When do you plan to retire?

[Manhattan]

At what age do you guys plan on retirement if at all. There's a lot of factors to consider but these were the major ones.

- annual income
- income savings %
- how well you investments turn out
- lifestyle you want to have in retirement
- where u want to retire
- years of retirement

I'm not a big believer in pensions seeing how many people have been screwed over in the last few years in the recession and have to keep on working past retirement. How's everyone planning?

[barmanjay]

Originally posted by Manhattan
At what age do you guys plan on retirement

Never

I'll die if I don't work. I'm a work-a-holic and need work to keep my mind and body alive.

[CapnCrunch]

Originally posted by barmanjay


Never



+1. I'd get way too bored. People like to envision retirement as endless travelling all around the world without a care.

I've seen enough people retire to realize that its a couple trips a year, with the in between time filled with sitting around on your ass, watching price is right until you get so bored that you go back to work.

[ercchry]

once i pay off a primary residents and rental property in calgary i will probably start to think about retirement...

sell house, buy something in a sleepy mountain town near a ski hill and lake for 1/3 of the price... throw the rest in investments.. get another rental property... snowboard and wakeboard my life away with some motor sports mixed in there... im sure i can fill my time pretty easily without a job i do because i need the money

hopefully i will achieve this in the next 10 years :bigpimp:

[Cos]

I plan to semi-retire. I will own a business or be a consultant where I can work or be in contact with my industry when I feel like it.

[ercchry]

yeah i guess semi-retire is a better way to put it... its not like in my 30s i am going to sell off everything and move to a trailer park and watch the price is right everyday... i am reserving that till i am at least 60 :rofl:

[mac_82]

...

[Pollywog]

Thanks to Amway I'll have a Porsche in my garage next week, and own an island next month for retirement.

[89coupe]

The better question is, how much do you think you will need dollar wise when you retire in order to sustain your lifestyle?

I think people are delusional if they think a couple million in the bank will be enough.

The fiance and I figured that we would need roughly 10.5 million come retirement in order to maintain a comfortable lifestyle.

[ercchry]

Originally posted by 89coupe
The better question is, how much do you think you will need dollar wise when you retire in order to sustain your lifestyle?

I think people are delusional if they think a couple million in the bank will be enough.

The fiance and I figured that we would need roughly 10.5 million come retirement in order to maintain a comfortable lifestyle.

really? even if you only had that 10.5mil in a high interest savings account you will still be getting over 200k a year return :nut:

[Cos]

Originally posted by 89coupe

The fiance and I figured that we would need roughly 10.5 million come retirement in order to maintain a comfortable lifestyle.

You need 420,000 a year (assuming no growth either)? That assumes you retire at 55 (early) and die at 80 (quite old)

You wont have your house paid off by then? What the hell are you going to spend 10k a month on when you are 75?

[Alterac]

If i won 2million, i could live off the interest comfortably.
($2,000,000 @ 3% (approx return on invests) = 60k/year)

Although, I would never stop working. I would say having 4mil in investments would be a good way to go.

[Alterac]

Originally posted by Cos

What the hell are you going to spend 10k a month on when you are 75?

Lunch?

[you&me]

Originally posted by Cos


You need 420,000 a year (assuming no growth either)? That assumes you retire at 55 (early) and die at 80 (quite old)

You wont have your house paid off by then? What the hell are you going to spend 10k a month on when you are 75?

$200 lunch + $300 dinner x 30 days/month = $15,000 a month.

Oh noes :D

[89coupe]

Do you guys not factor in inflation?

When I was 10 I could buy a 350ml can of pop for 25cents, how much is a can of pop now?

Gas?
Food?
Travel?
Entertainment?
Taxes?

[Alterac]

Well I plan to retire around 65 maybe.. then consult for many more years.

So lets assume at 65, you have 20 years left. you would need to factor in inflation from the time you STOP earning your money.

In 20 years inflation could be, 10-15%. (im just throwing numbers out, dont quote me).

10.5mil for 2 people is not a whack number.

My 4 mil number is for 1 person. (and i forgot about inflation)

[sputnik]

Originally posted by 89coupe
I think people are delusional if they think a couple million in the bank will be enough.


I would retire if I was debt free and had 2 million in the bank.

I see no issues maintaining my lifestyle if it was invested properly.

$2 million in a decent dividend fund would pay out about $10-15,000/month and you would still retain the invested principle.

If you can't live off that (and reinvest the excess before inflation kicks in) you have issues.

Some people feel that retirement means owning a couple vacation properties or constantly travelling to high dollar locations.

For me retirement means answering to no one other than myself and living life on my own terms. Personally I would rather live a more modest lifestyle than have to answer to a boss or a client another day.

[89coupe]

Originally posted by sputnik


I would retire if I was debt free and had 2 million in the bank.

I see no issues maintaining my lifestyle if it was invested properly.

$2 million in a decent dividend fund would pay out about $10-15,000/month and you would still retain the invested principle.

If you can't live off that (and reinvest the excess before inflation kicks in) you have issues.

Some people feel that retirement means owning a couple vacation properties or constantly travelling to high dollar locations.

For me retirement means answering to no one other than myself and living life on my own terms. Personally I would rather live a more modest lifestyle than have to answer to a boss or a client another day.

You are full of it.

Break it down for us, show us how you would live off $2million for the next 30 years.

[masoncgy]

Originally posted by barmanjay
Never

I'll die if I don't work. I'm a work-a-holic and need work to keep my mind and body alive.

That's exactly my position on the matter too... but I'll likely slow it down to part-time/casual in the later years.

I'm a lot like my Dad... we need to work to keep ourselves balanced... he's been eligible for full retirement with his huge pension for years and he's still going strong.

[InRich]

I'm already semi-retired at 30 years old :nut:

[Speed_69]

Originally posted by 89coupe


You are full of it.

Break it down for us, show us how you would live off $2million for the next 30 years.

How is that not possible?

If i invest the $2million and lets say I earn 4% interest annually, that's $80,000 each year. I would already have a paid off mortgage and I don't have an extravagant lifestyle. If I don't have any expenses other the regular house bills, how is that not enough?

[Sugarphreak]

...

[ercchry]

Originally posted by Sugarphreak

The thing that scares me the most is once you get well into your old age and less sharp or sick, people will constantly be trying to take advantage of you.

http://blog.nj.com/entertainment_impact_tv/2009/01/large_GranTorino.JPG


...problem solved

[89coupe]

Originally posted by Speed_69


How is that not possible?

If i invest the $2million and lets say I earn 4% interest annually, that's $80,000 each year. I would already have a paid off mortgage and I don't have an extravagant lifestyle. If I don't have any expenses other the regular house bills, how is that not enough?

Break it down, dollar for dollar. No mortgage, just day to day living expenses.

[sputnik]

Originally posted by 89coupe


You are full of it.

Break it down for us, show us how you would live off $2million for the next 30 years.

Take a fund like the Sceptre High Income Fund (http://www.theglobeandmail.com/globe-investor/funds-and-etfs/funds/summary/?id=55061) and invest your $2 million there.

The fund pays out a dividend of $0.0691 per unit per month.

Assuming a $14 unit price you are looking at a 6% annual yield. With a $2 million investment you would be earning about $120,000/year and still retain the units of the mutual fund should you need to liquidate them. Buying into this fund a couple of years ago would have given you a $10 unit price and your income would be even higher.

Now as for a lifestyle.

$120,000 is pretty sweet considering you are only paying dividend tax and be mortgage free. If you can't live off of $10,000/month then yes, you would need much more.

For me I could probably live (assuming no mortgage) quite comfortably on $80,000/year. That would leave me the remaining $40,000 to invest elsewhere (or even in more units of the income fund).

As inflation moves (at 1-2%/year) I would need to increase my income accordingly. However even at a rate of 2% (which is average) I probably wouldn't be needing to start liquidating capital investments for at least 30 years to cover my living expenses.

However as I get older I actually think my costs would drop. I would no longer have to support kids, I would possibly be living in a smaller place, and I would be driving less. I would also be collecting CPP/OAS (if they are still around) which at current rates is about $1000/month.

Sure $10.5 million is nice. However it is WAY overkill if you have it properly invested and don't need $200 lunches and $2000 watches.

[sputnik]

Here is my spreadsheet.

Do the math yourself if you want.

Here is the graph showing a $2 million dollar start at the age of 30, a 5.5% growth rate (which should be easy to attain) and a 2% inflation rate.

The income starts at $80,000/year at the age of 30 and goes for 55 years until 85.

http://img4.imageshack.us/img4/388/graphgp.png

Here is a table showing the inflation adjusted yearly income until 75... but you get the picture.

http://img715.imageshack.us/img715/9039/tablev.png

**** EDIT: Please note that my spreadsheet doesn't even account for any dividend yields that I mentioned above. It would be a straight investment earning 5.5% and zero dividend income.

[sputnik]

For those curious as to what a starting point of $10.5 million would look like.

If you wanted a similar graph (where your money trickles down as you approach 85 years old) you would have to start day one with an income of $425,000.

Anything lower than $400,000/year (even inflation adjusted) and you would have more money the day you died compared to day 1.

I guess now we all know that 89coupe is either bad at math, or has a pretty ballin lifestyle to maintain.

[ercchry]

Originally posted by sputnik

I guess now we all know that 89coupe is either bad at math, or has a pretty ballin lifestyle to maintain.

i came to this conclusion when he first posted... no number crunching even needed :rofl:

[Alterac]

Originally posted by sputnik
For those curious as to what a starting point of $10.5 million would look like.

If you wanted a similar graph (where your money trickles down as you approach 85 years old) you would have to start day one with an income of $425,000.

Anything lower than $400,000/year (even inflation adjusted) and you would have more money the day you died compared to day 1.

I guess now we all know that 89coupe is either bad at math, or has a pretty ballin lifestyle to maintain.

Can you send me that spreadsheet? Looks like you have some time free at work. haha.

[sputnik]

For those interested in the spreadsheet.

Here it is.

http://rapidshare.com/files/419661861/RetirementCalculator.xls

[89coupe]

Originally posted by sputnik
Here is my spreadsheet.

Do the math yourself if you want.

Here is the graph showing a $2 million dollar start at the age of 30, a 5.5% growth rate (which should be easy to attain) and a 2% inflation rate.

The income starts at $80,000/year at the age of 30 and goes for 55 years until 85.

http://img4.imageshack.us/img4/388/graphgp.png

Here is a table showing the inflation adjusted yearly income until 75... but you get the picture.

http://img715.imageshack.us/img715/9039/tablev.png

**** EDIT: Please note that my spreadsheet doesn't even account for any dividend yields that I mentioned above. It would be a straight investment earning 5.5% and zero dividend income.

There are no investment havens in Canada that offer 5.5% yield per year with no risk. So you can't provide me a graph based on "guestimates". We have all seen what happens to the market during volitile times. You could lose everything in a blink of an eye.

Canada Bonds are probably the lowest risk investment and long term yields are 3.5 percent. But even then, they don't pay out monthly.

http://www.bankofcanada.ca/en/rates/bonds.html

What happens if you run into a situation that requires you to spend your monthly allowance up front, say an accident, a family emergency or a repair. Then what? Do you borrow? Do you pay a penalty and pull out of your initial investment?

Do you guys factor any of this in? Or do you just assume your life will live out perfectly?

I still haven't seen day to day costs factored in?

[KappaSigma]

Originally posted by 89coupe


You are full of it.

Break it down for us, show us how you would live off $2million for the next 30 years.

If you have no debt than its quite easy to live off the interest. Its $5K before taxes, but if you had it split with a spouse than its almost all tax free due to personal expemptions.

Without a mortgage payments, if you cant live off say $3,000 per month with only having to pay things like utlities, food, etc than you do have issues. Plus, if your smart you will start collecting old age and CPP later in life and depending on the age that you take it it could be up to another $1,500 per spouse, so another $3K.

[sputnik]

Originally posted by 89coupe


There are no investment havens in Canada that offer 5.5% yield per year with no risk. So you can't provide me a graph based on "guestimates". We have all seen what happens to the market during volitile times. You could lose everything in a blink of an eye.

Canada Bonds are probably the lowest risk investment and long term yields are 3.5 percent. But even then, they don't pay out monthly.

http://www.bankofcanada.ca/en/rates/bonds.html

What happens if you run into a situation that requires you to spend your monthly allowance up front, say an accident, a family emergency or a repair. Then what? Do you borrow? Do you pay a penalty and pull out of your initial investment?

Do you guys factor any of this in? Or do you just assume your life will live out perfectly?

I still haven't seen day to day costs factored in?

Who said anything about requiring any guaranteed returns? I am more than okay with a 5.5% average return.

A 5.5% expectation is a VERY modest one for someone looking at having a long term investment. Sure you might have to weather some questionable economic times, but that would be a great time to lower your standard of living slightly and let things recover on their own. Who knows, you might have had some good years prior that built up enough reserves to get through.

However if you are still stuck on bonds. I would suggest looking at the Philips Hager and North Bond-D fund.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/globe-investor/funds-and-etfs/funds/summary/?id=18150

It has been around since 1970 and has returned over 9% since then without any major drops along the way.

PH&N is probably one of the best fund companies in Canada, they have LOW MERs and require a minimum of $25,000 investment.

[Awd-Tsi]

I plan to retire by the time I'm 30

[Euro838]

Originally posted by 89coupe
The better question is, how much do you think you will need dollar wise when you retire in order to sustain your lifestyle?

I think people are delusional if they think a couple million in the bank will be enough.

The fiance and I figured that we would need roughly 10.5 million come retirement in order to maintain a comfortable lifestyle.

How did you figure 10.5 million? Are you talking about cash in the bank with zero liabilities, house with no mortgage, new vehicle without loans, kids all self sustainable, no major health issues, life insurance policy self sustaining?

Obviously retirement means different things for different people, for some people it means not having to work to provide the necessities i.e. house, food, clothing, economic transportation, no desire to travel or eat out, entertainment = TV/Internet, etc.

This could be extremely boring which is why we see some comments regarding people would continue to work.

For people who want to live life to the fullest i.e. 89coupe, you will need a more progressive estimate that ensures your retirement portfolio can sustain this lifestyle your foresee at retirement. Activities in this spectrum would be maintaining a golf club membership, snow birding, etc. $2 million would probably not sustain this lifestyle for 30 years.

[Cos]

Originally posted by Euro838

For people who want to live life to the fullest i.e. 89coupe, you will need a more progressive estimate that ensures your retirement portfolio can sustain this lifestyle your foresee at retirement. Activities in this spectrum would be maintaining a golf club membership, snow birding, etc. $2 million would probably not sustain this lifestyle for 30 years.

Just a counter point, if you are skiing at 85 I will be surprised (not saying it doesnt happen).

[sputnik]

Originally posted by Euro838
For people who want to live life to the fullest i.e. 89coupe, you will need a more progressive estimate that ensures your retirement portfolio can sustain this lifestyle your foresee at retirement. Activities in this spectrum would be maintaining a golf club membership, snow birding, etc. $2 million would probably not sustain this lifestyle for 30 years.

So you need $35,000/month to "live life to the fullest"?

Also, how long does one plan on working to attain that much wealth?

[ercchry]

Originally posted by Cos


Just a counter point, if you are skiing at 85 I will be surprised (not saying it doesnt happen).

snow birding =/ snowboard/skiing

snow birding would be wintering in a warm climate ie. Florida

[Euro838]

Originally posted by sputnik


So you need $35,000/month to "live life to the fullest"?

You'd be surprised the amount of expenses you have for retirement activities i.e. annual golf membership, vacation property (fixed expenses, travel to/from, etc), healthcare expenses, etc.

Like I said, people have different definitions of what retirement constitutes. Some of it may be viewed as excessive but others a rewarding necessity.



Originally posted by sputnik

Also, how long does one plan on working to attain that much wealth?

LOL! For some longer than others!

[G]

$3000 a month is not living it's surviving....yeah 10.5 million wtf 89Coupe your epenis is huge.



Originally posted by KappaSigma


If you have no debt than its quite easy to live off the interest. Its $5K before taxes, but if you had it split with a spouse than its almost all tax free due to personal expemptions.

Without a mortgage payments, if you cant live off say $3,000 per month with only having to pay things like utlities, food, etc than you do have issues. Plus, if your smart you will start collecting old age and CPP later in life and depending on the age that you take it it could be up to another $1,500 per spouse, so another $3K.

[Sugarphreak]

...

[kaput]

.

[max_boost]

Originally posted by G
$3000 a month is not living it's surviving....yeah 10.5 million wtf 89Coupe your epenis is huge.




LOL :werd:

[max_boost]

I think by the time I retire I will no longer give a shit about living in a big house, dressing to impress, eating fancy meals or driving nice cars.


:dunno:

[Tik-Tok]

Originally posted by G
$3000 a month is not living it's surviving....


$3000/month WITHOUT mortgage/rent is more than just surviving.

At current consumer index, with a paid off house, we would be "surviving" at $1500. That's property tax, house bills, car gas, insurance, and groceries. Even less than that really, if we cut our food bill down to just the necessities.

[bourge73]

your crazy if you dont think $3,000 per person a month is enough to more than survive? :nut: come on by the time your that age you'll need a 26 of Whisky, some depends and the same blue pants you've been wearing for the past 20 years....daily

[Twin_Cam_Turbo]

I would like to retire in about 45 years.

[89coupe]

Wow, such boring retirement plans you guys have.

I want to travel at least twice a year for at least 3 weeks at a time. I want to have a golf membership. I want to eat out at least once a week. See a movie at least once a week. Play poker at least once a week. I want to buy my grand children gifts every year for Christmas and Bdays. Enjoy a nice bottle of wine once a week. Drive a nice car.

x2 and these things add up.

You guys gonna be bachelors for the rest of your life? No kids? No grandchildren?

[G]

Originally posted by Tik-Tok

Even less than that really, if we cut our food bill down to just the necessities.

So cutting down to only necessities isn't surviving?

Don't know about you but I don't have a mortgage and my monthly fixed costs are

Property Tax = $270
Groceries for family of 4 = ~$400
Utilities/Cable/Gas/Phone/Cell/Internet = ~$600
Home/Auto Insurance = $250
Gas for Cars = ~$400 this is a modest estimate C63 is about $50 every 5 days.

so before we even go for a night out or buy any clothes/gifts for ourselves or family it is already $1920.

Not saying I need 10.5 million but $4000 is comfortable and $5000 would be very comfortable but $3000 is just surviving.

[bourge73]

^^ maybe but we are assuming you have a wife/GF with the same $3000 per month hence the $6000 per month ya?

[G]

Typically when married I speak as a unit.


Originally posted by bourge73
^^ maybe but we are assuming you have a wife/GF with the same $3000 per month hence the $6000 per month ya?

[89coupe]

Originally posted by G


So cutting down to only necessities isn't surviving?

Don't know about you but I don't have a mortgage and my monthly fixed costs are

Property Tax = $270
Groceries for family of 4 = ~$400
Utilities/Cable/Gas/Phone/Cell/Internet = ~$600
Home/Auto Insurance = $250
Gas for Cars = ~$400 this is a modest estimate C63 is about $50 every 5 days.

so before we even go for a night out or buy any clothes/gifts for ourselves or family it is already $1920.

Not saying I need 10.5 million but $4000 is comfortable and $5000 would be very comfortable but $3000 is just surviving.

How the heck do you live on $400/mth in groceries for a family of 4??? Thats some good budgeting. We are double that with a family of 3...LOL.

Of course we like to eat a lot of fresh produce, meats, fish, veg, & fruit. We try to cook fresh healthy meals every night.

[Zewind]

Retiring?

I dont know what I would do with all that extra few time. No really plans yet. But I am butting money away for it

[G]

Sorry only 3 as of now. Looking to acquire the forth sometime after her MBA.

Yeah $400 and we cook 5 nights a week fresh produce and meat. No can or precooked stuff. Maybe Chinese food is cheaper?


Originally posted by 89coupe


How the heck do you live on $400/mth in groceries for a family of 4??? Thats some good budgeting. We are double that with a family of 3...LOL.

Of course we like to eat a lot of fresh produce, meats, fish, veg, & fruit. We try to cook fresh healthy meals every night.

[89coupe]

Originally posted by G
Sorry only 3 as of now. Looking to acquire the forth sometime after her MBA.

Yeah $400 and we cook 5 nights a week fresh produce and meat. No can or precooked stuff. Maybe Chinese food is cheaper?



We will be 4 in about 2 months...lol.

[Ekliptix]

No clue about retirement, but having my mortgage paid by 40 is a goal I think I can hit (10 years away).

[max_boost]

Originally posted by Ekliptix
No clue about retirement, but having my mortgage paid by 40 is a goal I think I can hit (10 years away).

Once the mortgage is out of the way, it's just smooth road ahead :D

[Cos]

Originally posted by ercchry


snow birding =/ snowboard/skiing

snow birding would be wintering in a warm climate ie. Florida

Reading > me.


I think I'm burnt out today

[Ekliptix]

Originally posted by max_boost


Once the mortgage is out of the way, it's just smooth road ahead :D
Is this from personal experience? I plan to do property rentals after finishing my mortgage.

[Beerking]

Honestly, what does it matter? Sure, you can say I'll 'retire or semi retire" by 55 with $8mill, but will you be alive by then? Will you have encountered certain disasters, metldowns etc.

I save fixed amounts of cash monthly to contribute to my RRSP, while investing outside of it as well for extra income. I live within my means yet still try to travel and enjoy life while I can ( I chose to buy a house and drive a shitty car, not have both and over extend myself). If i don't make the money I 'expect' to for my 'retirement' savings, then that will be a huge let down. So, just be smart and ready for whatever comes your way.