Problems with Landlord After Moving Out

[project240]

Will try to keep this as short as possible while still providing all the details...


We had previously been renting a house for approx 2.5 years and just recently moved out because we bought a house. During our stay, we didn't have any problems with the landlords, mostly because I took care of the yard, did all the small repairs myself... I didn't want to bother the landlords, nor did I want to be bothered.

Anyways, upon moving out the landlords came to inspect the house twice. The husband met us there in the afternoon, while we were finishing up cleaning a few things and then him and his wife met my girlfriend at the house again that evening to do a final walkthrough. They were both satisfied with the condition of the home and my girlfriend asked for a written note stating this along with when the damage deposit would be returned. The wife wrote a note stating she was happy with the condition of the home, DD would be returned within 1 week, dated it Aug.30 and signed.

Two days later we receive a phone call from landlord saying new tenants are complaining about the house "not being clean enough". I try to explain to her this is no longer my problem as we have already done our walkthrough with them. No matter how many times I try explaining it, she insists I need to go back and clean more or pay $300 for a cleaning service to come in.

I refuse and explain to her that I will file a claim if necessary because I have a signed note from her stating they were happy with condition of the house.

This is when I find out they must be very spiteful people. A day later I receive an email about a scratch in the floor as well as scratches on a kitchen countertop (both of which were talked about in the walkthrough and deemed "normal wear and tear") that she now is "getting a professional estimate to repair". She also says she wants to charge me because I "subletted" the house which broke the lease agreement (my brother stayed with us for about 12 weeks... the landlords knew about this and had no problem with it at the time).

Anyways, I have already figured out it is going to be necessary to file with small claims court to settle this. I have a couple things I am unsure about though...

First off, since I do have a signed note from them, my thinking is that I am pretty much guaranteed to win and receive at least my full DD back... does this sound logical?

Secondly, can I now charge them in my claim for past repairs/yard maintenance I did while living at their house? I do still have receipts for a few things...

Has anybody dealt with a similar situation? I'm extremely frustrated with the whole situation, mostly because I didn't ever ask them for one thing during our entire stay and now they have decided to turn this into a huge issue all because they don't want to have to spend a cent as landlords...

Sorry for the very long read... if anybody actually read everything any advice is appreciated.

[Kloubek]

Wow... amazing how quickly things can turn eh?

Firstly, you have an air-tight case. It was signed off, and there is nothing they can do now. Should they take it to court, you will win. And should they feel the need to do so, it is at that time you can present your counterclaim regarding the repairs you made and request compensation. If it was me, I'd drop it unless I was dragged into court anyway.

I can almost guarantee they will not give you your dd back. As such, you will probably have to instigate the court proceedings, or try to speak to some sort of regulatory board which will force them to give you have the dd.

Keep in mind the dd should have interest paid on top of it as well.

Good luck!

[BrknFngrs]

I would expect that you would have no major issue getting your full damage deposit back since you have signed confirmation from them that they were happy with the condition and would be refunding your deposit.

As for the work that you did, unless you had some kind of agreement with the landlords that entitles you to be reimbursed for the costs incurred I wouldn't expect that you'll be able to recover these amounts.

That being said, when you talk to them its probably worth telling them that your claim will include these amounts in full to see if the extra costs, if big enough, will be significant enough to make them back down and refund your deposit without having to go to court.

[CUG]

You're golden getting the signed note.

[AndyL]

Landlords name lucy by chance? :rofl: Sounds like my old one. She came after me for exterminator fees; largely why we left - couldn't get her to deal with it, after hundreds of empty promises.

Luckily we had a calgary health dept record of the complaints and inspections and the numerous orders to deal with the infestation... (And no we're not slobs - wife was a nurse and was/is OCD about keeping things spotless clean)

[bignerd]

Tell them you are going to contact maintenance companies and find out what they charge to do the repairs and maintenance you did on their home and send them an invoice (be sure to charge for your time).

[dsr7723]

Landlord's name start with an M by any chance? I could totally see my landlord breaking out the hammer and chisel once I move outta here...

[davidI]

You should be ok.

I'm currently seeking money from former tenants for a city fine of $250 as they didn't mow the lawn for 4 months and the city had to do it and for a broken window. Sucks.

[autosm]

Make sure to phone CCRA to ensure they are claiming the rental income from you. Tell them you moved out because she insisted you pay them cash.

[A790]

Originally posted by autosm
Tell them you moved out because she insisted you pay them cash.
Oh dude, that'd be fantastic!

+ rep!

[UndrgroundRider]

In Alberta the RTA is HEAVILY weighted in the favour of the tenant. In this situation you're golden. But let me clarify a few things.


Originally posted by project240
She also says she wants to charge me because I "subletted" the house which broke the lease agreement (my brother stayed with us for about 12 weeks... the landlords knew about this and had no problem with it at the time).

You might have been in default at the time when your brother was there, however, most leases require that the other party be given notification and a reasonable amount of time to cure any defaults. Since no action was taken at the time they have no grounds to enforce a remedy on you after the fact. Of course I can't be certain without seeing your lease, but usually that is the case.


Originally posted by project240
Anyways, I have already figured out it is going to be necessary to file with small claims court to settle this. I have a couple things I am unsure about though...

Call Service Alberta. They enforce the RTA. Usually just a call is enough to scare the landlord into returning your damage deposit.

Also, by law all landlords are required to put the damage deposit in an interest bearing trust account. Very few actually do. The interest is supposed to be paid out annually to the tenant.

They're looking at a ticket for witholding the damage deposit for more than 10 days ($250), a ticket for not putting the deposit in a trust account ($250), a ticket for not paying interest ($250), and a ticket for deducting money from the deposit without a proper inspection ($250).



Originally posted by project240
Secondly, can I now charge them in my claim for past repairs/yard maintenance I did while living at their house? I do still have receipts for a few things...

Not a chance. You could only do this if the landlord failed to perform the maintenance after ample notice, and a reasonable amount of time given the gravity of the maintenance required. And if that was the case, you should have billed the landlord at that time, not down the road after you have moved out.


Originally posted by project240
Has anybody dealt with a similar situation?

Everyone who rents deals with this at one point or another. Renting is a crap shoot, and buying my own place was the best thing I ever did for simple virtue of not having to answer to anyone else.

[Supa Dexta]

Don't get any elaborate schemes on the go.. Simply tell her you have a signed document on hand, and any further stalling on their part will result in a call from your lawyer.

[project240]

Well, after a few more emails back and forth here is her latest...

"Now I figured out the process. I will be sending you full deposit back with interest today, but I will be claiming damages/compensations through the court. "

Also, a text message from the husband (keep in mind he has never sent me a text before...) Word for word as I received it so excuse the fact it doesn't really make much sense....

"You have a piece of paper from XXXX (name of wife) regarding move out condition, I want to tell you 2 things. I did not sign that paper. The land titles have my name and XXXX name. At that time, XXXX mentioned it is subject to hidden damage cost. You added water filter, fire pit, frames (garage, basement) without our written permission, that is not accepted, so remove things out."

I installed a reverse osmosis system (at my time/cost), installed a firepit (again, my time/cost) and built a overhead storage in the garage. I didn't have written permission for anything, however, all of these were done within the first 6 months of us living there and the landlords knew about it and didn't have a problem. Plus, none of these take away any value and could easily be argued they add value...

I lol'd. I didn't even bother replying anymore at this point. Just going to wait to receive the DD, deposit it and then make a few more calls to Service Alberta and try to get them fined.

Is there really anything they can do after sending back my DD? I doubt it especially considering the note I have along with the fact a proper written inspection was never completed, but just trying to cover all bases....

[Sugarphreak]

...

[kvg]

save the emails, texts, and the signed note. threating legal action (I forget whats its called or why) but if they don't you can sue them. Send them a registered letter requesting the DD by agreed upon date as after that you will contact the CCRA, and may also file for reimbursement for repairs to the rental unit.:dunno:

[Rat Fink]

.

[Supa Dexta]

Yup simple, tell them you're awaiting the deposit back and will have your lawyer review the paper work they send should you have to prepare for court. Don't give them any more info then that, don't offer to remove anything..etc. Fuck greasy landlords.

[crazieness]

Just hold onto the signed inspection stating everything is a.o.k and wait for your DD. By law, your landlord has 30 days to return it to you and based on the signed document, it'll be returned in full. If the husband says he didn't sign the document, too bad for him. As long as his wife is also documented as the landlord or an acting agent of the owner you are fine. Even if she isn't and you can show she's been acting as an agent of the landlord you should be ok.

If they don't return the DD in full, you can sue, but really, it may not be worth the time and effort. If they do return the DD in full, you're good to go. Even if they sue you, you have a signed inspection notice noting NO damage or acceptable damage based on general wear and tear. I don't see you getting your money back for your upgrades as you did put them in on your own goodwill.

The only time I could see a landlord suing after a clean inspection has been signed off and being successful is the tenant was growing something funky that they wouldn't have been able to identify during the normal inspection, which even at that point, they'd have to prove it was you and not a previous tenant.

[spikerS]

Originally posted by crazieness
By law, your landlord has 30 days to return it to you

actually, according to the RTA in Alberta, a landlord has 10 business days to return your damage deposit, with any intrest, and that is 10 CALENDAR days, not business.

[max_boost]

Your old landlord should be grateful that they had you as a tenant for 2.5 years. Sounds like you took care of the place as if it was your own and followed everything properly.

I really don't know why they (landlord) are being such dicks about things now. Money is fucking evil. Makes people become two face so fast and in this case for no apparent reason really. :nut: :dunno:

[freshprince1]

Originally posted by spikers


actually, according to the RTA in Alberta, a landlord has 10 business days to return your damage deposit, with any intrest, and that is 10 CALENDAR days, not business.

:nut: Typo perhaps? so is it business or calendar days?

[spikerS]

yeah, it was a typo, they have 10 Calendar days to return a damage deposit, not business days.

[broken_legs]

Originally posted by autosm
Make sure to phone CCRA to ensure they are claiming the rental income from you. Tell them you moved out because she insisted you pay them cash.

This.

[Muji]

Shitty when bad things happen to good people, you look after a place like it is your own for years and when the process is over you are left with a really bad experience. Reminds me of the time I rented a place in Calgary, the owner was a big real estate lawyer, all nice and happy until a pipe burst in the building (nothing to do with me) and the lawyer got all lawyerly. Karma bites hard and for certain people in the legal profession the bite will be in the left ball followed by the right ball. All said though, I would hire him in a second, assholes this useful are hard to come by.

Hope it all works out for you, keep the thread updated on the end result.

[rinny]

Agreed with max_boost. I recently moved out of a house after a year and a half. Before we left we cleaned that place as best as possible including the carpets, behind the stove etc. Next renters in apparently said the house was dirty.

One man's clean is anothers dirty I guess. Our landlord wasn't bothered by it.