Interested a town house

[Prelude_dude]

Hi, I am currently in the market for a town house. I currently live in the NW in Panorama, and I plan to stick around here. I've recently been looking into the Prospect Ridge by Homes by AVI and Wildstone by Rockford developments.

Anybody have any insight on these builders or their developments? Or some other suggestions of places in the NW for around 300k. Thank you

Yes I have tried google, I can't seem to find anything on rockford development. Homes by Avi, there is the odd poor review running around. Homes by Avi seem to do pretty good on the J.D Power and Associates 2011 Alberta New-Home Builder Customer Satisfactory Study. Mind you I don't know how they come about these results or where this survey is from.

TIA :dunno:

[tch7]

I just bought with Avi at their other current townhouse project - the Enclave in Castle Keep / Aspen Woods. The purchasing process was painless, and now I'm just playing the waiting game for the year until it's built.

As you say, there are some poor reviews of Avi out there, but general sentiment seems to be positive. At least no better/worse than other builders in the same league.

Can't comment on any of the developments up in the Panorama area, as I didn't look around up there.

[Kloubek]

You'll get bad reviews for virtually all the "standard" builders. You might even get some for the higher end/custom builders as well. As long as you don't see mega issues around like you'll find for Cardel and Pointe of View, you're probably going to do alright.

Just make sure you remain involved in the building process. That is, however, less essential than if you were building a detatched home.

Congrats on being a future homeowner! I couldn't imagine renting anymore...

[Prelude_dude]

Awesome thanks, that is what i figured. Somebody is always never satisfied and is going to bitch online.

Any tips on remaining involved in the building process? Pretty new to this, so not even sure where to begin.

[dj_rice]

I am also in the market for a new townhouse but in Edmonton.


Just curious for those with townhouses. Can you actually hear your neighbors next door?Are the walls built that thin?I do alot of music/playing with my turntables so this might be a problem.

[sexualbanana]

Take a look at this
JD Powers Home Builder Satisfaction Survey (http://www.jdpower.com/news/pressrelease.aspx?ID=2011040)

[pho88]

If you are interested in staying in the area, the townhomes in hanson ranch are quite nice. I see mls currently has one listing in the hidden creek garden units for $325K. My friend has a unit in the hidden creek rise block, but nothing appears to be listed for those units right now. Don't know who built them, but by now you should be able to check out the condo documents to see if there are any outstanding issues.

[GreyFox]

We should keep this thread going. There's a condo thread, loft thread, urban house thread, may as well make this the official townhouse thread.

I'm also looking into the same thing, around the same budget but I'm more open to any area (not just NW for example).

When I get home I'll post a list of places I've looked at or know exist and sometimes googling "townhomes for sale in calgary" doesn't always work out and it might be helpful for others to post new projects that they are aware of.

Perhaps Jordan can chime in as well and include a listing of townhomes for sale? Not sure how easy it is for him to put up a listing like that...

[masoncgy]

I find the easiest way to search is to use the old MLS website.

http://www.theoldmls.com

That way, you can search by neighborhood easily.

The 'new' MLS site sucks. I've never adapted to it. lol

[GreyFox]

^Thanks for the link.

Alright here's a list of the places I've looked at so far and the locations. If others can add any places they know about (new builds) I'm sure more than just me would benefit.

Evanston square - Evanston
Mosaic mirage - Mckenzie towne
Mosaic lakeside - Auburn bay
Coventry station - Coventry Hills
York 29 - New Brighton
Wildstone - Panorama
Sagestone - Sagehill

[Nitron88]

To the OP, Rockford has built some solid multifamilies, however not so much during the labor crunch or even now. I also don't recommend the wildstone, it has a poor layout and subpar materials. I know someone who lives in one and it is in my mind, simply atrocious. This is from the planning to the blueprinting to the upsell.

I can recommend them in the past but not as of current.

[Civic_Drift]

Have you looked at a duplex as an option?

I think Shane Homes and Homes by Avi are building duplexes at the moment in Panorama, but I'm not sure how much they are going for. I've seen resales in Panorama hover around 300-325K though.

[masoncgy]

Originally posted by Civic_Drift
Have you looked at a duplex as an option?

I think Shane Homes and Homes by Avi are building duplexes at the moment in Panorama, but I'm not sure how much they are going for. I've seen resales in Panorama hover around 300-325K though.

I believe Avi has finished building the duplexes in Panorama now as the last showhome parade was sold off.

That said, check the resale market for one of these. They are quality builds. I know the site super who was in charge of the development and he is solid. Little to no deficiencies on the walks.

[Cos]

.

[maximus5502]

Hunter developments has a nice Townhouse project in that area called Coventry Station

[GreyFox]

Had a chance to look at a few more, I've added them to the previous list. Any thoughts or opinions if you've looked at any of these or own one yourself.

Nitron, thanks for the info. When we looked at Wildstone we thought it was one of the nicest builds that we had seen so far. We didn't do much digging around as of yet to see what type of building materials etc.. etc.. were involved, but I guess that just goes to show you that just because the show home looks awesome, doesn't mean it's built from quality materials.

Evanston square - Evanston
Mosaic mirage - Mckenzie towne
Mosaic lakeside - Auburn bay
Coventry station - Coventry Hills
York 29 - New Brighton
Wildstone - Panorama
Sagestone - Sagehill
________________(updated)
Silverado Townhomes - Silverado
Stonecorft - Copperfield
Aura - Copperfield
Zen - McKenzie Towne

[CapnCrunch]

You should check these out if you like Panorama. It's a bit north of your budget but the cost is offset by not paying any condo fees.

http://www.shanehomes.com/creations/Communities/15

[Q-TIP]

Condo Fees are not always that big of a deal when it boils right down to it. Mine include water/sewer, insurance, grounds-keeping and maintenance. With the huge rainfalls last summer the sewer in front of my house backed up at 10pm. Condo corp had it cleaned up and carpet and drywall ripped up by 1am. Basement was rebuilt with brand new carpet/drywall by the end of the week and all I had to do was make 1 phone call.

There are benefits to single family and condo, but if you are like me and spend 50% of your time out of town or like to travel a lot the condo is the way to go.

Check out some older townhouses in nice areas too. When I bought mine I looked at a bunch of new ones but the older ones were bigger and better built. I never hear my neighbor, only had one complaint from her back in the day when my roommate had his subwoofer pushed right up against his bedroom wall.

[Redlyne_mr2]

The Mosaics in Aspen are nice townhomes, they sold very quickly when they were first built but I do see a few up for sale right now.

[triplep]

These are the ones we looked at when we were purchasing:

Mosaic mirage - Mckenzie towne:
We did end up buy here, as based on the different prices etc it was the most affordable and best priced. The current 15k promotional pricing, put us in a townhome (indigio 3bed 2 bath, with upgrades) for 275k. So it wasn't bad.

Mosaic lakeside - Auburn bay:
Really liked this community, however the homes were a little more expensive then mckenzie towne. The lake is nice to have, but you do have to pay I believe close to 500$ a year for community fees. Further more, these condos are right beside the hospital. So I would think that it could maybe get very loud. Also, I was driving into cranston this morning at 630, and the overpass was backed up all the way onto deerfoot. So I can't imagine how backed up it will get once they open the hospital up.

York 29 - New Brighton:
We found these to close to the dump, so we didn't even bother looking.

Silverado Townhomes - Silverado:
These were nice, but they were priced in the same area as the mosiac ones, and you only get a single garage and 2 bedrooms +1 outside stall. It is close to the ctrain station, but in the mornings I just couldn't imagine trying to get out of the area if you worked downtown and didn't take the ctrain. Also, they are close to the CP railway lines, and I mean I hear the train horn in cranston at night, so I couldn't imagine how loud it would be where the townehomes are.

Zen - McKenzie Towne:
These were nice, but the biggest draw back was that the it was all surface parking. Which really really sucked. A garage was a must have, so we didn't end up going this way.



Also for those that suggested duplexs... I know they are typically a few thousand more expensive.. in my case ended up being 15ish k more for the duplex (with no upgrades). But what you get vs the town house is totally different. Don't forget with the duplex, you do not have a garage, you do not have landscaping, no fence. It might seem trivial, but these costs add up really quick, I can see another 15k being spent easily on a garage/landscaping/fencing. So in the end it turns out to be an extra 30k more.

[GreyFox]

Fantastic info triplep. It's funny because you've been thinking pretty much the exact same things that I have been thinking.

To be honest the Silverado and Mosaic Mirage are in the top runnings right now and I've been saying for over a month now that we're not going to find a better value than Mosaic Mirage. I had no idea about the train line in Silverado, that's good info to have.

Silverado is desirable for us because my fiancee doesn't have a car and works downtown, so it would be super nice to be that close to an existing train station. I know that there is a "proposed" future LRT line that goes down to McKenzie but that could be 5-10 years away still.

I think our biggest challenge with the Mosaic is there aren't any showhomes yet. I find it extremely difficult to judge a place when all you're looking at is a piece of paper and some cut up rugs on a wall in their info centre.

Triplep, when is your place scheduled to be completed? Or do you remember when they anticipated having a showhome ready to go for that project?

Also, I'm confused as to the whole process of using a realtor for buying a new home. I kind of understand the benefits of using one, however, I'm super confused as to how they make money on this type of deal. Do they collect a fee from the builders? If so, wouldn't using a realtor piss off the builders in some cases?

[88CRX]

I’m in a townhouse (built by Sabal Homes) and I thought it would be awesome not having to cut my own grass or shovel snow but after 3 years of paying $140-$160/month for condo fee’s I’m about done with all that waste of money. Our condo board sucks. The property management company sucks and it doesn’t appear that anyone else in the development cares.

You could put that extra $150/month towards a larger mortgage and therefore be able to afford a house or duplex.

Also I was quoted by the builder $15k to building a detached garage maybe 4 month back when I was looking at their show homes (might have gone up since then). But that $150/month should cover that $15k.

[masoncgy]

Meh, I still think a duplex is a better option than a townhome. You don't have a condo board to deal with. As well, condo fees add up over time, paying for that detached garage, landscaping, etc.

Easier resale too. Townhouses are harder to sell when the market is slow.

[CanmoreOrLess]

I would never buy anything if it had to do with a condo board. Hard enough to get four adults on a road trip to agree on where we are going for the lunch stop. The condo fees are sucked out of your account monthly, add to it property taxes and it adds up over the years. And you get nothing in return.

Maybe I am too frugal? If I can save $20 a month on "subscribe" fees like bank charges, car insurance, cable, etc I do. Today I asked my bank to remove the monthly fees we were paying on our bank account, they did so and returned the last 14 months fees back to the account (wife was to take care of this a year ago). Said I would walk if they did not make it right, did the same with auto insurance, they figured jacking the monthly fees by $16 would go unnoticed. No claims ever in over five years and this is the thanks... they reversed the attempt. This month I have shaved $130 a month off my monthly bills by making a call and asking for a reduction, $1,500 a year more in my pocket for an hours work.

Condo fees to tend badly planned complexes, no way.

[triplep]

Originally posted by GreyFox

I think our biggest challenge with the Mosaic is there aren't any showhomes yet. I find it extremely difficult to judge a place when all you're looking at is a piece of paper and some cut up rugs on a wall in their info centre.

Triplep, when is your place scheduled to be completed? Or do you remember when they anticipated having a showhome ready to go for that project?



Hey GreyFox... I don't know if you know this, but if you have visited the the auburn bay townhomes, you have already visited the mckenzie towne ones. As far as I am aware, all the floor plans are exactly the same (Cranston/Mckenzie Towne/ Auburn bay/ and the completed project in signal hill). The only difference I know is that they offer a different type of "bungalow" which is much larger, the other units are exactly the same. So if you wanted you could always go to the cranston/auburn bay ones to check out. The exteriors might be different colors etc but otherwise that is what you get.

I know that there isn't any current Ctrain line, but by the condos they are building (cove condos) right in front of them, is the last stop of the BRT that goes straight to downtown. I think it is line 302. I know it isn't perfect, but your wife could easily walk to the BRT station.

If you are looking to buy, once they have their show homes built, they will stop offering the promotional 15k for not having any show homes built yet. They did this in Cranston, and as well in Auburn bay.

Our place is supposed to be completed sometime of Summer 2012.... I was hoping end of June, or 1st week of July.... Since I am getting married last week of june, but it doesn't look like they will be done by them. They haven't even started digging our foundation.

If you want to know what we ended up paying and what options we went with send me a PM and I will be more then happy to share. So you can get an idea of the prices differences.

[88CRX]

And yes all the Mosaic townhomes are the same floor plans. Or at least all the current jobs are the same.

[tch7]

These are the townhouses I looked closely at:

Chalet by Sabal - Copperfield
Good, spacious floor plans and seemed to be solid construction. What killed it for me is that you're miles away from anything and Copperfield overall just feels cheap. I don't see it being a desirable community in the long term.

Silverado by Slokker West - Silverado
Came very close to putting in an offer here. Liked the floor plans (particularly C), and finishings/construction seemed good. Exterior appearance is pretty bland. Close to existing LRT, 3 blocks from future LRT, right beside a future Sobeys, banks, etc. Community feels a little higher end than others in the south, with more green space. The railway is down the hill and far enough away that I can't see it being an issue for this development. Big con is that road access into the city is the craps, and there's no end in sight for a SW ring road leg. The salesman tried a hard sell with me which really put me off.

The Enclave by Avi Urban - Castle Keep / Aspen Woods
Bought here based largely on location, even though there is quite a premium attached to the area. Surrounded by green space, which is then surrounded by million dollar homes. Easy access to the mountains (huge factor for me), and multiple access routes into the city, with a future LRT station a 5-10 minute walk away. Aspen Landing mall within walking distance. Not my favourite floor plans on paper, but hard to know for sure until something's built. Materials seem high quality and I like the exterior renderings.

[GreyFox]

Here's another quick question:

Do you have to pay property tax on townhomes or is that included in the condo fees?

I've been looking at duplex's now as they tend to be around the same price (without a garage though), and I figured that if you were to take that ~$170 in condo fees you're spending every month and put it towards your mortgage, that will afford you about an extra 30 grand.

Which means you would normally end up with a slightly larger place, could add on a garage and you would still have about the same monthly payments.

We were checking out the Brookfield Side-by-Side in both McKenzie (Elgin) and Auburn Bay.

Post up if you've had an experiences (good or bad) with these or if you know of any other duplex builds around town. And if somebody could answer the question about the property tax that would be great!

[Weapon_R]

Property taxes are not included in condo fees. Neither is content insurance, so you will have to pay those separately.

A duplex without condo fees often turns out to be almost the same cost. Usually a bigger home, full size yard, and only one shared wall. In my opinion with prices the way they are, a duplex makes more sense if you don't want a single family home.

[Tomaz]

Originally posted by Weapon_R
Property taxes are not included in condo fees. Neither is content insurance, so you will have to pay those separately.

A duplex without condo fees often turns out to be almost the same cost. Usually a bigger home, full size yard, and only one shared wall. In my opinion with prices the way they are, a duplex makes more sense if you don't want a single family home.

I have only heard about the Duplex units in Silverado. Anybody have some suggestions of where some others can be found? <$300k

[triplep]

mckenzie towne has under 300k duplexes, I would assume that copperfield, and the community right next to copperfield would also have <300k duplexs. Auburn bay is just over 300

[GreyFox]

Knowing that you have to pay property taxes on top of condo fees, I've pretty much eliminated all town houses from our search as of now. I knew about the contents insurance but that's only like 20 bucks a month compared to maybe 60 or so for full home insurance.

Adding property taxes (say around 150/month) to condo fees (170/month) is basically double...that's just nuts.

As far as duplex's go (Tomaz), I haven't actually visited any of these except the one's in Auburn Bay, but I'm headed there this weekend, so maybe don't quote me on the exact addresses but here's where I've heard are showhomes for duplex's:

339 Copperpond Blvd
218 Copperpond Blvd
174 Auburnbay Blvd
585 McKenzie Towne Drive
## Silverado Blvd
425 Evanston Drive NW

All of these are AROUND the 300k mark but I know most have options that are under and over depending on the square footage and options you choose. Even the ones in Auburn Bay have their base options at about 1160sqft for only 285...so pretty reasonable. Like mentioned above, this is the same price as most townhomes and you get a larger space, backyard, only 1 wall with a neighbor and don't have to worry about a condo board jacking up fees for no reason.

[triplep]

Yeah very true about the condo fees.... but I mean you also have to remember what they include vs what they don't include.

If you buy a duplex you will pay insurance, chances are depending on how expensive your property is you can easily pay 1000 a year and up.... so lets say just for the sake of saying it is 1200 a year, so thats 100 a month. That would knock down your condo fees to 50 a month plus +20 for personal insurance... so its 70 more a month.

Property taxes, would probably end up being cheaper in a townhouse as well, since you don't actually own as much land etc. and the house is probably valued lower.

Same with heating costs etc, I would assume they are cheaper in a townhome vs a duplex.

Also, with a duplex, you will have to landscape and build a garage.... that will easily set you back another 30k...

I guess for a fair comparison, you'd have to look at everything and see if the condo fees are that much more...

Also another factor at least for me was the fact that I have to do dick all for outside maintenance... don't have to mow the lawn, don't have to weed it, don't have to put up a fence, etc etc etc... as I will be pretty pressed for time (working and doing a CA) I rather spend my weekends doing what I want to do instead of having to worry about mowing the lawn etc.

Someone should do a side by side comparison...

[GreyFox]

Yeah I could try and put together a side by side comparison. If somebody could chip in and let us know how much insurance is as well as property taxes.

I was under the impression that property tax is based on the value of your home...so a 300k townhome would be taxed the same amount as a 300k duplex. Anybody know for sure?

Also, I did a quick online quote for home insurance and it came out to around 65/month. I asked around the office here and got answers ranging from 580-850...I would imagine it differs on the value of your home and the type as well but I don't think what we're looking at here is going to be 1200 a year. If somebody who actually owns and lives in a duplex/townhome right now can confirm that would really help this comparison out.

[triplep]

I guess you are right that land doesn't have anything to do with it...


city of calgary website

Property assessed value x Tax Rate = Your property tax levy.

Tax rate is just under 5.7%.....


so duplex with garage etc vs townhome, i would say maybe a 40k difference in price?

so thats 228$ extra a year for the duplex with garage

So differences:
Townhouse
Condo fee: 150
Heating?
Electricity?
Insurance: 20

House:
Property tax: 19 (this is only the difference)
Insurance: 65
Heating?
Electricity?


The other thing you would have to I guess consider if you wanted to, is the extra amount of interest you will end up paying for the length of the mortgage for the added cost of the duplex.

Also, I think a fair comparison would include a duplex with a 2 car garage? I don't know?

[ercchry]

Originally posted by triplep
mckenzie towne has under 300k duplexes, I would assume that copperfield, and the community right next to copperfield would also have &lt;300k duplexs. Auburn bay is just over 300

new brighton?

not sure if they are still building them. but in 09 they went new for ~$315 with upgrades like counters and hardwood, in 2010 assessment was just shy of $348k, this year was $328k

ones that have sold used have been around $340k

on the tipps program for tax, its $162/month on the $328k assessment

home insurance was also around the $900/year mark

also utilities were around the $250/month mark

single car garage and ~1450spft

[GreyFox]

I don't even think it's close to a 40k difference. Like mentioned a few posts above, there are duplex's avail around 1175 sqft in Auburn Bay for about 290k.

I asked the builder (Brookfield) how much for them to build a double car garage and it's about 20k. From what I understand (have yet to confirm) but it's probably even cheaper to get it done with a private company. But let's say 20k just to make the math easy.

And yeah, it's hard to compare apples to apples but let's try and get it as close as possible. Keep in mind most townhomes only have a single car garage...or a tandem one, which I would assume isn't as "valuable" as a normal double car garage.

Can you clarify how you got the difference in property tax? At a 5.7% tax rate on 300k is $17,100....where do you go from there? That's obviously not what you pay per year for property tax....

[ercchry]

Originally posted by GreyFox

Can you clarify how you got the difference in property tax? At a 5.7% tax rate on 300k is $17,100....where do you go from there? That's obviously not what you pay per year for property tax....

http://www.calgary.ca/CA/fs/Pages/Property-Tax/Tax-Bill-and-Tax-Rate-Calculation/Tax-Bill-and-Tax-Rate-Calculation.aspx

[GreyFox]

^That page didn't even provide the actual tax rate for this year though, so that doesn't really help.

Anyways, seems to just be a typo...correct me if I'm wrong but all these calculations that we're all getting is based on a tax rate of 0.57%... obviously NOT 5.7%

Also, ercchry, are you able to break down the utilities just as a rough estimate? Would help me out with my budgeting as I pay for some, but not all utilities right now, so would be nice to figure where the difference is going to be coming from.

[Graham_A_M]

For the homes I've looked at by AVI, you really cant go wrong. They have standards worlds above most other brands out there.

Everything we looked at with the home inspector was top notch. Electrical, plumbing, insulation.... it was all done very, very well. We were both quite impressed.
:thumbsup:

[ercchry]

Originally posted by GreyFox
^That page didn't even provide the actual tax rate for this year though, so that doesn't really help.

Anyways, seems to just be a typo...correct me if I'm wrong but all these calculations that we're all getting is based on a tax rate of 0.57%... obviously NOT 5.7%

Also, ercchry, are you able to break down the utilities just as a rough estimate? Would help me out with my budgeting as I pay for some, but not all utilities right now, so would be nice to figure where the difference is going to be coming from.

yeah i reread it later and couldnt find it. but i swear the last time i was looking i found all the info needed :rofl:

utilities include just the basics, water, gas, electric, recycling, garbage... couldnt tell you the breakdown since we dont pay them there anymore (our renters do) and cant find any of the old bills

didnt factor in phone, tv, internet

[triplep]

Originally posted by GreyFox
^That page didn't even provide the actual tax rate for this year though, so that doesn't really help.

Anyways, seems to just be a typo...correct me if I'm wrong but all these calculations that we're all getting is based on a tax rate of 0.57%... obviously NOT 5.7%

Also, ercchry, are you able to break down the utilities just as a rough estimate? Would help me out with my budgeting as I pay for some, but not all utilities right now, so would be nice to figure where the difference is going to be coming from.

Yeah all I know is i multiplied the difference by .0057

here is the link

http://www.calgary.ca/CA/fs/Pages/Property-Tax/Tax-Bill-and-Tax-Rate-Calculation/Current-Property-Tax-Rates.aspx

also I am not 100% sure, but typically the condo fees include waste/recycling I would assume, since the garbage is communal...

also I remember when i was looking around during september... it was just shy of 300k for an auburn place... even the smallest one? I don't know if when they advertise they include the GST etc in their prices?

I mean hell you drive around and you see starting from the low 240's but you wont' find a single unit after taxes anywhere near the 240's. I know my place was 275k after everything this included close to 9k in upgrades.. so it was around 258 before taxes and upgrades....

[Cos]

.

[GreyFox]

So I think we're getting pretty close to pulling the trigger on the side-by-side in Auburn Bay. It's either that or we found that development by Homes by Avi in Silverado called "Street Townes". Basically it's townhomes but with no condo fees. Seems like a stellar idea and really good pricing right now as well. Around 310k, includes a detached double car garage, all landscaping and fence and a deck. Interior is nice and they're throwing in granite for free right now.

We're still in a little bit of a toss up as it would really be nice to be closer to transit in Silverado AND have the double car garage. However, a duplex is going to retain it's value alot better, we get a bigger place (about 250sqft) and we feel like in 5 years or longer, Auburn Bay will be more valuable as a community. It too will eventually have a train coming through, hospital is close by at the Seton retail development should really help resale value. We're also considering looking for a person to rent out a room, and with a few thousand employees set to start working at that hospital this summer, it seems like this would be easy to do.

ANYWAYS...

Anybody care to share their experiences with buying a new home (triplep especially you since you bought with brookfield) either with or without a realtor? We're most likely going to opt for not using one. Can we ask for a reduction in the price of the home since we're not using one?

Also, any input concerning lawyers would be helpful as well. I know almost all builders offer free lawyer fees if you use theirs, but lots of people say that's still not a good idea...any huge reason why? And what does a lawyer cost anyways?

[autosm]

Off topic but Jordan just sent me some info on houses forsale in the NW. A single family in hidden Valley for 315K FYI

[stefan15]

What do you guys think about the Enclave? They are pretty strict in the way you want to go about purchasing. Basically, they want 5%, or 10% if you want 5,000 off. We shot for 10%, but then realized the bank misquoted us on an equity loan. So we'd be scraping pretty badly for that 10%. Seems kind of harsh to need so much up front for a complex that won't be done for at least another year and a bit.

Anybody good with this sort of things and can offer any advice? I'm skeptical about the overall value of the location in general. Very pricey townhomes. Ours came to 440ish for a 1400sq ft corner unit.

[tch7]

I bought at Enclave last December. Nowhere near $440k for my non-corner unit, but coming up with the 10% wasn't an issue for me, nor is it particularly unusual for preconstruction townhomes/condos.

They aren't flexible and aren't open to negotiation, but based on the rate the place has been selling, if I were them I wouldn't be flexible either. Other developments I considered have sold maybe 5 units since I bought in, whereas Enclave has sold closer to 50+.

Comps in the area, such as at Mosaic or Zen, sell for right around $300/sq. ft, and I don't think they're as nice, so your $440k for 1440 sounds about right. As you'd be buying one of the last available units, the pre-construction discount is pretty much gone.

[stefan15]

Well that does put things into perspective. Thanks.. I'll try to close the deal.