Why M3's are so popular in the states...

[rage2]

... man they're so much cheaper down there!

In USA, a M3 starts at $46,500, or $60,450cdn at today's exchange rate.

In Canada, the M3 starts at $73,950, a whopping $13,500 more.

Noticed this when I was comparing M3 vs C32... in Canada, C32 is $7k cdn cheaper. In the states, the C32 is $10k cdn more expensive. When you compare C32 US price vs Canadian price at today's exchange rate, it's only off by about $2000.

So why do americans get M3's cheaper??? :)

[BMWilli]

wish i had an m3, but its soo true...they get a lot of their cars much cheaper than ours....and sometimes they get more standard options too

[1badPT]

yankee bastards!!!

I dunno, probably with it being a true import as opposed to imported as parts and assembled in the us, its probably a market driven price drop - more people having m3 = less of a status symbol and lower closing prices. Canada its the reverse since M3 are still fairly rare. Just guessing though really.

[buh_buh]

I wouldn't say its rare.
I see more M3's during the summer than I do Preludes!
Its by far the most popular car in that price range.

[1badPT]

Only other thing I can think of (but can't justify the price difference) is maybe the Canadian M3's are re-sold American M3's (ie one more set of hands to pay profit to). But 13,500 for each seems quite the premium.

[sputnik]

I've also noticed that older M3s on eBay sell for much cheaper than used in Canada.

[K271]

It's because in the states there are more repair facilities for BMW's then there are in Canada. In the states there are many certified BMW garages, and not as many in Canada. It's the same reason why Mercedes, BMW, Peugot... and so forth are so cheap in Europe. It's all about the technicians.

[max_boost]

The exchange rate!!

Weird how the C32 is almost $6K US more than the M3 in the U.S but in Canada, it is the other way around;:confused: :confused:

[Weapon_R]

Your calculations are flawed. It is actually MB that is overpricing their C32.


Given that the prices were set at the beginning of the year when exchange rates were approximately 1.49 or so, the Canadian M3 price of 73,000 and the US price of 46,500 would almost be identical. Now that the Canadian dollar has risen in comparison to the US dollar, it seems as though we can purchase the U.S. M3 cheaper, although both the US and Canadian prices within their domestic borders has not changed.

With that said, when exchange rates were at 1.49, the MB C32 would have been completely overpriced here as compared to the United States. It's only when the U.S. dollar weakened that the exchange rate made the two prices relatively equal (within $2000).

[buh_buh]

hm... is it legal to buy a new M3 over in the states and register it here then? You could save like $15k!

[bol]

Originally posted by buh_buh
hm... is it legal to buy a new M3 over in the states and register it here then? You could save like $15k!


As far as I know, it's legal. Getting dealers do honour your warranty would be a different story though...


You'd have to switch the gauge cluster for km/hr of course and make sure it has amber reflectors to pass inspection.

[rage2]

Originally posted by Weapon_R
Your calculations are flawed. It is actually MB that is overpricing their C32.

BMW M3 :
Canadian Price : $73,950cdn
US Price : $46,500 (exchange rate of 1.59)

Mercedes Benz C32 :
Canadian Price : $67,850cdn
US Price : $52,100usd (exchange of 1.30)

haha man, we're so getting juiced on the M3's in Canada :).


Originally posted by buh_buh
hm... is it legal to buy a new M3 over in the states and register it here then? You could save like $15k!
Yes it's legal.... and it'll still come out cheaper. But of course you have to deal with Calgary BMW and their "great service" :barf:

[Altezza]

Well, another thing to consider is that there is a much larger market for these cars in the US than in Canada. Not only that, but Americans in the income range that can afford those cars generally make more money than us Canucks. Add that to the fact that they pay less in income tax, makes it relatively easy to afford an US$60k car. Generally, the tax situation for the businesses and the individuals are more favourable in the US than in Canada.

[1badPT]

In reply to buh_buh

There's an orgainization that is responsible for importing cars from other countries, but I forget what it is. Someone posted it in one of the threads here, but I can't remember what it was called, RIY or something. I'll try to find it and edit my post.

EDIT: THANKS! Its in the next post :)
http://www.lobsterpot.net.uk/images/gimme/arrow-down.gif

[rage2]

http://www.riv.ca :)

[rage2]

Originally posted by Altezza
Well, another thing to consider is that there is a much larger market for these cars in the US than in Canada. Not only that, but Americans in the income range that can afford those cars generally make more money than us Canucks. Add that to the fact that they pay less in income tax, makes it relatively easy to afford an US$60k car. Generally, the tax situation for the businesses and the individuals are more favourable in the US than in Canada.
Good explaination, so why the hell is the M3 that much cheaper in the US? :)

I actually found this oddity when trying to justify buying an M3 a few months ago. I posted on a few BMW forums complaining about the M3 being so damn expensive, and not worth the money, and I got flamed pretty good. I just thought those BMW guys were a bunch of stuck up snobs... then last night, I read last month's C32 vs M3 vs S4 review and noticed the price of the M3 was cheaper than the C32, a quick check on the 2 sites, and these numbers came up. So I guess I sounded like an idiot on the bmw forums lol.

[ZorroAMG]

Originally posted by 1badPT
yankee bastards!!!

I dunno, probably with it being a true import as opposed to imported as parts and assembled in the us,

Are you saying that you think the C32 is assembled in the US?

[B17a]

Originally posted by rage2

I read last month's C32 vs M3 vs S4 review

What was the outcome of this review? That'd be a neat comparison.

[1badPT]

Originally posted by ZorroAMG


Are you saying that you think the C32 is assembled in the US?

Nope. I was trying to figure out why there was such a disparity between the US M3's and the Canadian M3's. The point I was trying to make is that M3's are assembled in Germany which is unlike most Japanese imports like hondas and toyotas which are imported as parts and assembled in north america. Japanese imports seem to be consistently priced whether you buy them north or south of the border, but the original question in the thread is why are M3's priced so much higher in Canada than they are in the States. I thought perhaps the US was the main point of import, and then they were re-tooled for the Canadian market - extra set of hands to pay, and extra work to bring it to Canadian specs (DRL's, km speedo, etc.)

PS - I have no fucking clue where the C32 is assembled and I can't be arsed to find out :tongue: :dunno:

[ninjak84]

Originally posted by rage2
... man they're so much cheaper down there!

Not just the e46 M3's, but we get screwed on the e36's too!!!

[bol]

Originally posted by 1badPT


I thought perhaps the US was the main point of import, and then they were re-tooled for the Canadian market - extra set of hands to pay, and extra work to bring it to Canadian specs (DRL's, km speedo, etc.)

PS - I have no fucking clue where the C32 is assembled and I can't be arsed to find out :tongue: :dunno:

Nope. All the tooling is done in Germany and the point of import is in Halifax if I recal correctly(if its not, it's still someplace east.) They get loaded onto a train and delivered to the dealerships.


The only difference between US and Canadian models are standard features(and the gauge cluster.)

I am not aware of current standard features, but they are different, and always have been. For the longest time Canada got Xenon headlights as standard, while in the US they were an option. Things like sunroof, heated seats, power vs manual seats, all different in the standard feature list between the countries.

That will have an effect on pricing, but not a 15k effect.

My take on it is they picked an average exchange rate that was high and used that to convert all the pricing thus keeping prices artificially high. The US is a much larger market, with MUCH more supply(dealers are having a lot of trouble clearing out 2002/3 inventory.)

[C4S]

Originally posted by rage2
... man they're so much cheaper down there!
In USA, a M3 starts at $46,500, or $60,450cdn at today's exchange rate.
In Canada, the M3 starts at $73,950, a whopping $13,500 more.
Noticed this when I was comparing M3 vs C32... in Canada, C32 is $7k cdn cheaper. In the states, the C32 is $10k cdn more expensive. When you compare C32 US price vs Canadian price at today's exchange rate, it's only off by about $2000.
So why do americans get M3's cheaper??? :)

Because in US .. they sell BASIC M3 !
leather, sunroof, Harman Kardon, Xenon, alarm, memory seats .. even CD player . is option ! :( and in Canada, they come Fully loaded already ! (well, GPS or SMG are still option)

For C32, that is the other way, for canadian model, Xenon, sunroof ..etc and many things.. are still options...

However, any car, is cheaper to buy in USA today ... :(
But 6 months ago, every car is cheaper to buy in Canada ... :D

But it is turth that, in other markets, such as UK, European, Asian, C32 is about 5% more expensive then M3, however,other market offer discount on C32 but not M3.(ie:UK)

Last yr, everyone is talking about buy a car from Canada and sell to US, today, is the other way !

May be should plan to go to state to buy a used M3 ! ::clap:

Anyway, both are nice car ! :bigpimp:

[rage2]

Originally posted by bol
My take on it is they picked an average exchange rate that was high and used that to convert all the pricing thus keeping prices artificially high. The US is a much larger market, with MUCH more supply(dealers are having a lot of trouble clearing out 2002/3 inventory.)
That's not true either, I went through a few BMW cars and exchange rates varied on the high side.

Same went with Mercedes, the exchange varies throughout the model range. Average is a bit lower than BMW.

You would assume pricing would be close between each segment, but it's not haha. Very confusing indeed. With the M3 vs C32 which competes with each other, well, we got pretty much the opposite ends on both brands, which made comparing the 2 cars in canada totally different than comparing the 2 cars in US.

[C4S]

Originally posted by B17a


What was the outcome of this review? That'd be a neat comparison.

From which comparasion ?
for all the UK magazines, M3 rules !
for American magazines ? because of "1" more horsepower on S4, and it is a V8, and offer more "space" they pick S4 ! believe or not !

I will go for C32 before S4 ! (predicted resale value in 4 yrs : 33% vs 41% :eek: )

[B17a]

Originally posted by C4S


From which comparasion ?
for all the UK magazines, M3 rules !
for American magazines ? because of "1" more horsepower on S4, and it is a V8, and offer more "space" they pick S4 ! believe or not !

I will go for C32 before S4 ! (predicted resale value in 4 yrs : 38% vs 53% :eek: )

How about for just straight performance?

[C4S]

Originally posted by B17a

How about for just straight performance?

Performance ? M3

But S4 and C32 offer better ride.
For some reason, I don't like S4 much.. it is a good car.. but .. not as good as BENZ or BMW image.
However, they all as quick as a 911 for 2/3 price ! :thumbsup:

This is the US test : http://www.roadandtrack.com/article.asp?section_id=3&article_id=913&page_number=6&preview=

[SpoonEK9@STRD]

m3 in the states comes in 25 or more differnt colors...you should see the crazy colors they get.

[rage2]

Originally posted by C4S
Because in US .. they sell BASIC M3 !
leather, sunroof, Harman Kardon, Xenon, alarm, memory seats .. even CD player . is option ! :( and in Canada, they come Fully loaded already ! (well, GPS or SMG are still option)

For C32, that is the other way, for canadian model, Xenon, sunroof ..etc and many things.. are still options...
You should visit the sites more carefully... Xenon is standard, bixenon is optional in both US and Canada.

I spec'd out both to the max :

M3 - $88770cdn, $60140usd = 1.48 exchange
C32 - $84332cdn, 60955usd = 1.38 exchange

The C32 actually has more options in the states, so the 2 cars aren't equivilent anymore :).

[benyl]

Originally posted by rage2


BMW M3 :
Canadian Price : $73,950cdn
US Price : $46,500 (exchange rate of 1.59)

Mercedes Benz C32 :
Canadian Price : $67,850cdn
US Price : $52,100usd (exchange of 1.30)



Up until a few months ago, on average, Canadian car prices were cheaper relative to our american neighbors. In February, I was paying as much as $1.62 for a US dollar (When the dollar was $0.60).

One would expect that with our stronger dollar that price would come down, but I think that the car companies won't do that... they will just lose less money this year in Canada... hahaha

The strong dollar is great for getting stuff from the states, but it will screw the local merchants as consumers can get it for less in the states. You think that maybe the US planned this to boost exports?

[C4S]

Anyway .. AMG product in Canadian is a bargain !
Example:

AMG SL55 is about the same price or slightly more expensive compare to a Porsche 911 Turbo in all other market, however, it is cheaper to buy in Canada.

CLK 55 is also about the same price to a Loaded 911, but cheaper to buy in Canada ..

C32, they are slightly more expensive then M3 and Boxster S in other markets too, but cheaper in Canada ...

I guess that is what M-B Cananda decide to do, and since they merge with Chysler, M-B don't need to pay those "import car tax" to Canada (6.5%?) that is another reason why prices for Benz is going down a bit for last few years.

BMW used to be quite a bit cheaper then Benz 10 yr ago, but now, they are about the same ! even Lexus... Audi, their prices are going up ....

For people who likes Benz, Canada is a good place to
buy ! :thumbsup:

Rage: correct me if I am wrong, I got quote for $1445 for Xenon on C32(bi-xenon with headlightwasher) which is standard on M3.

[1badPT]

I think the MB distribution/sales network is much better developed in Canada than BMW's now simply because every Chrysler dealership can sell pretty much any model Benz now.

If you were to time warp from 1995 to today, it would look strange to see a showroom with Dodges, Chryslers, Jeeps (no Plymouths or Eagles) AND Mercedes Benz!

[C4S]

Ok..
I add up the price for 2004 M3 and C32 (6sp manual on M3, Auto for C32)

"Both" loaded with Bi-Xenon,headlight washer, premium sound system (Bose on C32, Harman Kardon on M3) Sunroof, Rear SunShade, Rain sensor, Tele Aid and CD changer.

C32 : $76,235 MSRP

M 3 : $76,020 MSRP
They are about the same price in Canada, however, AMG C32 is still more expensive then M3 in State, and the good thing for C32 is, if you don't take some options, the price is much lower, but on M3 case, most options are already "build in" to the price.

[rage2]

I don't think you understand what I was trying to point out :).

I'm not comparing C32 vs M3 here, I'm saying M3's are a lot cheaper in the states than in Canada.

Also, for the Xenon, I was talking about US C32 vs CDN C32.

[buh_buh]

Originally posted by SpoonEK9
m3 in the states comes in 25 or more differnt colors...you should see the crazy colors they get.
Actually at any dealership in any country you can get any color that BMW has ever made. The dealership just has to do extra paperwork. And the only available "offered" colors at US dealerships without special order is 10, which is the same as Canada.

[E36M3]

Currency fluctations fuck the auto industry all the time. With the CDN dollar gainining 20%, pricing response has more to do with the parent companies hedging positions in a lot of cases then with local market conditions.

The complexity arises from the fact that as BMW, you might be paying your fixed costs in a combination of Euros, USD and CDN dollars, with your variable costs usually pegged to the local market currency, and when that currency has a huge rally (or fall), you have to cover your fixed + variable costs in other currencies.

M3s are definitely cheaper in the US right now (relative to Canada) mostly because of the relative strength of the CDN dollar. It definitely hasn't always been the case. Watch what happens when the CDN dollar rises to about 1.10:1 to the USD.


Originally posted by rage2
I don't think you understand what I was trying to point out :).

I'm not comparing C32 vs M3 here, I'm saying M3's are a lot cheaper in the states than in Canada.

Also, for the Xenon, I was talking about US C32 vs CDN C32.

[max_boost]

Originally posted by E36M3

M3s are definitely cheaper in the US right now (relative to Canada) mostly because of the relative strength of the CDN dollar. It definitely hasn't always been the case. Watch what happens when the CDN dollar rises to about 1.10:1 to the USD.

All hell is going to break loose if that happened! In a good way of course!!:D

[Clem]

Rage:

While yes we pay more for M3s one thing you may not have looked at is the standard features on an M3 in Canada vs. the USA.

Base M3s in the US are litterally BONE stock. Compare the standard features and options on www.bmwusa.com with the ones on www.bmw.ca . Or to make it even easier try the "Build your own..." on each site. You'll see clearly that there are very little options on Canadian M3s because a lot more stuff is standard equipment. (over US m3s)

As an example:

Xenons and glass power moonroof are both standard in Canadian M3s while in US ones they are not.

You're prolly looking at $800-$900 for the Xenons and over $1000 for the sunroof alone. (based on what it would cost if you were to get those options on a regulaer E46)

[C4S]

Originally posted by rage2
I don't think you understand what I was trying to point out :).
I'm not comparing C32 vs M3 here, I'm saying M3's are a lot cheaper in the states than in Canada.

Agree !:thumbsup: most the sports cars are cheaper to buy in State then Canada now ! :D

If I have money, I will buy the 911 Turbo from State ! he he .
$120KUS($156Kcan)base vs $176Kbase in Canada ! $20K different!:eek:

[E36M3]

If you wanted to bring it into Canada, you wouldn't end up saving any money. You'd pay US taxes (sales tax if the state had it), plus 7% GST + an additional importation tax for duty (~6.5%), both on the entire sales price of the car, including US taxes.

156k * 1.07 = 166.92
166.92 * 1.065 = 177.77

Already, you'd lose money by buying it in the US, not taking into account your currency risk at moment. This also assumes a 0% sales tax from the state you buy it from.


Originally posted by C4S


Agree !:thumbsup: most the sports cars are cheaper to buy in State then Canada now ! :D

If I have money, I will buy the 911 Turbo from State ! he he .
$120KUS($156Kcan)base vs $176Kbase in Canada ! $20K different!:eek:

[C4S]

He he .. just dreaming .....

but still .. after all the taxes, at $177K vs $176k plus GST ...is like $190K !

He he ..if I have that much money, I guess I don't care.....:D

We cannot buy the whole USA to Canada ..right ? :drool:

[FiveFreshFish]

Originally posted by rage2
... man they're so much cheaper down there!

In USA, a M3 starts at $46,500, or $60,450cdn at today's exchange rate.

In Canada, the M3 starts at $73,950, a whopping $13,500 more.

Noticed this when I was comparing M3 vs C32... in Canada, C32 is $7k cdn cheaper. In the states, the C32 is $10k cdn more expensive. When you compare C32 US price vs Canadian price at today's exchange rate, it's only off by about $2000.

So why do americans get M3's cheaper??? :)

You have to look at the prices and exchange rates when the E46 M3 was introduced. Back then, it took about 1.60 of our pathetic dollar to equal 1.00 US buck.

The Canadian price, iirc, was about $69k to $70k. Now that our dollar has strengthened so much relative to the US buck, you'd think the price should be less than the 2001 price, but that'll never happen.

They have to keep the price in line relative to the previous model year's price, so you can't compare the price to a similar model offered in another country. Check the US prices and you'll also see that the 4 model years' prices are not out of line.

[FiveFreshFish]

What bugs me the most is the price of the SMG option.

It's $4900 in Canada and only $2400 in the US! WTF?

[Redlyne_mr2]

Yah buying a car in the states is the way to go...I might pick up a 951 south of the border next summer sooo cheap]

[rage2]

Originally posted by Redlyne_mr2
Yah buying a car in the states is the way to go...I might pick up a 951 south of the border next summer sooo cheap]
Buy mine... :)

[C4S]

you are selling your nice 951 ? :D

[Redlyne_mr2]

Originally posted by rage2

Buy mine... :)
Last time I checked a fully built 951 street/track car that runs 12s wasnt cheap..If I could id buy yours in a second:(

[frostyda9]

Interesting thread. I've noticed the exchange issue ordering parts recently. Parts that had a dealer cost of say...$600USD at an exchange of 1.60 ($960) are still priced about the same now. In reality, at todays exchange rate, that part cost 1.31370 X 600 = $788.22. That's a $171.78 increase in profit on a sub-1000 dollar part by doing nothing. As long as the CDN $ stays strong, I plan to order from the US as much as possible.
Sorry if I went a little OT ;)