W5 Undercover probe of Canadian Garages

[friedn00dles]

Don't know if anyone has seen this or if it's a repost but anyways, it s a good watch as Calgary was one of the 2 cities to be tested.

And of course Canadian tire is always a FAIL! **well not always but a 2/3 tested did fail **


http://www.ctv.ca/CTVNews/TopStories/20110408/w5-the-mechanic-110409/


Calgary Results - > http://www.ctv.ca/generic/WebSpecials/pdf/APACalgarysurveyresults.pdf

Toronto Results - > http://www.ctv.ca/generic/WebSpecials/pdf/APACalgarysurveyresults.pdf

[Idratherbsidewayz]

I dunno, I feel like more tests would have to be done to properly judge shops as it depends on the mechanic on duty. Of course, I wouldn't take my car to even one of the places listed.

[Jeremiah]

Fuck thats brutal, for a loose battery terminal, paying a couple hundred bucks

[lilmira]

I'm not so surprised at the number of fails but the fact that almost all of them didn't bother to do anything but denial after they are busted is kinda frightening.

[Sugarphreak]

...

[crapstixs]

this time around it was much more fair. last time they found some flat out crooked shops and painted the whole industry with the same brush. this time the shops who deserved to be slammed got it. I guess w5 dosent like to be sued. I like these things, it could be better but I think it exposes some real problems in the industry that need to be fixed. the asian service writer from active green and ross was so bad it was painfull to watch.

guess who was the one that found the problem in 30 seconds :bigpimp:

[Guillermo]

LOL @ the massive FAIL at all of these shops. really, this is a 5 second fix... should be done for free as a courtesy to the customer. I see how Delta was honest but still charging for labor. IMO, diagnosis should be free. that's how my family's shop has done it since 1958, anyhow.

[crapstixs]

Originally posted by Guillermo
LOL @ the massive FAIL at all of these shops. really, this is a 5 second fix... should be done for free as a courtesy to the customer. I see how Delta was honest but still charging for labor. IMO, diagnosis should be free. that's how my family's shop has done it since 1958, anyhow.
diagnosis should not be free at all. so what happens when a shop spends hours in figgering out a problem and the falty part is like $50 you would be out of business so fast.

[bituerbo]

Originally posted by crapstixs
guess who was the one that found the problem in 30 seconds :bigpimp:

Are you the Fountain Tire tech that inspected this vehicle?

[friedn00dles]

Agree with Guillermo,

My Mechanic has done numerous Diagnosis's on my old civic's without charging a cent. I paid for the work completed and i have always referred business over to him.

[crapstixs]

it depends on the problem. guy come in with a check engine light. code is for a larg evap leak. gas cap was not on right, took like ten min. yes let that one be a free. but there are other ones that are very very different. a month ago or so I had a grad prix come in that would randomly stall. no codes, all pid's looked good. it took me six hours to find the maf that would randomly command full voltage at idle and stall the engine out. should that be free? I spent the latter part of a day to call a $300 maf. we ended up charging him 2-3 hours, that is way more than fair. the guy at delta is going to do good from this, but keep in mind he is a one man show. its just him, there is only so much he can do by himself untill he has to hire people and raise his rates. also this w5 thing might be a cures to him. hes really cheap now people know, that attracts all of the cheap cunts, and the give me shit for free people.

[max_boost]

So much fail at some of these shops!

Good for you crapstixs, well done haha

[crapstixs]

Originally posted by max_boost
So much fail at some of these shops!

Good for you crapstixs, well done haha
thank you! my boss was the happiest one in our shop.

[Guillermo]

Originally posted by crapstixs

diagnosis should not be free at all. so what happens when a shop spends hours in figgering out a problem

that's part of the cost of doing business. that's what i figger, anyhow.


Originally posted by crapstixs
and the falty part is like $50 you would be out of business so fast.

as you know, you're telling this to someone who is a third-gen mechanic, and whose family shop has been in the same location since 1958.

[max_boost]

^^

Time is money. Depending on the issue at hand IMO, figure it out fast, no need to charge. If it takes hours, then got to charge something.

[ddduke]

what shop are you at Guillermo?

[A790]

Originally posted by Guillermo
that's part of the cost of doing business. that's what i figger, anyhow.

That's just poor business sense.

A reasonable person would have no problems paying for a diagnostic that took several hours to show what the problem was. That's part of the cost of owning a vehicle.

I mean, it's nice to be able to provide some services free to your customers, but that doesn't mean it makes sense.

Also, being a third generation mechanic is awesome. What does that have to do with running a business?

[luxor]

Originally posted by Guillermo


that's part of the cost of doing business. that's what i figger, anyhow.



as you know, you're telling this to someone who is a third-gen mechanic, and whose family shop has been in the same location since 1958.

Free diagnostics right? Yeah we'll see how long that lasts. Post the name of your shop and offer Beyond members alone free diagnostics and we'll see how long you last until you start charging too.

[J-hop]

Originally posted by crapstixs

diagnosis should not be free at all. so what happens when a shop spends hours in figgering out a problem and the falty part is like $50 you would be out of business so fast.

agreed, in no way should diagnosis be free. The problem is the one that would end up biting the bullet would be the tech. Especially if the tech is paid based on piece work and not on a flat hourly (don't even know if many shops do a flat rate). Why should a tech waste their time doing a free diagnosis they aren't going to make any money on when they could be making money doing something else. And as Crapstixs said sometimes it can take quite a while to diagnose a car, guaranteed a dealer wouldn't pay a tech for more than a half hour worth of work to diagnose a car. Techs have to make money too right?

[Graham_A_M]

Gullermo; There is being kind, then there is being a fool that works for free needlessly, I think you're fixated on the latter.
Hey if I knew you guys had free diagnostics; next time my car was acting funny I'd have you guys isolate the problem, then i'd come back to grab my car and fix it myself.
Unfair as that is for you guys; from a customer perspective that's hard on cash that makes perfect sense.

All that list does is confirm just how much Canadian tire is a joke. modifying inspection reports in the pending investigation? If I ever caught that as a service manager there would be a number of people packing up their tool boxes & cleaning out their desks the next day

[Rat Fink]

.

[Jeremiah]

G. What shop does your Fam own?

[Guillermo]

it's in the states. i guess i don't know the details of what they charge for diagnosis, since i haven't worked there since '97. i was mainly basing my comments on the fact that we do tons of minor repairs like lightbulbs, etc. for free (that battery cable would've been fixed at no charge, e.g.), and people have picked up cars without getting repaired and don't pay for the diagnosis. we also lose money on GOFs (grease oil filter). and yet, when my dad died a few months back, we had customers there who were in their 80s or even 90s, saying how they've been coming since the 60s when my grandpa ran it. :dunno:

[crapstixs]

you have no idea how much has changed over the last 14 years. you relize that some light bulbs are like $7 and take ove a half hour to replace. that is not somthing your going to give away. the small stuff is what will kill your business. you bother me because you post this shop is a scammer and that shop ripped this guy off, and act like your super tech that has been in the industry for ever. yet you havent even worked in a shop in 14 years. I rember in a different thread you indirectly called me a con and a hack, and said how good a tech is, is not based on how productive he is. so, now im LOL at you.

[Guillermo]

Originally posted by crapstixs
you have no idea how much has changed over the last 14 years. you relize that some light bulbs are like $7 and take ove a half hour to replace. that is not somthing your going to give away. the small stuff is what will kill your business. you bother me because you post this shop is a scammer and that shop ripped this guy off, and act like your super tech that has been in the industry for ever. yet you havent even worked in a shop in 14 years. I rember in a different thread you indirectly called me a con and a hack, and said how good a tech is, is not based on how productive he is. so, now im LOL at you.

:facepalm:

i was in teh shop when i was home last december, and watched my dad give away and install a free headlight. (I think that was actually a $30 light, at our shop rate which is doubled). he said "merry christmas" to the customer. maybe you should stop trying to argue with me (some random guy on the internet) and focus on your own "real" life. YES, we DO give away free shit. all the time. we even let customers who can't afford it make payments over time. have we been burned? of course. but in the long run, it's the return customers that make your business successful. anyhow, i don't need to argue with some random idiot on the internet, when i can go to the brick and mortat shop that's been there since 1958. :facepalm:

are you going to make some more jokes about my dead parents now?

[Toma]

Originally posted by Guillermo
LOL @ the massive FAIL at all of these shops. really, this is a 5 second fix... should be done for free as a courtesy to the customer. I see how Delta was honest but still charging for labor. IMO, diagnosis should be free. that's how my family's shop has done it since 1958, anyhow.

Word....

If a customer rolls in and the mechanics spots an easy 30 second fix, a :thumbsup: for just sending the customer on their way.

You don't HAVE to, but it is a cool thing to do.

Other posters that MIS UNDERSTOOD this guys post, he never said diagnosis should be free. Especially if it is lengthy, he clearly states "really, this is a 5 second fix... should be done for free as a courtesy to the customer."

and what kind of mechanics are ythey if someone complains of a intermittent no start, and the FIRST thing you forget to do is wiggle the battery terminals???

[crapstixs]

Originally posted by Guillermo




are you going to make some more jokes about my dead parents now?
possibly.

[Toma]

Originally posted by Guillermo


:facepalm:

i was in teh shop when i was home last december, and watched my dad give away and install a free headlight. (I think that was actually a $30 light, at our shop rate which is doubled). he said "merry christmas" to the customer. maybe you should stop trying to argue with me (some random guy on the internet) and focus on your own "real" life. YES, we DO give away free shit. all the time. we even let customers who can't afford it make payments over time.

My GF works at a cool place in town where the owner is JUST like that. She is often astonished when he helps out someone with a quick freebie, or boost, or some other thing he was not 'supposed' to do.

My dad is also a regular at another place for the last 10 + years BECAUSE the owner treats his customers the same way. Stupid "little things", are either free or ridiculous cheap.

[max_boost]

Originally posted by Toma


Word....

If a customer rolls in and the mechanics spots an easy 30 second fix, a :thumbsup: for just sending the customer on their way.

You don't HAVE to, but it is a cool thing to do.

Other posters that MIS UNDERSTOOD this guys post, he never said diagnosis should be free. Especially if it is lengthy, he clearly states "really, this is a 5 second fix... should be done for free as a courtesy to the customer."

and what kind of mechanics are ythey if someone complains of a intermittent no start, and the FIRST thing you forget to do is wiggle the battery terminals???

OK fair enough. I guess I have my own little story too.

I needed to get my fog lights installed on my SLK and Hyatt Mercedes quoted me 1 hour labor ($125). Flat rate, had to remove the bumper etc. It just seemed expensive so I said no.

I took the car to Mike at Integra Tire and he had it done in less than 5 minutes and that includes pulling the car in and out of the bay. I know I'm a regular there but that's cool. Straight up.

[crapstixs]

Originally posted by Toma


Word....

If a customer rolls in and the mechanics spots an easy 30 second fix, a :thumbsup: for just sending the customer on their way.

You don't HAVE to, but it is a cool thing to do.

Other posters that MIS UNDERSTOOD this guys post, he never said diagnosis should be free. Especially if it is lengthy, he clearly states "really, this is a 5 second fix... should be done for free as a courtesy to the customer."

and what kind of mechanics are ythey if someone complains of a intermittent no start, and the FIRST thing you forget to do is wiggle the battery terminals???

see that is the whole point of the w5 thing, create a problem with a very simple fix and see what mechanics do. no shop is going to charge to actualy tighen the cable, they charge to find the loose cable. it was a massive fail for 22 shops in canada because that is something that should have been found, and been found in a few minuits. from what i took away from guillermo's post is diagnostics should be free. and thats just crazy talk. and keep in mind it depends on what type of customer you are depends on how much free shit you get. if you have been going to one shop for a long time there going to get services cheaper or free. hence why Guillermos shop gives away more things because they have long time customers. but if some randome person walks in and demands free shit, its not going to happen.

Guillermo, I really dont have that much of a problem with you. you just rubbed me the wrong way a few times.

[Guillermo]

i should also like to point out that our good friend TomcoPDR fixed the small dent in my car for FREE as well. granted, it was a quick job, but we did donate $100 to charity, and i will most certainly do any of my future PDR work with him - and would highly recommend him to anyone else needing PDR, just as I am doing here.

TomcoPDR really has the same business philosophy as my family does... unfortunately, this is something that is sorely lacking at most shops these days.

[Kloubek]

Giving a "quick fix" away often results in someone being a loyal customer in the future. There is one shop (Our Mechanic) which I will exclusively use thanks to a good experience.

As for Canadian Tire fucking up... man, I'm shocked!

[dj_rice]

LOL @ Franklin Canadian Tire getting busted. I've dealt with that service advisor before :rofl:

[johnboy27]

Originally posted by Guillermo
i should also like to point out that our good friend TomcoPDR fixed the small dent in my car for FREE as well. granted, it was a quick job, but we did donate $100 to charity, and i will most certainly do any of my future PDR work with him - and would highly recommend him to anyone else needing PDR, just as I am doing here.

TomcoPDR really has the same business philosophy as my family does... unfortunately, this is something that is sorely lacking at most shops these days.
That philosophy would keep me coming back if I needed work. I do 99% of y own work because shops in Red Deer are so greasy. I do have a tire shop I deal with here in Innisfail that I will always recommend friends to and always have my tires installed at.

[xxviet]

the guy in the back ground picture holding the wrench looks like mario :clap:

[ExtremeSi]

Originally posted by dj_rice
LOL @ Franklin Canadian Tire getting busted. I've dealt with that service advisor before :rofl:

I used to work in the parts dept there and I never liked that service manager. He's been there forever and is just scum. They need to overhaul that whole place. He was the quickest one in the video to say "no comment". He's probably had lots of complaints over the years.

NEVER take your car to Canadian Tire. There were maybe 2-3 honest mechanics I knew when I worked there, but the rest are sketchy. You never know who is going to work on your car and you'll get raped with charges regardless.

[962 kid]

Originally posted by Toma


Word....

If a customer rolls in and the mechanics spots an easy 30 second fix, a :thumbsup: for just sending the customer on their way.

You don't HAVE to, but it is a cool thing to do.

Other posters that MIS UNDERSTOOD this guys post, he never said diagnosis should be free. Especially if it is lengthy, he clearly states "really, this is a 5 second fix... should be done for free as a courtesy to the customer."

and what kind of mechanics are ythey if someone complains of a intermittent no start, and the FIRST thing you forget to do is wiggle the battery terminals???

:werd:

[jsn]

It wasn't on that list, but back when I had my mr2, I brought it into charlesglen toyota and they recommended that I replace all the struts on the car because they were worn. The struts were replaced just the previous year. This was when I first bought the car and the previous owner had receipts for the work done just the previous year. :thumbsdow

There should be a thread stickied on beyond somewhere for local mechanics/garages that are honest and do a good job. I might have missed it but what shop do you work at crapstixx?

[dj_honda]

Originally posted by dj_rice
LOL @ Franklin Canadian Tire getting busted. I've dealt with that service advisor before :rofl:

That guy is such a tool. I've had to deal with him twice ever, because my parents were in a rush and sent their vehicles there. The first time they did exactly the same thing in the video, new spark plugs and a new battery, because the car wouldn't start. The funny thing was, the car still wouldn't start after, so me and my dad had to sit there and tell him we aren't paying for his fucking quad pronged bosch $80 spark plugs when the oem Denso ones were fine from toyota. And that was 10 years ago. Ended up being a new distributor, from pick n pull no less, for $10 bucks, a new cap and rotor for another $30, solved the problem. Doing this in -30C when the shop should have figured it out....I'll never forget that.

This most recent one, my moms van's ps pump stopped working and me being in school I couldn't fix it for her within the time needed. They ended up changing the rack, the pump, and also wanted to change the front brakes and tires as well. Also what was funny was, they wanted to change the reservoir with the pump! I was on the phone arguing with this guy, on why the reservoir would ever need to be changed if it wasn't leaking! Finally they dropped some of their bs shop charges and cut the labour because their original quote was so far off the actual cost. The tires too, it was funny....he wanted me to change them, not because of treadwear, but because the steel belts were offset or some shit, but when I mentioned they were Motomaster or whatever, and they should be under warranty, he backed right the fuck off and wanted a receipt.

This is why everyone should take the time to at least be somewhat educated in the basics of car repair. Just so they aren't screwed by the mechanics for stupid shit. I've had to slowly teach my gf's parents not to run to the mechanic right away...

[dj_honda]

Oh and shaz at delta has always been good to me. I never have taken a car there, but have often had him do random shit like press in a bearing or whatever, that I don't have the equipment for. Always good work and a fair price.

[Mitsu3000gt]

I've never paid for diagnostics. I don't think it should be a charged item either because how long it takes depends on far too many things, including the competency of the mechanic. It would also be way too easy to just tell the customer it took way longer than expected to diagnose and tack on an extra couple hundred bucks.

I've seen shops that do and shops that don't, I don't deal with the ones that charge for diagnostics when others will do it for free.

George @ Tune Dub has never charged me for diagnostics, best service out there IMO.

[crapstixs]

tune dub is the first shop I have ever heard of that dosent charge for diagnostics. shit, im going to take my car there and get it looked at for free then fix it my self. if you call around and ask for free diagnostics you will get laughed at alot.
most techs in this trade are paid flat rate or some sort of commission, so now your boss starts giving away money off your pay cheque. im sure that will go over good.

[Mitsu3000gt]

Originally posted by crapstixs
tune dub is the first shop I have ever heard of that dosent charge for diagnostics. shit, im going to take my car there and get it looked at for free then fix it my self. if you call around and ask for free diagnostics you will get laughed at alot.
most techs in this trade are paid flat rate or some sort of commission, so now your boss starts giving away money off your pay cheque. im sure that will go over good.

Paying for diagnostic time is so incredibly subjective I don't know how anyone can charge for it. Sure, it's their time, but it would be SO EASY to take advantage of customers, or simply pay 10X the cost because the mechanic took longer than necessary to find the problem because he was inexperienced.

I'd rather they make up for it with having a higher labor rate, because each job has a set labor rate attached to it. That way, the shop has incentive to find the problem as fast as possible which is a win/win scenario - customer is less likely to get screwed, and the shop can move more cars though. If there is a problem, I'd rather pay a premium on labor for the work actually being done rather than have someone charge me $100/hr for 5 hours only to realize the problem is a $10 fix or something because of their incompetence.

[crapstixs]

incompentent techs get fired, and incompetent shops go out of business. as what was seen a few years ago when the auto industry was crashing. that cleaned up alot of garbage in the industry.
there is a degree of honisty and decernment involved here. if you feel your getting ripped off, tell the shop to stop and go elsewere. the shop cant just charge what ever they feel like. you have to back up your charges and have proof.
like what i was saying befor people will milk free diagnosics. get the shop to tell you whats wrong with it then they will fix it them selfs. when your fridge breaks, and its a $10 part you still get charged for a service call and labour. why would a car be any different? do you go to superstore and demand free food? do computer repair places diagnose your computer problems for free? why would mechanics be any different.

[Mitsu3000gt]

Originally posted by crapstixs
incompentent techs get fired, and incompetent shops go out of business.

I'm pretty sure there are still shady shops still operating :). Lots of people are trusting and will just pay whatever the bill is, even if it took some incompetent mechanic 10 hours to find the problem. The bad shops probably just make money off of less customers because they get more out of them.

This news article also suggests incompetent techs do not get fired, and incompetent shops do not go out of business. Whether they are intentionally bending the customer over or are just retarded, it really makes no difference.

Anyways, the fact is the best service in town is available with free diagnostics, so it doesn't really matter what other shops are doing in my case :D .

[crapstixs]

concidering w5 has been sued a few times for being shady them selfs. belive me incompent techs do get fired, and shops do go out of business. ive see it many many times.
on a side note though, many shops including mine. if you come in for a brake check it will be $60, but lets say you need front pads and rotors and you get the shop to do the brake job, they will not charge you the $60 inspection fee. if you just take the car back and dont get the job done you pay the $60. if you come in and say my engine runs rough and stalls, that is very different.