AWD System Comparisons

[SeeGeeWhy]

Hey everyone,

I'm in the market for a new ride and have a few musts.

1. AWD
2. Space for 5+
3. Half decent towing capacity
4. Good reputation for reliability
5. Reasonable operating expenses
6. Good cold weather performance

Figuring out items 2 - 6 are straightforward, but assessing the different AWD systems on the market is pretty tough.

Lots of companies market 4WD systems as AWD, which is sort of misleading. True AWD systems can vary quite a bit from what I've been able to read on the subject as well.

Is it engaged 100% of the time, or is it an "intelligent" system that depends on certain conditions and feedback from the system sensors to engage.

The tradeoff appears to be traction control vs fuel economy. The fully engaged systems (Subaru) have higher fuel consumption, but perform great. The 'intellegent' systems have better fuel economy, but do not perform as well in all conditions.

Lastly, it looks like companies will stratify their systems depending on trim levels, yet they really don't get into the detail on how the different systems vary... it seems that most people are happy to hear "yes, this has AWD" and then go no further to understand what they're getting.

Any opinions out there on which manufacturers have the best AWD systems, and which models are the top performers?

For instance, how would a Mitsubishi Outlander compare with a Toyota Sienna?

Thanks all

[bituerbo]

Audi's Quattro is a pretty good system. You can push gobs of hp through those diff's and they are never the point of failure.

[syeve]

Not the prettiest things on the road but the MDX handles 1-6.

[Tik-Tok]

Originally posted by SeeGeeWhy

1. AWD
2. Space for 5+
3. Half decent towing capacity
4. Good reputation for reliability
5. Reasonable operating expenses
6. Good cold weather performance


Audi and Subaru are generally accepted as the best AWD systems around (they should be, it's been their meat and potato's for decades ahead of the rest of the crowd)

So between these two (and for clarity I own one of each)...

1. AWD - Audi's is better (IMO), however their cars are also heavier, which makes for a nice quiet ride, but also worse fuel economy, and worse stopping on ice

2. Space for 5+ - Audi wins again, bigger cars (well depending on which ones you're looking at anyways), but once again, the fuel economy/weight.

3. Half decent towing ability- Depends what you consider half decent? The Audi Q7 can tow the most of the two manufacturers @ 6600 lbs, but most of both their line ups are between 2000-4000 lbs.

4.Reliability - Subaru wins hands down, though Audi has supposedly gotten better in the past few years, I can tell you everything that does need work, is a PITA (I had to take the entire front clip off my Audi just to change the alternator), Subaru is really simple to work on comparatively

5. Operating expenses - Subaru again, easy to work on, cheaper parts, better fuel economy (for the most part)

6. Cold weather performance - Both, optioned right, they both come with heated seats, mirrors, etc., and both have awesome AWD systems, but as mentioned earlier, Audi's are generally heavier, and there-fore worse braking ability on ice.

[Canmorite]

Agreed on all points. Would you be looking at an Outback or a Tribeca? More passenger room in a Tribeca, but heavier on gas.

What about Volvo XC70? Not familiar with them but my friend has one and loves it. Few more options available on it too.

My family has three Subarus, so I'm biased :rofl:

[max_boost]

If you want a reliable, fully equipped, easy to maintain AWD vehicle, it's Subaru no doubt. Not to out do you Canmorite, but my family has 5! haha

If you want a luxury head turner, then Audi wins.

For cold weather, winter tires #1, but #2, you can install a remote starter on the Subaru, not sure about the Audi. There's nothing like jumping into a warm car on a -30 day.

[freshprince1]

We looked at AWD for a while, and decided that bang-for-your-buck, the Mitsubishi Endeavour was a great deal. Very competitive prices for an import SUV. Full time All Wheel Drive, good towing, 3.5L V6 - so its not a total killer on gas. Seats 5 with a good cargo area. And they look great.

I ended up deciding I wanted a 4x4 that I could manage (i.e. turn it off, on, Lo, HI...etc). I ended up buying an Envoy because I found one for a killer price. Plus I can chnage it to 4HI, 4LO, AWD, or 2HI. And the 4.2L inline 6 has good power and not a total pig on gas, relatively speaking.

[Axe]

We drive an '08 Highlander. Tows up to 5000lb, 3rd row seating (for the 5+) and the 3.5L six isn't too bad mileage wise. the 4wd is a constant 50/50 split and then managed based on the VSC and traction control. I like it because it is not a "smart" system but sends power to all 4 wheels constantly.

[psycoticclown]

Subaru or Audi for sure. I think Audi has a slightly better system though.

Here's a very informative video, kinda biased for Subaru, but still worth the watch: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ooQRxlChvMw

The Audi's should perform the same or better as the Subaru did in that video.

[Sugarphreak]

...

[Xtrema]

How often do you need the + in 5+?

That really narrow down your choices to MDX, Q7 and Tribeca.

I agree that Acura, Audi, Subaru have the best AWD. Acura probably get the best bet on reliability.

Beyond that, you are probably looking at real trucks.

[clem24]

Man for "5+", I would just skip everything and go for the minivan. As much as I hate minivans, you just can't beat them for hauling people. Does it have to be AWD?

[Eleanor]

Ford Flex?

[heavyD]

LOL at Audi and Subaru being the best. Technically Mitsubishi makes the best high volume AWD system hands down but it's also more complex involving multiple LSD's and an S-AYC in the EVO X. The Ralliart's is based on the EVO IX system which has ACD (active center differential) with front and rear LSD's. Unlike Subaru's and Audi AWD systems EVO's/Ralliarts can send torque to individial corners rather than simply front and rear. Acura is similar but doesn't have S-AYC and only the Nissan GTR offers similar technology. Subaru's system works well but it's the most basic, simple, low-tech design with no LSD's and torque is evenly applied to all four wheels at all times. It works well (AWD is AWD after all) but it's not even remotely close to the technology of the competition.

Mitsubishi's AWD system was chosen as 2009's Best New Technology Award over other entries such as Honda's SH-AWD;

http://www.ajac.ca/files/ccoty/CCOTY_Tech_EN.pdf

To the OP's question. The Outlander is not an AWD vehicle. It's 4WD. It will be fulltime FWD in 2WD mode, in 4WD it will act like a Honda CRV where torque is applied to the rear wheels when sensors detect slippage, in 4WD Lock it will lock a 50/50 front/rear torque split. I believe only Mitsubishi and Toyota offer real 4WD in the CUV segment.

[Tik-Tok]

That may be true, but it's only application (in N.A.) is in the EVO series, which doesn't fit ANY of the criteria of the OP

[heavyD]

Originally posted by Tik-Tok
That may be true, but it's only application is in the EVO series, which doesn't fit ANY of the criteria of the OP

Ralliart and Ralliart Sportback ;) As well Consumer reports ranks Mitsubishi as the #6 most reliable of all automakers behind only Honda/Acura and Toyota/Lexus of the Japanese brands. All the other Japanes brands are in the teens and twenties.

[Xtrema]

^ I knew you'll show up.

The only reason Mitsu is not listed is because of the 5+ requirement. As nice as EVO is, it's more of a 4+ 1/2.

[alloroc]

Originally posted by Eleanor
Ford Flex?

The more I research these the more I like them. It would fit all of the OP's requirements.

[bspot]

Originally posted by heavyD
LOL at Audi and Subaru being the best. Technically Mitsubishi makes the best high volume AWD system hands down but it's also more complex involving multiple LSD's and an S-AYC in the EVO X. The Ralliart's is based on the EVO IX system which has ACD (active center differential) with front and rear LSD's. Unlike Subaru's and Audi AWD systems EVO's/Ralliarts can send torque to individial corners rather than simply front and rear. Acura is similar but doesn't have S-AYC and only the Nissan GTR offers similar technology. Subaru's system works well but it's the most basic, simple, low-tech design with no LSD's and torque is evenly applied to all four wheels at all times. It works well (AWD is AWD after all) but it's not even remotely close to the technology of the competition.

Mitsubishi's AWD system was chosen as 2009's Best New Technology Award over other entries such as Honda's SH-AWD;

http://www.ajac.ca/files/ccoty/CCOTY_Tech_EN.pdf

To the OP's question. The Outlander is not an AWD vehicle. It's 4WD. It will be fulltime FWD in 2WD mode, in 4WD it will act like a Honda CRV where torque is applied to the rear wheels when sensors detect slippage, in 4WD Lock it will lock a 50/50 front/rear torque split. I believe only Mitsubishi and Toyota offer real 4WD in the CUV segment.

Depends on the model of Audi. Some new models use electronic torque vectoring diffs.

The advantage of the old ones was using Torsen so there didn't have to be slip before power was shifted. Open diffs front and back though.

[mr2mike]

Originally posted by alloroc


The more I research these the more I like them. It would fit all of the OP's requirements.

my gf likes her Ford Edge. I can't see it being too comfortable with 5+ but its decent with the AWD but probably smaller than the Flex.

[gqmw]

Originally posted by Xtrema
How often do you need the + in 5+?

That really narrow down your choices to MDX, Q7 and Tribeca.

I agree that Acura, Audi, Subaru have the best AWD. Acura probably get the best bet on reliability.

Beyond that, you are probably looking at real trucks.

I agree with that, although if you are consistently needing 5+ you're probably better off with a van...even if it may not look as attractive. For sure the q7 if you're looking for a luxury awd.

[heavyD]

Originally posted by Xtrema
^ I knew you'll show up.

The only reason Mitsu is not listed is because of the 5+ requirement. As nice as EVO is, it's more of a 4+ 1/2.

The EVO is a terrible choice for the OP as it has a tiny trunk. I was more making reference to people saying Subaru has the best AWD system when really it's the most basic you will see in the industry as while older models at least received one LSD now no new models do with the exception of the STI and 07-09 Legacy Spec B. Since all their cars come with AWD to remain price competitive with competitors 2WD models they have stripped their AWD system down to the most basic in the industry. It's certainly not bad at all as any AWD will be give more traction than 2WD but nowhere near the most advanced out there.

[clem24]

Originally posted by heavyD


Ralliart and Ralliart Sportback ;)

Are you serious?!? That's like telling OP to buy a Corolla for 5+ duty. Great advice. :rolleyes:

[heavyD]

Originally posted by clem24


Are you serious?!? That's like telling OP to buy a Corolla for 5+ duty. Great advice. :rolleyes:

We fit nine in my old Dodge Daytona which was only a two door hatch. It's all about creativity. In reality the only vehicle that will meet 5+ adequately is a minivan.

[ExtraSlow]

Honestly, I'd consider getting a big five-seater instead of a 7 seater, because you'll get much more useable passenger room, and more cargo room in that back. It's a big comprimise to fit three rows of seating into anything but the largest vehicles.
Also, that third row is a torture chamber for anyone by children.