22,000 teachers laid off today in California.

[ZenOps]

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/03/15/massive-california-teache_n_835987.html

State has run out of money. Actually they ran out of money last year, but the teachers had a small extension.

Well, at least they don't have to worry about earthquakes yet.

[Cos]

Yeah because that state has so many extra teachers that arent required. :banghead:

[rx7boi]

Now they can take up bodybuilding.

[D'z Nutz]

Originally posted by rx7boi
Now they can take up bodybuilding.

Haha what the fuck? that was so random :rofl:

[broken_legs]

Too bad the teachers that are retiring and the ones that have already retired feel so entitled to their massive pension plans. Maybe, if they would make some concessions, the state wouldn't be forced to fire new teachers to pay for ones that have already stopped working.

Pretty F'd up.

Public Unions = Bad.

Public Teachers Unions = The Worst.

EDIT
Mish...:

http://globaleconomicanalysis.blogspot.com/2011/02/calstrs-california-state-teachers.html

http://globaleconomicanalysis.blogspot.com/2011/02/are-teachers-special-is-anyone-why.html

http://globaleconomicanalysis.blogspot.com/2010/04/governor-christie-on-death-threats.html

http://globaleconomicanalysis.blogspot.com/2011/02/40-of-madison-teachers-call-in-sick.html




Here is the exact statement: "I think that teachers are special and must be separated out in this debate and protected."

Ironically, if anyone is "special" in the student-teacher relationship, it is the students (and those who cannot protect themselves), not the teachers!

With no disrespect to teachers or any other profession, no one is "more special" than anyone else.

People who believe they are special are a huge part of the problem. Everyone wants their group protected at the expense of everyone else. Every group has their own excuse why they are special. It's one of the reasons we are in this mess.

The person who emailed me has decidedly biased opinion (his wife is a teacher). I also hear it from police think they are special because their lives are on the line.

However, stats show that agricultural work is far more dangerous than police work. Fishing and roofing are of the most dangerous professions of all. Should fisherman, roofers, and agricultural workers get "special" pension benefits?

[kertejud2]

In related news the Ontario Teachers' Pension Plan is supposedly listening to offers for their 66% stake in MLSE (~worth $1.5B) to gain some liquidity.



Since these layoffs were seemingly based on seniority rather than quality Alberta should look into poaching the better ones.

[ZenOps]

I don't know that we can afford Cali teachers.

They pay $2,000 for wacky weed down there and 2 million for apartment buildings. Living that high on the hog for that long means even a starter teacher expects caviar with wine.

They've pretty much priced themselves out of the market. While the US can indefinitely print $600B every time they need to, we can't (We can't even justify $16B to replace a 20 year old fighter jet fleet)

And if you look at how amazingly prosperous California is now - do you really want to bring any of their teachers here to do the exact same to Canada?

Besides, the local teachers would be angry if they got squeezed out in a tight market.

[CMW403]

Originally posted by ZenOps
I don't know that we can afford Cali teachers.

They pay $2,000 for wacky weed down there and 2 million for apartment buildings. Living that high on the hog for that long means even a starter teacher expects caviar with wine.

They've pretty much priced themselves out of the market. While the US can indefinitely print $600B every time they need to, we can't (We can't even justify $16B to replace a 20 year old fighter jet fleet)

And if you look at how amazingly prosperous California is now - do you really want to bring any of their teachers here to do the exact same to Canada?

Besides, the local teachers would be angry if they got squeezed out in a tight market.

:rofl:

Do you ever come to meets Zenops?? I would like to meet you one day.

[broken_legs]

More on California Teachers Pension Plan (CALPERS)

http://www.zerohedge.com/article/calpers-holds-assumed-return-rate-775



The committee of the California Public Employees' Retirement System decided to recommend maintaining the rate at 7.75%, instead of adopting the recommendation by Calpers's chief actuary to lower the rate to 7.5%.
...
Critics blame too-rosy rates for contributing to state pension shortfalls, estimated at more than $1 trillion nationwide.
...
A decrease in the Calpers rate of return to 7.5% would have bumped up what local California governments pay on behalf of government workers by 1.5% to 3% of payroll costs each year and 3% to 5% of what they pay on behalf of police officers, firefighters and other public-safety officers, a Calpers spokeswoman said.
...
Pension plans are typically funded by investment returns as well as contributions from public employers and government workers. Pension plans considering the adoption of a more-conservative annual rate of return are faced with having to shift a greater financial burden on to public employers (AKA TAXPAYERS), since typically contributions from employees legally can't be changed.

[zipdoa]

Originally posted by CMW403


:rofl:

Do you ever come to meets Zenops?? I would like to meet you one day.

I feel the same way. I don't even want to hate on the guy, I simply love the flavour he provides to the forums!

[1barA4]

...but the real question is, how much do Cali teachers make?

We can shoot the breeze about how they should sacrifice their pensions and all but really, if they made shit for cash to begin with, that pension means very, very little.

I would almost bet money that a Californian teacher makes a fraction of what an Albertan teacher makes.

Wait...

http://teacherportal.com/salary/California-teacher-salary

They start in the high 30's and on average make 60?

That's a lot less than Alberta teachers....a LOT. Plus, larger class sizes.

One of my teacher friends mentioned, when he maxes out at the 12 year mark (he's about 5 years in), is projected to make 100k (and currently makes in the high 60s).

[cashflow]

Originally posted by rx7boi
Now they can take up bodybuilding.

This is the most hilarious comment.

[Rat Fink]

.

[sputnik]

Originally posted by ZenOps
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/03/15/massive-california-teache_n_835987.html

State has run out of money. Actually they ran out of money last year, but the teachers had a small extension.

Well, at least they don't have to worry about earthquakes yet.

It is a way of breaking the union.

Lay off a ton of teachers in the spring with lots of advance notice (so that the union can't fight the decision) and then high the majority of them back for September and weed out the dead wood in the process.

[Konj]

Why did you post this? What does this have to do with Calgary or Canada? What kind of ties do you have with California?

[1barA4]

Originally posted by Rat Fink


Where the hell does he live to make that much scratch? My mom had around 35 years experience and when she retired she was at 75-80K before taxes in Lethbridge. My step-dad is around the same mark too with similar amount of experience.

The only teachers having a chance at making close to 100K in the school districts I know of are principals.

Currently, the cap (at 6 years of education) is like 76k.
If you read what I posted, the union projects that when he hits the 12 year mark (the highest wage level) at 2018, that top step should be at 100k.

That projection is based on cost of living increases and contract increases. I'm just saying what he said and what he was told by his union reps.

[Cos]

Originally posted by 1barA4


Currently, the cap (at 6 years of education) is like 76k.
If you read what I posted, the union projects that when he hits the 12 year mark (the highest wage level) at 2018, that top step should be at 100k.

That projection is based on cost of living increases and contract increases. I'm just saying what he said and what he was told by his union reps.

After the last couple years they have had, they will be lucky to get 1.2% on the next contract. Teachers are always right behind the curve. Get in shit in a recession because they are getting raises. Once people are back to 5 - 10% raises they will be arguing for 2%. I very much doubt he will be at 100k in 7 years.

I would bank on about 95k MAX

[Kloubek]

Originally posted by Konj
Why did you post this? What does this have to do with Calgary or Canada? What kind of ties do you have with California?

Who pissed in your cornflakes? The OP found it interesting - even if it doesn't directly affect us here. If you don't want to read the content then you should have read the (accurate) subject line before you came in here.

[Tik-Tok]

Originally posted by Kloubek


Who pissed in your cornflakes? The OP found it interesting - even if it doesn't directly affect us here. If you don't want to read the content then you should have read the (accurate) subject line before you came in here.

No he's totally right. Why should we pay attention to any news outside of Calgary, I mean screw the rest of the world, it's not like anything outside of Canada, effects Canada or the people in it at all.

I keep hearing people talk about some kind of earthquake in Japan, and I just tell them, "Hey, it wasn't in Canada, don't worry about it!"

:nut:

[Kloubek]

Originally posted by Tik-Tok
I keep hearing people talk about some kind of earthquake in Japan, and I just tell them, "Hey, it wasn't in Canada, don't worry about it!"

:nut:

Exactly what I was thinking of saying actually. But perhaps the fact that the Japanese economy is so intertwined on a global scale to ours is reason sufficient to deem it important. When dealing with mindless twits like this, it is really impossible to know what is (or is not) going through their head....

[chkolny541]

Originally posted by Tik-Tok


No he's totally right. Why should we pay attention to any news outside of Calgary, I mean screw the rest of the world, it's not like anything outside of Canada, effects Canada or the people in it at all.

I keep hearing people talk about some kind of earthquake in Japan, and I just tell them, "Hey, it wasn't in Canada, don't worry about it!"

:nut:

haha, doing this would simply turn us into typical americans

[Xtrema]

Originally posted by Konj
Why did you post this? What does this have to do with Calgary or Canada? What kind of ties do you have with California?

We are taxpayers and we also have a teacher's union. Some of us has kids in the public school system. Eventually we'll have in the same fate as we grow.

[dexlargo]

Originally posted by Rat Fink


Where the hell does he live to make that much scratch? My mom had around 35 years experience and when she retired she was at 75-80K before taxes in Lethbridge. My step-dad is around the same mark too with similar amount of experience.

The only teachers having a chance at making close to 100K in the school districts I know of are principals.



Originally posted by 1barA4


Currently, the cap (at 6 years of education) is like 76k.
If you read what I posted, the union projects that when he hits the 12 year mark (the highest wage level) at 2018, that top step should be at 100k.

That projection is based on cost of living increases and contract increases. I'm just saying what he said and what he was told by his union reps.
No, currently the cap for a teacher with 6 years of education and 11 years of experience is $94,641.

Here's the current pay grid:

Effective September 1, 2010


Years of teaching Years of University Education
experience C (3 yrs) D (4 yrs) E (5 yrs) F (6 yrs+)

0 45,939 55,156 58,387 62,086

1 45,939 58,387 61,626 65,316

2 48,261 63,626 64,862 68,555

3 50,579 64,862 68,088 71,788

4 52,904 68,088 71,319 75,017

5 55,232 71,319 74,561 78,258

6 57,552 74,561 77,794 81,490

7 59,875 77,794 81,027 84,721

8 and 9 62,206 81,027 84,267 87,954

10 64,291 84,267 87,497 91,196

11 87,713 90,944 94,641The reason 8 and 9 are combined is that they are reducing the number of steps on the grid. So next year, steps 9 and 10 will be combined, and then the next year (in theory) step 11 will cease to exist.

[1barA4]

Originally posted by dexlargo




No, currently the cap for a teacher with 6 years of education and 11 years of experience is $94,641.

Here's the current pay grid:

Effective September 1, 2010


Years of teaching Years of University Education
experience C (3 yrs) D (4 yrs) E (5 yrs) F (6 yrs+)

0 45,939 55,156 58,387 62,086

1 45,939 58,387 61,626 65,316

2 48,261 63,626 64,862 68,555

3 50,579 64,862 68,088 71,788

4 52,904 68,088 71,319 75,017

5 55,232 71,319 74,561 78,258

6 57,552 74,561 77,794 81,490

7 59,875 77,794 81,027 84,721

8 and 9 62,206 81,027 84,267 87,954

10 64,291 84,267 87,497 91,196

11 87,713 90,944 94,641The reason 8 and 9 are combined is that they are reducing the number of steps on the grid. So next year, steps 9 and 10 will be combined, and then the next year (in theory) step 11 will cease to exist.

That little bugger!
He's the cheapest guy I know and he's banking nearly 80k and says he can't afford to come out for wings on wing night?

That makes more sense that the top step is just short of 95k, from the union rep's projection for 100k at top step in the next 7 years (based on contract and cost of living increases).

Thanks for posting that, I'm gonna boot that cheap bastard next time I see him lol

[Graham_A_M]

22k teachers, wow thats insane.

I wonder what percentage that equates to. I wonder what California's game plan is. I wonder if they even have a glimmer of hope that they'll be out of this reaction mode at some point. This absolutely cannot go on.... :nut:

[Cos]

Originally posted by Graham_A_M
22k teachers, wow thats insane.



My boss is friends with the LA Public School board Superintendent. He said that their special ed budget cut a couple years ago was $1bn. Wonder how big overall the budget is if they cut special ed by that much.

I only know this because her husband is the past president of the AAA. He got some sick box seats at Laguna

[dexlargo]

Originally posted by 1barA4


That little bugger!
He's the cheapest guy I know and he's banking nearly 80k and says he can't afford to come out for wings on wing night?

That makes more sense that the top step is just short of 95k, from the union rep's projection for 100k at top step in the next 7 years (based on contract and cost of living increases).

Thanks for posting that, I'm gonna boot that cheap bastard next time I see him lol I wouldn't be surprised if its 100k within 3 years. Next year teachers are going to receive a 4.4% raise for the last year of their 5 year deal, so next year, the top position will pay $98,805.

That said, I don't think that their next agreement will be quite as good. In fact, I expect the government's starting position will be a pay cut.

[Cos]

Originally posted by dexlargo
I wouldn't be surprised if its 100k within 3 years. Next year teachers are going to receive a 4.4% raise for the last year of their 5 year deal, so next year, the top position will pay $98,805.

That said, I don't think that their next agreement will be quite as good. In fact, I expect the government's starting position will be a pay cut.

Yeah what I posted earlier I suspect that 1% a year is about the best they can hope for.

[ZenOps]

Now that the Canadian dollar is a few percentage points over the US dollar, the teachers here might be in line for a wage freeze.

I mean their wages were fine - when the dollar was 68 cents, but now its definitely out of line with everyone else. More so now with the current economic situation.