Technologist Advice... Any ASET Guys or other Engineering Types

[v2kai]

I'm at a bit of a crossroads here in terms of growth for my education and career and I'm hoping someone with a bit more real life experience and wisdom can give me their opinions. I know this is very similar to a few other threads out there right now like the "UofC or SAIT" thread but I'd like to keep it separate if the mods dont mind. I'll try to keep it concise. All opinions and advice are appreciated.

Education Backstory in point form:

-Partially completed Electronics Engineering Technology @ DeVry couple years back (just under halfway through. first stint was on full scholarship so pretty much a free ride hence why i took it fresh out of highschool)
- after leaving DeVry EET incomplete I went on to dick around a bit; finding myself. A couples years later eventually enrolled and completed 2 year Mechanical Engineering Technology diploma at SAIT (it was a great experience and landed a good job before graduating starting over $50K not bad for an MET diploma):clap: i was lucky

Quick Backstory on me:

I've always had an interest in electronics and robotics, however when I was taking the EET program at DeVry I was too young and didnt have my head in the right place to continue with my education at that point; among other unfortunate personal events all happening around that time. Enrolling in SAIT's MET program years later was really a step to see if my brain was still alive after dicking about for a couple years. And seeing as it was a 2 year diploma I figured I could stomach that rather than go head first back into a degree or hardcore university and at least get some sort of piece of paper.

Fast forward to now:

I lucked out with a great job. I work at a smaller company and am basically their all-in-one tech guy doing computer & network stuff to machine repair, but mainly R&D with automation and custom robotics for the company. Its never a boring day and now I'm working on a National Research Council funded Robotics Project to develop some new innovative robotic automation for our industry sector. I am the lead of the Electronics and Control Systems Development of the Project (it's only a small team, myself and an engineer who is doing the mechanical design so really I'm only the boss of myself lol) But I am brushing shoulders with giants working with some significant engineering individuals the most prominent would probably be the lead engineer from the terrestrial Canadarm Project Development who is advising us. So the experience and contact references I'm making are vital and I am undertaking some ambitious and challenging tasks with the project and also my day to day activities.

Coming up on two years of exp. this spring I am aspiring to apply to ASET for my CET credential but am also a little unsure of how to proceed with my career and education growth as I work mainly with electronics and computers but dont have the associated credentials completed. Which got me going back in the direction of completing the EET program at DeVry or possibly SAIT. Which has led to some serious considerations which is why hopefully somebody with more life and work experience can offer me some words of wisdom. Also not sure if it really matters but I am currently not working in oil and gas but would definitely like to continue work as an R&D Technologist or Electronics and Robotics subcontractor on my own in the future in any sector or field of work.

The difference between the two Post Secondary Educations:

-DeVry EET program is a B.Sc in Electronics Engineering Technology from the University of Phoenix
-SAIT also offers a EET program but is only a 2 year diploma much like the MET program I have already completed.

So my questions(and i ask in relevance to future job potentials and potential growth and how it might help, hinder or have no real effect at all):

1. Does a degree really matter that much if the degree from DeVry is not really an engineering degree but rather a technologist credential recognized by ASET and the CCTT similar to a SAIT diploma?
2. If I do get my CET credential from ASET (only from my MET and 2 years exp to date) is there any real advantage for me to finish my Degree from DeVry or a EET Diploma from SAIT seeing as EET is predominantly the field of work I see myself working in? Or will all an employer see is the CET credential and look more at my past projects, experience and achievements?
3. Is the degree really worth it if it's not truly an Engineering Degree and the highest level of recognition is a B.Sc as a technologist through ASET?
4. For those who are ASET members with CET or higher levels of certification is it likely to be able to earn your CET with the minimum level of experience? (I know this is a bit vague of a question and I am in contact with ASET to try and better understand how it would work)
5. As an employer would a EET Degree make that much more of a difference over a EET Diploma?


I am weighing the pros and cons of cost with taking the EET program either at SAIT or DeVry as DeVry is substantially more expensive but the biggest thing is DeVry can be completed online; hopefully allowing me to earn my degree without taking time off work. I am still finding out the particulars about cost, and much of the education I've completed to date overlaps into these programs so it's likely I will be able to complete the EET credential fairly quickly from either institute. The only debate is if it's worth it. And timing with work.

SAIT doesnt work so well for timing but would be cheaper tuition-wise (unless I get the scholarship back at DeVry) Or completing the B.Sc through DeVry at more tuition-cost (assuming I dont get the scholarship) but being able to maintain my work throughout my education. At this point I'm fairly certain taking time off for SAIT would cost me more as I wouldnt be working but again the particulars are still being figured out and money and time will come clear later.

Sorry if it was a bit long winded. The long and short of it - I've got an MET diploma is finishing my EET Degree really worth it?

Links
http://sait.ca/pages/cometosait/academic/diplomas/aent.shtml
http://www.devry.ca/programs/electronics-engineering-technology/about.jsp?WT.ac=ca-eet

[97'Scort]

1. Does a degree really matter that much if the degree from DeVry is not really an engineering degree but rather a technologist credential recognized by ASET and the CCTT similar to a SAIT diploma?
The Devry "degree" is not recognized by ASET as far as I know. Only Canadian institutions approved by the CTAB are eligible. All others must apply for equivalency.

2. If I do get my CET credential from ASET (only from my MET and 2 years exp to date) is there any real advantage for me to finish my Degree from DeVry or a EET Diploma from SAIT seeing as EET is predominantly the field of work I see myself working in? Or will all an employer see is the CET credential and look more at my past projects, experience and achievements?
Past experience and achievements. The mechanical diploma is diverse enough to include multiple disciplines, which is why I recommend it to anybody :)


3. Is the degree really worth it if it's not truly an Engineering Degree and the highest level of recognition is a B.Sc as a technologist through ASET?
You're better off getting your Bachelor of Technology or a full-on engineering degree. Your DeVry one won't HURT, but it won't necessarily help much either.
http://www.nait.ca/program_home_28092.htm


4. For those who are ASET members with CET or higher levels of certification is it likely to be able to earn your CET with the minimum level of experience? (I know this is a bit vague of a question and I am in contact with ASET to try and better understand how it would work)
This is what I hate about ASET. They do NOT have an objective review process. I applied with WAY more experience than I needed but did not get my CET. Instead I was awarded a C.Tech (Eng) which I feel is misleading as it suggests I'm a technician. I'm in the process of appealing.

However, all you really need is your references to be (a) engineers and (b) people who will THINK about the answers. A good chunk of the review package that is sent out to your references is about your management and leadership SKILLS. Many people interpret that as management EXPERIENCE. If you've got references that see that you have leadership potential and answer as such, you're fine. If you have people that take it literally and say you have zero experience therefore zero skills, then you're screwed for now. ASET will then give you a deadline to either get more experience or provide additional references.

5. As an employer would a EET Degree make that much more of a difference over a EET Diploma?
Again, it can't hurt, but the degree would need to be passed for equivalency. And then, it might just be the same as the diploma, anyways.

[v2kai]

Originally posted by 97'Scort

The Devry "degree" is not recognized by ASET as far as I know. Only Canadian institutions approved by the CTAB are eligible. All others must apply for equivalency.


You're better off getting your Bachelor of Technology or a full-on engineering degree. Your DeVry one won't HURT, but it won't necessarily help much either.
http://www.nait.ca/program_home_28092.htm


This is what I hate about ASET. They do NOT have an objective review process. I applied with WAY more experience than I needed but did not get my CET. Instead I was awarded a C.Tech (Eng) which I feel is misleading as it suggests I'm a technician. I'm in the process of appealing.



I'm fairly sure it is recognized by ASET as per my discussions with an advisor but again it's a degree on paper but coming in on the same level in terms of a technologist diploma.

That nait program looks like something I would definitely like to do. It unfortunately brings up the same dilemma I'd have completing EET at SAIT which is taking considerable time off work as well as relocation for that particular program. This is not out of the question and I am dedicated to my education and growth such that I would definitely do that; however at this point if at all possible I'm trying to find a way around that somewhat.

When you applied for ASET (if you dont mind me asking, or if you're more comfortable continuing via pm go that route) were you well over the experience in years with very hands on in-depth work? from the sounds of things it was your references that didnt speak well for you...how well did you know your references and what were they? were you in any management roles or always working with or within other engineering teams?

[97'Scort]

Not at all. I had in excess of two years as a designer (office design, estimating, CAD work) and another year in the field (I suppose I exaggeraged on the "WAY MORE" bit). I know guys with way less experience than that (ie, just the bare minimum) who got their CET no problem.

My references were all engineers and two were my immediate supervisors. I was in several unofficial leadership roles (lead designer for a group, lead mechanical designer on a number of jobs) I was still considered only an Intermediate Designer as far as the company was concerned. When it came down to filling out the surveys, the bosses said I had no formal management work, which is true, but any idiot would see that I had been placed in and done well in several leadership positions. It depends how they choose to answer the questions.

Also, with the DeVry thing, call a different person or the head registrar with ASET to be sure. Sometimes those advisors are talking our of their asses (I volunteered with ASET for a long time, and a lot of the advisors are also volunteers. Defer to the head office just in case!).

[Sugarphreak]

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[v2kai]

Originally posted by 97'Scort
Not at all. I had in excess of two years as a designer (office design, estimating, CAD work) and another year in the field (I suppose I exaggeraged on the "WAY MORE" bit). I know guys with way less experience than that (ie, just the bare minimum) who got their CET no problem.

My references were all engineers and two were my immediate supervisors. I was in several unofficial leadership roles (lead designer for a group, lead mechanical designer on a number of jobs) I was still considered only an Intermediate Designer as far as the company was concerned. When it came down to filling out the surveys, the bosses said I had no formal management work, which is true, but any idiot would see that I had been placed in and done well in several leadership positions. It depends how they choose to answer the questions.

Also, with the DeVry thing, call a different person or the head registrar with ASET to be sure. Sometimes those advisors are talking our of their asses (I volunteered with ASET for a long time, and a lot of the advisors are also volunteers. Defer to the head office just in case!).

Ouch so choose references wisely is what youre saying.

Yup DeVry is confirmed on ASET's new website. so the program is technologist level. Except a degree not a diploma and in the correct field for my work.
http://aset.ab.ca/pages/Membership/AccreditedPrograms.aspx

[SJW]

Originally posted by Sugarphreak
ASET certification is useless

Sure that may just be my 0.02, but I have never found a solid correlation between that certification and employee ability. You fill out an ethics test and then send them some money.... you get the certification.


I'm a C.E.T. and I stand by this statement. I make my money based on my good looks.

[zieg]

Hm, I have a diploma of technology in mechanical engineering and I just got my T.T status from ASET.. and I was actually pretty happy to get that. I hope it's not completely useless...

Of course, I AM jobless right now. :(

[LLLimit]

Originally posted by SJW


I'm a C.E.T. and I stand by this statement. I make my money based on my good looks.


I'm in the same boat. I'll be eligible for the the P.Tech designation/level in a couple years. Hopefully that will change things.

[Sugarphreak]

...

[v2kai]

hmmm good to know. Food for thought I guess.

I know experience is key. And companies judge a guy based on what he does not what he says.

Sugarphreak

Do you think having a degree in EET would be worth more than the ASET CET credential? (again taking into account my experience and past projects and achievements will shine more than any piece of paper)

also curious how much experience do you have yourself and what field are you in?

[Sugarphreak]

....

[97'Scort]

You can't call yourself a technologist without ASET certification. They own the trademark to the word in Alberta (as do the other associations in their provinces). Also, since ASET is getting rolled into the same legislation that governs APEGGA, the designations will soon carry actual weight with them when it comes to professional liability and responsibility.

[Sugarphreak]

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[jjmac]

Originally posted by Sugarphreak
You are comparing APPEGA to ASET :rolleyes:

Well I am here to learn as much as the next guy; what kind of proffesional liability exactly is ASET going to give to them?

Currently if I wanted to join I would simply send them a couple of references, do an ethics test and a big check. I don't understand what that brings to the table in terms of credibility :dunno:

I save on my car insurance with ASET that's all I know.

ASET fee ($110)
Car Insurance Savings ($500+) compared to others I got quoted from.

hehe

Currently I'm a T.T. (Technologist in Training) and might continue onto CET this May.

I'm still debating the fact if I should continue to CET or not, since I believe the company I work for doesn't recognize the certification, but I always think more credentials, more pay (with great work ethics and job performance of course)

I just got off the phone with someone from ASET and asked what credibility and benefits would I have when I'm CET and here's what I got:

- Pay raise - Apparently once I'm CET they would send my Boss some sort of letter regarding my certification which would lead me to getting a raise...(not sure how that works, but if it does GREAT!)

- Resume Booster - If for any reason I decide to get another job and that other job recognizes ASET Certification, it will help me land the job, plus Salary negotiation is to my advantage.

- Perks - Like I said I save quite a bit on my car insurance, that's basically why I have this ASET membership. I'm not sure what other benefits I have, but I believe you get discounts at some car rental places and restaurants...I don't know, I haven't tried.

I'm not sure if he answered my question fully, but he sounded like a salesman LOL

I'll probably end up giving it a try and if it doesn't live up to its expectation, i'll just let it expire.

[Sugarphreak]

....

[jjmac]

Yea SAIT Grad MET like the OP, and yes I have the TD Meloche Monnex Insurance due to the savings hehe

I compared the savings from being a SAIT Alum and an ASET Member, $40 difference in savings, with ASET being the cheaper one.

I just talked to my Boss about ASET certification and he said that it's not needed for me, but I can still have it if I wanted for personal preference.

As far the pay raise after being CET, he said he'll get back to me on that HAHAHA

[Sugarphreak]

....

[jjmac]

$40 difference per month.

$224 / month with ASET

$259 / month with SAIT Alum

Sorry it was $35 to be exact

$420 savings per year between the two

[bubbley]

What kind of scholarship would give you a free ride through devry? Isnt it like 6k per semester

:confused:

[v2kai]

ASET and APEGGA will be recognizing the new P. Tech (Eng.) which lets individuals with this level of certification have the right to practice engineering independently in accordance with established methodologies and specifications including existing codes and regulations. With this right, a member is able to sign off and stamp their own work.

The scholarship was the presidential scholarship back when I first enrolled. I believe it has now changed somewhat but yes around 6K a semester, 3 semesters/year all year round schooling.

Thanks for all the input guys I think I've got my direction. Degree is the way to go even if it is only a B.Sc for now I can continue my education at a later date and CET from ASET can't hurt either.

[Cos]

Originally posted by SJW


I'm a C.E.T. and I stand by this statement. I make my money based on my good looks.

I am a CET, only reason I keep it is because I think the P.Tech will be useful some day and you have to have the CET to get it.


OP sorry I tried to read your post a few times and it is just too big for me (training at work all day so powerpoint + brain = mush). If anyone hasn't answered anything in particular I can try. Just don't type a big wall again. haha

[v2kai]

Originally posted by Cos


I am a CET, only reason I keep it is because I think the P.Tech will be useful some day and you have to have the CET to get it.


OP sorry I tried to read your post a few times and it is just too big for me (training at work all day so powerpoint + brain = mush). If anyone hasn't answered anything in particular I can try. Just don't type a big wall again. haha

lol yea sorry i tried to break it down and keep it shorter and somewhat readable. The P.Tech is the only other thing i thought might be worth it in the long run but after looking at the scope of work you are allowed to practice not much is really applicable to me so... not sure if it's still even relevant for me.

the only question i really have now is just to get a feel for real life application of ASET.

all the beyond technologists out there:

1. If youre a CET has it helped you at all?
2. What is your field of work?

[LLLimit]

Originally posted by v2kai


1. If youre a CET has it helped you at all?
2. What is your field of work?

1. Not at all. Although my old manager that hired me has his RPT, and does well. I'm looking forward to a P.Tech designation.
2. Transmission Lines

[sevewone]

Im going for electronics engineering at Okanagan College and have to transfer to BCIT or U of Vic if I really want work in this economy. Sure Devry may be approved by certain institutions.. but when it comes down to it, it's going to be hard to get a good job when you went to a school that was on a commercial in between Maury episodes. :dunno:




Originally posted by v2kai


all the beyond technologists out there:

2. What is your field of work?

Technologist manage equipment where as a technician is more in the design side of things.

[Cos]

.

[LLLimit]

.

[Cos]

.

[jjmac]

OK so chatted again with the Boss regarding a pay raise when I get my CET and to break it down he says,

"A pay raise is a possibility NOT primarily due to your certification, but through your work performance within the past 2 years."

Whatever letter ASET sends to my Boss this May, I hope it gets me a reasonable raise =)


DRINKS ARE ON ME (if I get the raise)!! :bigpimp:

[Cos]

.

[LLLimit]

Just paid my $250 in CET dues. I hope your company will cover that, mine didn't
:thumbsdow

[jjmac]

My Boss did agree to being a reference, and now I just need 2 more before May hehe

As far as the certification, like I said in my previous post, I always think that more credentials, more pay. May not always be the case, but can sometimes put you ahead of your co-workers as far as pay and higher position consideration.

I work for ECCO Manufacturing as a Manufacturing Engineering Technologist, we produce HVAC components for commercial buildings and residential housing.

Drinks are on me till you :barf: haha

[jjmac]

Originally posted by LLLimit
Just paid my $250 in CET dues. I hope your company will cover that, mine didn't
:thumbsdow

Company doesn't cover my dues unfortunately, but I'll do a requisition for it and see where that goes.

[Cos]

Originally posted by jjmac
My Boss did agree to being a reference, and now I just need 2 more before May hehe

As far as the certification, like I said in my previous post, I always think that more credentials, more pay. May not always be the case, but can sometimes put you ahead of your co-workers as far as pay and higher position consideration.

I work for ECCO Manufacturing as a Manufacturing Engineering Technologist, we produce HVAC components for commercial buildings and residential housing.

Drinks are on me till you :barf: haha

Im an alchoholic englishman haha :bigpimp:

Can always try and expenses dues, or just ask your boss. If they say no your fucked even if you try and sneak it through.

Your office isnt far from mine. We are at the top of the hill near the shell on Blackfoot. Blackfoot and 42nd.

[jjmac]

Which company do you work for Cos?

I'm assuming it's by the Silver Dollar Bowling Alley

[Cos]

Originally posted by jjmac
Which company do you work for Cos?

I'm assuming it's by the Silver Dollar Bowling Alley

It is actually across the street from Cash Casino, the new construction site attached to Coco Brooks (to the north).

We dont have a sign yet but we are called Caltech Utilities (www.caltechutilities.ca)

http://maps.google.ca/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&geocode=&q=&sll=51.033689,-114.036283&sspn=0.008474,0.022681&gl=ca&ie=UTF8&ll=51.019357,-114.048729&spn=0,359.977319&t=h&z=16&layer=c&cbll=51.019906,-114.04863&panoid=mlTXUQcBo8C0ttgtHJR_SA&cbp=12,214.1,,0,2.36

that is our building.

[jjmac]

Ohh yea lucky, being right beside Coco Brooks

San Pedro Egg mMMmm

[Cos]

Originally posted by jjmac
Ohh yea lucky, being right beside Coco Brooks

San Pedro Egg mMMmm

Between beer and coco brooks and all the ukranian places around here. I gained something like 15 lbs in the 6 months we have moved to this location.

Uggg

Since it has been warm I have been running, running is hard being fatter.

[sevewone]

Originally posted by Cos



Uhhh you have that backward.

http://www.aset.ab.ca/pages/Membership/TechComparison.aspx

yeah thats right y bad

[broken_legs]

Originally posted by LLLimit


1. Not at all. I spend more time explaining wtf it is to people than anything else.
2. Oil and Gas

[Jry_79]

Originally posted by Sugarphreak
You are comparing APPEGA to ASET :rolleyes:

Well I am here to learn as much as the next guy; what kind of proffesional liability exactly is ASET going to give to them?

Currently if I wanted to join I would simply send them a couple of references, do an ethics test and a big check. I don't understand what that brings to the table in terms of credibility :dunno:

Usually people have opinions, some good, some bad, some with facts and some without. (Im assuming your in a higher level position due to the fact you specified your position involves considering potential employees such as designers etc) But someone who portrays themselves in a position with great responsibility should be more informed about current legislation, prior to spewing their misinformed intelect all over this board in which some people do take your guidance with high consideration.

[JfuckinC]

Yo dirty D why didn't you tell me this the other night!!!! We are doing robotics design at work and could maybe use your help/contacts. I'm gunna message you on facebook when i get home from work.

[rony_espana]

1. CET has not helped me at all, but I guess its one more thing you can put on your resume. Hard to justify paying $250 a year for something that is not very useful...am looking forward to P.Tech someday though I guess....

2. Networking/Telecom

[Sugarphreak]

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[Cos]

Originally posted by Sugarphreak


Fourthly, as far as the P.tech certification goes, it is fairly new and I have yet to meet anybody with it. From what I understand ASET is working in conjunction with APEGGA to offer the P.Tech certification, which allows them to sign off on their own work. My question before was more regarding what exactly it entitles them to sign off on, I somehow doubt it can encompass the same range of things that a full P.Eng stamp is able to.

afaik, aset is now independent of apegga. Aset used to offer ret/rpt as a joint certification but now that they are equal under the act the joint certification is no longer valid.

Just an FYI

[Sugarphreak]

...

[broken_legs]

wow


495 dollars later.

I got a nice pamphlet explaining the new P.Tech.

A POS little cardboard card saying im a CET

and a 2010 sticket to ?? put on my certification in my imaginary office lol

[Cos]

Originally posted by Sugarphreak


What about the P.Tech certification? I was just going off the announcement on the APPEGA site about how they jointly regulate it.

http://www.apegga.org/Applicants/Professional-Technologist/index.html

I was talking about P.Tech. From the literature I got from ASET the RET/RPT was joint certified (RET was ASET and didnt actually give you anything like the CET, but it DID allow you to hold the RPT with APEGGA and stamp). The new P.Tech is regulated under the same act as APEGGA but is independent from them.

That is just my understanding form ASET's literature they sent me and the news articles I have read.

[Sugarphreak]

...

[Cos]

.

[Jry_79]

Originally posted by Sugarphreak



Firstly, you spelled "intellect" wrong; which kind of casts a bit of irony onto your post :) lol, sorry... anyway moving on.

LOL! Hilarious...........we all know the kind of people that pin points something as little as that..........someone needs to grow up! So NO it doesn't cast a bit of irony onto my post, if anything it secures the underlying message that you sir........talks out of your ass LOL

[jjmac]

Originally posted by Jry_79


Usually people have opinions, some good, some bad, some with facts and some without. (Im assuming your in a higher level position due to the fact you specified your position involves considering potential employees such as designers etc) But someone who portrays themselves in a position with great responsibility should be more informed about current legislation, prior to spewing their misinformed intelect all over this board in which some people do take your guidance with high consideration.

:facepalm: :facepalm:

[Sugarphreak]

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[Jry_79]

Originally posted by Sugarphreak


lol, stop being such a drama queen and lighten up a bit. I usually am not a grammar nazi, but you were accusing me of "spewing misinformed intellect"... and you spelled "intellect" wrong in the process... it is kind of funny in an ironic way considering the context :) Sorry if you are upset by it, it was meant as a friendly jab before I lead into my response.

Okay okay, lets get back to providing guidance to the original poster....anyways our little squabble will give him a little insight of what kind of drama he may experience in the work force.....at the end of the day Sugarphreak I'm sure you are good at what you do! You previously mentioned how you got in the industry and where you stand now, you must be a hard working individual with good work ethics....my apologies for the bantering, I can come off as a bitch sometimes but don't mean to be! My delivery needs working on.....as well as my grammer!

[Sugarphreak]

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[cet]

Originally posted by LLLimit
I'm with SNC, currently doing 240kV design & brownfield work. I remember I did 25kV dist. work for Shell when I first started in this industry. Just a short ~4km line in Fort Mcmurray.

I see you live in bridgeland too, hows that drive to the Fortis building btw? Good company to work for?

I'm with SNC as well. I was with CPBU for 5 years and am now with Transportation.