ZL1 Camaro

[calgary350z]

new GT500 competitor.....what do you think?

CTS-v engine and magnetic suspension with around 550 hp

[calgary350z]

a pic

[calgary350z]

why cant i attach a picture!!!

[Twin_Cam_Turbo]

I would still take the GT500/GT550.

[Idratherbsidewayz]

I dunno, looks pretty damn sick:

http://www.blogcdn.com/www.autoblog.com/media/2011/02/07-2012-chevrolet-camaro-zl1.jpg

http://www.blogcdn.com/www.autoblog.com/media/2011/02/02-2012-chevrolet-camaro-zl1-1297265362.jpg

http://www.blogcdn.com/www.autoblog.com/media/2011/02/13-2012-chevrolet-camaro-zl1-1297267589.jpg

Might be the first chev interior I find ok:

http://www.blogcdn.com/www.autoblog.com/media/2011/02/36-2012-chevrolet-camaro-zl1.jpg

[Twin_Cam_Turbo]

http://www.montrealgazette.com/4252604.bin

Some key specs:

6.2L V8 Estimated 550HP and 550TQ
Hypereutectic Pistons
Sixth-generation Eaton supercharger with four-lobe rotors
Piston Oil Squirters
Tremec TR-6060 six-speed manual (MG9 version)
RWD 6 speed manual with a dual disc clutch
Heavy Duty Driveline and LSD
Dual mode exhaust (loud valve type I assume)
Brembo 6 Piston 370MM Front 4 Piston 365MM Rear Discs
Front splitter and brake cooling air intakes
Aluminum Hood
20" wheels with Goodyear Supercar F2 Tires
Magnetic Ride Control

[heavyD]

Originally posted by Idratherbsidewayz

Might be the first chev interior I find ok:

http://www.blogcdn.com/www.autoblog.com/media/2011/02/36-2012-chevrolet-camaro-zl1.jpg

Looks cheap and dated IMO. You can see panel gaps around the instrument cluster and silver trim.:thumbsdow

[Idratherbsidewayz]

Originally posted by heavyD


Looks cheap and dated IMO. You can see panel gaps around the instrument cluster and silver trim.:thumbsdow

Oh yea, it still sucks some pretty hardcore balls. Look at the ebrake and plastic middle console piece.

But compared to this, it's a revelation:

http://paddocktalk.com/news/html/modules/ew_filemanager/07images/autos/gm/corvette/2008corvette-interior-hires.jpg

[Tik-Tok]

Originally posted by Idratherbsidewayz
I dunno, looks like sick


Corrected

The only redeeming feature of the Camaro is the drive trains, imo.

[treg50]

Originally posted by Twin_Cam_Turbo
I would still take the GT500/GT550.
+1 for the Ford Mustang GT500/GT550.

Go fuck yourself GM, I used to be a fan. Too bad you cut Pontiac :facepalm:,

http://blog.firebirdclub.net/wp-content/uploads/2007/06/new-trans-am1.jpg

Firebird Trams Am: Oh what could have been, :cry:.

[slinkie]

awaiting fd swap

[Anomaly]

Looks good, but too bad it's probably going to weigh as much as a CTS-V

Looking forward to the Z28 still, rumored to be more of a track focused car...lighter, better handling than the 2SS but with the same motor.

[calgary350z]

whats a gt550?

[Twin_Cam_Turbo]

Some people refer to the GT500 as the GT550 because it has 550HP.

[calgary350z]

Originally posted by Twin_Cam_Turbo
Some people refer to the GT500 as the GT550 because it has 550HP.

ah, thanks for clearing that up.

in that case i love my gt700

[Xtrema]

Originally posted by heavyD


Looks cheap and dated IMO. You can see panel gaps around the instrument cluster and silver trim.:thumbsdow

I'm ok with that Interior if this car sells for under $40k

[roll_over]

http://www.autoguide.com/gallery/d/107150-4/IMG_8772.JPG http://www.autoguide.com/gallery/gallery.php/d/107158-4/IMG_8773.JPG

this was at sema

[heavyD]

Originally posted by Xtrema


I'm ok with that Interior if this car sells for under $40k

It will be over $50k likely.

[Orbie]

2011 GT500 is pretty much 60K with taxes and no options in Canada. I would expect as a competitor this would be in that range. I wouldn't be surprised to see this thing greater than $60K or so MSRP.

[Cos]

:thumbsdow

[Twin_Cam_Turbo]

I predict 50-60% of a ZR1 for base price.

[TorqueDog]

Originally posted by heavyD
Looks cheap and dated IMO. You can see panel gaps around the instrument cluster and silver trim.:thumbsdow You're fucking hilarious. GM, of all companies, is releasing a car with a dashboard/interior draped in alcantara suede and all you can do is complain about is a panel gap on the instrument cluster. You've got to be kidding. I'll concede on cheap only because of that one glaring issue, but dated? Wat?

I will say, however, that the Mustang's interior with all the soft-touch materials is well ahead of it. Ford has immensely stepped up its game in all facets. Their interiors went from being atrocious to bettering the offerings of some of the high end manufacturers. Ever sat in a C300 sedan? You'd swear they melted down leftover Dodge Caliber interior pieces to build it.

[Graham_A_M]

HeavyD, of course you would say that right? Its GM so the interior HAS to be shit right?, of course. ;)

Originally posted by treg50

+1 for the Ford Mustang GT500/GT550.

Go fuck yourself GM, I used to be a fan. Too bad you cut Pontiac :facepalm:,

http://blog.firebirdclub.net/wp-content/uploads/2007/06/new-trans-am1.jpg

Firebird Trams Am: Oh what could have been, :cry:.
They cut pontiac, because when you have Bankruptcy court on your doorstep very drastic things needed to be done. In another light there was nothing Pontiac offered that wasn't offered in some other area of the company, within reason. It doesn't make much sense promoting two brands that offer the same product with only a few changes to merely justify it. So that was the most logical choice, but I agree, they should have put the brand on hiatus until they had the ability to make better decisions. I too *really* wanted that new Trans am. :(

one thing that really annoyed me was them deciding to cut Saturn. With the Astra, Aura & Sky they were making great headway, then they just cut it. I just bought an Aura XR as a new DD, and man I LOVE it. SUCH a nice car for what it cost new.

[heavyD]

Originally posted by TorqueDog
You're fucking hilarious. GM, of all companies, is releasing a car with a dashboard/interior draped in alcantara suede and all you can do is complain about is a panel gap on the instrument cluster. You've got to be kidding. I'll concede on cheap only because of that one glaring issue, but dated? Wat?

I will say, however, that the Mustang's interior with all the soft-touch materials is well ahead of it. Ford has immensely stepped up its game in all facets. Their interiors went from being atrocious to bettering the offerings of some of the high end manufacturers. Ever sat in a C300 sedan? You'd swear they melted down leftover Dodge Caliber interior pieces to build it.


Originally posted by Graham_A_M
HeavyD, of course you would say that right? Its GM so the interior HAS to be shit right?, of course. ;)


Relax guys. I'm a defender of domestics not a hater. I love cars not brands. I've never been a fan of the Camaro interior since I sat in one at the auto show simple as that. The tried too hard to make it look retro which doesn't work with all the hard plastics used on newer cars. Adding suede to a turd still makes it a turd IMO. I really like other GM interiors in Buicks and the Cruze just not the Camaro interior. The Ford Mustang interior is much better and IMO has better fit and finish than most Japanes non-luxury cars.

[95teetee]

Originally posted by calgary350z
new GT500 competitor... so they'll finally have one that's faster than the 5.0?
:rofl:

[jonnycat]

Originally posted by Graham_A_M
. In another light there was nothing Pontiac offered that wasn't offered in some other area of the company, within reason. It doesn't make much sense promoting two brands that offer the same product with only a few changes to merely justify it.


Don't forget about the G8. Other than Europe or Austrailia it wasn't offered in ay other package in North America. Now it will come back as an extended length Chevy cop car.

Killing Saturn also cost Pontiac, the Solstice. Pontiac's only other decent car.

[Gripenfelter]

http://www.camaroz28.com/2012_camaro_zl1.jpg

http://www.camaroz28.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=318&d=1297266524

http://www.camaroz28.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=319&d=1297266524

http://media.gm.com/content/media/us/en/news.detail.brand_gm.html/content/Pages/news/us/en/2011/Feb/11chicago/chevrolet/0208_zl1


LSA 6.2L supercharged engine will produce an estimated 550 horsepower (410 kW) and is matched with a six-speed manual transmission with a dual-disc clutch system
Packed with performance technologies, highlighted by Magnetic Ride Control, and advanced materials – including a vented carbon fiber hood insert. Extensive aerodynamic development designed for high-performance driving
Development ongoing, targeting launch at the beginning of 2012
CHICAGO – The 2012 Chevrolet Camaro ZL1 debuted today at the Chicago Auto Show. It is the highest-performing Camaro and the most technically advanced car ever developed in its class. The new ZL1 continues the momentum of Camaro, propelling it into an entirely new realm of leading-edge performance technology. It is planned to launch at the beginning of 2012.

Motivated by a supercharged V-8 engine producing an estimated 550 horsepower (410 kW), the Camaro ZL1 will be the fastest Camaro ever offered by Chevrolet. And more than just power, the ZL1 features technologically advanced and highly developed chassis and suspension systems that help it deliver balanced, track-ready handling and braking power to complement its high engine output. Rigorous development of the ZL1 is ongoing, and official estimates of the car’s capabilities will be released later in 2011, as testing nears completion.

“Camaro ZL1 is about high-tech performance and design, and is a type of car no one has ever brought to this segment previously,” said Rick Scheidt, vice president of Chevrolet marketing. “It’s the most technically advanced Camaro ever, so we’ve chosen a name from the most elite and exclusive Camaro in history.”

The ZL1 name is derived from the all-aluminum racing engine of the same name, which was developed in the late 1960s and installed into a handful of regular-production 1969 Camaros. Only 69 were built with the engine, but they’ve achieved mythical status among enthusiasts, as they represented the pinnacle in Camaro performance – until now. The 2012 ZL1 model is designed to be a major leap forward for the Camaro, bringing a new level of performance capability to the segment.

The central goal of the car’s development was creating something new – a Camaro intended to reach optimal lap times on top road-racing circuits and excellent driving dynamics on the street. To achieve that goal, engineers evolved many of the existing Camaro’s systems, as well as incorporated new technologies such as electric power steering and Magnetic Ride Control, the world’s fastest-reacting suspension system.

Camaro ZL1’s design communicates and supports its performance mission. Rather than using decorative elements, ZL1 is visually differentiated from other current Camaro models with elements vital to the car’s elevated capabilities.

“Everything about the ZL1’s design is directly related to its technology and serious performance, especially aerodynamics,” said Ed Welburn, vice president, Global Design. “Our designers’ goal was to execute that function-oriented design with beautifully sculpted forms, creating an imposing, powerful persona. Function becomes the aesthetic. The intent is a car that delivers on the attitude it projects.”

Major elements of the ZL1’s design are a new front fascia and hood with air extractors, designed in tandem to create aerodynamic downforce to aid handling. The car’s hood includes a signature center section constructed of carbon fiber and rendered in satin black finish. New rocker panels, wide tires, 20-inch wheels and exhaust tips portray the car’s handling and power.
The ZL1 badge appears on the grille, hood and the brake calipers, all key areas portraying the technology within.

Tech overview
Supporting the dynamic track and street performance of the ZL1 is the LSA 6.2L supercharged engine, which will produce an estimated 550 horsepower (410kW) and 550 lb.-ft. of torque (677 Nm), with specific features for the Camaro. Built on GM’s legendary all-aluminum, small-block V-8 architecture, the LSA features an intercooled supercharger system, premium heat-resistant aluminum-alloy cylinder heads and other details designed to ensure its exceptional performance is delivered with smoothness and refinement. Components and design elements that contribute to the LSA’s performance include:

Balanced, lightweight reciprocating assembly
High-strength hypereutectic pistons
Sixth-generation Eaton supercharger with four-lobe rotors
Piston oil squirters.
Because the Camaro ZL1 uses electric power steering, the engine does not incorporate a conventional hydraulic power steering pump on its accessory drive system. This enhances performance, because no engine power is used to turn a steering pump pulley.

Camaro ZL1 is a complete high-performance car, not just a Camaro with more power. Key technical highlights include:

Transmission – The high-performance Tremec TR-6060 six-speed manual is matched with the LSA engine. It is the “MG9” version of the transmission, with a higher torque capacity. It is used with a dual-mass flywheel and twin-disc clutch for easy operation and shift smoothness. A new, shorter-throw shifter actuates the gear changes.

Exhaust – ZL1 is equipped with a dual-mode exhaust system, which alters the sound level and character in response to engine rpm. First used on the legendary Corvette, and specifically tuned for Camaro ZL1, the dual-mode exhaust will give the car a signature sound.

Drivetrain – It is revised with a stronger driveshaft and rear axle system, featuring a larger and stronger cast iron differential housing, stronger axles and heavy-duty limited-slip differential. This patent-pending system is designed to ensure that ZL1’s tremendous power is delivered smoothly to the ground.

Suspension – The suspension features completely revised tuning and the inclusion of segment-exclusive Magnetic Ride Control. ZL1’s Magnetic Ride system will include driver selectable modes (Tour and Sport) tailored for the preferred style of driving. It uses advanced magneto-rheological science to produce shock damping with the highest level of precision, enabling body control optimized for excellent performance in everyday driving as well as track situations. This technology appears on only a small roster of some of the world’s finest performance cars. Other chassis elements are redesigned to support the car’s high-performance limits. Rear stabilizer bars have drop links repositioned outboard of the control arms. This makes the bars more effective in controlling body roll in turns, with crisp response to driver commands.

Brakes and Steering – Camaro ZL1 features an advanced track-capable braking system, developed in conjunction with experts from Brembo. The large 14.6-inch (370 mm) two-piece front rotors have six-piston calipers; the 14.4-inch (365 mm) rear rotors have four-piston calipers. ZL1 marks the entry of a new electric power steering system to Camaro. It is being developed to ensure precise control and feedback to the driver, with greater variability of effort for high-performance driving.

Exterior – ZL1’s signature from the front is the redesigned fascia and aluminum hood with a raised, carbon fiber insert. The fascia includes a front splitter and new vertical fog lamps. The fog lamp area includes air intakes designed for brake cooling. The hood features front-mounted air extractors that direct air precisely over the car. Visually, this center section, in satin black carbon fiber, communicates the car’s high-performance intent as a visual contrast to the car’s exterior color. Functionally, the air extractor is a key in connecting airflow closely to the bodywork, creating aerodynamic downforce. The carbon fiber center section reduces the mass of the hood. High-intensity discharge (HID) headlamps and fog lamps are standard. The rear of the car includes a diffuser and spoiler, also functional elements that enhance the car’s aerodynamics.

Wheels and Tires – New-design, 20-inch forged aluminum wheels, which are lighter than the 20-inch wheels used on the Camaro SS, are used with new Goodyear Supercar F2 ties developed specifically for the ZL1.

Interior – ZL1 is tailored for high-performance driving. The front seats feature microfiber suede inserts. Other enhancements include a redesigned steering wheel, alloy pedals, Head-Up Display with unique performance readouts and the “four-pack” auxiliary gauge system featuring a boost readout.

Production details
All of the Camaro exterior colors will be offered with the ZL1, but black is the only interior color. The unique exterior features are complemented with a black center section on the hood. Inside, the Camaro ZL1 has heated leather seats with microfiber inserts and ZL1 logos embroidered on the front headrests. Microfiber suede is repeated as an accent on the instrument panel, adding a richer look to the interior. The ZL1 will include the same content as the current 2SS package and include the following new or unique features:

Six-way power driver and passenger seats
Unique instrument panel and door panel inserts; and ZL1-logo sill plates
Steering wheel audio controls with Bluetooth capability
Wireless PDIM and USB-port
Boston Acoustics premium audio system
Rear parking assist
Rear camera system (displayed in the inside rearview mirror).
Engineers have already driven Camaro ZL1 prototypes extensively at demanding road courses in the U.S. and Germany, with final testing being completed through the balance of 2011.

About Chevrolet
Founded in Detroit in 1911, Chevrolet celebrates its centennial as a global automotive brand with annual sales of about 4.25 million vehicles in more than 140 countries. Chevrolet provides consumers with fuel-efficient, safe and reliable vehicles that deliver high quality, expressive design, spirited performance and value. The Chevrolet portfolio includes iconic performance cars such as Corvette and Camaro; dependable, long-lasting pickups and SUVs such as Silverado and Suburban; and award-winning passenger cars and crossovers such as Spark, Cruze, Malibu, Equinox and Traverse. Chevrolet also offers “gas-friendly to gas-free" solutions including Cruze Eco and Volt. Cruze Eco offers 42 mpg highway while Volt offers 35 miles of electric, gasoline-free driving and an additional 344 miles of extended range. Most new Chevrolet models offer OnStar safety, security and convenience technologies including OnStar Hands-Free Calling, Automatic Crash Response and Stolen Vehicle Slowdown. More information regarding Chevrolet models can be found at www.chevrolet.com

# # #

PRELIMINARY SPECIFICATIONS

Overview

Model: Chevrolet Camaro ZL1

Body style / driveline:
four-passenger, front-engine, rear-drive coupe

Construction:
unitized body frame, one- and two-sided galvanized steel

EPA vehicle class:
coupe

Manufacturing location:
Oshawa, Ontario, Canada

Key competitors:
Ford Mustang Shelby GT500


Engines


LSA 6.2L Supercharged V-8

Displacement (cu in / cc):
376 / 6162

Bore & stroke (in / mm):
4.06 / 103.25 x 3.62 / 92 mm

Block material:
cast aluminum

Cylinder head material:
cast aluminum

Valvetrain:
overhead valve, two valves per cylinder

Fuel delivery:
1.9L supercharger with intercooler; sequential fuel injection

Compression ratio:
9.1:1

Horsepower (hp / kW @ rpm):
550 / 410 @ 6100 (estimated)

Torque (lb-ft / Nm @ rpm):
550 / 745 @ 3800 (estimated)

Recommended fuel:
premium required

Maximum engine speed (rpm):
6200


Transmission

Tremec TR6060 six-speed manual

Gear ratios (:1):


First:
2.66

Second:
1.78

Third:
1.30

Fourth:
1.00

Fifth:
0.80

Sixth:
0.63

Reverse:
2.90

Final drive ratio:
3.73


Chassis / Suspension

Front: double-ball-joint, multi-link strut; direct-acting stabilizer bar; progressive-rate coil springs; with Magnetic Ride Control

Rear:
4.5-link independent; progressive-rate coil springs over shocks; stabilizer bar; with Magnetic Ride Control

Steering type:
electric power steering with variable-ratio, variable-effort rack-and-pinion

Steering ratio:
16.1:1

Steering wheel turns, lock-to-lock:
2.5

Turning circle, curb-to-curb (ft / m):
37.7/11.5


Brakes

Type: four-wheel disc w/ ABS; ventilated two-piece front and one-piece rear rotors; six-piston fixed Brembo aluminum front and four-piston rear calipers

Rotor diameter, front (in / mm):
14.6 / 370

Rotor diameter, rear (in / mm):
14.4 / 365

Rotor thickness, front (in / mm):
1.26 / 32

Rotor thickness, rear (in / mm):
1.1 / 28


Wheels / Tires

Wheel size and type: 20 x 8-inch aluminum (front)
20 x 9-inch aluminum (rear)

Tires:
P245/45ZR20 summer (front)
P275/40ZR20 summer (rear)


Dimensions
Exterior

Wheelbase (in / mm): 112.3 / 2852

Overall length (in / mm):
190.4 / 4836

Overall width (in / mm):
75.5 / 1918

Overall height (in / mm):
54.2 / 1376

Track, front (in / mm):
63.7 / 1618

Track, rear (in / mm):
63.7 / 1618

Curb weight (lb / kg):
TBD

Weight balance (% front / rear):
TBD

Coefficient of drag:
TBD


Interior

Seating capacity (front / rear): 2 / 2

Headroom (in / mm):
front: 37.4 / 950
rear: 35.3 / 897

Legroom (in / mm):
front: 42.4 / 1077
rear: 29.9 / 757

Shoulder room (in / mm):
front: 56.9 / 1444
rear: 42.5 / 1080


Capacities

Cargo volume (cu ft / L): 11.3 / 320

Fuel tank (gal / L):
19 / 71.9

Engine oil (qt / L):
8.9 / 8.5

[Graham_A_M]

550hp/550Tq. Holy shit I want that engine.
:drool:

[MGCM]

Originally posted by Graham_A_M
550hp/550Tq. Holy shit I want that engine.
:drool:

You could always get a Hennessey Camaro, GSL Chev City has one right now, should be in the showroom by tomorrow, maybe sooner.............unless it sold at the auto show lol

[calgary350z]

Originally posted by MGCM


You could always get a Hennessey Camaro, GSL Chev City has one right now, should be in the showroom by tomorrow, maybe sooner.............unless it sold at the auto show lol

Wouldnt pay the $68k they want for it!!

It still has the SS rims on it at that pck level and price
:thumbsdow

[jrps13]

wtf is magnetic ride control

[heavyD]

Originally posted by jrps13
wtf is magnetic ride control

I believe Porsche was doing it before gm. Simplified to my knowledge involves having a magnet/piston arrangement in an electorchemical filled shock absorber. Supposed to respond faster than regular gas filled shocks. Sounds expensive to maintain and I'm not sure how this arrangement would respond to aftermarket springs.

[flipstah]

Originally posted by heavyD


I believe Porsche was doing it before gm. Simplified to my knowledge involves having a magnet/piston arrangement in an electorchemical filled shock absorber. Supposed to respond faster than regular gas filled shocks. Sounds expensive to maintain and I'm not sure how this arrangement would respond to aftermarket springs.

Kinda like what Audi did with the TT; they placed iron filings in the shocks so when you activate the magnet, the suspension becomes firmer.

[Shlade]

Awaiting the thread for

Full bolt on 2011 5.0 mustang destroys new ZL1 Camaro.

I dont mean to sound like a fanboy buy for fuck sakes theres seriously no better domestic in its class right now than the new 5.0

Chevy is trying too hard lol

[JRSC00LUDE]

I just don't understand chevy styling. It doesn't work and hasn't worked for, what, 20 years now? Everything they make looks "cheap". I don't mean the materials even, it's like whoever does their design is the equivilent of the guy at H&R Block who does tax returns....Just couldn't quite cut it in school and had to settle for a job that settles for you. I swear, you could make the whole thing out of carbon fibre and diamonds and the most expensive leather on earth and it would look like you should be able to buy it for $9,995.00.

They just continually miss the mark.....hell, they miss the whole building.

:dunno:

[corsvette]

Originally posted by JRSC00LUDE
I just don't understand chevy styling. It doesn't work and hasn't worked for, what, 20 years now? Everything they make looks "cheap". I don't mean the materials even, it's like whoever does their design is the equivilent of the guy at H&R Block who does tax returns....Just couldn't quite cut it in school and had to settle for a job that settles for you. I swear, you could make the whole thing out of carbon fibre and diamonds and the most expensive leather on earth and it would look like you should be able to buy it for $9,995.00.

They just continually miss the mark.....hell, they miss the whole building.

:dunno:

I do somewhat agree with you, the Camaro does have almost a cartoonish look about it and i doubt its daring styling will age very well. It does have presence on the road though and people do look at Camaros.

I don't agree that ALL Chevys look cheap. The Malibu even in its 4th year still looks way more upscale than it is. The new Cruze is not terribly exciting to look at but its certainly not cheap looking either. I still like their Trucks and newst small SUV's....i'm not a total fanboy either....i do drive a newer Ford truck.

[treg50]

Originally posted by corsvette
I do somewhat agree with you, the Camaro does have almost a cartoonish look about it and i doubt its daring styling will age very well. It does have presence on the road though and people do look at Camaros.

I don't agree that ALL Chevys look cheap. The Malibu even in its 4th year still looks way more upscale than it is. The new Cruze is not terribly exciting to look at but its certainly not cheap looking either. I still like their Trucks and newst small SUV's....i'm not a total fanboy either....i do drive a newer Ford truck.
I'd agree that most Chevy's did look like crap even compared to their Pontiac or Saturn counterparts (obviously I'm not talking about Corvette, f'ing love it). Sadly, that's still the case for most Chevs. and without it's better looking siblings Pontiac and Saturn around, Chevy isn't making things easier for GM.

One thing I will say, I actually think the Cruze IS exciting... for a Chevy? HELL ya it's exciting for Chevy. I liked the Cobalt SS sedan and coupe but good the see the standard Cruze is improved over the standard Cobalt. To me it actually looks like Chevrolet Cruze rips off styling from the good ol' Acura 1.6 EL, tail lights especially --- looks good. If Acura was smart and kept the EL I could see those tailights on it. The front end is sharp, aggressive and pretty original --- rare these days from any manufacturer. And in the BTCC the Cruze is pretty f'ing sweet I have to say.

[flipstah]

Originally posted by corsvette


I do somewhat agree with you, the Camaro does have almost a cartoonish look about it and i doubt its daring styling will age very well. It does have presence on the road though and people do look at Camaros.

I don't agree that ALL Chevys look cheap. The Malibu even in its 4th year still looks way more upscale than it is. The new Cruze is not terribly exciting to look at but its certainly not cheap looking either. I still like their Trucks and newst small SUV's....i'm not a total fanboy either....i do drive a newer Ford truck.

The bold designs never look good after a couple of years; case in point, the Nissan Murano.

When it first came out, I thought it was innovative and a year after, it just looks like a bloated egg. Now it looks even worse.

Chevy loves plastics; my dad's Silverado made so much creaking and... I just hate that noise plastic makes when you tap it. It's like a Tupperware party. His new F-150 is roomier and looks way more classier.

Still... Camaro in orange with no chrome? Yes please. :drool:

Also, the Cruze only looks good modded and on the track. Otherwise, it's blargh.

[Mitsu3000gt]

Originally posted by flipstah
Chevy loves plastics; my dad's Silverado made so much creaking and... I just hate that noise plastic makes when you tap it. It's like a Tupperware party. His new F-150 is roomier and looks way more classier.


When I was in California last week I convinced the lady at Hertz to give me a Corvette instead of a Cobalt LOL. Anyways, the point being I got to live with a vette for a week, driving it for a few hours every day in city and on freeways.

It was, BY FAR, the largest POS I've driven in recent memory. I didn't even feel safe in it, and that isn't an exaggeration. It has an amazing engine (LS3) & chassis but it stops abruptly right there. Seats were horrible (most sports cars have great seats), so many creaks, cracks, noises, rattles, etc. I literally thought it would fall apart if I hit one more bump. I cringed every time I shut the door because based on the sound it made, I seriously thought it was going to break and then I'd have to pay for something. Cheap plastic everywhere, and the worst automatic transmission I've ever experienced (I'm sure the manual is better but it's not an option on rentals). The transmission was extremely lethargic even in sport shift mode, it blipped down shifts but it was so slow that it didn't matter, and the paddles were super cheap plastic. It would shift into 6th gear at 25 MPH and needed full throttle to shift down, so I used sport shift most of the time which at least let me hold gears (used gears 2-5 only). The car was a low mileage 2009 ZHZ edition convertible. The brake feel sucked too (IMO) very mushy. Going down ramps diagonally to save the front end made the car twist so much I thought it was going to snap in half and made the most awful noise. Again, it handled amazing, sounded good, and went like hell, but you couldn't pay me to own one of those things. They have such a good engine/chassis combo but then its like they stopped giving a shit, and gave it a worse-than-a-caviler everything else. It got good mileage though LOL...28 MPG on the freeways.

Anyways, just my opinion, but after living with one for a week I don't know how people like these things unless it was a dedicated track car. No offense to vette owners either, each to their own, but I just couldn't handle it personally. I hope this new ZL1 is a departure from that, but I'll wait until I can see one in person.

[flipstah]

Your post makes me want to rent a Corvette for a while lol. I think Chevrolet has a lot of catching up to do with Ford in terms of style and quality.

Not a fan of domestics but there's something about the blue oval...


Originally posted by Mitsu3000gt


When I was in California last week I convinced the lady at Hertz to give me a Corvette instead of a Cobalt LOL. Anyways, the point being I got to live with a vette for a week, driving it for a few hours every day in city and on freeways.

It was, BY FAR, the largest POS I've driven in recent memory. I didn't even feel safe in it, and that isn't an exaggeration. It has an amazing engine (LS3) & chassis but it stops abruptly right there. Seats were horrible (most sports cars have great seats), so many creaks, cracks, noises, rattles, etc. I literally thought it would fall apart if I hit one more bump. I cringed every time I shut the door because based on the sound it made, I seriously thought it was going to break and then I'd have to pay for something. Cheap plastic everywhere, and the worst automatic transmission I've ever experienced (I'm sure the manual is better but it's not an option on rentals). The transmission was extremely lethargic even in sport shift mode, it blipped down shifts but it was so slow that it didn't matter, and the paddles were super cheap plastic. It would shift into 6th gear at 25 MPH and needed full throttle to shift down, so I used sport shift most of the time which at least let me hold gears (used gears 2-5 only). The car was a low mileage 2009 ZHZ edition convertible. The brake feel sucked too (IMO) very mushy. Going down ramps diagonally to save the front end made the car twist so much I thought it was going to snap in half and made the most awful noise. Again, it handled amazing, sounded good, and went like hell, but you couldn't pay me to own one of those things. They have such a good engine/chassis combo but then its like they stopped giving a shit, and gave it a worse-than-a-caviler everything else. It got good mileage though LOL...28 MPG on the freeways.

Anyways, just my opinion, but after living with one for a week I don't know how people like these things unless it was a dedicated track car. No offense to vette owners either, each to their own, but I just couldn't handle it personally. I hope this new ZL1 is a departure from that, but I'll wait until I can see one in person.

[corsvette]

Originally posted by flipstah
Your post makes me want to rent a Corvette for a while lol. I think Chevrolet has a lot of catching up to do with Ford in terms of style and quality.

Not a fan of domestics but there's something about the blue oval...



Ford has some catching up to GM in certain areas imo. Their Lincoln brand offers nothing special or even that competitive. Cadillac offers the CTS sedan, wagon, coupe, and v-series-all very competitive cars, they also have the fairly new SRX suv which is selling very well, add in the upcoming ATS and XTS flagship and GM has Ford solidly trumped in the luxury car market. GM also has the Volt, which you must admit is a pretty novel idea, and is doing very well in the publics hands. The buick Regal (rebaged Opel Insignia) is a solid hit along with the Lacross, and further plans for the Regal include a further hoped up GS GNX version with AWD and a twin turbo V6. The Cruze has also been met with great success so far, and more variations of it are on the way (a 5 door and ss model) All these new models are doing well in quality surveys as well. GM's newest interior designs are very well done.

Ford just got with the program with a new line of gas V8's in their trucks. But It will take a bit to repair the damage done by offering a underpowered and rather troublesome engine for so many years (5.4l from 97-10') same can be said about Fords diesel, still new and unproven, and still getting whiped by GM's proven duramax. Ford trucks do have a huge edge in interiors though.

Ford has quite a few great new products, The Mustang, Focus, Fiesta, new explorer, and Ecoboost engines (GM has a similar engine in the works). I own one of their trucks (06 model bought in 08) and have been fairly happy with it, but if GM trucks had a nicer interior i would buy theirs next time. I have also liked the Edge suv since it came out, but never see to many around. I also hardly ever see any new Taurus' on the road, and the reviews on them are lukewarm. Their large SUV's are dated, as is the Escape compact suv compaired to the Chev Equinox and GMC terrain.

Really GM's not as far behind as you think. There are still a few very dated products in the lineup that need replacing (Impala, Lucerne, DTS) I rode in a Cruze a few weeks ago and was very impressed with the interior, for a inexpensive car its downright luxurious, the whole car is very well done. I think GM has a bright future if they keep it up.

[Mitsu3000gt]

Originally posted by flipstah
Your post makes me want to rent a Corvette for a while lol. I think Chevrolet has a lot of catching up to do with Ford in terms of style and quality.

Not a fan of domestics but there's something about the blue oval...



It was a fun rental, because you can drive it however you want and it doesn't matter, but seriously the quality was much lower than I even had expected, and my expectations were very low. I truly didn't feel safe in it, in a "when is this POS going to fall apart" kind of way. The key is to not rent it online....choose the cheapest car, then when you actually arrive at your destination, sweet talk the employee into an upgrade haha. The vettes sit there more often than not, so they are sometimes willing to get them out at a greatly reduced cost. They are all automatic, and all convertible though.

Both Ford and GM have some decent cars in their lineups, and some cars that should be hurled into a pit of flames. Both are headed in the right direction, but still have a long road ahead IMHO. I'm glad to see they are finally starting to "get it" though with some of their offerings.

[flipstah]

Originally posted by corsvette





Originally posted by Mitsu3000gt




Both of you make great points. It's like a new tide has come up on North American shores; the domestics are the innovative, evolving brands while the big imports (Honda, Toyota) are becoming stagnant and complacent.

It's a vicious cycle, I tell ya.