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three33
01-14-2004, 02:37 PM
I went to Mcdonalds the other day for lunch and out of curiosity asked the cashier what the starting wage is there...she told me it used to be $8-9 bucks per hour but now she said they are starting newbies off at $10..I was like holey crap Im quitting my normal job and working there.I guess its cause its kind of a shitty job but whatever..you work at Mcdonalds for a year and anyone will hire you....my buddies sister started working there when she was 14....5 years later she was manager making 20 bucks an hour...crazy crazy

BloNdie
01-14-2004, 02:50 PM
Do you really wanna work there for 5 years just to make 20 bucks an hour. go to schoooool for 5 years and make alot more in a more respectable job. thats my advice!
I worked there for 3 months in the summer between grade 10 and 11 and only made $6.25

RX-7_TWINTURBO
01-14-2004, 02:52 PM
when i was 14 i worked at McDonalds and got paid a wopping $4.25/hr to start

roopi
01-14-2004, 02:55 PM
Originally posted by BloNdie
go to schoooool for 5 years and make alot more in a more respectable job. thats my advice!

sounds pretty easy. :thumbsdow

lint
01-14-2004, 03:25 PM
If you stick around and make it to management at McD's, it's a pretty nice gig. This girl I knew in univ started working there at $3.25/hr or something crazy like that, and worked her way up to management. Decent wage, but there were alot of perks. Like all expenses paid trips to Hambuger U, good beneftis and a wicked stock purchase plan (buy at something like 50% of market, so you double your money right off the bat).

CRX-R
01-14-2004, 03:28 PM
Originally posted by RX-7_TWINTURBO
when i was 14 i worked at McDonalds and got paid a wopping $4.25/hr to start

I can validate this one! Cheap bastards

three33
01-14-2004, 03:29 PM
but you think about going to school for 5 years and then you have all that debt to pay off when you can work for 5 years...become manager....and pretty much get a job anywhere you want after that....

lint
01-14-2004, 03:39 PM
Originally posted by three33
but you think about going to school for 5 years and then you have all that debt to pay off when you can work for 5 years...become manager....and pretty much get a job anywhere you want after that....

Depends on what you're looking for. Schooling is not always a means to a management job. It should also be about learning, personal development and enrichment.
Another thing to consider is that if you had gone to school for those 5 years, you will most likely also have much more room for advancement. Not saying that there aren't still opportunities to work your way up from the mail room these days, but it's getting harder and harder, when more and more people are educated and entering the work force.
The debt is something to consider. I'm still paying mine off, but I wouldn't trade it for flipping burgers for 5 years instead.

richardchan2002
01-14-2004, 03:41 PM
I heard that when McDonalds was actually doing well, the managers with stock options all became millionaires...

Goes to show that if you're in the right place at the right time, anything can happen.

Super_Geo
01-14-2004, 03:46 PM
Originally posted by three33
but you think about going to school for 5 years and then you have all that debt to pay off when you can work for 5 years...become manager....and pretty much get a job anywhere you want after that....

Yeah but on average people with university degrees make more money then people with high school diplomas. Not a lot of jobs out there that pay over $100,000 and require only a high school diploma. Also... you do a lot more of everything but studying at university. It's pretty fucking fun... I'd much rather be in university than have 9-5. There's the rest of life for working.

ryder_23
01-14-2004, 03:47 PM
^
I just learned in economics that mcdonalds stocks are starting to drop..:dunno:

rage2
01-14-2004, 03:51 PM
Originally posted by BloNdie
Do you really wanna work there for 5 years just to make 20 bucks an hour. go to schoooool for 5 years and make alot more in a more respectable job. thats my advice!
Sucker! :rofl:

Ask all the university grads where they're working today. You'll be surprised!

I personally know 6 ppl with degrees in the restaurant industry. And I don't know many people heh.

EK 2.0
01-14-2004, 03:57 PM
Originally posted by rage2

Sucker! :rofl:

Ask all the university grads where they're working today. You'll be surprised!

I personally know 6 ppl with degrees in the restaurant industry. And I don't know many people heh.


I know of three engineers who are selling Home Theatre...

three33
01-14-2004, 04:00 PM
wow..im just simply saying that it doesnt sound like a bad job for someone who needs one...I have a good job already...Mcdonalds is not an option for me....but for those who need something to get by on it wouldnt hurt to apply

BloNdie
01-14-2004, 04:10 PM
HAHAHA okay okay, i realize that just because you go to uni you don't automatically become a millionaire, but "i want to be the manager at mcdonalds in 5 years" probably isnt the best goal in life. But hey, if its as good a job as you all say then go for it if thats what you really want!

B17a
01-14-2004, 04:15 PM
Originally posted by richardchan2002
I heard that when McDonalds was actually doing well, the managers with stock options all became millionaires...

Goes to show that if you're in the right place at the right time, anything can happen.

I think that's more of an urban legend. Unless they're handing out stock options with a 10 cent strike price they won't be cashing in huge. Plus, when was the last time you saw a nice Benz or Bimmer in the parking lot of a McD's that wasn't a customers?:D

Super_Geo
01-14-2004, 04:16 PM
Originally posted by rage2

Sucker! :rofl:

Ask all the university grads where they're working today. You'll be surprised!

I personally know 6 ppl with degrees in the restaurant industry. And I don't know many people heh.

Well, my parents and their friends are all university grads, and they're all making six digit salaries :dunno:

BloNdie
01-14-2004, 04:24 PM
Originally posted by Super_Geo


Well, my parents and their friends are all university grads, and they're all making six digit salaries :dunno:


I think all they're saying is that a going to university doesnt ensure a good job and good money...sometimes it does, obviously in your families case, just not always.

Ajay
01-14-2004, 04:52 PM
People don't go to post secondary automatically thinking as soon as they get out they're gonna be rolling in the cash. Well most don't and I know I don't think that way.

A post secondary education simply provides a better chance of advancement. A high school diploma can only go so far, there are definetly exceptions to the this but patterns usually show that a person who holds some type of post secondary education has a better chance for advancement and placement.

I know a couple people who have degree's but aren't really doing anything with them. This one dude I know has a Mechanical Engineering degree and he ended up going back to the small town we grew up in to work in the lumber mill stacking lumber cause it's pretty good cash and he needs to pay off his loans. At the same time I know of people that graduated with sociology degrees who hold high management positions.

Alot of companies require specific education in order to work for them but alot don't.

Weapon_R
01-14-2004, 04:57 PM
Originally posted by three33
wow..im just simply saying that it doesnt sound like a bad job for someone who needs one...I have a good job already...Mcdonalds is not an option for me....but for those who need something to get by on it wouldnt hurt to apply

It isn't a bad job. In fact, they treat their employees exceptionally well. My sister worked there for a year while she was in grade 11 and they paid her reasonably well ($8/hr) and her schedule coincided with her schooling. Day shift employees have the potential to make even more.

Mcdonald's general managers make a very comfortable living. You have to remember that the revenues of each mcdonalds restaurant probably make most of the "nice" restaurants in Calgary look like pocket change. Revenues of over $20,000 in a single day were normal at the location where my sister was at. This necessitates a very important role for these managers, who must ensure that the success of these restaurants stays high. The manager at this particular location was able to put 3 of his children into post secondary (university) without forcing them to take out a single loan.

Team_Mclaren
01-14-2004, 05:16 PM
I worked at mcDicks for two years..... just quit last month..

Startin wages at different store is different, all depends on your store-manger. Before i quit i was a swing manger which i get 8/hr. started with $6 2 years ago.... A swing manger is as far as you'll go as a part time, full time u can go to second assistant. whihch gets about 2g/month. {from what i know:, from that point on to go any further, u haev to take some kinda course or something to go any further.

rage2
01-14-2004, 05:17 PM
Originally posted by Super_Geo
Well, my parents and their friends are all university grads, and they're all making six digit salaries :dunno:
Do they have a membership at the country and golf club too? :rofl:

Obviously there are exceptions, I mean you can't be a doctor or a lawyer without going to university (unless you're that dude in the Catch me if you can movie).

What I was trying to say is that for *MOST* people, university is really a waste of time. They go to university with an expectation that this super duper university education to be their ticket to a great job, money, etc. It's a myth... fueled by parents (especially asian parents), and they do it to get their kids to go to school so they can brag to their friends about how smart their kids are. After wasting 4 years of life and a mounting student loan debt, they're stuck working $10/hr as kitchen help because really, that's all you can get!

B17a
01-14-2004, 05:20 PM
Originally posted by rage2

It's a myth... fueled by parents (especially asian parents), and they do it to get their kids to go to school so they can brag to their friends about how smart their kids are.

:rofl: This my friends is the most accurate definition of asian parent behaviour I have ever seen! Hit the nail on the head!

Super_Geo
01-14-2004, 05:24 PM
Originally posted by rage2

Do they have a membership at the country and golf club too? :rofl:


No. They're asian... they pinch every penny ;) Must be something about the genes.


What I was trying to say is that for *MOST* people, university is really a waste of time. They go to university with an expectation that this super duper university education to be their ticket to a great job, money, etc. It's a myth... fueled by parents (especially asian parents), and they do it to get their kids to go to school so they can brag to their friends about how smart their kids are. After wasting 4 years of life and a mounting student loan debt, they're stuck working $10/hr as kitchen help because really, that's all you can get!

You can go through university without getting into debt at all. There are a lot of summer jobs that specifically hire university students. Shell, Esso, Husky etc all have summer student positions that pay $3000-4000 a month. The $12-16K you make during summer can knock out tuition and living expenses for the next year. Just don't own a car and you'll be fine.

A degree totally gives you an advantage in the working world though. I mean, it doesn't mean you're going to be rolling in the cash right away, but it does give you a much better chance to.

edit- there's also co-op programs too. A lot of people pay for their education and have money left over from their 12 or 18 month internships. And if you do well in your internship there's a well paying job waiting for you at the end.

CRX-R
01-14-2004, 05:24 PM
Little known fact about McDonald's. They actually run two businesses, first; Food Service, second; Real Estate. The are one of the largest land owners in the world. For one there is a McDonald's on every second corner in ever city in the world (well.. you know what I mean), Secondly they lease none of the properties... They own them all.. Thirdly all of their properties are high traffic and in demand! The head corporation owns a very large chunk of the highest traffic commercial real Estate in the world...

Weapon_R
01-14-2004, 06:24 PM
Originally posted by rage2

Do they have a membership at the country and golf club too? :rofl:

Obviously there are exceptions, I mean you can't be a doctor or a lawyer without going to university (unless you're that dude in the Catch me if you can movie).

What I was trying to say is that for *MOST* people, university is really a waste of time. They go to university with an expectation that this super duper university education to be their ticket to a great job, money, etc. It's a myth... fueled by parents (especially asian parents), and they do it to get their kids to go to school so they can brag to their friends about how smart their kids are. After wasting 4 years of life and a mounting student loan debt, they're stuck working $10/hr as kitchen help because really, that's all you can get!

I think that the real exception is people like you, who have landed great jobs without having to pursue a post secondary education. This exists for a few of us, but most would like something to actually improve the chances that their hard work will be recognized, and take precedence over other applicants.

Superesc
01-14-2004, 06:40 PM
University is good and all if you actually have a goal(doctor?) and a good market when you graduate, but if there's work opportunities offer to you before you graduate u should take it. You can always go back to school, but opportunities don't open itself often.

max_boost
01-14-2004, 06:55 PM
Originally posted by rage2

Sucker! :rofl:

Ask all the university grads where they're working today. You'll be surprised!

I personally know 6 ppl with degrees in the restaurant industry. And I don't know many people heh. :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: You might as well add my name to that list

Idratherbsidewayz
01-14-2004, 07:05 PM
Originally posted by rage2

Do they have a membership at the country and golf club too? :rofl:

Obviously there are exceptions, I mean you can't be a doctor or a lawyer without going to university (unless you're that dude in the Catch me if you can movie).

What I was trying to say is that for *MOST* people, university is really a waste of time. They go to university with an expectation that this super duper university education to be their ticket to a great job, money, etc. It's a myth... fueled by parents (especially asian parents), and they do it to get their kids to go to school so they can brag to their friends about how smart their kids are. After wasting 4 years of life and a mounting student loan debt, they're stuck working $10/hr as kitchen help because really, that's all you can get!

I disagree, for all types of engineering, you need some sort of university diploma. Id hope that its not possible for people to graduate from high school and start designing foundations for calgary's buildings...

pinoyhero
01-14-2004, 07:09 PM
It is a personal pride issue for sure but you can make a really decent living at McDs if your able to work your way up to store manager. I have heard you can get to more like 30/hour plus great benefits.

NickGT
01-14-2004, 07:26 PM
Originally posted by rage2

Do they have a membership at the country and golf club too? :rofl:

Obviously there are exceptions, I mean you can't be a doctor or a lawyer without going to university (unless you're that dude in the Catch me if you can movie).

What I was trying to say is that for *MOST* people, university is really a waste of time. They go to university with an expectation that this super duper university education to be their ticket to a great job, money, etc. It's a myth... fueled by parents (especially asian parents), and they do it to get their kids to go to school so they can brag to their friends about how smart their kids are. After wasting 4 years of life and a mounting student loan debt, they're stuck working $10/hr as kitchen help because really, that's all you can get!

This is true. I went to post secondary, took a condensed course at SAIT. I should have stayed home instead of spending the 13,500 on 12 networking courses which i aced. So now I'm an unemployed network technician. Having your ticket in something means fuck all unless you either have previous experience, know somebody already in the field that can hook you up, or you're somehow at the right place at the right time, good luck. I'm learning a trade now tho, making wicked cash, doing something I love, with no school. I think alot of people on here are in for a rude awakening when they find out all their work is for nothing. Best of luck to everyone.

Shaolin
01-14-2004, 07:33 PM
University degree pretty much gives you more negotiating power during interviews.. I thought I needed a degree to do what I do, next thing I know, I got an interview because one of my clients was the Accounting manager for Western Canada.. go figure.

A person with a degree does classify them as a smarter person than someone who doesn't have a degree.. Can't wait to finish mine though, bah.

kenny
01-14-2004, 07:48 PM
A university degree for the most part (IMO) is a waste of money. The direct costs (tuition, books, etc) alone make it very unattractive for most positions. There are of course exceptions. Then you gotta factor in the indirect costs such as the opportunity costs involved in getting a university degree. 4 - 5 years spent working towards a degree (all the while ramping up a huge debt). In those 4 - 5 years even with a weak sauce $20k / year job means you've missed out on $100k in wages. Add this to the $20k or so you've spent in tuition and books and you got yourself a tiny house or a really nice car :)

I think a degree is useless, but if you are an employer and want to prove me wrong, hire me. :rofl:

el_fefes
01-14-2004, 07:50 PM
University is a good thing...as long as u study something that has a market available after you're done. Which is not usually the case if u study something because you like it. You will definitely have a better chance of getting a job than if you only graduated from highschool...unless you have connections...connections will take you far.

Ajay
01-14-2004, 07:50 PM
Originally posted by Weapon_R


I think that the real exception is people like you, who have landed great jobs without having to pursue a post secondary education. This exists for a few of us, but most would like something to actually improve the chances that their hard work will be recognized, and take precedence over other applicants.

I agree.....nowdays it's tougher to find a good paying job with security unless you have some type of education. People that don't have that post secondary background who have excellent jobs....good for them but I would think Weapon R is right in saying those people are the exception.

I'm getting my university education because things I want to do in life require more technical knowledge than I can gain by just simply working. Hopefully when I graduate next year I'll be able to enter into a career that I'm aiming for. If not I'll work my way up...everyone does it.

pinoyhero
01-14-2004, 07:57 PM
Originally posted by kenny
A university degree for the most part (IMO) is a waste of money. The direct costs (tuition, books, etc) alone make it very unattractive for most positions. There are of course exceptions. Then you gotta factor in the indirect costs such as the opportunity costs involved in getting a university degree. 4 - 5 years spent working towards a degree (all the while ramping up a huge debt). In those 4 - 5 years even with a weak sauce $20k / year job means you've missed out on $100k in wages. Add this to the $20k or so you've spent in tuition and books and you got yourself a tiny house or a really nice car :)

I think a degree is useless, but if you are an employer and want to prove me wrong, hire me. :rofl:

OK I just want to make one quick comment on your argument. Basically youa re saying that the cost of a degree including opportunity cost is 120K. Fair enough, just to make things round and to give you benefit of the doubt lets call it 150K. So I go to school while you accumulate 150K. I get a job that pay 40K vs your 20K. After 7.5 years we are even (assuming I get no raise, this is far less liely to happen to me than it is to you as you are uneducated I am). Now after 7.5 years we are both ~30 years old. Given that on average people work until they are 60 thats another 30 years I'm making 20K more than you which equates to 600K not taking into account the time value of money and the fact that an educated individual will have far more opportunites in both quality and quantity. Moral of the story. Go to school!

pinoyhero
01-14-2004, 07:57 PM
Originally posted by dfgh
University is a good thing...as long as u study something that has a market available after you're done. Which is not usually the case if u study something because you like it. You will definitely have a better chance of getting a job than if you only graduated from highschool...unless you have connections...connections will take you far.

Connections will take you a long way but unless they are just amazing they will only get an uneducated person so far.

JAYMEZ
01-14-2004, 08:24 PM
I skipped alot of the reading , but did i just hear right.... working at Mcdonalds for 5 years is better than 5 years at Uni????

I think not! :thumbsdow

three33
01-14-2004, 08:24 PM
Too be truthful an ideal job would be truck driving...you get to travel north america for free pretty much and you role in close to $70grand per year and really your not home at all very much so all you need is a small apartment and save the rest and you'll be sitting quite pretty for a long time.....all you have to do is get a class 1 license....I've been thinking about it for a long time

three33
01-14-2004, 08:25 PM
and if you don't want to go to university which i know a lot of people dont unless you have a set goal....a job at mcdonalds would give you money to save and money to spend if your just starting out

C4S
01-14-2004, 08:27 PM
Originally posted by Super_Geo


Shell, Esso, Husky etc all have summer student positions that pay $3000-4000 a month. The $12-16K you make during summer can knock out tuition and living expenses for the next year. Just don't own a car and you'll be fine.


I am sure if a part-timer can make $16K in a Gas station in 3-4 months, no one will work as full time in Calgary ! :dunno:

I guess you guys are all young, and still "fantasy" how easy is making money !? :dunno:

Wake up kids ! :zzz: :zzz:

Altezza
01-14-2004, 08:31 PM
How much does a taxi driver make?? Doesn't take any education for that either. Just need to learn a map. If the cab has a navigation system, the guy doesn't need to know a thing except for how to count money. :D

Last time I was in TO, the taxi cab driver was wearing nice clothes, nice watch, nice glasses. And we started to chat about how he travels a lot for vacation, how he is planning on taking 3-4 months per year off to visit his grandkids in the US (and cuz he said he can afford to), and his bling home theatre he just setup. He's been a taxi driver all his life and claimed not to come from a wealthy family.

Also know a guy who delivers pizza for Domino's. Salary+tips is over $60k a year and he claims to report 80%+ of his tips, hehe.

Time for a career change!

szw
01-14-2004, 08:47 PM
Originally posted by C4S


I am sure if a part-timer can make $16K in a Gas station in 3-4 months, no one will work as full time in Calgary ! :dunno:

I guess you guys are all young, and still "fantasy" how easy is making money !? :dunno:

Wake up kids ! :zzz: :zzz:

I don't think he's talking about the gas stations

kenny
01-14-2004, 08:49 PM
Originally posted by pinoyhero


OK I just want to make one quick comment on your argument. Basically youa re saying that the cost of a degree including opportunity cost is 120K. Fair enough, just to make things round and to give you benefit of the doubt lets call it 150K. So I go to school while you accumulate 150K. I get a job that pay 40K vs your 20K. After 7.5 years we are even (assuming I get no raise, this is far less liely to happen to me than it is to you as you are uneducated I am). Now after 7.5 years we are both ~30 years old. Given that on average people work until they are 60 thats another 30 years I'm making 20K more than you which equates to 600K not taking into account the time value of money and the fact that an educated individual will have far more opportunites in both quality and quantity. Moral of the story. Go to school!

That example of mine was just a start. It takes you roughly 7 years before the university grad is back even with the person that just entered the workforce immediately. Now, armed with 7 years of experience that person MOST LIKELY has moved up in the ranks and acquired 7 years worth of experience. Search the job postings, many companies now acccept experience in lieu of degrees or certifications. Also, in 7 years it is not that hard to meet someone that can "hook you up" with a job. If after 7 years you do not develop yourself by meeting new contacts, and moving up from the first job you get then well of course that person deserves to make 20k / yr for the rest of their life.

Khyron
01-14-2004, 09:00 PM
Well I've done both - worked at McDicks for most of high school and during University. I have no complaints - as far as jobs go if you don't have skills, it's not bad at all. There's the whole "uncool" aspect, especially if school buddies come in - but keep the eye on the ball and you'll be the one laughing eventually. Managers make good money but are also expected to work 50+ hours so the hourly rate actually gets bad.

I got my degree but missed out on the internship programs - big mistake. Ended up doing tech support for Cadvision before working up the chain. A bit of luck got me a decent job - but I'd say my degree had almost nothing to do with it. It just shows the employer that a) You can set a goal and obtain it. b) You have at least some intelligence. c) You know at least some things outside your field. The larger companies filter out people that don't have one, so it's often just used to get your resume read.

Go to university if you have to (Doctor, Lawyer etc) otherwise do trade school and make better money. IT has been saturated with the pay-to-own diplomas and certs.

And smile when the fuckers that made fun of you working at McDondalds are now bagging your groceries.

Khyron

Weapon_R
01-14-2004, 09:04 PM
Originally posted by Altezza
How much does a taxi driver make?? Doesn't take any education for that either. Just need to learn a map. If the cab has a navigation system, the guy doesn't need to know a thing except for how to count money. :D

Last time I was in TO, the taxi cab driver was wearing nice clothes, nice watch, nice glasses. And we started to chat about how he travels a lot for vacation, how he is planning on taking 3-4 months per year off to visit his grandkids in the US (and cuz he said he can afford to), and his bling home theatre he just setup. He's been a taxi driver all his life and claimed not to come from a wealthy family.

Time for a career change!

The reason for this is because Taxi drivers do not have to pay taxes like the rest of the population. EVERY taxi driver claims less than actual, which means that they have a LOT more money to play with at the end of the year. As far as I know, Associated cab is installing navigation systems in all of their cabs, so there really won't even be a reason to read a map :)

NickGT
01-14-2004, 09:09 PM
not everyone can be a doctor, lawyer, rocket scientist. But there's nothing that says a cabby can't be a millionaire if he's a smart businessman, and can move the money properly :rofl: :rofl:

Sure he might not have the status of some prick in a suit. But do you think he cares when hes taking 3-4 months off. haha. We should all be so lucky heh. Doesn't matter what you do in life as long as your happy with the $$$.

Super_Geo
01-14-2004, 11:09 PM
Originally posted by C4S


I am sure if a part-timer can make $16K in a Gas station in 3-4 months, no one will work as full time in Calgary ! :dunno:

I guess you guys are all young, and still "fantasy" how easy is making money !? :dunno:

Wake up kids ! :zzz: :zzz:

Not at the pumps :poosie:

One of my housemates got the job for this summer with Shell. $13,000 for 4 months of work. They give him a company truck for the summer and he drives to the rigs and takes data (or something down those lines). Last summer I was making $3200/month for three months doing a summer internship. That paid for a year's tuition and half a year's worth of rent. The work wasn't too hard either. ;)

Ajay
01-15-2004, 05:21 PM
And those internships look good on resumes as well.

googe
01-15-2004, 05:49 PM
its funny how everyone is getting offended and taking a defensive position about their career path. anyone here who didnt get a degree says its a waste of time, everyone who did justifies why they got it. this is one of those arguments that wont go anywhere, neither side is going to concede to the other :)

btw, pinoyhero is fired

Khyron
01-15-2004, 06:08 PM
Originally posted by googe
its funny how everyone is getting offended and taking a defensive position about their career path. anyone here who didnt get a degree says its a waste of time, everyone who did justifies why they got it. this is one of those arguments that wont go anywhere, neither side is going to concede to the other :)

btw, pinoyhero is fired

Read the thread again - a lot of people WITH degrees are saying it's not worth it, and some who don't say they wish they had one.

Khyron

no_joke
01-15-2004, 07:02 PM
Originally posted by Super_Geo


Not at the pumps :poosie:

One of my housemates got the job for this summer with Shell. $13,000 for 4 months of work. They give him a company truck for the summer and he drives to the rigs and takes data (or something down those lines). Last summer I was making $3200/month for three months doing a summer internship. That paid for a year's tuition and half a year's worth of rent. The work wasn't too hard either. ;)

Sounds like its one of those engineering jobs... Should I have gone to some of those Job Fairs back in September?

benyl
01-15-2004, 07:59 PM
Originally posted by pinoyhero


Connections will take you a long way but unless they are just amazing they will only get an uneducated person so far.

It is never what you know... it is always who you know to get a good job. Otherwise it is luck or a job agent.

A University degree just proves to an employer that you can be taught something and finish it to the end.

People lie on the resumes all the time. Employers know that. Where I work, we do a lot of "try before you buy." We contract a person and get to know them for a couple of months. Most of the peeps with awesome education are the ones who don't know anything. Experience counts for a lot more than people give it credit, especially people in University.

I have a degree. The only thing I got out of it was a loan and wasted 4.5 years of my life.

And don't kid yourself you guys, entry level positions are hard to come by and usually pay less than $40K (just from my experience and what I see in the market right now).

Super_Geo
01-15-2004, 08:19 PM
Another reason for going to university (and I'm surprised no one's brought this up yet...) is that it's fun. I thought there'd be a lot more work than there really is.. and I didn't even expect there to be much work to being with. Nothing beats a life of partial responsibility. An hour or two of class a day, maybe a few hours of work, and the rest of the day is yours to do whatever you want. You can get a 4-8 person house with who you want to live with, getting drunk and getting stoned is no longer just a weekend thing, and going to classes is really more of a myth than a reality. Also everyone you end up knowing is within a 3 block radius cause of the student ghetto.

It's the freedom of living on your own with the fun of partying and living with your friends, and financial responsibility is really what you want it to be. Bust ass during summer and you'll be fine for the year, or if not just hit the parents up for cash because if they have the money there's no way they'll deny their kid a good education. If not, there's student loans and a line of credit. Also, summer jobs for students are slack and pay well.

Hell, I'd probably stay in university for a few victory laps if I could... but then everyone you went through school with would graduate and you'd have mounting debt.

There's the rest of your life for a 9-5. Why start now when you can be having fun and only have to 'work' a few hours a day? University won't benefit everyone... but if it's an option, I'd definatly say take it.

hockeybronx
01-15-2004, 09:02 PM
Dude McDonalds is the most trailer trash job in the world. Go to school and get the hell out of there. I think your wages are a little off. One guy I know started at $6.50 there and worked his way up to $7.00 in a year, and another guy I know manages the Midnapore McDonalds and he makes $10.00 an hour.

Get your ass back in school and forget about McDicks.

JAYMEZ
01-15-2004, 09:50 PM
LOL , ya you become fat and lazy , very unhealthy , you usually own your own truck and have to repair it all the time , tires cost like 2 grand each. You have to drive around with deadlines to make , its not so easy as you think.

BloodBaneZXY
01-16-2004, 12:57 AM
Get a job at Rona like me :P Start at 9.50 woop!

Shaolin
01-16-2004, 01:21 AM
one of the new guys on my soccer team i heard is a manager at mcdonalds, but i don't know for sure because i haven't asked.. seems like he's doing pretty well for himself.. he just bought a house and stuff.

ShOwOfF
01-16-2004, 01:46 AM
First of all lets begin with the $6.50/hr crew. Then you have the swing managers who are making in the ranges of $8-12/hr, then you have the assistant managers who are making upwards to $12-18/hr. From there you have a resturant manager who makes a salary in the range of $40k to 60k/year. Above resturant managers is administration of the franchisee or McDonald's Canada where salary starts at about $85k+. I know this because my dad is a consultant for McDonald's Canada. :)

SI-vic
01-16-2004, 02:28 AM
If you want to go to school, management is where its at.
This world will always need management.
I really wanted to do the CNT course at SaiT but I realized that the IT industry isnt very good right now, so I thought to myself, I better take the safe road and do some management.
Everyone needs accountants, managers, and etc.

No going to school will not ensure a great job after graduation, but it does help.
Working at McDonald's for 5years wont ensure you a great management job either.

But if you wanna make money,
Be an entrepenuer (sp?), thats where the BIG money is, but also you can also terribly fail at it too.

403Gemini
01-16-2004, 02:32 AM
managers almost anywhere make good money, its the fact of stickin it out that long to get that job... also its not the most respected job, but meh. money is money!

accordboi_02
01-16-2004, 03:36 AM
Originally posted by Super_Geo
Another reason for going to university (and I'm surprised no one's brought this up yet...) is that it's fun.

Well said!

I fall into the category of having a so-called "useless" degree, but lucking out in the job category... I've already had people with Engg degrees and MBAs ask me for a job!!

I would not trade my 4 years in Univ. for anything - the friends I've made, the connections, and just the learning itself... the money that I "could have" made instead just isn't worth it.

Yes, you can go to school later on in life, but by that time, you'll miss out on the whole "university experience"... you'll have many other responsibilities, and honestly, how fun do you think it can be if you're the only 30+ yr old in class full of 18 yr olds? Yeah, the view can be nice, but how many friends do you think you're going to make??

Also, as has been mentioned before, is the options that are open to a Univ. grad like myself. If I ever get tired of my job, or something happens, I can just go back to school, get a LLB or MBA or PhD... someone without does not have access to any of those options immediately.

When does the value of work experience end and education begin (or vice versa)? Someone who didn't get a degree can claim, say 6 years of work exp. I, on the other hand, can claim 4 years school and part-time work exp, and 2 years full-time work exp. If it ever ended up that we went for the same job, I would not only have references from people in the workforce, but I also have references from Doctors that I worked with in school... Personally, I think it would be a tough sell for someone to claim that their extra 4 years of full-time work have taught them much more than what I could offer... but in the end, to each their own. If you are happy with your life right now, why bother changing it??

:thumbsup:

TrevorK
01-16-2004, 10:07 AM
Originally posted by accordboi_02


When does the value of work experience end and education begin (or vice versa)? Someone who didn't get a degree can claim, say 6 years of work exp. I, on the other hand, can claim 4 years school and part-time work exp, and 2 years full-time work exp. If it ever ended up that we went for the same job, I would not only have references from people in the workforce, but I also have references from Doctors that I worked with in school... Personally, I think it would be a tough sell for someone to claim that their extra 4 years of full-time work have taught them much more than what I could offer... but in the end, to each their own. If you are happy with your life right now, why bother changing it??

:thumbsup:

That's you opinion and a generalization.

But for something like say IT, if someone has 6 years experience and you have 2 (Plus a Comp Sci degree), they are going to take the 6 year guy. Companies I've worked for in IT are like that (And I'm not talking mom and pop shops).

It's nice that you're confident in yourself, but if you're going up for a job that is attainable by someone who might not have the same university schooling (IT is one example) you'll be in for a surprise.

Shaolin
01-16-2004, 12:16 PM
I find that going to school was the key to network myself which resulted in the current job that I have.. I'm a finance major, worked as a computer consultant (still do) for the past 2 years and workin at freakin co-op because I couldn't find a job in the field of my studies.. went to school, met some new people who actually knew people in the industry and just so happens that they needed computer work done, and bam.. next week I was working for their company.

Never would I have gotten these contacts if I didn't go to school and network myself with people at school.. Now I have a good paying job in the field that I'm graduating in, and I have more clients for my side job..

GTS Jeff
01-16-2004, 05:27 PM
rage2, there is a difference between a plain old degree and a professional degree utilized with ambition.

Khyron
01-16-2004, 10:43 PM
Originally posted by TrevorK


That's you opinion and a generalization.

But for something like say IT, if someone has 6 years experience and you have 2 (Plus a Comp Sci degree), they are going to take the 6 year guy. Companies I've worked for in IT are like that (And I'm not talking mom and pop shops).

It's nice that you're confident in yourself, but if you're going up for a job that is attainable by someone who might not have the same university schooling (IT is one example) you'll be in for a surprise.

There is a magic number for experience in IT, and it happens to be around 3 years. If you have more, you will do well in the interview but you may not even make it past the "minimum" education filters. Equally - you have your degree with not enough experience, you'll have trouble finding a company take a risk. My intern worked for 4 months for free before we hired him on. And it still was a sacrafice on our part.

And since we're putting out generalized opinions, I'd wager the guy with the degree and 4 years experience stands a better chance at the IT job than someone with no education and 10 years experience. I know I've sure seen some 10+ year experience idiots working in IT.

Khyron

OPGForce
01-17-2004, 02:11 AM
Originally posted by Shaolin
I find that going to school was the key to network myself which resulted in the current job that I have.. I'm a finance major, worked as a computer consultant (still do) for the past 2 years and workin at freakin co-op because I couldn't find a job in the field of my studies.. went to school, met some new people who actually knew people in the industry and just so happens that they needed computer work done, and bam.. next week I was working for their company.

Never would I have gotten these contacts if I didn't go to school and network myself with people at school.. Now I have a good paying job in the field that I'm graduating in, and I have more clients for my side job..

If you don't mind answering, what "type" of "computer consulting" are you involved with?

Shaolin
01-17-2004, 02:16 AM
Just simple stuff, I've done work for people at work just doing basic troubleshooting to doing work for small businesses in pretty much migrating to different systems and setups.. having friends' parents in high places pretty much got me started..

accordboi_02
01-17-2004, 02:27 AM
Originally posted by TrevorK

It's nice that you're confident in yourself, but if you're going up for a job that is attainable by someone who might not have the same university schooling (IT is one example) you'll be in for a surprise.

I don't think so... my current job liked applicants to have a degree, but it was not necessary. I was the youngest person hired by the company into that particular position, and I beat out applicants that had at least 10 yrs work experience on me (it's a management position, not IT).

What it really boils down to is whether you have 6 yrs work exp or a degree and 2 yrs work exp, you're both most probably going to make it past the resume stage and into the interview. Then it just comes down to who can sell themselves better to the interviewer(s).

Shaolin
01-17-2004, 02:43 AM
I sort of have to agree with accordboi, because my current job I walked into the interview with no experience, and they told me i was up against a couple applicants with experience.. and I ended up getting the job. So it does hold true in a way, you may know what you're doing, but if they don't like you, then you're screwed. I think it's important to have the experience, but there's alot of socialising involved in it.. You can have someone say have 10 years of experience, but really, is that 10 years of experience really going to make THAT big of a difference compared to someone with maybe 2 years of experience? To this day I'd like to know what experience really means.. because I can say I have experience in IT working for one of the biggest tobacco manufacturing firms in Southeast Asia, but all I really did was just went into work everyday and learnt the stuff they taught me while giving my own inputs into the job.

so I don't know.. experience is important to a certain extent, but I think it boils down to proving that you can do the job, and selling yourself to bosses so they are confident you'll do the job well..