Omar's return to canada

[AndyL]

http://www.torontosun.com/2012/05/24/majority-of-canadians-oppose-khadrs-return-poll


OTTAWA - The Tories will be at odds with the majority of Canadians - and almost 70% of their supporters - when they eventually allow convicted terrorist Omar Khadr back into Canada, a new poll shows.

The Abacus Data survey into public opinion on Khadr, who pleaded guilty in 2010 to war crimes committed in Afghanistan when he was 15 years old, suggests 53% of Canadians view him as a security threat and shouldn't be allowed back into the country.

The Toronto-born Khadr, now 25, has been jailed at the U.S. military base in Guantanamo Bay, Cuba, since he was captured in battle after killing U.S. combat medic Sgt. First Class Christopher Speer with a grenade.

"This might be an issue where the law and legal requirements don't match up with public opinion," Abacus CEO David Coletto said Thursday.

Khadr signed a plea deal in 2010 that required him to serve eight years of a 40-year sentence. The Canadian government agreed at the time to look favourably on his transfer back to Canada after one year.

But just 13% of Canadians strongly support his return while 32% are strongly opposed.

"The intensity of opposition is much greater than the intensity of support," Coletto said. "You see the same trend and pattern right across the country."

And while the bulk Conservative supporters tend to be against Khadr's return, a full 46% of New Democrat voters and 41% of Liberal voters are also balking at his return.

The paperwork for Khadr's return is on Public Safety Minister Vic Toews' desk, but he has yet to set a date for his eventual transfer.

Abacus Data conducted its online survey of 1,008 randomly selected adults May 15 and 16.

Using traditional polling methods, a survey of that size would be accurate to within 3.1 percentage points, 19 times out of 20.

Omar made a deal, Canada agreed to take him back... :banghead:

What the heck are we to do with this terrorist? Him and his family aren't exactly repentant, reformed or in any way should be allowed to remain in our country...

I think we need to get back to that plan to repopulate the north, Lets have his release conditions state he needs to be restricted to baffin island, but that's almost too populated for him... Maybe Ellesmere :)

[JRSC00LUDE]

The most shocking part of that article is that 46% of New Democrat voters and 41% of Liberal voters appear to be displaying a modicum of intelligence/common sense.

Fuck that guy though and his entire family, I hope ill happenings befall them all.

[btimbit]

I'm with you guys. Not even a suspected terrorist, but a convicted and known one. Fuck this, and fuck him.

[broken_legs]

Originally posted by btimbit
I'm with you guys. Not even a suspected terrorist, but a convicted and known one. Fuck this, and fuck him.

a 15 year old kid hanging out in a village that is attacked by US forces for over 4 hours fighting for his life, throws a grenade and kills one, then gets horribly injured and captured.

Yeah definitely cut and dry terrorist.

Never mind that he was charged with "murder" and attempted murder against the "accepted rules of war" (whatever the fuck that is supposed to mean) while he was being shot at by a superior military force

According to the US -They had every right to attack him, and his village, he was a valid target - BUT - He had no right to attack the troops that were attacking him.

Definitely cut and dry. Why plead for an 8 year sentence when you can maintain that you are innocent and spend the next 40 years in jail without trial?

[FraserB]

I dont see why they brought him to trial. He should have died in Afghanistan.

[AndyL]

A 15yr old kid who's been videotaped building, planting and setting off IEDs... I guess broken legs wants him as a neighbor?

While I feel for him being brought up in that family, he shouldn't be free to walk Canadian soil. And whenever he is transferred here - he will be let out pretty much immediately, even though he is a threat...

Everyone's life would have been simpler if the marines had killed him, unfortunately how could they know how this would unfold...

[desi112]

No child deserves what he has gone through

[ZenOps]

His story sounds eerily familiar to Lawrence of Arabia, except of course that Lawrence was white - and was also quite a bit older before he mastered train rail bombing.

While his actions may have pissed off the US, he did not piss off the British half as much. And probably played no small role in his lighterhanded treatment.

I always like to change races. If a Swedish boy was defending his house, family and loved ones from a roving band of African invaders that came from 1,000 miles away - just to kill him... Would he throw the grenade too? You bet your ass he would. If he doesn't his house is gone, and family is screwed.

[broken_legs]

Originally posted by AndyL
A 15yr old kid who's been videotaped building, planting and setting off IEDs... I guess broken legs wants him as a neighbor?



Sorry... Maybe I misunderstood. Is he being charged with building IEDs? Terrorizing? Is building IEDs even a crime in Afghanistan?

Nope?

Ok. Then.


If you believe that someone defending their country against a foreign invading army is a "terrorist" and deserves to go to jail, then there's really nothing we can talk about further.

[FraserB]

Originally posted by broken_legs

If you believe that someone defending their country against a foreign invading army is a "terrorist" and deserves to go to jail, then there's really nothing we can talk about further.

Then send him back there, he can defend his country all he wants. Send the rest of his shitty family with him.

[CUG]

I fully admit that it is difficult to take a position on this issue.

[Sugarphreak]

...

[broken_legs]

Originally posted by Sugarphreak


Odd, I don't recall Canada being invaded by a foreign army
Just imagine for a second that it's possible to identify yourself with another country via
- Culture
- Family
- Language
- History
- Etc.. etc.. etc...


Anyways, my opinion on the matter is that the kid did what he did. He also was a terrorizer, in the sense that Terrorizer means fighter against a foreign army invading his homeland. To me that is a totally logical and expected behavior if someone invades your country - Whether he held a Koran or a bible, it's still the logical thing to do for someone that cares about their homeland. (Fight the invaders? Not if they say you are a terrorist!)

He's also paid a terrible price, and endured torture that no one on this board could possibly understand. So let him serve his sentence in Canada, let him get an education like other children should have, and if he's still fucked up after given the rights that are supposed to be guaranteed to him then gas him, but at least acknowledge the fact that he was only doing what any of you would do if your countries were attacked and treat him as such.

Im out.

[01RedDX]

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[googe]

Yeah based on what I've heard about this case and what his charges are, I don't see how he is anything close to a terrorist. WTF?

[max_boost]

I don't see how he is a danger. You guys make it sound like he's going to show up at some public place and just lob a bomb into the crowd. :nut: :dunno:

[Feruk]

He killed an American soldier defending his country. If that's terrorism, then every American fighting against the British in their revolution could be classified as a "terrorist." Yet they call those guys patriots.

Also, isn't he a Canadian citizen?

[CUG]

What's the agreed statement of facts here? He moved to Canada with family, went back to the ME to fight with his father, Americans storm the area he is staying in, he lobs a grenade at them?

I'm not sure Broken-Legs understands the concept of allies and the obligations thereof, but it doesn't sound like anyone has usable information around this situation, myself included. Anyone claiming to have more facts than anyone else, if you could provide good sources, not just anti-western hate blogs, please, send it along.

[Cos]

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[01RedDX]

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[CUG]

Originally posted by 01RedDX


The father's story is an interesting one as well. During the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan, he was moved by the plight of widows and children in the country. He started a charity and built orphanages, clinics and schools in Afghanistan, and was frequently at odds with the Taliban for building schools for girls. His charity was legitimate considering all the humanitarian projects he had completed. In order to do that, he had to make friends with some powerful unsavory characters in the region. He would frequently send his sons away to work and stay with tribal leaders in order to build trust, and on some occasions became angry when he learned that they put his sons in danger. In any case, there's no evidence to show that he explicitly sent his sons for terrorist training. When he was arrested in Pakistan, certain Jewish groups called for his release, noting the importance of his work in the region - that tells you something. After his release and return to Canada, he kissed the ground - again, not the sign of a hardcore terrorist. It's possible that he became more radicalized toward the end of his life, probably from seeing the effect that foreign interventions and wars had on the people. You're not even fucking with me?

[ZenOps]

The fathers story probably is more relevant to the outcome of this.

Sometimes you are stuck with what you've got. IE: If you want clean drinking water as a native in Canada, you do probably eventually end up talking someone like Rob Anders - Even if he does sleep through your request.

[finboy]

There is also evidence that the grenade which killed the us soldier was either friendly fire, or thrown by one of the other assailants in he comPound. The latter part was actually backed up by testimony from one of the American soldiers who assisted in storming the compound.

[Sugarphreak]

...

[broken_legs]

Originally posted by Sugarphreak


So if during WW2 somebody sympathized with the Germans or Japanese because they had some old family roots there, and then travelled there to fight Canada's allies, it somehow wouldn't be treason? It would be patriotism?


Fuck I can't resist this stupidity... Since when is attacking the USA treason against Canada?

And many many more im sure


In 1944 the Nazi created the Britisches Freikorps or British Free Corps which was the brainchild of John Amery a son of a British cabinet minister. This Nazi recruitment effort focused on recruiting POW’s which included three Canadians.
Edwin Barnard Martin of the Essex Scottish Regiment(Captured at Dieppe in 1942) , CPL. John Gordon Galaher, Pvt. George Hale. At a military trial on Sept 28, 1945 they were sentenced to life imprisonment.
All were given a royal pardon in 1954
(Source documents of WW 2 Court Martial Records at ottawa Federal Records Centre in Tunney’s Pasture, microfilm Lot 44, Accession 72R6)



Edit:

Interestingly enough, we could have held him in Canada and tried him for treason because he was aiding Afghani fighters who we were engaged in "Peacekeeping and Nationbuilding" operations against at the time.



(c) assists an enemy at war with Canada, or any armed forces against whom Canadian Forces are engaged in hostilities, whether or not a state of war exists between Canada and the country whose forces they are.


Just charge him with that then and stop all this nonsense already.

[Sugarphreak]

...

[broken_legs]

Originally posted by Sugarphreak


Since we are at war with the extremist Taliban sect he was assisting;



Nah bro, were not at war. Were just taking part in the "International Security Assistance Force"

So its all good.

[egmilano]

The way I look at it he knew what he was doing. He wasn't some un educated afghani kid fighting for his life. His father and what he did early in life shouldn't have an impact on this. I think we should send the family back.

[2Legit2Quit]

Welcomed back to Canada with a smile, hand shake and a beige corolla waiting for him.

[Toma]

Need top point out.... many prisoners to get out of Guantanamo signed guilty deals even though they were not guilty of the ridiculous (and often baseless) charges.

It was a desperation move by the US. Could not convict, no real evidence, so threaten to hold them indefinately, or make them sign a deal so at least they ahd a hope of getting out.

Anyway, in terms of trial alone, no one accused has been PROVEN guilty by a court of law.

780 people were kidnapped and held at Guantanamo, most were held without any charge or due process.

Many were released after many many years without charge or due process.

and many were are still stuck there without due process, or legit evidence that would stand up in modern, civilized courts.

[01RedDX]

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[Seth1968]

Originally posted by 2Legit2Quit
Welcomed back to Canada with a smile, hand shake and a beige corolla waiting for him.

This.

But I digress.

We're good folk who accommodates all sorts of violence in the name of religion.

BTW- I want that fucking oil, and I'll kill your kids to get it.