2011 Hyundai Elantra tops Honda Civic, best selling car in Canada

[Super_Geo]

http://thelinkpaper.ca/wp-content/uploads/2011/03/Hyundai-Elantra-2011-pic-4.jpg

Thoughts? Personally I love the new look. Wish they gave it some more hp though.

http://thelinkpaper.ca/?p=5544


The 2011 Hyundai Elantra became the best-selling car in Canada in January 2011 leaping ahead of the Honda Civic, Toyota Corolla and Mazda3 that usually fight for the top slot.

And why precisely did this happen?

Well one has to a look at this all –new Elantra to discover why. Not only does it look oh so sexy, it has a host of features and a big car feel that belies its price tag.

The stylist pushed the envelope to make the Elantra look like nothing else in its class. Notice the long, low profile: that rear window is so steep it makes this sedan more coupe- like than sedan.

Pronounced hood and door creases, swooping fender flares and elongated headlights and tail lights add a sense of drama to the design. Look carefully and one could swear there is a hint of the best of BMW, Infiniti and Acura going on. The car looks incredibly sophisticated and modern in contrasts to its rivals. You can see why people swoon for it.

For 2011, the Elantra swaps has a 1.8-litre four cylinder with 10 extra horsepower at 148 horses and 131 lb-ft of torque. The previous five-speed manual/four-speed automatic transmission option is now replaced by a six-speed manual in the L, GL and GLS trim levels, or an optional six-speed autobox as on our tester. In terms of trim, the Elantra impresses the hell out of everyone in this segment with its standard spec. For a reasonable $18,549 starting price the base L model, has six airbags, active front head restraints, electronic stability control, power locks, heated mirrors, stereo with USB port and auxiliary input and power windows. The GL adds air conditioning, heated seats, keyless entry, Bluetooth and cruise control. Step up to the GLS and one gains a leather-wrapped steering wheel, sunroof, fog lights, XM satellite radio, and the surprise, surprise is the only car to offer heated rear seats in the compact segment.

The hearty –boy Limited at $22,699, offers 17-inch alloy wheels, automatic climate control, leather seats, auto-dimming rear-view mirror and garage door opener. Navigation is a $2,000, option with pushbutton start, stereo amplifier and rear-view camera.

Entry into the rear cabin is a tad hampered by the low sloping roofline and taller rear passengers need to be aware. Legroom is good however and two rear passengers will have room, while three will fit cosily. One high point is the generous trunk, but note the folding rear seats don’t fall quite flat.

On the road, the Elantra has a firm stable ride and be prepared for a little noise when you accelerate on the highway. However the four cylinder benefits for the extra horsepower and hums along just fine at cruising speeds. The six-speed automatic transmission shifts smoothly and willingly downshifts. The engine does get noisy at high rpm, however.

Handling wise, the electric power steering offers a fairly neutral feel and is responsive enough to keep things interesting. The stiffer body structure and a well-calibrated makes this new Elantra fun to drive. The car feels stable and planted, with relatively little body roll through turns also impressive is the fuel economy which at 6.9 L/100 km in the city and 4.9 L/100 km on the highway is comparable to some hybrids. Downside is few, limited to the following observations: The engine does get a tad noisy at high rpm, the new electric power steering is quick and precise, but lacks the feel sporty drivers might hanker for. Small gripes really for what amounts to a good overall package.

During my week long test, the Elantra garnered many looks and enquires about its price. This is a hugely impressive vehicle to of knocked off the Japanese players of the sales charts. It looks like gorgeous, is fairly spacious, has a great equipment list and is well priced. Add that five year and 100,000 km comprehensive warranty and the new Elantra starts looking like a lot of sense.

2011 Hyundai Elantra priced from $22,699 -$24,294

[max_boost]

:thumbsup: Hyundai
:thumbsdow Honda

:werd:

[msommers]

That thing has impressive gas mileage and and equally impressive factory warranty at a lower price. It's a no brainer!

[maxwinedog]

Was talking to my uncle the other day who has own just about every make of jap/korean car...nissan, honda, toyota, mazda, hyandai.

He said Hyandai has surpassed them all now and is the best of them all in terms of quality.

[Guillermo]

I love hyundai. my first car was an '88 excel, and while it was a total pile of crap, i still have a special place in my heart for it.

we now have an '09 accent hatch that is used for work commutes. it's not super comfortable, and is definitely underpowered, but it's great for her 20 minute drives to and from work each day.

i was seriously considering a v6 sonata (i love the styling of those cars, even if they do appear to imitate other auto makers), but really wanted a hatch so went with a madza instead. I REALLY wish hyundai would introduce a mid-size hatch. the elantra touring is *OK*, but i would like to see a larger hatch, or at least a small hatch with a v6.

[corsvette]

No doubt their new products look great, and Initial quality may be good, but i still worry about long term Hyundai ownership. I've talked to many owners of Tiburon's, Santa fe's and the simailar kia stablemates, most are happy for the first 5yrs or so,after that they tend to fall apart rather quickly. Maybe thats why their resale value is still poor.

[Aleks]

Not surprising it's a new design and the car is loaded with features for a low price. From checking out the Elantra, Cruze and Focus I think Focus is the nicest overall car. We'll see if that translates into sales here and what happens when the new civic arrives.

In the States though both Corolla and Cruze outsell the Elantra. :dunno:

[Xtrema]

Originally posted by Aleks
In the States though both Corolla and Cruze outsell the Elantra. :dunno:

Canadians seems to have a bigger Hyundai following than US.

Civic will post no threat. It will be either 3rd or 4th in this class for at least the next 4-5 years. You just can't afford FMC that looks like MMC any more.

[Redlyne_mr2]

Ya quebec and Ontario love Hyundai. Not so much in bc/alberta/sask

[heavyD]

Not surprised as this has been in the making for a while. Honda left the door open and the Koreans took full advantage. This is just the beginning as they will eventually become the biggest car manufacturer in the world. The only thing stopping them from gaining complete domination will be the lack of pickup truck offerings. When you go back a couple of decades and look at where they were this turn of events is astounding.

[Phenix]

Hyundai ftw! I like all the hyundais I've had!

[01RedDX]

.

[403Gemini]

I'm highly considering the genesis coupe as my next car :thumbsup: Big props to Hyundai for all of their new products. Their new styling is AMAZING.

[Xtrema]

Originally posted by 01RedDX
Last year of 8th gen Civic + first year of 5th gen Elantra = unfair comparison.

It's only unfair that many of those Elantra went to fleet. Given 9th gen is same or worst than 8th gen depends on level of fanboyism, it's very valid.

[revelations]

Hondas look boring, but are usually quite reliable.

Hyundais look great, but have an unproven reliability (I need more data).

[maxwinedog]

Originally posted by revelations
Hondas look boring, but are usually quite reliable.

Hyundais look great, but have an unproven reliability (I need more data).

Really? I was told Hyundais have surpassed Nissan, Mazda, Honda, Toyota, Mercedez, BMW, Subaru, VW, Audi in terms of engine and parts quality and lifespan.

[01RedDX]

.

[InRich]

I'd have no problem driving that thing as is...

[revelations]

Originally posted by maxwinedog


Really? I was told Hyundais have surpassed Nissan, Mazda, Honda, Toyota, Mercedez, BMW, Subaru, VW, Audi in terms of engine and parts quality and lifespan.

You were also "told" that Calgary has more snow than anywhere else in Canada.

Cite your sources then for the automotive stats.

I dont doubt this is true, I just need to see some numbers.

[heavyD]

Originally posted by 01RedDX

Look at sales numbers for any model that's in its last production year, then get back to me.

Civic will no doubt have a bounce back year in 2012 with the new model launch but I would expect sales to taper off very quickly as there will be little reason for current gen owners to trade up to the 2012+ considering the cars are nearly identical in every way. The long term future looks very bleak for the Civic.

[Xtrema]

Originally posted by revelations


You were also "told" that Calgary has more snow than anywhere else in Canada.

Cite your sources then for the automotive stats.

I dont doubt this is true, I just need to see some numbers.

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-6-iPZP32M54/TYYuBMD97iI/AAAAAAAELRM/xoqyN0tR8YA/s1600/2011-JD-Power-chart.jpg

Just in case people who are not familiar with VDS, it's data collected after 3 years of ownership of a new car.

So 2011 stats would be from 2008 models.

If you discount the low volume brands, the ranking goes:

Toyota
Hyundai
Honda
Ford
Chevy

[MGCM]

Out of all the Sub $20k compact cars on the market I believe the Cruze has the best overall power(when equipped with the 1.4L DI Turbo) and suspension feel, even the brakes feel very good for a compact car. The only thing that car is missing is a manual gearbox which is only available with the gutless 1.8L non-DI Turbo powertrain. Maybe upon the release of the hatchback model late this year or early next year they will finally give us a manual gearbox for the 1.4L DI Turbo powertrain.

[lamp_shade_2000]

Originally posted by MGCM
Out of all the Sub $20k compact cars on the market I believe the Cruze has the best overall power(when equipped with the 1.4L DI Turbo) and suspension feel, even the brakes feel very good for a compact car. The only thing that car is missing is a manual gearbox which is only available with the gutless 1.8L non-DI Turbo powertrain. Maybe upon the release of the hatchback model late this year or early next year they will finally give us a manual gearbox for the 1.4L DI Turbo powertrain.

It is already available with either the 6spd auto or a 6spd manual. The manual being very popular in the ECO model.

[MGCM]

Originally posted by lamp_shade_2000


It is already available with either the 6spd auto or a 6spd manual. The manual being very popular in the ECO model.

To date GSL has zero 6spd manual Cruze's with the 1.4L DI Turbo powertrain, the only 6spd manual's we ever had were for the 1.8L models. I see now on GM's website the new ECO model with 6spd manual.........I guess once we get some in stock I'll have to test drive one.

[lamp_shade_2000]

We have a few at CMP. You can definitely feel the torque of the 1.4T compared to the 1.8

[corsvette]

I'm going try to rent a Cruze this week while in the states. Mostly all the reviews of this car are.very positive, and they have a beautiful interior for the price. Just curious to see how all these new compact cars perform, and if they live up to their MPG ratings.

[SilverRex]

Originally posted by corsvette
No doubt their new products look great, and Initial quality may be good, but i still worry about long term Hyundai ownership. I've talked to many owners of Tiburon's, Santa fe's and the simailar kia stablemates, most are happy for the first 5yrs or so,after that they tend to fall apart rather quickly. Maybe thats why their resale value is still poor.

thats my issue with them as well, my dad had a kia a few years back and for the 1st few years it was all well but the last few years, the fuel mileage suddenly started to drop rapidly and so does performence,

if this is the case, obviously the re-sell will continue to not hold. I am sure they are on the right track and it will take more years of this following to create a new mental brand in everyone's mind, there fore price savings really have to stick out in order for me to get into one.

business strategy, it doesnt come at a better time for them to leap ahead of toyota/honda especially now with everything that has been going on of late and of recent years, Hyundai/kia is trying to be the acura/honda, Lexus/toyota Infinity/nissan

[Mitsu3000gt]

I'm a huge fan of all the recently re-done Hyundai product.

As for the Cruze, anyone else notice you can pay $32,000+ for one of those? I thought it was a decent little car until I saw the window sticker at the car show. Maybe I'm alone on this one, but IMO that thing is not worth anywhere near $32k with a full option load.

[Aleks]

Originally posted by Mitsu3000gt
I'm a huge fan of all the recently re-done Hyundai product.

As for the Cruze, anyone else notice you can pay $32,000+ for one of those? I thought it was a decent little car until I saw the window sticker at the car show. Maybe I'm alone on this one, but IMO that thing is not worth anywhere near $32k with a full option load.

That's how domestic pricing works. They price the cars high then hit them with huge incentives and you end up paying what you'd expect in the class :nut:

[Mitsu3000gt]

Originally posted by Aleks


That's how domestic pricing works. They price the cars high then hit them with huge incentives and you end up paying what you'd expect in the class :nut:

Their website shows $500 off, is there a bigger credit than that available?

Using their online price/builder thing I get $32,707.50 - $500 credit. Still a massive rip off IMO, unless the discounts are actually more like $5000-6000 and not $500. Thats only a few thousand off the base prices of the BMW 3 series, Audi A4, or Infinity G series, etc.

[flipstah]

Good for Hyundai! The Elantra looks fantastic!

.. For once.

[94boosted]

Originally posted by Mitsu3000gt
I'm a huge fan of all the recently re-done Hyundai product.

As for the Cruze, anyone else notice you can pay $32,000+ for one of those? I thought it was a decent little car until I saw the window sticker at the car show. Maybe I'm alone on this one, but IMO that thing is not worth anywhere near $32k with a full option load.

:werd: and :werd:

Hyundai's look great, they really do. The one thing I'm hoping they do now is shoehorn their new V8 into the Genesis but that's another story.

I was shocked at the car show when I saw the sticker on the fully loaded cruze, but like Aleks said you could proably walk out the door for under 30k.

[Aleks]

Originally posted by Mitsu3000gt


Their website shows $500 off, is there a bigger credit than that available?

Using their online price/builder thing I get $32,707.50 - $500 credit. Still a massive rip off IMO, unless the discounts are actually more like $5000-6000 and not $500. Thats only a few thousand off the base prices of the BMW 3 series, Audi A4, or Infinity G series, etc.

The incentives might not be in effect yet. In US they already have strong incentives on it and its outselling the Elantra. I'm guessing Canada will follow soon. Cobalt had anything from a few grand to $9000 in incentives at the end.

I've been reading some owner reviews of the Elantra and there are already complaints about how crappy the ride is and how very noisy the engine is, cheap paint, rattles and fuel economy nowhere near the advertised. :dunno:

[treg50]

Wow go Lincoln??!!?11?/ So in about 3 years we should see Toyota behind SAAB I guess, given Toyota's trend of massive recalls and defects in the past 12 months.

I like the new Tuscon. This new Elantra has some interesting bumps and bulges, angry lights on all four corners if you're into that, and the future-Prius like shape is neat. Kinda gay that they couldn't remake the Elantra Touring at the same time but that would make too much sense.

[flipstah]

Originally posted by treg50
Wow go Lincoln??!!?11?/ So in about 3 years we should see Toyota behind SAAB I guess, given Toyota's trend of massive recalls and defects in the past 12 months.


Not really "wow" for Lincoln. It's a luxury brand that few people buy so their ratio is better.

I don't think you count fleet in this, right?

[Kloubek]

Originally posted by maxwinedog


Really? I was told Hyundais have surpassed Nissan, Mazda, Honda, Toyota, Mercedez, BMW, Subaru, VW, Audi in terms of engine and parts quality and lifespan.

While I am not sure about this statement, keep in mind that we're not just talking about "initial quality". The long-term longevity of the new Hyundai has yet to be proven, imo.

With that said, it looks very, very good for them. This Elantra is a home run for sure.

[Mitsu3000gt]

Yeah those reliability lists mean very little, IMO. Also 3 years means nothing for "long term" reliability. No matter what car you buy these days, it will be pretty good if it's only 3 years old unless you get a lemon.

If I recall, the biggest problem with this list is that the severity of the problem is not taken into account, which makes it completely irrelevant (IMO). An engine bursting into flames and a burnt out headlight are each treated as a single problem. Reliability is also very dependent on how well the owner takes care of it, which is a HUGE variable.

Also, Lincoln is at the top because they do such a small volume, and most of them get driven like 2,000 km/year by seniors, so naturally they will break down less under such gentle and infrequent use. The one person I know personally with a Lincoln as a daily driver hates it, and it is in the shop constantly. I'm willing to bet Buick and Jaguar are near the top for similar reasons.

Interesting to see Mini at the bottom of the list, as I recall reading recently it had one of the highest resale % of any vehicle.

I do agree that true long term reliability of the new Hyundai product is yet to be seen, but from what I saw at the car show, I was impressed.


Originally posted by Aleks
I've been reading some owner reviews of the Elantra and there are already complaints about how crappy the ride is and how very noisy the engine is, cheap paint, rattles and fuel economy nowhere near the advertised. :dunno:

Most of those are things that are easily discovered during a close look at the car and some test drives. I have zero sympathy for someone who only discovers an interior, for example, is cheap after they've owned it. It doesn't take any more than common sense to see see if cheap crappy plastic is used everywhere or not. And bad ride quality? Noisy engine? Anyone complaining about those things clearly did not even bother to test drive the car, or they would have known before hand. Anyways, I'm not directing these comments at you obviously, but I don't feel sorry for car owners who don't do their due diligence, especially with a large purchase like a car. A 24 hour test drive (if available) would easily tell them what the gas mileage is like as well. The only thing that would be tough to test in the extreme short-term is cheap paint, and if a rattle developed over time and wasn't present at the test drive.

[Ymerej472008]

Originally posted by maxwinedog


Really? I was told Hyundais have surpassed Nissan, Mazda, Honda, Toyota, Mercedez, BMW, Subaru, VW, Audi in terms of engine and parts quality and lifespan.

Hyundai has never been known for making vehicles with long lifespans and high quality until recently (2+ years?).
Its gonna take more than a couple years for them to build a reputation in terms of quality and reliability.

On the other hand Toyota, Honda, Nissan etc have had their hands in that jar almost since the beginning.

[heavyD]

Originally posted by Ymerej472008


Hyundai has never been known for making vehicles with long lifespans and high quality until recently (2+ years?).
Its gonna take more than a couple years for them to build a reputation in terms of quality and reliability.

On the other hand Toyota, Honda, Nissan etc have had their hands in that jar almost since the beginning.

Not sure if I would put Nissan up there as their reliability has been pretty spotty over the years much like Mazda. There's been two tiers of Japanese automakers over the years; Honda & Toyota then the 2nd tier although Toyota has been slipping.

[Xtrema]

Originally posted by Ymerej472008
On the other hand Toyota, Honda, Nissan etc have had their hands in that jar almost since the beginning.

Nissan is Mazda with more reliable engines*.


*when it's not made in Mexico

[01RedDX]

.

[heavyD]

Originally posted by 01RedDX


The model change from 5th gen to 6th gen was nearly identical as well, and it continued to be a top seller. Even faced with stiffer competition like this Elantra, I don't expect the Civic to disappear from the top bestsellers anytime soon.

As for Japanese car reliability, it's always been spotty for any models built outside of Japan.

The Civic will not disappear but it's days of sales domination are coming to an end. Honestly I don't see how anyone could purchase the 2012 Civic over the 2012 Focus unless you were a die hard Honda fan. As far as styling inside and out it's not even a fair comparison the Focus is so far ahead. More standard power and better transmission options in the Focus. Early tests are reporting that the Focus handles better than anything in the current compact market. Throw in that Ford is amongst the top in reliability and you would really have to be a close minded Honda fan to go with the Civic. Not even counting the Focus there are more compelling options such as the Elantra, Cruze and the market is much, much different from when it was at the time of the 5th/6th generations of Civic.

[Xtrema]

Originally posted by 01RedDX


The model change from 5th gen to 6th gen was nearly identical as well, and it continued to be a top seller. Even faced with stiffer competition like this Elantra, I don't expect the Civic to disappear from the top bestsellers anytime soon.

As for Japanese car reliability, it's always been spotty for any models built outside of Japan.

I think you are thinking 6th (96-2000) and 7th (2001-2005)? Where they started to take the dbl wishbone out from the front? And the all look mostly identical?

Well, there wasn't any competition back then. Elantra is still shit. Protege is no threat and Mazda 3 didn't even show up til end of 7th gen cycle and domestics also posted no threats.

[heavyD]

Originally posted by Xtrema


I think you are thinking 6th (96-2000) and 7th (2001-2005)? Where they started to take the dbl wishbone out from the front? And the all look mostly identical?

Well, there wasn't any competition back then. Elantra is still shit. Protege is no threat and Mazda 3 didn't even show up til end of 7th gen cycle and domestics also posted no threats.

Forgot about the Mazda 3. Since replacing the Protege it's taken a dent out of Civic sales. Heck even Impreza's and Lancers have taken a bite out of the market. It's really crowded right now in the compact segment and the 2012 Civic is in danger of being lost in the crowd.

[A790]

Originally posted by Mitsu3000gt
Also, Lincoln is at the top because they do such a small volume, and most of them get driven like 2,000 km/year by seniors, so naturally they will break down less under such gentle and infrequent use. The one person I know personally with a Lincoln as a daily driver hates it, and it is in the shop constantly. I'm willing to bet Buick and Jaguar are near the top for similar reasons.
I don't agree with this. You honestly believe that people don't actually drive their Lincoln's, Buicks, or Jaguars? Let's have a look shall we...

Lincoln MKZ's for sale in Calgary: http://www.autotrader.ca/a/pv/Used/Lincoln/all/Lincoln+MKZ/?srt=3&lloc=Calgary&cty=Calgary&prv=Alberta&ctr=Canada&vpt=50.8519000273506%2c-114.471113982568%2c51.2381725156429%2c-113.655319163647%2c&prx=100

Coles notes:

+ Average number of KM's per year is about 18,000 km.

Buick Lucern's (new ones) for sale in Calgary: http://www.autotrader.ca/a/pv/Used/Buick/Lucerne/Buick+Lucerne/?cat2=7%2c11%2c9%2c10&prv=Alberta&r=20&rprv=True&srt=3&st=6

Coles notes:

+ Average number of KM's per year is about 22,000 km.

Jaguar XF: http://www.autotrader.ca/a/pv/Used/Jaguar/XF/all/?cty=Calgary&rcty=True&prv=Alberta&r=20&rprv=True

Coles notes:

+ Average number of KM's per year is 21,000 km.

:)

[Mitsu3000gt]

Originally posted by A790

I don't agree with this. You honestly believe that people don't actually drive their Lincoln's, Buicks, or Jaguars? Let's have a look shall we...

Lincoln MKZ's for sale in Calgary: http://www.autotrader.ca/a/pv/Used/Lincoln/all/Lincoln+MKZ/?srt=3&lloc=Calgary&cty=Calgary&prv=Alberta&ctr=Canada&vpt=50.8519000273506%2c-114.471113982568%2c51.2381725156429%2c-113.655319163647%2c&prx=100

Coles notes:

+ Average number of KM's per year is about 18,000 km.

Buick Lucern's (new ones) for sale in Calgary: http://www.autotrader.ca/a/pv/Used/Buick/Lucerne/Buick+Lucerne/?cat2=7%2c11%2c9%2c10&prv=Alberta&r=20&rprv=True&srt=3&st=6

Coles notes:

+ Average number of KM's per year is about 22,000 km.

Jaguar XF: http://www.autotrader.ca/a/pv/Used/Jaguar/XF/all/?cty=Calgary&rcty=True&prv=Alberta&r=20&rprv=True

Coles notes:

+ Average number of KM's per year is 21,000 km.

:)

I didn't say people don't drive them haha, all I'm saying is that I don't think they get driven nearly as much as other brands overall. A little bit of googling suggests the average Buick owner is 65. That supports what I have seen on the roads, for sure. Buick and Lincoln definitely appeal to the older crowds more-so than the younger ones. The Lincoln owner I know is in his 70's. His only buying criteria is that the car be a Lincoln haha. He also drives about 2000km/year. Obviously they aren't all like this, but I think overall, owners of those cars are older and drive less. I don't have time to find a bunch of articles, but I also don't think a few for-sale ads represent any company's customer's driving habits :).

[Xtrema]

Or to take it another way, low volume usually do better because the sample data is much smaller and the environment they ran in is narrower.

[Mitsu3000gt]

Originally posted by heavyD


The Civic will not disappear but it's days of sales domination are coming to an end. Honestly I don't see how anyone could purchase the 2012 Civic over the 2012 Focus unless you were a die hard Honda fan. As far as styling inside and out it's not even a fair comparison the Focus is so far ahead. More standard power and better transmission options in the Focus. Early tests are reporting that the Focus handles better than anything in the current compact market. Throw in that Ford is amongst the top in reliability and you would really have to be a close minded Honda fan to go with the Civic. Not even counting the Focus there are more compelling options such as the Elantra, Cruze and the market is much, much different from when it was at the time of the 5th/6th generations of Civic.

The new Focus looks good, but Honda still has the edge on build quality and resale. Also, people looking for cars who don't know anything usually head straight for Honda or Toyota, just because.

I don't necessarily disagree with you, but I don't think the Focus will be a no-brainer decision for most people shopping in the segment either.

As for the Cruze, if you were after the top-end one, they need to be discounted $5-6k to be competitive IMO. $32k is WAY too much.

[SilverRex]

Originally posted by Mitsu3000gt


The new Focus looks good, but Honda still has the edge on build quality and resale. Also, people looking for cars who don't know anything usually head straight for Honda or Toyota, just because.

I don't necessarily disagree with you, but I don't think the Focus will be a no-brainer decision for most people shopping in the segment either.

As for the Cruze, if you were after the top-end one, they need to be discounted $5-6k to be competitive IMO. $32k is WAY too much.

also there is something about the preception when one is seen driving a honda/toyota instead of a ford/chev

this preception will take many many years to change, until then, you will continue to get alot of no dd honda/toyota buyers, but I must admit, ford is doing a good job with their line up.

[heavyD]

Originally posted by SilverRex

also there is something about the preception when one is seen driving a honda/toyota instead of a ford/chev


Really? Perception amongst who? Car fanatics and fanboys? The average person couldn't give two shits if you drive an Accord or a Taurus. I have never, ever seen a person come out of a Honda that I would have thought differently if they got out of a Ford/GM.

[Jeremiah]

I drove the Sonata and I loved it - My mom has an 08 Accent, and its a bag of shit - hate it.

Genesis was a hoot too.

Hyundai and Kia are both heading in the right direction, whereas Honda and Toyota have taken a step back from quality, features and competitive pricing.

[SilverRex]

Originally posted by heavyD


Really? Perception amongst who? Car fanatics and fanboys? The average person couldn't give two shits if you drive an Accord or a Taurus. I have never, ever seen a person come out of a Honda that I would have thought differently if they got out of a Ford/GM.

well if you have 'that' perception you would have bought a honda/toyota, clearly you are not in that catagory, hence your emotions towards my statement is understandable.

most people who buy civic/accord and in masses, will continue to believe nothing compares, they walk into dealerships without really cross shopping other competitive models.

I must admit, a decade ago, it was a no brainer and a wise choice given its reliability reputation, but sadly, we are right in the middle of a cross road where nearly every manufacturer has caught up to a degree and some even exceeding it. That is fact, but the perception/reputation will take longer to shake off is what I am saying.

its like having the first impression on someone you just met, even if the individual proves you other wise, the initial imprint goes quite deep. you can almost use a similar saying that goes 'it takes 10 encouraging words to offset 1 negative comment"

it 'will' take some time before things really change, at the moment imports will continue to enjoy higher resell than domestic counterparts. tell me how long we have to wait until we see honda/toyota give 5000-8000 off incentive and ford/gm will not budge. --< thats the type of perception i am talking about.

[Guillermo]

hondas are way overpriced, i can't beleive people are willing to pay so much more for those than for hyundai.

[heavyD]

Originally posted by SilverRex

it 'will' take some time before things really change, at the moment imports will continue to enjoy higher resell than domestic counterparts. tell me how long we have to wait until we see honda/toyota give 5000-8000 off incentive and ford/gm will not budge. --&lt; thats the type of perception i am talking about.

Things are already changing. The Elantra has been the best selling car in Canada since it was introduced in December. It didn't take long at all for Hyundai to top Honda nor will it take time for other manufacturers to surpass them with more attractive offerings. Consumers turned on domestics in the 90's and they are slowly turning on Honda and Toyota. Years ago many posters at this very site have been lamenting the bland, uninspired vehicles Toyota and Honda started to manufacture at their peak popularity. It seems we were just ahead of the curve and now we are starting to see them losing their grip to the competition. 10-15 years ago when you mentioned Honda or Toyota the first thing people thought of was 'innovative' and 'quality'. For the better part of last decade that had changed to 'boring' and 'overpriced'.

[treg50]

Originally posted by heavyD
Things are already changing. The Elantra has been the best selling car in Canada since it was introduced in December....
Since "December"? 3 or 4 months? I know you're trying to imply that this means something amazing, but really it doesn't say anything at all concrete. It's off to a decent start --- maybe a combination of decent price + a pretty exterior but it has a quite a way to go yet. At the very least the Elantra, like the Cruze and Focus, is a welcomed 'improved' competitor to stir things up and give us consumers more to consider... whether they are or aren't a serious longterm contender is another question. I for one am looking forward to the Focus and Cruze making their impact.

On a seperate note, another fact of reality people need to accept: the Honda Civic is #1.

Globe and Mail - today March 2011
Honda’s Civic took the sales race prize last year selling 57,501 units, followed the Mazda3 at 47,740, the Toyota Corolla with 38,680 and Hyundai’s Elantra with 35,556.
It's not an opinion, it's a fact.

[Xtrema]

Originally posted by treg50
It's not an opinion, it's a fact.

That's against the old gen Elantra, Corolla. But new gen Mazda 3.

But I have to say the SE model of Civic is priced and optioned quite aggressively against Elantra.

And I don't doubt the dominance will continue for a year for the reps to build up for Elantra/Focus/Cruz.

[heavyD]

Originally posted by treg50

It's not an opinion, it's a fact.

Good thing we are discussing 2012 sales or you may have a point. You are going to have to come to grips that your beloved brand is on the decline.

[SilverRex]

Originally posted by heavyD


Things are already changing. The Elantra has been the best selling car in Canada since it was introduced in December. It didn't take long at all for Hyundai to top Honda nor will it take time for other manufacturers to surpass them with more attractive offerings. Consumers turned on domestics in the 90's and they are slowly turning on Honda and Toyota. Years ago many posters at this very site have been lamenting the bland, uninspired vehicles Toyota and Honda started to manufacture at their peak popularity. It seems we were just ahead of the curve and now we are starting to see them losing their grip to the competition. 10-15 years ago when you mentioned Honda or Toyota the first thing people thought of was 'innovative' and 'quality'. For the better part of last decade that had changed to 'boring' and 'overpriced'.

also while I dont have the numbers but I bet the resell continues to favor honda/toyota over ford/Hyundai/kia

again the same mentality of how most distinguish the brands remains and will continue to take many years to change. Even if Elantra sales go thru the roof I dont think it can break the backs of japanese imports. The scarcity of recent delay from japan will only cut down further incentive and enhance the resell sectors for all the japanese auto maker.

Dont get me wrong, for the price, the Elantra got me thinking too, beside who to say Honda/Toyota wont fight back.

There be definitely some interesting debate over the coming years.

[treg50]

Originally posted by heavyD
we are discussing 2012 sales
Originally posted by Xtrema
That's against the old gen Elantra, Corolla. But new gen Mazda 3.

But I have to say the SE model of Civic is priced and optioned quite aggressively against Elantra.

And I don't doubt the dominance will continue for a year for the reps to build up for Elantra/Focus/Cruz.
My point exactly. Honda, Toyota, Mazda have been doing it, and doing it well for decades. Hyundai's quality is just joining the party now (in the last year or two) in some categories, which is understandable.

I don't mind comparing current gen vs. last gen vs. next gen. It's an accepted practice of comparing cars for whatever reason, I didn't invent it. Manufacturers take turns benefiting and suffering by it. Discussing a 2012 model's sales from December 2010 to March 2011 makes no difference. It goes up against whatever competition is already there. Those figures are also justly compared to the year before. Sure, it makes Honda, Toyota (minus last years millions of recalls), and Mazda look better than hyundai but what can you do? It shouldn't be a problem for anyone but an ignorant hyundai fanboy. Just because the facts don't suit a hyundai fanboy's argument doesn't mean it's ignorable to everyone else with common sense and concerns about longterm quality.

Let's what happens in 12 months when there's actually 12 months of figures and quality measurements. I'm hoping that the Focus, cruze, and elantra aren't just pretty flashes in the pan and can maintain their quality levels.

[clem24]

I think the Elantra deserves what it's getting.

I generally agree with everything that's being said, but man oh man, that article screams big time corporate propaganda. And whatever the hell happened to PROOF READING... :nut:

[SilverRex]

I did my own version of comparo and pitted against toyota/honda/hyundai/kia/subaru/mitsubishi together.

I had broken down each class by SUV/small car/hatch/sedan.

and just to look at the SUV class since calgary weather warrants alot of buyers in this catagory,

I was suprised to find that the Venza and Rav 4 to be the choice in the SUV catagory.

I take into account the 2011 JDpower realibility ranking, performence output, gas mileage per tank, consumption, cargo space both rear seats up and down, price range and even the lease rate.

How I rate them was, if its above average it gets a +1, if its at the top of its class it gets a +2, vice versa for negative comparison amongst each other.

Yes the Toyota Rav4/Venza stood out. Is it no wonder resells are high and imports may very well continue to attract buyer who uses my approach in selecting their vehicle of course.

Just saying that Toyota is here to stay, others like Hyundai/kia or even ford will catch up, I dont think the new era will be dominated by any lone manufacturer anymore.

the resell is a huge component for a large group of buyers simply because if you ran into an accident and wrote your car off 2 years later and if your not covered properly, the insurance company will pay out what its worth based on blackbook or the going resell. Thats when you will learn a very hard lesson of not buying an import just because you get a bit more for your money up front.

people dont just buy a car and look at the specs on paper, smart buyers usually look at a 10 year span, maintenance cost, resell, reliability, etc

Hyundai and Kia still has a question mark regarding very long term reliability.

that is why I say the word the perceptions that import is the way to go continues to affect buyers for many more years to come.

Did I not tell you the story that my dad who lives in Vancouver leased a Kia rio a few years back, initially it perform as expected but after 3 years, both the hp and mileage of the car suddenly dropped significantly. Go figure