US to issue tax refunds in debit cards.

[ZenOps]

http://money.cnn.com/2011/01/13/pf/taxes/tax_refund_prepaid_card/index.htm

"The Treasury Department launched the pilot program Thursday, saying it will mail letters next week to 600,000 taxpayers with annual income under $35,000.

The letters will give taxpayers the option of activating a MyAccountCard Visa Prepaid Debit Card."

Bahaha! The end is nigh!

Metal money, bah. Paper money, bah. Cheques, bah. Lets send it out in electronic money, we don't even have to print it anymore!

It will save the US $40 million a year! Next year - Imaginary dollars!

Just type in a number in a computer ala Quantitative easing III every year like this and blamo, instant free electronic money!

I think the US govt has finally given up.

[Jeremiah]

God you're fucking cynical

[ZenOps]

Yes of course I am. Kids have no idea how they are being swindled nowadays.

Along with the debit of course, comes withdrawl fees, inactivity fees, and the idea that you are no longer in control of your money.

If you thought a gift card was a scam before when retailers had their hands on it, the government itself is doing it now.

I can understand the dangers of letting people own guns, but pretty soon - its going to be impossible to own copper coins (heaven knows, that this generation does not know what a real nickel looks like)

Too much faith must be placed in an electronic dollar for it to work, faith that is not deserved in *any* economic model. There must always be something physically holding currencies to acceptable values.

I figure Nickel might hit $80/pound before the next decade at this rate.

PS: Can I donate all my money to Wikileaks with my tax return? Nope, because Visa does not take payment for Assange because he is unsavoury and a weird looking Austrailian guy. Can I buy a barrel of oil from Saudi Arabia with a Visa gift card? Nope. Can I buy a Canadian barrel of oil with a US dollar Visa gift card? Probably not for much longer.

I barely accept US paper dollars, I am unwilling to accept US electronic dollars. And no Canadian steel toonies either.

[codetrap]

Originally posted by ZenOps
Yes of course I am. Kids have no idea how they are being swindled nowadays.

Along with the debit of course, comes withdrawl fees, inactivity fees, and the idea that you are no longer in control of your money.

If you thought a gift card was a scam before when retailers had their hands on it, the government itself is doing it now.

I can understand the dangers of letting people own guns, but pretty soon - its going to be impossible to own copper coins (heaven knows, that this generation does not know what a real nickel looks like)

Too much faith must be placed in an electronic dollar for it to work, faith that is not deserved in *any* economic model. There must always be something physically holding currencies to acceptable values.

I figure Nickel might hit $80/pound before the next decade at this rate.

PS: Can I donate all my money to Wikileaks with my tax return? Nope, because Visa does not take payment for Assange because he is unsavoury and a weird looking Austrailian guy. Can I buy a barrel of oil from Saudi Arabia with a Visa gift card? Nope. Can I buy a Canadian barrel of oil with a US dollar Visa gift card? Probably not for much longer.

I barely accept US paper dollars, I am unwilling to accept US electronic dollars. And no Canadian steel toonies either.

Really? You can donate to wikileaks via email transfer still. Also I haven't paid any bank fees in quite some time, so I don't know what you're talking about. You're still able to own copper. You can go and buy as much of it as you want.

You're still batshit crazy btw. Doubtful that nickel will go that high.

[Xtrema]

http://ant.sillydog.org/blog/pic/monopoly_visa_money.jpg

[Tik-Tok]

Hey ZenOps... you do realize that the government never sent actual cash, and that the the debit cards are part of the exact same system as the cheques they've been issuing for decades, right?

Debit Card = Cheque = Paper money = whatever value the system gives it.

You want us all to go back a few centuries and trade hacksilver?

[BigMass]

Originally posted by Tik-Tok
Hey ZenOps... you do realize that the government never sent actual cash, and that the the debit cards are part of the exact same system as the cheques they've been issuing for decades, right?

Debit Card = Cheque = Paper money = whatever value the system gives it.

You want us all to go back a few centuries and trade hacksilver?

I think what zenops might be getting at is that this might be the start towards a cashless society which in turn would destroy any semblance of privacy and control over your own life. A system in which the government can monitor and control your ever action and can basically “turn you off” and remove you from society if you ever become an outlaw to the system. So it really has nothing to do with “value” but on the other hand it’s not really about privacy either because it’s just the government giving back money you gave them in the first place. So what is this about? No clue sorry.

[HiTempguy1]

Originally posted by BigMass


I think what zenops might be getting at is that this might be the start towards a cashless society which in turn would destroy any semblance of privacy and control over your own life.

Guberment says "Wikileaks, we don't like you. Paypal, Visa, Mastercard, please freeze all transactions with them and we'll freeze their accounts"

Cash rules, I just wish I had some :(

[ZenOps]

Its another level of loss of control.

Heres another one: Can I pay my electricity, water, sewer, and natural gas bill with a Visa, Mastercard or Amex?

In Calgary, No. Because Enmax does not accept ANY of those as acceptable payment. Enmax is the smartest company ever for not accepting credit which is based on a US system of throwing money into their money pit.

I don't even think you can pay with US dollars in person at a teller (3rd floor city hall), they will direct you to the nearest exchange dealer and tell you to come back.

BTW: US Forbes magazine labelled the CEO of Enmax as the worst 5 (right up there with the BP CEO for the oilrig disaster) That right there tells me the US is at economic war with Canada.

In mexico, they bow down to the US dollar bill, here I might consider using it to blow my nose :rofl:

[Darell_n]

Nice, so now Visa gets a 2% cut of poor people's tax returns when they spend it? I'm sure these people will get all kinds of special 'deals' from Visa shortly after.

[codetrap]

Originally posted by ZenOps
Its another level of loss of control.

Heres another one: Can I pay my electricity, water, sewer, and natural gas bill with a Visa, Mastercard or Amex?

In Calgary, No. Because Enmax does not accept ANY of those as acceptable payment. Enmax is the smartest company ever for not accepting credit which is based on a US system of throwing money into their money pit.


No, it's because they don't want to pay the 3% transaction fees to the CC companies. I personally would LOVE to pay my regular utilities/mortgage payments on my Mastercard. Every dealership I go and test drive a car at, I ask them if I can pay for the whole vehicle on my Mastercard. I do ALL my transactions through it, and avoid using debit whenever I can. Why? Because I reward points for money that I'm already spending. Those reward points translate directly into groceries. Based on our experience, we seem to average about $80/month off at the till which is nice. I have to spend the money anyways, so why not get everything I can for it.

[ZenOps]

Visa doesn't deserve my fiscal fealty anymore than a US dollar.

Imagine if the US charged 3% on everything to use their paper dollar (which they kind of do, but thats a different discussion)

I say we as Canadians should charge 3% to start, on all tangible exports (oil) just because the US is electronically watering down its dollar. I will pay proper amounts for watered down lemonade too.

Seriously, if QEIII hits... I'm not selling any more oil to the US in US dollars (electronic or paper) Gold and Silver US dollars are still ok.

[911fever]

zenops, please go away. enough with the nonsense, seriously

[rage2]

Selective reading, selective quoting. Doesn't even read his own quotes.


Originally posted by ZenOps
The letters will give taxpayers the option of activating a MyAccountCard Visa Prepaid Debit Card.
It's an option, but he thinks everyone's forced to use these debit cards.

The advantage, and why some people will take it, and Zenops neglected to quote:


This pilot program will provide low- and moderate-income Americans with a low-cost option for faster delivery of their federal tax refund
Pretty much no fees if you use the in network ATM's, and a hell of a lot cheaper for these ppl than going to their neighborhood MoneyMart that's going to take 30%.

[ZenOps]

Originally posted by rage2
Selective reading, selective quoting. Doesn't even read his own quotes.


It's an option, but he thinks everyone's forced to use these debit cards.

The advantage, and why some people will take it, and Zenops neglected to quote:


Pretty much no fees if you use the in network ATM's, and a hell of a lot cheaper for these ppl than going to their neighborhood MoneyMart that's going to take 30%.

Sure its optional, either that or a cheque, which is slightly less useful than a paper US dollar. If you are at the level that a paper dollar is still worth something... Fine, it is a matter of opinion.

If we had a competent government, we'd be charging a 3% hike in tangible goods export for every QE the US has had, so 6% now, and 9% if they do it again this year.

Visa should be PAYING merchants to take on the debt risk that many credit card holders have by using electronic money (and defaulting, and never paying back)

http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20101223100738AAdQbiC

Meredeth Whitney is predicting that there may be up to 16 cities in the US declaring bankruptcy this year. Now, as a merchant are you sure you read your credit card contract properly? If an individual or a city owes money to you and they declare bankruptcy, will you even get 3 cents on the dollar owed? Probably not.

Credit is worse than love, in that it not only blinds, it maims.

[FraserB]

Zenops, just for personal curiosity how old are you? And yes, it does matter since I am stuck deciding if you are either a teenager with selective quoting skills or some old fruitcake that gets pissed at everything and sees conspiracy if the newspaper is delivered 5 minutes late.

[BigMass]

Originally posted by FraserB
Zenops, just for personal curiosity how old are you? And yes, it does matter since I am stuck deciding if you are either a teenager with selective quoting skills or some old fruitcake that gets pissed at everything and sees conspiracy if the newspaper is delivered 5 minutes late.

He’s probably some guy that’s sick of yuppie morons gathered around the water cooler talking about the latest sitcom, sporting event or iphone app and occasional news as filtered to them by the mass marketed media through 30 second talking points. This forum section is definitely more interesting with zenops creating new threads to talk about whether you see them as BS or not.

[sputnik]

Originally posted by Tik-Tok
Hey ZenOps... you do realize that the government never sent actual cash, and that the the debit cards are part of the exact same system as the cheques they've been issuing for decades, right?

Debit Card = Cheque = Paper money = whatever value the system gives it.

You want us all to go back a few centuries and trade hacksilver?

:werd:

I want my tax refund paid out in bushels of cotton and iron ingots.

[kertejud2]

Originally posted by BigMass


He’s probably some guy that’s sick of yuppie morons gathered around the water cooler talking about the latest sitcom, sporting event or iphone app and occasional news as filtered to them by the mass marketed media through 30 second talking points. This forum section is definitely more interesting with zenops creating new threads to talk about whether you see them as BS or not.

He'd probably be far more entertaining if he transferred his ability to understand any of the things he's posting to that inane water-cooler talk:

"Did you see the game last night? Tom Brady hit a homerun and then scored a slam dunk before getting the checkered flag! The socio-economic studies into the footgame are interesting because of deregulating bank rates vis-a-vis the Queen owning all the land hergo the Patriots beat the Jets last night by 34 and three eights points (when you take into account soil temperature and pre-Industrial Revolution landfill techniques that presided on the East Coast). If athletes were smart they wouldn't accept US currency, but demand to be paid in zinc and potash because of the crumbling assimilation with the Yuan and Eastern European cabbage market due to the results of American Idol's shared promotion with Glee because as well all know the Golden Globes are a good predictor for Oscar season."

[Tik-Tok]

Originally posted by kertejud2


He'd probably be far more entertaining if he transferred his ability to understand any of the things he's posting to that inane water-cooler talk:

"Did you see the game last night? Tom Brady hit a homerun and then scored a slam dunk before getting the checkered flag! The socio-economic studies into the footgame are interesting because of deregulating bank rates vis-a-vis the Queen owning all the land hergo the Patriots beat the Jets last night by 34 and three eights points (when you take into account soil temperature and pre-Industrial Revolution landfill techniques that presided on the East Coast). If athletes were smart they wouldn't accept US currency, but demand to be paid in zinc and potash because of the crumbling assimilation with the Yuan and Eastern European cabbage market due to the results of American Idol's shared promotion with Glee because as well all know the Golden Globes are a good predictor for Oscar season."

:rofl: Too true (but you forgot to sneak a Rob Anders in there).

[captain134]

Originally posted by kertejud2


He'd probably be far more entertaining if he transferred his ability to understand any of the things he's posting to that inane water-cooler talk:

"Did you see the game last night? Tom Brady hit a homerun and then scored a slam dunk before getting the checkered flag! The socio-economic studies into the footgame are interesting because of deregulating bank rates vis-a-vis the Queen owning all the land hergo the Patriots beat the Jets last night by 34 and three eights points (when you take into account soil temperature and pre-Industrial Revolution landfill techniques that presided on the East Coast). If athletes were smart they wouldn't accept US currency, but demand to be paid in zinc and potash because of the crumbling assimilation with the Yuan and Eastern European cabbage market due to the results of American Idol's shared promotion with Glee because as well all know the Golden Globes are a good predictor for Oscar season."

:clap: :clap: :clap:

[BerserkerCatSplat]

I cannot read a ZenOps post without thinking of this:

http://wondermark.com/556/

[ZenOps]

Originally posted by sputnik


:werd:

I want my tax refund paid out in bushels of cotton and iron ingots.

I call BS on Iron. You want cotton, its so expensive that we will stop using to print money this year and go to cheap polymer plastic.

But you don't want Iron. The entire earth is just a gigantic molten iron ball. Sure Steel will probably be well over $1000 per ton this year, but that still only makes a Steel toonie have about 0.8 cents worth of metal in it.

If you wanted to make an armored vest out of steel pennies though - That I would understand.

http://community.discovery.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/9741919888/m/8731909119

Remember, steel pennies are the ones that are magnetic.

[Zephyr]

Originally posted by ZenOps

Rob Anders Rob Anders Rob Anders Rob Anders Rob Anders Rob Anders Rob Anders Rob Anders Rob Anders Rob Anders Rob Anders Rob Anders Rob Anders Rob Anders Rob Anders Rob Anders Rob Anders Rob Anders Rob Anders Rob Anders Rob Anders Rob Anders Rob Anders Rob Anders Rob Anders Rob Anders Rob Anders Rob Anders Rob Anders Rob Anders Rob Anders Rob Anders Rob Anders Rob Anders Rob Anders Rob Anders Rob Anders Rob Anders Rob Anders Rob Anders Rob Anders Rob Anders Rob Anders Rob Anders Rob Anders Rob Anders Rob Anders Rob Anders Rob Anders Rob Anders Rob Anders Rob Anders Rob Anders Rob Anders

Wat.