay. So if that difference is $3000 and you offer cost + $500 (profit) and they accept, you are getting a discount of $2500.

[r0g3r]

oh so basically the report tells us what the car's invoice is and how much msrp it is, so we can negogiate for a discount?

Ex:


Honda civic 20k msrp

Invoice 18k

I offer 18.5k


like this would work??

[max_boost]

Originally posted by Tomaz
Personally, i would find the top 3 vehicles you like first. Then you research them for problems, maintainance schedules, recalls.

After you narrow down and know what you want, then you can go into attack mode! lol

haha yeah man. Unless you don't have anything to do other than going to every dealer and driving all the entry models. That would be a good way to kill a day though lol

Use the power of the internet to do the research, build & price the cars, know what options you want etc. Does this take away from the work of the salesman? Yeah because we are internet saavy, not some fob who speaks limited English, and unable to differentiate between DX/LX/EX/ etc. haha

The test drive should seal the deal. Knowing what you want when you go in tells the salesguy you aren't here to fuck around.

Also, if it's a hot seller, there might not be much of a discount so carcostcanada can be useless but spending the $40 won't hurt. Knowledge=Power.

[Jlude]

Originally posted by max_boost


The test drive should seal the deal. Knowing what you want when you go in tells the salesguy you aren't here to fuck around.


THIS.

You wanna be able to walk in, tell the sales guy to get you the keys to a (whatever car you want), take it for a test drive.. make your decision. Hand the keys back and tell him what you're gonna pay for it, no ifs ands or buts... and leave a number where you can be reached at.

You gotta play hardball... but don't lowball them or anything. Just offer a fair price below their asking price.

[r0g3r]

Originally posted by Jlude


THIS.

You wanna be able to walk in, tell the sales guy to get you the keys to a (whatever car you want), take it for a test drive.. make your decision. Hand the keys back and tell him what you're gonna pay for it, no ifs ands or buts... and leave a number where you can be reached at.

You gotta play hardball... but don't lowball them or anything. Just offer a fair price below their asking price.


if I want a car w ac/pw/pl/auto and the total cost turns out to be 21000, and I'm willing to put 4k down, what would be a fair and not a lowball price to pay??

[max_boost]

Originally posted by r0g3r



if I want a car w ac/pw/pl/auto and the total cost turns out to be 21000, and I'm willing to put 4k down, what would be a fair and not a lowball price to pay??

What you put down is irrelevant because the dealership will get paid regardless. Putting down $4k only helps YOU because it'll result in a lower payment.

$21K car.

It comes down to what the cost is.

If the cost is $17K, most members agree that cost+$500-$1000 is FAIR.

It depends on how bad you want the car.

OR

The dealer can say, this is our #1 seller. We'll only sell it for full price, take it or leave it. That happens too.

[r0g3r]

so the cost meaning what the "invoice price" is for the dearle then right?

so paying 500$ + dealer invoice price is fair then.


Okay I will try this then :)

[r0g3r]

aw fuck, they don't have any calgary dealerships listed for toyota/honda

[Aleks]

Originally posted by r0g3r
aw fuck, they don't have any calgary dealerships listed for toyota/honda

Doesn't matter, they will all work with the offer you give them.

[r0g3r]

oh really?

So they won't just shrug me off and say we don't care what hte report says or whateveR?

[Aleks]

Originally posted by r0g3r
oh really?

So they won't just shrug me off and say we don't care what hte report says or whateveR?

If they do go to another dealer. They all know about these reports now even if their location isn't directly listed in the report. If you're serious and confident they'll accept a fair offer don't worry.

[heavyD]

Originally posted by r0g3r
oh really?

So they won't just shrug me off and say we don't care what hte report says or whateveR?

It's always a possibility depending on the dealer as I recall a thread earlier this year of a Hyundai dealership not accepting it but most will work with it. When I was pricing WRX's as soon as I printed the car cost report within 15 minutes I got a call from Calgary Subaru to set up a test drive so they definately are on board with the program seeing how they get a tip as soon as you to the report.

[luv2ride_bikes]

When I was shopping for my Honda, Okotoks Honda gave me the best deal. I offered them invoice (less incentives) +2% and they accepted the offer. This was with my first email to them. I ended up buying from T&T because they where closer.

[r0g3r]

Hey everyone,

need some advice


I went to Nissan dealership and found a fairly good deal on a Nissan sentra.

That being said, I'm hearing mixed reviews on nissan's quality and build.


Also this car doesn't have "automatic" transmission it has "continuous variation transmission" or whatever.


What are your opinions on this?

[max_boost]

Well it's still an automatic but consider it new and improved with more noticeable benefits.

Read this page. http://auto.howstuffworks.com/cvt4.htm

New cars have warranty, don't worry. Unless there is a mass recall and you are overly picky about certain things, don't give it too much thought. They are all the same, entry level cars lol

[heavyD]

Originally posted by r0g3r
Hey everyone,

need some advice


I went to Nissan dealership and found a fairly good deal on a Nissan sentra.

That being said, I'm hearing mixed reviews on nissan's quality and build.


Also this car doesn't have &quot;automatic&quot; transmission it has &quot;continuous variation transmission&quot; or whatever.


What are your opinions on this?

It's one of the few passenger cars left in the world that doesn't have independant rear suspension and it's made in Mexico. I would pass as there are much better alternatives in the segment.

[pathwaydon]

Just want to stir up this thread a little...LOL

But I have a question. If you drive the car, you like the car, and you can afford the car, wouldn't it just be easier to pay the price for the car?

I mean let's face it, most of the repondants in this thread klnow about carcostcanada.com, so anyone can see that most imports don't have a profit of much more then $1500 to $2000.

So if you can't afford $21000 how can you afford $20000?

Is it just the ego? Maybe...I've always been intrigued by this notion that one MUST get the dealer to discount the price.

All of the questions about how to haggle would just go away if people just paid the price.

Plus I'd make more money! LOL

Let the angry responses begin.

[Wrinkly]

?????

Why pay $21,000 if I can pay $20,000? $1000 in my pocket is better than in the dealers.

(A common misconception about wealth and how to attain it: It's not about how much you make, it's about how much you KEEP ) :thumbsup:

[pathwaydon]

Originally posted by Wrinkly
?????

Why pay $21,000 if I can pay $20,000? $1000 in my pocket is better than in the dealers.

(A common misconception about wealth and how to attain it: It's not about how much you make, it's about how much you KEEP ) :thumbsup:

Understood.

So what you're saying is that a business person shouldn't make a fair profit. My I ask a question?

When you go to Wal-Mart and see a product or service advertised at a certain price, do you haggle with the manager for a further discount even if there is no defect, it isn't a floor model, etc..?

On a $20k vehicle the dealer makes a 3-6% profit. At almost any retail store where you spend money and don't even think about it the margins are 10-50% in profit, but a customer will 9 times out of 10 pay the price on the shelf. Isn't that extra $10.00 or whatever equally better in your pocket then the retailer's?

I'm simply pointing out that this is what I do all day. People come in, all ready for a confrontation because they have convinced themselves that they MUST not pay full price for a car that they obviously see the VALUE of at the M.S.R.P. or else why would they come in to the dealer in the first place?? We aren't giving out free hot dogs...

[max_boost]

If I may, you really can't compare saving thousands to saving $20 lol but I understand your point.

At the end of the day, it's business. If the deal works, it works, if it doesn't, no hard feelings, it's just business.

:D

[Wrinkly]

Originally posted by pathwaydon
Understood.

So what you're saying is that a business person shouldn't make a fair profit.
Absolutely not what I'm saying at all. Sorry, I was generalising - not putting it in relation to a specific vehicle price point. I meant what I said - why pay $21 if I can pay $20? That's just common sense, and as a consumer rather than a salesman, I'm sure you'd agree.


Originally posted by pathwaydon
My I ask a question?

When you go to Wal-Mart and see a product or service advertised at a certain price, do you haggle with the manager for a further discount even if there is no defect, it isn't a floor model, etc..?

On a $20k vehicle the dealer makes a 3-6% profit. At almost any retail store where you spend money and don't even think about it the margins are 10-50% in profit, but a customer will 9 times out of 10 pay the price on the shelf. Isn't that extra $10.00 or whatever equally better in your pocket then the retailer's?
No - I don't. But I have read about people who do - and it apparently works. :dunno: I think we've become programmed to the way things are - you go to a regular store and pay the sticker price. But when it comes to big ticket items like cars and real estate, you're 'expected' to haggle and it's assumed that "wiggle room" is built into the pricing in the first place.

Finding Carcost canada was great - takes the guess work out, saves the customer from insulting the salesman/dearlership and removes the feeling that you've been ripped off. It's a win win.


Originally posted by pathwaydon
or else why would they come in to the dealer in the first place?? We aren't giving out free hot dogs...
Because they do actually want to buy a car, yet have no idea just how much profit the dealer makes and is afraid of being ripped off so they 'low ball'. The average Joe on the street has no reference point. This is why I like Carcost so much, it was quite an eye opener for me, and it provides that reference point. People automatically assume that a car salesman is going to be full of BS so it doesn't matter what you tell them regarding how much profit you do or don't make - they won't believe it. :dunno: Carcost is a third party 'mediator' of sorts and provides that information. More people will no doubt discover it's benefits and use it over time.

.....and sometimes there are free hotdogs...lol

[pathwaydon]

Originally posted by Wrinkly

Absolutely not what I'm saying at all. Sorry, I was generalising - not putting it in relation to a specific vehicle price point. I meant what I said - why pay $21 if I can pay $20? That's just common sense, and as a consumer rather than a salesman, I'm sure you'd agree.


No - I don't. But I have read about people who do - and it apparently works. :dunno: I think we've become programmed to the way things are - you go to a regular store and pay the sticker price. But when it comes to big ticket items like cars and real estate, you're 'expected' to haggle and it's assumed that &quot;wiggle room&quot; is built into the pricing in the first place.

Finding Carcost canada was great - takes the guess work out, saves the customer from insulting the salesman/dearlership and removes the feeling that you've been ripped off. It's a win win.



Because they do actually want to buy a car, yet have no idea just how much profit the dealer makes and is afraid of being ripped off so they 'low ball'. The average Joe on the street has no reference point. This is why I like Carcost so much, it was quite an eye opener for me, and it provides that reference point. People automatically assume that a car salesman is going to be full of BS so it doesn't matter what you tell them regarding how much profit you do or don't make - they won't believe it. :dunno: Carcost is a third party 'mediator' of sorts and provides that information. More people will no doubt discover it's benefits and use it over time.

.....and sometimes there are free hotdogs...lol

[pathwaydon]

I agree I like carcostcanada as a salesperson. I just fail to understand why it is automatically assumed that a dealer "must" discount the price.

Isn't a good deal simply a car you want, at a price you can afford from a dealer that you trust will take care of you after you buy? What is a dealerships motivation to look after problems afterwards if you didn't let them make any money to begin with?

As a hypothetical, if EVERY dealer everywhere got together and said..."NO DISCOUNTING ANYMORE" would people still buy cars? I'm sure they would.

Also, it's not called "wiggle room" it's called "profit". My point is still valid, it's ego. Like you said, it's just generally accepted that you should haggle on price. So people will do it.

Lastly, how is the dealer "ripping you off" if he makes a full profit? 90% of the items you buy on a monthly/weekly basis are full profit for the retailer.

I didn't mean for things to get confrontational. All I was trying to point out is this: If you don't want the hassle of haggling price, then pay the price. It's only $1000...that's about $10/month if your financing. 1 less coffee every 2 days.

[Wrinkly]

Originally posted by pathwaydon
I didn't mean for things to get confrontational. All I was trying to point out is this: If you don't want the hassle of haggling price, then pay the price. It's only $1000...that's about $10/month if your financing. 1 less coffee every 2 days.

I didn't think it was getting confrontational - until that ^ post that is - it kinda comes across that way (apologies if mine did - wasn't meant to at all) It's very difficult to gauge on the interwebs. I actually thought we were having a good, intelligent discussion (I know that's a rarity on this site..lol). :D

I never once said a dealer shouldn't make a profit. I believe in a fair day's work for a fair day's pay. I was just trying to give you (my opinion only) of the consumer's side of things. I don't understand either how it came to be that dealers are expected to discount - I've just never known it be any other way - it just 'is'. I also never said we were being ripped off, I'm pointing out that with no knowledge of just how much profit is in the deal for the salesman, the consumer may PERCEIVE he's beng ripped off. This is where Carcost comes in handy - it removes those unknowns, and actually helped me see just how little profit there really is in some instances. Quite eye opening.

It would be interesting to see what would ensue if they did all say "no more discount". As you say, I'm sure people would still buy cars, yes. But - If they did stop discounting, and with the dollar almost at par again, I think many more Canadians would be looking south of the border.

I think another issue, is possibly all the large discounts that have been seen of late. I just got a very, very good one myself and I also saw a $14k disount on a 5 Series BMW (as an aside - and more relevant to your other thread, they didn't seem interested in financing it, they were looking for a cash buyer :dunno: ). Maybe as a result shoppers feel that if a $10k or more discount is possible on a car, albeit at luxury/executive level, they mistakenly believe ALL dealers make HUGE profits on EVERY vehicle and therefore there is room for bigger discounts, regardless of price point? Again - it's all about perception.

:dunno:

[pathwaydon]

I was trying to bring some levity to the conversation. Apologies if it came off confrontational.

Typically when you see those large discounts and rebates you have remember that they are coming from the manufacturer, not the dealer. And often, they will say "cash deal only" but that is because they are also offering sub-vented financing (i.e. 0% or 1.9%) something so low the bank couldn't touch it. When they offer those finance options, it's the auto maker that is making sure that the bank get's paid for financing you. So instead of paying off the bank to offer 0% they will offer you a huge "cash only" discount.

It's 6 of one 1/2 dozen of the other. Believe me, the manufacturer has accountants and bean counters working around the clock figuring this stuff out.

[luv2ride_bikes]

Originally posted by pathwaydon
I agree I like carcostcanada as a salesperson. I just fail to understand why it is automatically assumed that a dealer &quot;must&quot; discount the price.


They don't call them stealerships for nothing. IMO, dealers have been ripping off customers for years. I think a dealer should make a profit, but do they deserve a 2K or 3K profit for a few hours work? A lot of dealers also try to add on all these little extras (documentation fees, vehicle etching, vehicle prep, etc..) to increase their profit above the 2K or 3K amount.


Originally posted by pathwaydon
Isn't a good deal simply a car you want, at a price you can afford from a dealer that you trust will take care of you after you buy? What is a dealerships motivation to look after problems afterwards if you didn't let them make any money to begin with?

Well their motivation is the high prices they charge for service


Originally posted by pathwaydon
Lastly, how is the dealer &quot;ripping you off&quot; if he makes a full profit? 90% of the items you buy on a monthly/weekly basis are full profit for the retailer.

The 90% of the items most people buy regularly are low priced items. How can you compare this to a $30K+ vehicle? When you buy a new TV, do you not try to get the lowest price possible?

[pathwaydon]

Well there's a lot to reply to there.

Let's deal with the profit margins. As a previous poster has indicated consumer websites like carcostcanada.com will give you this information. I'd be suprised to find more then a few vehicles in any line-up that have $2K-$3K in profit. That vast majority of vehicles, at least at Hyundai and I know Toyota have less then $2K in profit. But even if you're correct, if the dealer makes a $27000 investment of capital to purchase the vehicle from the manufacturer is he not entitled to a 5%-6% return on investment? That is likely the lowest return in retail! And most deals don't take a few hours work, in somecases it takes days or weeks. The dealer needs that profit to:

A. Pay the sales rep
B. Pay support people
C. Keep the lights on
D. Pay himself

It's a business. It's not like the dealer gets every dime of a $1500 or $2000 profit. He gets what's left after everyone gets paid.

High Prices in service:

What is the going door rate for an independant mechanic in your area? Let's say Canadian Tire or something. Around here it's about $85/hour. Our door rate at the dealer is $106/hour. Now, if you're going to have to pay to get repairs and whatnot done on yourt car anyway, is it really worth the $20/hour you save going to an independant mechanic? Has he had the specialized training that techs at the dealership are REQUIRED to take. How well does he know your particular make/model/year. If you just spent say $40k on a new 2010 Genesis Coupe, would you take it to Canadian Tire to have work done. Maybe you would, but I wouldn't.

To Rip off or not Rip off.

It really doesn't matter the sticker price of the item. By that prevalent logic, if a new car was only $150.00 no one would ever haggle for a lower price. I doubt it. I will shop around for a less expensive T.V. when I'm in the market, but once I find the one I want at the least expensive price assuming they are both the same make/model year/trim I'll buy it. But I won't try to haggle the guy over the price.

And what about service? I assume from your use of the word stealerships that you have had a few bad experiences with sales reps or a particular dealer. Did you do any research before hand with the BBB or local consumer affairs advocate? Would that have been worth it to you in the long run?