Builder won't pour driveway due to insufficient ground settling

[quazimoto]

So the builder that built our home is Beattie Homes and we love our house to death but absolutely HATE the construction managers, site super's etc as we are continually being lied to regarding a number of issues with our home. Right now of course everybody wants to get into the swing of things by getting driveways done, fences installed, grass, decks, etc. Our builder has the gull to tell us the ground around our home hasn't settle sufficiently so they feel it best to wait 2-3 weeks as apparently that's going to make a huge difference.

The foundation for our home was poured last August I do believe so it's nearly a year since it's been backfilled and as such it has settled 18" in most places and more due to all the moisture we've had. The temporary drive way of crushed gravel they gave us is rock hard and nothing has shifted in the last 3 weeks.

We think they are delaying since there are only two other homes that need a driveway in our community from the builder and they are waiting to have more of the houses ready just to make things financialy viable for their company while putting us all out conveniently. Essentially we cant back fill, a fence, grass until this is done.

Nobody from the builder has come by to physically inspect the soil around our home as well to see if it is or isn't ready and other companies are pouring in our community as we speak. Is it just me or is it complete BS for them to say it hasn't settled enough when it's been nearly 1 year and at the same time they'll pour driveways for homes that were backfilled just 2-3 months ago. I'm puzzled on it and they continue to stress me out.

First they installed a sump pump in our home and didn't drill holes in the well so our basement flooded.

Second we have a faulty hot water heater which is consuming around 1000 KWH a month of electricity. Just in case you aren't aware that is more energy than most 2000 SQ FT homes will consume.

[Masked Bandit]

Well of course it's BS. But they have your money, what are you going to do about it? Unfortunately this is just one of the shitty parts of building a new home.

[shynepho]

Originally posted by quazimoto
So the builder that built our home is Beattie Homes and we love our house to death but absolutely HATE the construction managers, site super's etc as we are continually being lied to regarding a number of issues with our home. Right now of course everybody wants to get into the swing of things by getting driveways done, fences installed, grass, decks, etc. Our builder has the gull to tell us the ground around our home hasn't settle sufficiently so they feel it best to wait 2-3 weeks as apparently that's going to make a huge difference.

The foundation for our home was poured last August I do believe so it's nearly a year since it's been backfilled and as such it has settled 18" in most places and more due to all the moisture we've had. The temporary drive way of crushed gravel they gave us is rock hard and nothing has shifted in the last 3 weeks.

We think they are delaying since there are only two other homes that need a driveway in our community from the builder and they are waiting to have more of the houses ready just to make things financialy viable for their company while putting us all out conveniently. Essentially we cant back fill, a fence, grass until this is done.

Nobody from the builder has come by to physically inspect the soil around our home as well to see if it is or isn't ready and other companies are pouring in our community as we speak. Is it just me or is it complete BS for them to say it hasn't settled enough when it's been nearly 1 year and at the same time they'll pour driveways for homes that were backfilled just 2-3 months ago. I'm puzzled on it and they continue to stress me out.

First they installed a sump pump in our home and didn't drill holes in the well so our basement flooded.

Second we have a faulty hot water heater which is consuming around 1000 KWH a month of electricity. Just in case you aren't aware that is more energy than most 2000 SQ FT homes will consume.

Which community are you in? We are also having a tough time with our driveway being poured. All the people who took possesion after us have already received thier driveway. Ours on the other hand has not been poured yet due to the moisture in the ground. Right..

ps. im in Skyview ranch

[PeterGTiR]

It sounds like a reasonable expectation to me. The builder is there to make money: keep costs down to maximize net income. :thumbsup:

[NickGT]

It will get done eventually. I just moved into my place in Jan. and just got my driveway a week ago. I watched a lot of homes behind me that aren't even being lived in getting driveways before I did. It's annoying. But it will get done.

Like someone else said. It's part of building a new home. Your patience will be tested. Enjoy! :nut:

[quazimoto]

No I won't take the BS and lies they have delivered though. Which builder did you go through at skyview ranch just curious. There shouldn't be issues there I wouldn't think as the water table is higher.

Basic point why lie to the client.

If it weren't for the fact we have 3 dogs and require said back yard it might be one thing but becasue of all this we are seriously waiting until August if not longer just for a fence.

[sxtasy]

Construction is obviously seasonal, everyone is very busy right now and to have to wait a couple of week doesn't sound so bad. Could be a lot worse imo.

[quazimoto]

Except when you are originally told May and then lied to continuously. It's nothing to do with seasonal when they are delaying it just to wait for other homes in the area to be ready as well.

[NickGT]

Originally posted by quazimoto
No I won't take the BS and lies they have delivered though. Which builder did you go through at skyview ranch just curious. There shouldn't be issues there I wouldn't think as the water table is higher.

Basic point why lie to the client.

If it weren't for the fact we have 3 dogs and require said back yard it might be one thing but becasue of all this we are seriously waiting until August if not longer just for a fence.

I bought some of that temporary orange fence shit, some stakes. spiked them in the ground and laid some sod so my dog has a place to shit. Just a thought :dunno:

[Lex350]

Probably the real reason is the concrete companies are behind in their work because of a ll the rain.

[Hounddog]

We think they are delaying since there are only two other homes that need a driveway in our community from the builder and they are waiting to have more of the houses ready just to make things financialy viable for their company while putting us all out conveniently. Essentially we cant back fill, a fence, grass until this is done.

Quaz - did you have seasonal hold-backs when you took possession? Some builders automatically will have a hold back on their funds until certain seasonal items are completed. It would be in their best interest to have all flat work completed so the rest of the funds are released to them.

Holding back a pour to wait for other homes to be built shouldn't affect what is already built. The P/O's have already been released to the concrete company - the builder has already "paid" for the job - I'm not too sure how this would be financially viable to the builder to wait.

Anyways, it sounds like you're getting the run around here - does the builder have a seasonal supervisor? Give that person a shout and see if they can't give you a better explanation.

Good luck!

Edit: Have they at least prepped you driveway?

[GTS4tw]

Originally posted by quazimoto
No I won't take the BS and lies they have delivered though.

Unfortunately you will. What are you going to do? I have seen 90% of people I know go through the same situation and every one of them said the same thing "they wont get away with it!"

But they will.

[AndyL]

Do you really want to push the issue? Lets say they do pour it at your insistence... What happens if settling occurs and the driveway needs to be ripped out and redone? Are you going to pay for it?

Beatties pretty good - Not saying they or any other builder is perfect... But no they haven't paid for it (90% once completed - not before - often the bigger builders wont even allow for material purchases before one is onsite).

While it might be frustrating, there's probably a reason for it. You might think there's not - but I've seen some f*cked up shit working in construction; the oddest problems for the oddest reasons... If you've got a good builder - let them do their job.

[quazimoto]

I guess that's where your wrong. I have an egineering firm coming in on Friday to conduct core tests on the soil surrounding our house just to prove the builder wrong. If we can prove they are intentionally delaying the process for anything other than a "seasonal" reason they are in breach of contract and as such I can easily file a civil lawsuit against them for doing so.

The really bizarre part is every time we mentioned anything regarding the building process with deficiencies or problems areas the site super would flat out lie to us and when repairs were done they were not done in a professional manner.

Oddly enough i've read other threads where people said the contractors used felt pens to fix chips in stained wood products this goes beyond this. We were told initially that the showers in both our bathrooms would be tiled using a kerdi membrane and low and behold they didn't do that. They tiled the backsplash so poorly the grout looks rough, tiles aren't level, etc. They chipped the living crap out of fire place mantle when install brick work around the mantle. Apparently the retards they have doing the brick weren't smart enough to cover it. They fixed said mantle using the wonderful color it with a pen technique so it was a ghetto fix. Similar issue with our spindle railing. Installed it, whomever sprayed it was a retard since the stain is uneven all over the place and then to boot again t was chipped in several places and instead of properly restaining it they just colored it in with a friggin pen.

The worst part with the issues is we brought them up as the house was being constructed so they could be fixed in a timely manner and the site super responds with something like...

This is why I don't like people going into the house when it's still under construction since they look at everything too closely and try to tell us how to do our job.

Oddly enough the first time I built with Beattie it was nothing but a great experience with virtually no problems. This time around it's nothing but issue after issue and lie after lie.

Heck day after we moved in they send the plumber to install the water lines to our fridge since they put the appliances in at the very last second. Not only did the retard drill the hole for the water line poorly but in the process he decided he'd drop his entire tool belt on the floor which left several major dents in the hardwood. It was so bad it ruined the wood finish. He also saw fit to attempt to try to drill the hole through floor joist. I guess using a stud finder would make too much sense to make sure when you are drilling through finished product that it's going to actually work. When they looked at the damage to the hardwood apparently they didn't believe us when we all said he dropped his tool belt. It was basically, "we find it hard to believe our trades person would have done this". They went on to basically say that they would repair it anyways.

It gets better a month after move in snow starts to melt and we get a little rain. I hear this wierd sound from the basement. Go downstairs to find our entire basement is covered in water. Reason... The intelligent person they had installing the sump pump didn't drill a single hole in the sump pump casing so the water just came up right into the basement. It happened to ruin the carpet, underlay and damage a portion of the spindle railing down there. At first they basically told us they would have their guys come out to re-install the crappy carpet that had just been damaged. I had to ask a few times to get new carpet/underlay for the area. You would think they would at least offer to clean up the mess and the old crappy carpet/underlay but no they left it for us and we ended up having to spray down the entire basement and clean it to get rid of the smell.

Oh it gets better. i posted this one in another post. The electric water heater they installed is consuming a little over 1000 KWH a month. When we first told them our electrical bills were higher than they should be they sent their home technician out and he tested all the recepticals in the house and said it looks normal to him. He said they could call in the electrician to look over everything but if they didn't find anything we'd be on the hook for it. We knew something was wrong so we took the intiative and I slowly night by night and day by day tested every single breaker until we determined it was the water heater consuming mad amounts of electricity. You'd think any appliance consuming over 1000 KWH of electricity a month could be relatively dangerous but they seem to think it can wait another two weeks for the electrician to come look at the wiring. They also don't see to want to answer the question of if they are going to reimburse us for the wasted electrical consumption.

Had they looked at the consumption the house was taking prior to our possession they would have seen it was way out of whack. Epcor actually asked us if we had been running a hot tub a lot or maybe if we were growing some special plants. Seriously they couldn't figure out how our house was using up 1800 KWH a month.

I'm really praying nothing else goes wrong with the home now. We are pushing the builder more and more to terminate the site super as he has been constantly lying to us and honestly if they just came right out and told us why there were delays we'd be ok with but when you are constantly lied to its nuts.

As for the back yard situation we do have a temporary enclosure for them to do their business. HOWEVER having three little dogs couped up in a house is not normal and they want to go outside, run around, play, etc. Taking them for walks two times a day while some days it can be nice is a simple way to consume valuable time.

To top this off other builder's in the community have been pouring driveways 3 weeks ago since he land really hasn't shifted much since then. BLAH.....

[quazimoto]

Originally posted by AndyL
Do you really want to push the issue? Lets say they do pour it at your insistence... What happens if settling occurs and the driveway needs to be ripped out and redone? Are you going to pay for it?

Beatties pretty good - Not saying they or any other builder is perfect... But no they haven't paid for it (90% once completed - not before - often the bigger builders wont even allow for material purchases before one is onsite).

While it might be frustrating, there's probably a reason for it. You might think there's not - but I've seen some f*cked up shit working in construction; the oddest problems for the oddest reasons... If you've got a good builder - let them do their job.

Andy

Wish this was the case. They started spouting of facts to me and I simply brought up the fact their construction manager hasn't even come out to our house and nor has the concrete company to physically survey what the conditions are like. I basically asked them if they weren't just taking a basic guess and of course got no real answer. Yet at the same time they are probably going to pour driveways for homes that were backfilled just a couple months ago along with ours. Seems to make sense all right.

[theken]

concrete cracks. It always will. There is nothing you can do about it. They are stress cracks that's what the point of the lines in your driveway ands on the sidewalks is to create a controlled crack essentially. If it cracks in other spots it is a weak spot in the concrete.

[Unknown303]

You are definitely better off letting it sit longer before pouring.

When I first move to calgary I was working for a concrete cutting outfit and we were always removing driveways that were poured to early and then they would collapse when a car drove onto them. Sometimes after 6 months the ground under the garage would settle more than a foot and one day when your parking in there it the whole thing would collapse.

[ddduke]

Originally posted by Hounddog


Quaz - did you have seasonal hold-backs when you took possession? Some builders automatically will have a hold back on their funds until certain seasonal items are completed. It would be in their best interest to have all flat work completed so the rest of the funds are released to them.

Holding back a pour to wait for other homes to be built shouldn't affect what is already built. The P/O's have already been released to the concrete company - the builder has already "paid" for the job - I'm not too sure how this would be financially viable to the builder to wait.



I don't know where you get your facts from, but we do alot of work for many different home builders and they usually don't pay for 30-90 days after completion, so they haven't "paid" for anything. Supers drive around and check each stage of the house (literally mark that it's ready for the next step), so if your driveway is ready to be poured I'm sure it's not the supers fault.

I'm going to say it's the concrete company waiting for a few to be ready before they move into the area, or maybe they're just behind schedule. The super is probably just lying to you because he has no real answers.

It sucks that you don't have your drive way, but I'd tell you to be patient. In 2004 when Cardel built our first home the driveway cracked 2 times and each time they replaced the full thing. If you press the issue and anything comes up in the future then I bet you'd be SOL.

Just be patient.

[derran.m]

Patience is a virtue ... it is a bitch having to wait it out, but just let them do their jobs ... especially when dealing with new construction this time of year, and with the weather we have had this year.
Site super is lying because he cannot get a straight answer out of the concrete company. Concrete company is probably so backlogged they are either lying to their clients or just not answering them, therefore site super has no truth to tell you because he does not know, so he lies to get you off his case. Give it time and wait it out. The more you harass the super the more pissed he gets at you - think of him as only a middle man ... he hires all the specific contractors to do the work... and again, with weather as shitty as it has been, concrete co's are running their asses off trying to get caught up.

[Hounddog]

Originally posted by ddduke


I don't know where you get your facts from, but we do alot of work for many different home builders and they usually don't pay for 30-90 days after completion, so they haven't "paid" for anything. Supers drive around and check each stage of the house (literally mark that it's ready for the next step), so if your driveway is ready to be poured I'm sure it's not the supers fault.



Sorry, I should have been more clear. My "paid" contained in qoutes has obviously, eluded some on here. The reason I put, "paid" (in qoutes) was to point out figuratively that the home builder has this work in their respective build budget - I was simply trying point out to the o/p that the builder wouldn't gain much in regards to, "financial viability"

Hope this clears up my, "paid"

ddduke - what concrete co. are you with? I'm using A-1 for my pours - maybe I know you!

[D. Dub]

Originally posted by quazimoto
I guess that's where your wrong. I have an egineering firm coming in on Friday to conduct core tests on the soil surrounding our house just to prove the builder wrong. If we can prove they are intentionally delaying the process for anything other than a "seasonal" reason they are in breach of contract and as such I can easily file a civil lawsuit against them for doing so.




...and what exactly would your damages consist of? How could it be enough to possibly make the time and effort of a lawsuit worthwhile? :dunno:

[ddduke]

Originally posted by Hounddog


Sorry, I should have been more clear. My "paid" contained in qoutes has obviously, eluded some on here. The reason I put, "paid" (in qoutes) was to point out figuratively that the home builder has this work in their respective build budget - I was simply trying point out to the o/p that the builder wouldn't gain much in regards to, "financial viability"

Hope this clears up my, "paid"

ddduke - what concrete co. are you with? I'm using A-1 for my pours - maybe I know you!

Sorry man, didn't mean to come off as a dick. But I completely get what you're saying.

I actually don't work in the concrete industry, we do full exteriors for the builders.

[Hounddog]

Originally posted by ddduke


Sorry man, didn't mean to come off as a dick. But I completely get what you're saying.

I actually don't work in the concrete industry, we do full exteriors for the builders.

ddduke - It's all good! :thumbsup:

[quazimoto]

Originally posted by D. Dub



...and what exactly would your damages consist of? How could it be enough to possibly make the time and effort of a lawsuit worthwhile? :dunno:


Nothing to do with damages. I'd simply file a civil lawsuit and have another company pour the driveway just to get it done and paid for. Seriously you can't just let people or companies attempt to push you around when you have a signed contract I don't think at least.

[masoncgy]

It's probably a combination of the trade & the site super giving you a little BS to buy time.

Concrete companies get stretched to the limit during the 'dry months' and rainy/wet weather simply puts them further behind schedule, so there are times where they will arrange to do pours on an entire street/etc so that they can attempt to get back on track.

This is pretty standard. I had tons of clients in Silverado wait forever for sidewalks & driveways because of wet & rainy weather... it happens.

If it does not happen this season, then I would be pissed off. Unfortuntely, you have to give these seasonal trades a little more time to get their work done within the 'dry season'.

[quazimoto]

Honestly no I don't. If they are doing houses in other communities then it's just crap. It's just a delay tactic since they don't have enough homes to pour at the same time to make it most economically viable for them. As it stands right now we are looking at mid august at BEST. The concrete is really just one thing in a list of many that the builder is doing to physically annoy us. Either way the complaint was made with the better business bureau today.

I was able to call other companies that said they could easily come this week to pour a driveway. They have said yes it's busy this time of the year but the employees also expect that and they apparently don't mind the overtime hours.

My guess with certain builders is they demand the lowest price possible which is probably next to cost and because of it they get the least priority possible. The amount beattie said they would give us if we did the driveway ourself was just absolute crap.

My personal preference would be to have a fiber reinforced concrete driveway and it's not even an option they will provide. I know my friends family did this some 10 years ago and their driveway doesn't have one single crack it's rather amazing.

[masoncgy]

^ I see your side of it, but for a large production builder like Beattie, these sorts of complaints are a dime a dozen. Trust me, I managed hundreds of new build accounts with another builder in Calgary, and complaints about incomplete seasonal work are the majority between April & October, for all large production builders.

There should be a section within your purchase agreement that details the specifics surrounding seasonal work completion timelines, holdbacks, etc. You might want to refer back to those pages and determine what has been outlined as a reasonal completion time frame for all of your seasonal work. If something has been written and not delivered as promised, then you have a little ground to stand on.


Originally posted by quazimoto
It's just a delay tactic since they don't have enough homes to pour at the same time to make it most economically viable for them. As it stands right now we are looking at mid august at BEST. The concrete is really just one thing in a list of many that the builder is doing to physically annoy us. Either way the complaint was made with the better business bureau today.

I was able to call other companies that said they could easily come this week to pour a driveway. They have said yes it's busy this time of the year but the employees also expect that and they apparently don't mind the overtime hours.

My guess with certain builders is they demand the lowest price possible which is probably next to cost and because of it they get the least priority possible. The amount beattie said they would give us if we did the driveway ourself was just absolute crap.

Absolutely. It makes little financial sense for a trade like A-1 to pour one driveway in one community, trot off to another area and do one there and so on. That is exactly why an entire street will be prepped & poured together. This is the same practice for final grade & topsoil, laying sod, etc. It's all done at the same time in the same area by the same trade.

Your complaint is one of hundreds occurring with every builder right now, guaranteed. This is standard between April & October... the push to get seasonal work done and the trades not being able to deliver the goods in what is to believed to be a reasonable about of time.

Perhaps you'll luck out and get your driveway done sooner than later based on your complaints... that remains to be seen.

[Lex350]

Originally posted by quazimoto


My personal preference would be to have a fiber reinforced concrete driveway and it's not even an option they will provide. I know my friends family did this some 10 years ago and their driveway doesn't have one single crack it's rather amazing.

Maybe because they let the ground settle before they poured the driveway. ;)