Vacation/Holiday's the first year worked

[pheoxs]

Hi everyone,

I have some questions regarding how amount of holidays works the first year around.

1. I get 10 days per year off

2. Our reference year is based April 1st to March 31st

3. I started this job in the middle of July, 2011

My boss is saying I am only eligible for 6.5 days of vacation time for 2012 because of my start date.

Is this normal or is he trying to screw me over

It seems strange to me that I would have to work just shy of 2 years to finally get my proper number of days off ...

Can someone explain how this normally happens?

Thanks

Edit: Thanks, guess its prorated

[G-ZUS]

Sounds like it gets prorated which is what the company I am at does too

[Moonracer]

Scroll down to vacations and vacations pay

http://www.employment.alberta.ca/documents/WRR/WRR-ES-PUB_esguide.pdf

[SilverGS]

Earning vacation days is what every company does. Since you started 1/4 into the reference year for this company you only had enough time to earn 3/4 the vacation. If it's the middle of July though I would have expected 7 days.

Some places are nicer and will let you take it the same year you earn it. Others you basically have to work the first year to earn that time off. I was in the negative at my company for most of the first year since I had already booked a big vacation before I even started but they knew about it ahead of time and had no issues with it.

Other companies are not so nice about it and won't let you take it until you have put in the time.

So you are getting your earned vacation. If you take no vacation days and are allowed to roll over you will have 16.5 vacation days available to you as of April 1st, 2013

[pheoxs]

Alright, thanks everyone ... that really sucks though

[Stephen81]

^ What they said.

10 days off in the ENTIRE year though?! Sign me up for some of that

[Spoons]

Originally posted by pheoxs
Hi everyone,

I have some questions regarding how amount of holidays works the first year around.

1. I get 10 days per year off

2. Our reference year is based April 1st to March 31st

3. I started this job in the middle of July, 2011

My boss is saying I am only eligible for 6.5 days of vacation time for 2012 because of my start date.

Is this normal or is he trying to screw me over (which they've tried to do in the past repeatedly at every opportunity...)

It seems strange to me that I would have to work just shy of 2 years to finally get my proper number of days off ...

Can someone explain how this normally happens?

Thanks

Common sense just isn't that common any more.

You are rated for vacation in this case on a per day basis of when you have worked there for. So you get 10 days in your first year. Since you started late, that is prorated.

Now there is roughly 252 working days in a year. Divide 10 by 252 and you get ~ 0.04. This is the amount of vacation time you get every day you work.

Lets say you started July 18th. That means there is only ~144 working days left in your work year. 0.04(144)=.......

5.76!! Or 6.

This is very rough math work, but it proved my point as the number is roughly the same.

So next year, April 1st (the new work year for you) you would get your full 10 days. Then say if you get 15 days on your second year, they would be prorated from when you actually started (most likely, but not guaranteed).

^^^Stephen, 10 days in your first year is pretty standard. That is 2 weeks vacay if taken together. Same as I got. Next year though I get 15, then 20 is where it is capped.

[Stephen81]

I think I need to move to Europe. 10 just seems so low :dunno: I get 15 now but I have to wait 10 years until it goes to 20.

[ExtraSlow]

Lots of industries in Calgary give more vacation than that.
many oil companies give 15 days to start, plus 12 flex days.

[pheoxs]

Originally posted by Spoons


Common sense just isn't that common any more.

You are rated for vacation in this case on a per day basis of when you have worked there for. So you get 10 days in your first year. Since you started late, that is prorated.

Now there is roughly 252 working days in a year. Divide 10 by 252 and you get ~ 0.04. This is the amount of vacation time you get every day you work.

Lets say you started July 18th. That means there is only ~144 working days left in your work year. 0.04(144)=.......

5.76!! Or 6.

This is very rough math work, but it proved my point as the number is roughly the same.

So next year, April 1st (the new work year for you) you would get your full 10 days. Then say if you get 15 days on your second year, they would be prorated from when you actually started (most likely, but not guaranteed).

^^^Stephen, 10 days in your first year is pretty standard. That is 2 weeks vacay if taken together. Same as I got. Next year though I get 15, then 20 is where it is capped.

I understand that, I was just confused considering I've been here a full year and just got an email saying I only can take 6.5 days off which changes my holiday plans now as I can't do 2 weeks ...

So say I quit, how does it work then? Would I receive pay for those 6.5 days? or would it be 10 counting the 6.5 from last reference year and ~3.5 accumulated since April 1st?

Also their policy is 10 days vacation until 5 years then 15 days ... basically the minimum required but I won't be here that long so I guess it doesn't affect me.

[Spoons]

Originally posted by pheoxs


I understand that, I was just confused considering I've been here a full year and just got an email saying I only can take 6.5 days off which changes my holiday plans now as I can't do 2 weeks ...

So say I quit, how does it work then? Would I receive pay for those 6.5 days? or would it be 10 counting the 6.5 from last reference year and ~3.5 accumulated since April 1st?

Also their policy is 10 days vacation until 5 years then 15 days ... basically the minimum required but I won't be here that long so I guess it doesn't affect me.

If you quit whatever vacay days you used would be taken off your last pay cheque with the balance of whatever days you had left in your work year.

Now I redact my previous comment attacking your common sense because it seems to be more complicated, did you start mid July of last year or this year? Because if it was last, you should get the full 10 days, and your boss is a dick.

He doesn't have to, he can say you have to work here a full year, but I mean it should just be prorated. So even though your full year doesn't come into effect till July of this year (if that is the case) you still should have 10 days as they would "expect" you to work April 1st to March 31st. If you quit early, then again as I stated above.

[pheoxs]

Originally posted by Spoons


If you quit whatever vacay days you used would be taken off your last pay cheque with the balance of whatever days you had left in your work year.

Now I redact my previous comment attacking your common sense because it seems to be more complicated, did you start mid July of last year or this year? Because if it was last, you should get the full 10 days, and your boss is a dick.

He doesn't have to, he can say you have to work here a full year, but I mean it should just be prorated. So even though your full year doesn't come into effect till July of this year (if that is the case) you still should have 10 days as they would "expect" you to work April 1st to March 31st. If you quit early, then again as I stated above.

Haven't taken any holidays to date, and I started July 15th, 2011 so 1 full year as of last week (give or take a couple days I think it was the 15th)

[dirtsniffer]

your holidays will have already all been banked. if you quit today they would owe you the full 6.5 from 2011 and the prorated amount from april 1-august 1. so they would owe you roughly 9 days pay.

[SilverGS]

Originally posted by pheoxs


Haven't taken any holidays to date, and I started July 15th, 2011 so 1 full year as of last week (give or take a couple days I think it was the 15th)

Technically since you have worked a full year I don't see why they can't give you the 10 days since you have earned them. 6.5 Days from last year and 3.5 days this year so far.

If he doesn't let you then it's a pretty dick move since you have earned it in time worked and doesn't even move you into the negative.

My company updates my vacation earned at the end of every month so I could have taken a day after one month if I wanted to. As stated they didn't even mind that I took 3 weeks when I had only earned 1 week and just made it up throughout the remaining of the year. I am guessing if I had quit they would have made me pay it back somehow.

[pheoxs]

Originally posted by SilverGS


Technically since you have worked a full year I don't see why they can't give you the 10 days since you have earned them. 6.5 Days from last year and 3.5 days this year so far.

If he doesn't let you then it's a pretty dick move since you have earned it in time worked and doesn't even move you into the negative.

My company updates my vacation earned at the end of every month so I could have taken a day after one month if I wanted to. As stated they didn't even mind that I took 3 weeks when I had only earned 1 week and just made it up throughout the remaining of the year. I am guessing if I had quit they would have made me pay it back somehow.

See thats what I was thinking but my boss disagrees ... thanks everyone for the help.

[sputnik]

Originally posted by pheoxs


See thats what I was thinking but my boss disagrees ... thanks everyone for the help.

The problem is that there are two ways of earning holiday time.

Some companies force you to accrue your time the year prior to taking it and some allow you to accrue the time in the same year.

You are in a company that does the former.

Which means when you leave they might owe you if you have unused time accrued. Other companies, when you leave you might owe them part of your last cheque if you have not accrued enough time to cover the amount of time you already took off.

Its not a dick move. It is just a different way of handling holiday time. If you don't like it. Get a job somwhere else.

[holden]

Sounds like what your boss is doing is legit, if that is the way your company calculates vacation time, but it is pretty unfair of him. Personally, a company that does it like that seems like it's saying it doesn't trust it's employees, therefore you have to earn all your vacation time before you can use it.

Is your company large? Maybe you can send an email to HR and see if that is really the company's vacation policy.

At the place I work at you get to use your vacation in the same period you are supposed to earn it. So if you start in the middle of the year, you can take 1/2 the vacation allotment anytime during your first 6 months. If you start on January 1, you can take 3 weeks in January if you want.

[SilverGS]

Ok I guess not really a dick move just to tow the company line but most company's I have worked for have been a little flexible with things like this and it usually is up to the boss to decide if they will allow it.

Company is not really losing anything in this case since he has earned all the time required. Seems like a technicality that they vest the time earned on a yearly basis over say monthly.

[Spoons]

I don't know everything he has said is pointed to the fact that he should be given the full 10 days. I can understand the first year her worked he only gets 6.5, but this year it should be the full 10.

I would call the labour board and see.

Sounds like your boss is a tool bag.

[WithTheLightsOn]

From what I can tell from the Alberta Employment Standards, I don't see why should matter that your company chooses to start its reference year in April. It states pretty clearly that you are entitled to two weeks (which I guess in your case means 10 days) of vacation with pay after each of the first four years of employment. So it definitely sucks you have to wait 8 months to get something you should be entitled to right now.

Link: Vacations and Vacation Pay - Employment Standards (http://www.employment.alberta.ca/SFW/1471.html)

[sputnik]

Originally posted by Spoons
I don't know everything he has said is pointed to the fact that he should be given the full 10 days. I can understand the first year her worked he only gets 6.5, but this year it should be the full 10.

I would call the labour board and see.

Sounds like your boss is a tool bag.

Why should he get a full 10 days if he hasn't yet accrued a full 10 days?

[holden]

Originally posted by Spoons
I don't know everything he has said is pointed to the fact that he should be given the full 10 days. I can understand the first year her worked he only gets 6.5, but this year it should be the full 10.

I would call the labour board and see.

Sounds like your boss is a tool bag.

Actually from what the OP has stated, sounds like he gets no vacation the first year, because he hasn't accrued anything yet. He get's 6.5 vacation days the second year because he only worked part of the first.

I think many places will just let you use vacation days in the year you earn them. So 6.5 the first year, 10 the second. If you quit halfway through the second year and you've used more than half your allotment, you have to pay it back. If you've used less than half, you get it added onto your pay.

[Mitsu3000gt]

Some companies make you earn it (Like my previous job) and other companies give it all to you right away, but if you quit, you have to pay them for any holiday you used but hadn't "earned" yet. That's how my current company works. I started here then 1 month later I took a 3 week holiday haha. If I quit tomorrow though, I'd owe them most of that back.

[pheoxs]

Hey everyone, thanks for the advice.

So (unfortunately) from the sounds of it what happens is as follows and I'm given no choice in the matter:

I worked July 15th, 2011 to April 1st, 2012 and earned 6.5 days worth of holidays that I may take between April 1st, 2012 and March 31st, 2013

By working April 1st, 2012 to March 31st, 2013 I earn 10 more days off which I cannot take until March 31st, 2013

Basically they are delaying all my earned holidays by a year rather than allowing them in the present year and working to earn them then.

Can someone confirm that if say I were to quit today I should be entitled to 6.5 days of pay from last reference year plus April 1st--> July this year so ~3.5 days meaning 10 days total?

In the event I quit (almost a certainty before new years due to other things going on...) just want to make sure that I'm not getting screwed over

Edit: Found this from someones link they posted


If employment is terminated after an employee has completed at least 12 months of employment, the employer must pay:

The unpaid vacation entitlements for the previous year; plus

Either 4 or 6 per cent of wages in the current year, depending on the length of employment

Thanks guys! (and girls)

[Spoons]

Originally posted by pheoxs
Hey everyone, thanks for the advice.

So (unfortunately) from the sounds of it what happens is as follows and I'm given no choice in the matter:

I worked July 15th, 2011 to April 1st, 2012 and earned 6.5 days worth of holidays that I may take between April 1st, 2012 and March 31st, 2013

By working April 1st, 2012 to March 31st, 2013 I earn 10 more days off which I cannot take until March 31st, 2013

Basically they are delaying all my earned holidays by a year rather than allowing them in the present year and working to earn them then.

Can someone confirm that if say I were to quit today I should be entitled to 6.5 days of pay from last reference year plus April 1st--> July this year so ~3.5 days meaning 10 days total?

In the event I quit (almost a certainty before new years due to other things going on...) that I'm not getting screwed over

Yes if that is how they are working it, and you quit today, they would have to pay you your two weeks that you give notice, PLUS the 6.5 vacation days that you earned.

Where do you work anyways? Futureshop handled their vacation days like this too, but I mean every office setting I've worked in has always given your vacation in advance.

For example me, I started January 2nd, I'm entitled 10 days in my first year, so I got the full 10 days in advance. If I quit right now, I'd have to pay back what ever I took.

[pheoxs]

Originally posted by Spoons


Yes if that is how they are working it, and you quit today, they would have to pay you your two weeks that you give notice, PLUS the 6.5 vacation days that you earned.

Where do you work anyways? Futureshop handled their vacation days like this too, but I mean every office setting I've worked in has always given your vacation in advance.

For example me, I started January 2nd, I'm entitled 10 days in my first year, so I got the full 10 days in advance. If I quit right now, I'd have to pay back what ever I took.

I'm working as a process control engineer at a chemical Plant / Start up company in Edmonton though the company is based out of Quebec. The general trend has been they do the absolute minimum required in every aspect and continuously pulled shady tactics over on contractors ... needless to say my employment is coming to an end in the near future and I'm just trying to sort things out with regards to this as well as APEGGA / time as an EIT

[CompletelyNumb]

And when you get your next offer letter, include more holiday days in your counter offer. It's not unheard of to get between 2 to 4 weeks of vacation days. I know I have.

[Mitsu3000gt]

You are definitely paid for all unused, earned, holiday if you quit. You won't be paid for the year's worth though if you quit 6 months in, for example.

Holiday is very negotiable, I've had everything from 4 weeks to 10 weeks depending on the job. 3-4 weeks is very standard, 5+ is usually for senior employees unless you work a sweet deal.

Some companies have perks for Fridays and long weekends too, which adds up. Christmas week is another one people sometimes forget.