60 day Juice Diet - Personal Fitness Thread

[Atriux]

I was a bit skeptical about posting this, but I felt in the end whatever ensured my chance at success was something that I should be taking.

There will be a lot of confused looks and much criticism, many saying it's a poor idea (as it's littered with that all over the internet), but I feel that for myself, the pros for doing it far outweights the cons.

I'm 21, 5'7 and edging towards 230lb (little of that being muscle mass). I realize that I'm grossly obese, and have tried many times to curb my bad eating habits. While some work occasionally, things tend to falter.

I understand that this isn't a long term option, it's something I'm using in the short term to 1) lose weight, and 2)consume enough vegetables and fruits to try and build a healthy eating habit for the future. I will still be going to the gym, and doing cardio, but it's an extreme plan to get my life back on track.

For people who are not aware, what the juice diet entails: No food for 60 days (today is Feb 2nd, I will be done this diet on the morning of April the 3rd). My meals will consist of fruit/vegetable juice, 3 times a day. I will probably keep just a personal journal (a google docs located here (https://docs.google.com/document/d/18pEDFZSMDDh5O3quSBomwWpICeI_lDbFQ_y8oPhUs_M/edit)) which I will update daily with my progress.

This idea stems off of a documentary created called Fat, Sick, and Nearly Dead, and while it may seem a tad ridiculous, it could be what my life needs to kick my life back onto track.

Thanks for reading.

Edit: Looking back at it (and at GQBaller's reply). This is less of a Personal Fitness Thread, and more of a place for me to keep an update on how this is going... oh well.

[GQBalla]

Even though i believe this is horrible for one, i wish you good luck on your journey. It's not about the destination its the journey getting there.

[bigbadboss101]

I have seen the documentary along with other similar programs. Me and a buddy both have vegan gf's. they did for two weeks and I did for 10 days. You do feel clear minded but for me I was feeling week a few days into the program. The cleanse would work for some but for me to consume very little protein or calories didn't fit.

[spikerS]

My buddy did this, and while he got results, he ran into some big issues with it. You really need to plan it out, and make sure you are taking a lot of supplements with it, otherwise you will be doing more harm than good, especially over 60 days. There is a reason why most cleanses are only a week long...

[kvg]

I needed to drop 25-30 pounds to be slim again. I think it was about 20lbs I lost in 2 weeks doing a variation of this diet and since I could eat less and feel full after doing this another 10lbs fell off in about a month. :thumbsup:

[revelations]

Good on you OP, changing habits is hard.

I used to be a pizza and KD kinda bachelor years ago but after going through a couple of week-long fruit and veg juice fasts - I dont have that problem anymore as my eating desires changed completely.

In fact my whole outlook on life changed.

[Atriux]

Yeah, while I understand there will be certain things missing, as someone who has 60lb to lose, it's something I'm willing to try.

[Shlade]

I'm sorry, that's fucking retarded.

You'll find once you finish the 60 days you'll lose weight but feel weak. And I can almost guarantee you will gain all that weight lost and go past your 230lb mark right now and only get worse. What do you think your body is going to do after eating a burger or piece of bread after only having liquids? It'll store ALL of that into fat because your body needs fats In a diet.


Dude, I know I sound harsh but come on.... Go to the gym, get a meal plan going... Visit some online forums about what sort of foods to eat... Getting started on a diet isn't that hard it's just sticking to it and getting rid of the mental part that "you want that burger or fries or pizza"

A diet, hitting the gym and lifting weights will far outweigh you doing a liquid diet and cardio.


Think about it, do you want to do that to yourself and after 3-4 months from now be back to square 1 and feel/look even worse?


Edit: I feel like a dick for writing it like that. No offence man you just need a good fitness buddy to get you on the right track. To show you what to eat, how to eat, what to do In the gym... I can bet my life on it that with the determination you have to lose this weight you will start seeing results in 2 weeks and be a lot more successful beyond that.

[brucebanner]

Might be harsh Shalde but I have to agree with you. OP there are lots of people on here that hit the gym regularly, maybe even a guy or two that would be willing to show you around a gym. Lots of good information here on Beyond, guys that work in the industry(warcaster etc), so there are resources here. It seems like you've reached the point mentally where you want a change and now you just need help with the how.

Definitely better ways than this man, look into a little more and come up with a better plan.

[lint]

good on you for deciding to self experiment with an idea that others may not understand. Don't let the bro-science get you down

[JRSC00LUDE]

Just make sure you aren't doing it as a form or protest or you'll just end up getting fatter.



Seriously though, I don't think these are healthy at all - you should pay close attention to nutrients etc. while doing it. I would try to listen to some of Schlade's "tough love" and maybe look at nutritional/fitness planning as an alternative or at the least, a modification to it. You could see the same benefits in 6 months instead of 60 days and learn some healthy habits along the way.

The only thing standing between health/fitness and your goals is you - conquer yourself mentally and you'll end up where you want to be man. Good luck either way. :thumbsup:

[Atriux]

I've tried changing many times in the past, like... for the last 8 years. I just get to a point where it all crashes. At the end of the day, it stems from my eating habits which eventually just deteriorate.

Even though there are some aspects of this that look really negative (and I appreciate all the advice, I really do), anything that I do would be better than what I'm going through when it comes to my weight.

If it ends up failing, I can say I've tried it and move on. If it works, then I'm a better person for it.

Note: I've been going to the gym 2-3 times a week for the last several months, it's an eating habit thing that's just spiraled out of control.

Again, I appreciate all the helpful advice, it's things that I prepared to hear, I'm just in a precarious position where I'm looking to try something new.

[Disoblige]

Atriux, do you live/work near downtown? If so, I'd love to help you on your journey on being more healthy and losing weight. I'm not a trainer, but I know a thing or two about fitness and I keep myself healthy and strong. I feel what you're saying and I truly want to help if I can.

You're 21. Don't put this off any further. It's time for some permanent real change. You might be busy with work, or school, whatever. But the point is, I can help you lose 50 pounds healthy and the proper way (yes, you need to lose 50 pounds, and keep it off). It might be hard because people usually want to do things and get results now now now. But I'll tell you that throughout the entire process, you will already feel much healthier the first week exercising and working out. The results will come; you just need to get into the HABIT of exercising and eating healthy. Once you get passed that, you will get angry when you miss workouts because you don't want to lose what you've gained.

If you're motivated, I want to help. Plus you would not be a burden to me because you'd be making me be more active than I already am. I get lazy during the holidays; I'm human too! ;)

[scboss]

I've seen many people attempt this and the biggest issue that always comes up is energy levels. I hope you don't plan on working out either because unless your taking a shipload of protein powder your not gonna recover from shit.

To be honest if your so serious you should just hire a nutritionist that way you learn how to eat within your macros. You would be suprised how much flexibility you actually have when it comes to weight loss.

Just remember in the end nothing beats hard work. There is no such thing as a permanent fix for weight loss except consistency in training/diet.

[GS430]

In my opinion, I don't think this is the best route either.

It seems like this would 'work' for an actor (example), that needed to cut weight for a one time thing. You're not going to learn proper eating, working out, and lifestyle habits by just switching to a 60 day juice diet.


Just my 2 cents, wish you the best of luck though. I'm glad you're taking initiative at least.

[Mibz]

Originally posted by lint
good on you for deciding to self experiment with an idea that others may not understand. Don't let the bro-science get you down Do you have some sources of "real" science that I can read?

[Super_Geo]

I think this is a great idea. At your current weight your BMI is around 36, so whatever you can do to get that to a healthier range is worth pursing.

Also, a benefit of going for 60 days instead of just the typical 7-20 day cleanse is that you will be sticking with it long enough to start breaking some of the ingrained bad eating habits you've accumulated over the years.

Just make sure you do plenty of research on potential deficiencies you may have and, first, see if you can find a fruit/vegetable that contains it:
http://www.whfoods.com/foodstoc.php

Or, if you can't, just buy some supplements.

Stick with it man, you should post daily weigh-ins to this thread to keep yourself motivated.

Looking forward to reading about your progress :thumbsup:

[zipdoa]

good luck with muscle retention in 2013

brb attempting mysterious 60 day juice challenge instead of following established, tested and proven method of physical improvement through maintaining a clean balanced diet and lifting heavy.

good luck though. srs.

[lint]

Originally posted by Mibz
Do you have some sources of "real" science that I can read?

watch Forks over Knives and read The China Study and come to your own conclusions.

[Mibz]

Just to be clear here, you used bro-science as a pejorative and then told me to read a non-peer-reviewed book and watch the movie based on it. I'm not saying the peer-review is the only criteria for defining good science, but it's a necessary step.

Also, The China Study is a book based on the opinion of one Doctor saying "animal protein causes high cholesterol which causes a myriad of bad things". Nowhere is it recommending a 60 day juice diet. I'm not going to argue the benefits of a well-rounded plant-based diet because that's not what we're talking about here, we're talking about 2 months of fruit and veggie juice.

Again, if you can find me a good source of scientific info on juice diets, please link it. TCS isn't relevant (contextually or scientifically) to this.

[lint]

Originally posted by Mibz
Just to be clear here, you used bro-science as a pejorative and then told me to read a non-peer-reviewed book and watch the movie based on it. I'm not saying the peer-review is the only criteria for defining good science, but it's a necessary step.

Also, The China Study is a book based on the opinion of one Doctor saying "animal protein causes high cholesterol which causes a myriad of bad things". Nowhere is it recommending a 60 day juice diet. I'm not going to argue the benefits of a well-rounded plant-based diet because that's not what we're talking about here, we're talking about 2 months of fruit and veggie juice.

Again, if you can find me a good source of scientific info on juice diets, please link it. TCS isn't relevant (contextually or scientifically) to this.

my point is that he should make his own decision on what to try with his body vs everyone else telling him what to do based on what they think.

Find a peer reviewed study that says 60 day juice diets are bad.

[zipdoa]

Originally posted by Mibz
snip

brb IT related background but formulates arguments better than most english majors.

[Mibz]

Originally posted by lint
my point is that he should make his own decision on what to try with his body vs everyone else telling him what to do based on what they think. That's fair. It's not what I got from your post, but that's not entirely your fault. No argument here.

[austic]

So isnt this just a variation of what the native chief did? maybe call it a hunger strike and score a meeting with someone while you are at it?

:dunno:

[max_boost]

This just seems insane.

1. You can start by cutting out all the crap you eat.
2. Find a sport you like to play and go nuts at it.
3. You will gradually see results over time.
4. ????
5. Profit

[JRSC00LUDE]

Originally posted by Super_Geo
.....At your current weight your BMI is around 36, so whatever you can do to get that to a healthier range....

I have problems with people fixating on a BMI number, I don't really believe in it to be honest. Or maybe I just don't understand it but I don't see how it is in any way a reliable benchmark.

My "BMI" is an obese 30.8 and I'd like to see someone call me fat because I'm not. Even on a girly day when i feel fat hahaha. If I get super active cardio wise I can drop 10 or so pounds from where I am now but If I get super active in non cardio activities I stay where I am (weight wise) but still look leaner. Point is, even at my lightest I am considered very overweight by "BMI" standards.

If I were in what they call a healthy weight, I'd likely be dying as to be at the very bottem end of "overweight" I would have to get down to a 25 or, 184 pounds. That would require my losing a minimum 43 pounds. :nut:

[Mitsu3000gt]

Did I miss something, or why not just eat properly instead of go to the extreme juice diet? I would think it would take far less will power to eat a balanced, healthy, diet than straight juice.

I used to be 40lbs overweight and one day I just said fuck it, I'm fixing this, and worked out 3 hours a day, 7 days a week, and changed my diet. I lost all the weight in 4 months and could eat basically as much as I want because my metabolism got so high. I probably could have done less work and got the same results if I knew more about fitness at the time.

I think the juice thing is a horrible idea. Just work out normally and go on a meal plan, it will be way more satisfying than juice so it should be even easier to do.

I just don't see the point of the juice at all in all of this. Whether it's juice or a balanced diet, both are extreme changes, so why not just do the one that will not only be easier on you, but better for your body? Just do that, keep working out as you are, and viola.

Best of luck to you though! The first few weeks SUCK, but then you eventually start to crave workouts.

[CapnCrunch]

Good luck man. There are many different paths to getting healthy. Everyone has opinions but everyone is different.

[Mibz]

I suppose I should also mention that I lost 35 pounds in 10 weeks just by eating better. The first month was strict. Meat was chicken or tilapia, veg was dark green, carb was small red potato, all in very small portions and eaten multiple times a day. After that, you start to appreciate ALL food and maintaining the lower weight isn't a challenge. Going out and having a salad is so godamn easy when it's got nuts and seasoned chicken. Portion control also became easier. I don't look at the leftovers on my plate and see wasted food, I see weight I'm not putting on.

This is also with a 100% sedentary lifestyle. Wake up, drive to work, sit at a desk all day, drive home, sit on the computer, sleep.

All that said, losing weight is like quitting smoking, if you aren't mentally committed, it's not going to happen. A juice diet is going to be just as ineffective as a "regular" diet if you don't have the psychological strength to follow through. If you manage to pull this off then adjusting to a clean and well-rounded diet should be a piece of cake (pun intended).

[Super_Geo]

Hey on your Google Docs blog you should post your daily weigh-ins (morning, after work, evening). I find the more I weigh myself the better I stay in line.

[403ep3]

A 60 day juice diet, to me, is more of a womans type of diet. Honestly, if you're looking to lose some weight then take some of the help some posters are willing to give you. I only weigh about 165 and I can't imagine going on an all juice diet because I don't think I'd have enough energy to stand up.

You should try it for a week and see how your body handles the lack of calories and energy. Make sure you don't over-do to the point that you faint or something. Good luck with your journey!

[InRich]

lets see pics of how fat u really are right now.
and then show us pics in april.
im curious to see how you end up...

go take some right now in the mirror with the shirt off.

[JAYMEZ]

Jesus christ , fuck no... Are you kidding me . THis would be the worse way to lose weight ... Your system would be completely fucked.. Fat or not dude.. Just start a clean and diet and doing cardio will get you results . You need to do some research first , a liquid diet is fuckin realllyyyyyyyy dumb...

[Shlade]

Originally posted by JAYMEZ
Jesus christ , fuck no... Are you kidding me . THis would be the worse way to lose weight ... Your system would be completely fucked.. Fat or not dude.. Just start a clean and diet and doing cardio will get you results . You need to do some research first , a liquid diet is fuckin realllyyyyyyyy dumb...

Thank you...

[Disoblige]

Atriux, as some have said on here already, they have already lost weight by cutting a lot of unhealthy food they are eating.

Maybe a better and more practical solution is if you post what kinds of things you would eat on a typical day. You can immediately change your diet, still eat and be full, and be content for the most part. Then in addition to a simple workout plan, you're golden. That first 15 pounds will be gone in no time.

Look in the long term. Do you want to just end up gaining that fat back, or do you want long term success? You're 21, very young. Changing how you look won't be difficult. Wait longer and it's going to be even harder. Change yourself properly now, so you don't regret it in the future.

[bigbadboss101]

Have a look at this

http://whatiwore.tumblr.com/post/42111518742/the-whole-30-challenge-review

Basically just eat whole food.

[hurrdurr]

If you're just drinking Vegetable and Fruit Juice you might as well stack some Clen, Ephedrine and Anavar for some quick fast "results" that definitely won't cause you problems in the long run.

I did Low carb and dropped 200lbs in about 1.5 years, but it was so easy to gain back because it wasn't a lifestyle change. Now I've changed my habits (clean/portioned correctly foods with lots of vegetables low starch and sugar) and it's melting off.

Get dietician and a personal trainer and you can drop 50lbs easily in 3 months.

Don't fucking drink juice for 60 days, get slim quick is a recipe for disaster.

[zipdoa]

Originally posted by hurrdurr
If you're just drinking Vegetable and Fruit Juice you might as well stack some Clen, Ephedrine and Anavar for some quick fast "results" that definitely won't cause you problems in the long run.


This. There's no getting rushed through the process. There's no secret spot fat reduction. There's no 1 weird little trick or one super simple secret to getting it done.

The process involves changing your lifestyle. That might mean spending a lot less time on the computer playing videogames.

I think this is the process a lot of people have trouble wrapping their heads around, and is also the reason people regain weight after substantial fat loss. Your lifestyle is the reason why your body is the way it is!

[scboss]

Originally posted by zipdoa


This. There's no getting rushed through the process. There's no secret spot fat reduction. There's no 1 weird little trick or one super simple secret to getting it done.

The process involves changing your lifestyle. That might mean spending a lot less time on the computer playing videogames.

I think this is the process a lot of people have trouble wrapping their heads around, and is also the reason people regain weight after substantial fat loss. Your lifestyle is the reason why your body is the way it is!

This x100
All your gonna do is lose the weight stop the diet and then go back to how you are now. This shit takes time and lifestyle change. When you realize that you will succeed.

[austic]

Originally posted by warcaster


This x100
All your gonna do is lose the weight stop the diet and then go back to how you are now. This shit takes time and lifestyle change. When you realize that you will succeed.
Do you mean these magic weight loss beans will not work?

[GTS4tw]

Originally posted by JAYMEZ
Jesus christ , fuck no... Are you kidding me . THis would be the worse way to lose weight ... Your system would be completely fucked.. Fat or not dude.. Just start a clean and diet and doing cardio will get you results . You need to do some research first , a liquid diet is fuckin realllyyyyyyyy dumb...

Yup, exactly.

[shadowz]

Originally posted by Mibz
I suppose I should also mention that I lost 35 pounds in 10 weeks just by eating better. The first month was strict. Meat was chicken or tilapia, veg was dark green, carb was small red potato, all in very small portions and eaten multiple times a day. After that, you start to appreciate ALL food and maintaining the lower weight isn't a challenge. Going out and having a salad is so godamn easy when it's got nuts and seasoned chicken. Portion control also became easier. I don't look at the leftovers on my plate and see wasted food, I see weight I'm not putting on.

This is also with a 100% sedentary lifestyle. Wake up, drive to work, sit at a desk all day, drive home, sit on the computer, sleep.

All that said, losing weight is like quitting smoking, if you aren't mentally committed, it's not going to happen. A juice diet is going to be just as ineffective as a "regular" diet if you don't have the psychological strength to follow through. If you manage to pull this off then adjusting to a clean and well-rounded diet should be a piece of cake (pun intended).

Funny thing is I asked Mibz if he was willing to do any sort of exercise also and he simply responded "No way in hell". Not a problem, it's one step at a time. It's difficult to have someone who has bad eating habits along with little to no exercise regime to be excited. Things take time step by step. I feel a 60 day juice diet would not only have some physical affects but also mental. I would go crazy not eating actual food each meal.

Give eating clean a shot for a month what wonders it will do. Ask Mibz about his meal plan that he stuck to for a couple months. He literally looked 10 years younger and it's changed his outlook for the better

[bigbadboss101]

Curious to see Mbiz' before and after :-). It would be a motivational factor for many who is looking to improve health.

[Markll7]

This diet won't work and quite honestly I would assume it's terrible for your health. What's going to happen is that you're body is going to start craving carbs and meats and then you're going to cave and binge. Even if you do go the full 60 days with only drinking... what then ? You're going to have to start eating healthy anyways so I don't get why you don't make that life style change now.

[austic]

When are people going to learn...
There is no magic "cleanse" "pill" or "crash diet"

There is no secret

Want to lose weight its painfully simple.

Eat meat and vegetables, nuts and seeds, some fruit, little starch and no sugar. Keep intake to levels that will support exercise but not body fat.

Then enjoy the results.

I went from 260lbs to 190lbs just have to change your life...

[yellowsnow]

I say go for it, but have a doctor supervise your progress.

[Super_Geo]

edit: I can't embed worth a fuck, apparently...


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gv3vEXy_EwU

Hm... interesting. Stick with it, let us know how it goes!

[403ep3]

Originally posted by Super_Geo
edit: I can't embed worth a fuck, apparently...


Gv3vEXy_EwU

Hm... interesting. Stick with it, let us know how it goes!

[Tej.S]

I don't understand how people are crazy enough to try these kind of diets. OP, I'm posting from my phone so it's irritating to write a lot. If you care to know the reasons as to why this is a very bad idea and would like to conform a proper, ENJOYABLE diet, send me a PM. I would more than happy to create a flexible diet plan for your needs, if you're interested that is lol.

[Shlade]

How's this going? Been to the hospital yet?

[roopi]

Originally posted by Shlade
How's this going? Been to the hospital yet?

I was actually thinking about this today wondering if he's still alive.

[trollolhah]

Hang in there OP

[Atriux]

Down between 13-15lb. Been going to the gym, I found doing the blog to be quite redundant as it's become more and more routine so that it'd be the same thing daily (still updating weights).

Starting weight (feb 3rd): 230,

Current weight as of this morning: ~217 (dipped into the 216s, product of fluctuation I would imagine)

Doing this has really made me reconsider what I used to put into my body on a daily basis, and while I understand that the ability to jump back into a shitty diet completely nullifies any purpose this serves, I'm actually excited to incorporate what I've gone through the last few weeks into my diet when this is done in another 5 weeks.

I have MORE energy then i used to for the most part, and I noticed that even after a workout, my appetite isn't even as bad as it used to be.

Sure I'll have an urge to eat solid (and honestly "shitty") food here and there, but it's going well so far. Going at the current pace, (about 2/3 lb a day) I'm hoping to be looking at a few pounds shy of 190 finish come April 3rd, a weight I only reached for a short period of time 1st year university

To the skeptics, and the people who are supportive, I thank every one of you, regardless of how crazy you think I am, it just goes to show that there are people who take time out of their day to think about a complete stranger.

Cheers

[Disoblige]

You've actually been on a juice only diet for almost a month?! No solid food whatsoever?

Mind you, the further you go down this, your face will look like a ghost. You'll look incredibly unhealthy, regardless of the weight loss.

[Atriux]

No solid food whatsoever. I've "slightly" broken (I don't know the exact rules to it) by eating solid vegetables that I would have juiced anyways (I figure I needed to increase my intake of fiber, as to avoid stomach issues) but aside from that, liquids only.

I found that I only need to juice twice (maybe 3 times if I'm going out with friends, where there's more temptation) a day.

1/3 serving of fruit juice in the morning, 2/3s of it during work (and lots of green tea) if it feels like a longer day I'll bring some of the Mean Green to work.

Go to the gym directly after work, get home and between then and sleep, drink 1 to 1 1/2 servings of "Mean Green" (kale, celery, green apples, cucumber, lemon, small piece of ginger) and I'm set.

I'm actually not hungry at any point throughout the day, which was something I found interesting and I quite like.

[Disoblige]

Once you reach a healthy and desirable weight, and start on a healthy diet/lifestyle (because you're going to be missing a lot of nutrients that your body needs to function once you're done this juice diet), then you might pull it off.

You've already gone a month into it, don't fuck it up or else you're disappointing yourself big time. If you're going to do it, at least just do it once, successfully, and get it over with.

I still have serious doubts about how someone could just drink veggie/fruit liquids for 3 months, but you're 1/3 there. I'd imagine it's going to get tougher.

Good luck and don't die. Seriously.

[JRSC00LUDE]

Yeah, I'm glad you're updating OP. Please continue to do so occasionally.

[lint]

Originally posted by Disoblige
Once you reach a healthy and desirable weight, and start on a healthy diet/lifestyle (because you're going to be missing a lot of nutrients that your body needs to function once you're done this juice diet), then you might pull it off.

please stop.

green leafy vegetables are among the most nutrient dense foods on the planet, especially the kale that the op is juicing.

zipdoa posted a version of this table in another thread:
http://s.doctoroz.com/sites/default/files/im_uploads/4_003_Nutrient_Density_Chart_PAGE.jpg

[Disoblige]

What's your point, lint?
http://nutritiondata.self.com/facts/vegetables-and-vegetable-products/2461/2

How much kale does he need to eat to be even close to the recommended amounts a proper diet would give?

Stop what, exactly?

[lint]

1. you're confusing nutrients (micro) with calories (macros). They aren't the same thing
2. you're confusing what the body NEEDS with what people WANT to eat

stop with the one size fits all diet advice, let the op run with his experiment, maybe do some more reading so you can understand what he's doing.

You're telling the guy he's going to look ghostly and incredibly unhealthy once he loses a bunch of excess weight and he reaches a healthy and desirable weight. Does that make any sense?

[Disoblige]

Originally posted by lint
1. you're confusing nutrients (micro) with calories (macros). They aren't the same thing
2. you're confusing what the body NEEDS with what people WANT to eat

stop with the one size fits all diet advice, let the op run with his experiment, maybe do some more reading so you can understand what he's doing.

You're telling the guy he's going to look ghostly and incredibly unhealthy once he loses a bunch of excess weight and he reaches a healthy and desirable weight. Does that make any sense?
Losing 2/3 lb a day to reach your target weight is not healthy. That's what I meant by that statement. Regarding the pale, ghosty look, I've seen this very often from those going on juice diets, or people who limit themselves to just fruits and veggies. They look very different (paler) than when they ate normally.

I'm not confusing micro and macro; he's clearly in a calorie deficit yes, but he's also on a nutrient deficit by limiting the types of foods he's eating.

I'm surprised he can even be on a juice diet, work out, and say he feels fine. He must be drinking a LOT then; he says he only juices twice a day, and 3 if he's going out.

Edit: Losing 2/3 lb a day based on this guy's diet is not healthy and unsustainable, in this particular situation.

[A790]

Originally posted by Disoblige

Losing 2/3 lb a day to reach your target weight is not healthy.
Where'd you come up with that one?

When I was at my peak during my weight loss I was losing over 1lb a day. I felt great, looked (increasingly) great, and basically everything was a positive.

The "safe weight loss amount" myth is just that, a myth. If you're 300lbs and you're losing 3lbs a day your body can probably sustain that for a little while without being "unhealthy" so long as you're getting the nutrients you need.

I don't see the issue. I also don't agree with what the OP is doing, but posting misinformation won't help anything.

[Disoblige]

I'll bite. I give up.
Someone who is 230 lb, losing 5 lb a week, for 3 months, is not sustainable with this juice diet. It is also not healthy.

That's all I'm going to say. You guys need to stop nit picking at my words, because yes, he is not getting enough certain nutrients by doing this, and yes he's losing the weight unhealthy. I'm talking about this situation.

As what I wrote in my previous post, as long as he rebounds from that after the 60 days and gets on a proper diet, he can resolve the damage he's done to his body and actually be healthy.

[lint]

Originally posted by Disoblige
Losing 2/3 lb a day to reach your target weight is not healthy. That's what I meant by that statement. Regarding the pale, ghosty look, I've seen this very often from those going on juice diets, or people who limit themselves to just fruits and veggies. They look very different (paler) than when they ate normally.

Not healthy according to...? when I did RFL, I lost 0.5lbs a day, averaged 3.5lbs a week. It's just not conventional and doesn't meet YOUR narrow definition of healthy. Not too long ago you HAD to eat 6-8 meals a day in order to lose weight, not lose muscle etc. Now, intermittent fasting has come to the forefront, works for a ton of people, and has pretty much blown up the myth of stoking the metabolic fire. You had to eat before training, now it's fasted training. Also, a juice fast isn't a master cleanse. He's not just having lemon juice and tobasco with water.


Originally posted by Disoblige
I'm not confusing micro and macro; he's clearly in a calorie deficit yes, but he's also on a nutrient deficit by limiting the types of foods he's eating.

he's on a caloric deficit, but I highly doubt he's on a nutrient deficit by skipping out on meats and dairy. Once again, I point you to nutrient density charts.


Originally posted by Disoblige
I'm surprised he can even be on a juice diet, work out, and say he feels fine. He must be drinking a LOT then; he says he only juices twice a day, and 3 if he's going out.

you'd be surprised by how much your body adapts. Again, when I was doing RFL, my calories average about 900 calories a day, I worked out, maintained strength while doing 5/3/1 and if anything my diet had less nutrients than what the OP is doing.

open up your mind

[lint]

Originally posted by Disoblige
I'll bite. I give up.
Someone who is 230 lb, losing 5 lb a week, for 3 months, is not sustainable with this juice diet. It is also not healthy.

That's all I'm going to say. You guys need to stop nit picking at my words, because yes, he is not getting enough certain nutrients by doing this, and yes he's losing the weight unhealthy. I'm talking about this situation.

As what I wrote in my previous post, as long as he rebounds from that after the 60 days and gets on a proper diet, he can resolve the damage he's done to his body and actually be healthy.

you have posted this numerous times, yet haven't backed any of it up

[Disoblige]

I don't need to tell you that only eating/drinking fruits and vegetables for a long period of time is causing you to miss out on key nutrients and can be harmful. It's fact, go look it up. I honestly don't mean to be rude, but isn't that obvious?

Isn't it obvious a number of nutrients essential for your body cannot be obtained from fruits or vegetables? And if they are, they were in very very small amounts? :dunno:

[lint]

in 5+ posts where you talk about nutrients, you haven't named a single one that the OP would be deficient it. nor have you specified what kind of damage that he's doing.

so no, it's not obvious.

[Lex350]

OP will lose the weight and then eventually gain it back because he is not learning how to eat properly. (clean, 6 times a day, balanced... etc) Diets are fads....eating right is a lifestyle.

[Disoblige]

Most notably, healthy fat and protein. I'll skip on the B12, since even though he's not taking in that vitamin, it's unlikely he'll be B12 deficient in 60 days. Although, this may vary between people.

And no, not comparing this to a master cleanse at all.

[Tej.S]

Whether you guys agree with OP or each other for that matter, you gotta stop the bashing. Everyone has their own opinions and beliefs and you're not gonna change that by pushing your own views on to them. Let OP do what he wants, if it's working, then let it be. You learn from experience, so if something unexpected does happen(knock on wood), he'll only learn from it.

Lint, you say juice isn't bad, but think about all the sugar you're putting in to your body when using vast amounts of fruits to obtain the juice. If green veggies are the most nutrient dense, how much would one be required to eat to obtain a certain micronutrient goal(according to that chart)?

[Disoblige]

Originally posted by Tej.S

Lint, you say juice isn't bad, but think about all the sugar you're putting in to your body when using vast amounts of fruits to obtain the juice. If green veggies are the most nutrient dense, how much would one be required to eat to obtain a certain micronutrient goal(according to that chart)?
That's what I asked too.

Plus I wasn't bashing OP. I basically said that if he was going to do it, then do it, stick with it and keep it up so he'll only have to do it just once, ever. Lose 40 lb on this juice diet, and keep it off. Then when he gets off the diet, go on a proper diet because this juice diet isn't a proper diet.

OP already knows the risks but to him the advantages outweighs the disadvantages. He already knows of the disadvantages, which I pointed out to him as well.

[FixedGear]

I don't think this diet is a good idea either. It's high in sugars and carbs, with absolutely no protein, which as I understand will favor muscle loss and fat storage (not fat loss).

Although OP is losing weight, I'm interested in how his percent body fat is changing.

Isn't a diet very high in protein, with essentially no carbs and no fat, best for fat loss?

[scboss]

Originally posted by lint


Not healthy according to...? when I did RFL, I lost 0.5lbs a day, averaged 3.5lbs a week. It's just not conventional and doesn't meet YOUR narrow definition of healthy. Not too long ago you HAD to eat 6-8 meals a day in order to lose weight, not lose muscle etc. Now, intermittent fasting has come to the forefront, works for a ton of people, and has pretty much blown up the myth of stoking the metabolic fire. You had to eat before training, now it's fasted training. Also, a juice fast isn't a master cleanse. He's not just having lemon juice and tobasco with water.



Yeah realistically any amount of weight loss is healthy. The only thing ive found when training someone that needs to lose alot is that once you are getting over 5lbs a week you will have alot of loose skin.

These kind of diets work but if you are an athlete and need alot more energy for training/competition you have to go off of macros.

[lint]

If you don't understand the difference between 60 days and long term I can't help you. A 60 day juice fast isn't a long term solution. It's 60 days of an extreme measure in order to kick off weight loss, change the way you look at food, how your body reacts to what you're putting into your body. The Velocity Diet is cut from the same cloth. If you can get through 30 days or 60 days of these diets, your mental state in relation to food changes.

This is going to come as a shock to most: You can get essential fatty acids from certain fruits and from green leafy vegetables, like kale. Plants also contain protein. When looking at amounts per calorie, many nutrients are higher in vegetables compared to meats. We're talking /calorie, not /g

http://www.drfuhrman.com/faq/question.aspx?sid=16&qindex=9

For some regularity as well as omega-3, the OP only needs to include a spoonfull of ground flax seed to his daily intake.

regarding b12, studies of long term vegans have not shown there to be b12 deficiency. Becoming b12 deficient over the course of 60 days is not a concern.

Yes, protein is muscle sparing. But guess what? Carbs are also muscle sparing in the absence of protein. Lyle McDonald covers this in RFL which is a protein sparing modified fast. Before using protein, carbs were used to spare muscle when fasting. And as everyone agrees, there is an abundance of carbs from the fruits in a juice fast.

Juicing in this manner allows one to increase their calorie intake from fruits and vegetables without the bulk of the indigestible fibre. It's hard to eat 3 lbs of vegetables a day, but if you juice it, you get maybe a litre of liquid? That's a pretty easy way to get enough calories, wouldn't you say? This includes getting fats and protein from plant sources. When the fast is over, the OP can add back in nuts and legumes which will give him more dense sources of fats and protein.

Once a day for my wife and I, I juice vegetables and then blend with fruit. We go through 20lbs of carrots, 4-6lbs of spinach, 2-3 heads of kale, 2-3 heads of collard greens, a couple of heads of celery, a head of bok choy, couple of bundles of parsley, a few cucumbers, a box of oranges, couple bags of apples, bags of frozen mixed berries and other misc fruits and veggies. That's for 1 week. If you tried to chew all that, you'd get lock jaw. Does your "healthy diet" include that volume of fruits and vegetables? If I was straight juicing for 3 "meals" a day, I'd be going through even more produce.

How can he have enough energy to work out? That's unpossible since we all know that you need carbs for energy when working out... wait a sec isn't he getting a bunch of sugars from the fruit he's juicing? Since his body doesn't have to expend any energy digesting anything, it can go straight to work.

The OP could start eating a "healthy diet" on Feb 3 or he can start on April 3, 30lbs lighter after doing a juice fast. How exactly is that a recipe for failure?

[FixedGear]

This guy should probably be eating about 150 grams of protein per day (that's an estimate seeing as I only know he weighs 230 lbs, and no other stats). That's a shit ton of fruit and vegetable juice. I'm also not convinced juicing removes all of this from the vegetables. You're showing nutritional data for raw foods, but do you have it for juice? I not saying you're wrong lint, but you're clearly very emotionally invested in juicing and I thought you might hav that info at hand. :rofl:

EDIT: for this guy to get enough protein from juice, assuming the juicer actually extracts all protein, would require almost 12 lbs of broccoli per day. :rofl: and, broccoli actually has the most protein per mass of any veggies on the dr. Furhrman sales website! It would actually take almost double that weight for the other two veggies listed there.

I havenothing against vegetarians, I just think the juice diet is a bad idea. Although you and your wife like it, this guy who is trying to lose fat should be eating a high protein, low fat, and low carb diet. Drinking all those sugars and little protein is a bad way to lose fat.

[Tej.S]

F*ck vegans, umad? Lol just kidding, but there's honestly no reason to be so butthurt just because people have opposing views. You say you're going through lbs of of fruits n veggies and then asked if we would be able to consume that amount(obviously no), but who the f*ck eats that much raw fruit, and why? Most of us probably eat our meals in proportions, we don't toss pounds of food/fruit in a juicer and gulp it down, what a waste(IMO). You like to juice your fruits and veggies? Great, keep doing so, we'll stick to eating our fruits and veggies raw, end of discussion.

What you said about the sugar intake is somewhat correct. If OP is consuming lots of sugar, not all of it is stored as fat. The body likes to adapt and will use any resource for fuel. This is why OP can lose weight, even if his protein and carb intake is low. Now please, stop with the back and forth arguing, jeez. Thread has officially gone to sh*t.

[lint]

I'm not on a juice diet. I juice to increase my nutrient intake.
juicing doesn't cook food
there's a difference between protein requirements for building muscle vs surviving. you don't need as much as you think you do.
it's not a fruit only juice fast. there's very little sugars in vegetable juice.

he's lost 13 lbs, has energy, is working out and has minimal hunger and cravings. he must be doing something wrong

[Disoblige]

Originally posted by lint

regarding b12, studies of long term vegans have not shown there to be b12 deficiency. Becoming b12 deficient over the course of 60 days is not a concern.

The OP could start eating a "healthy diet" on Feb 3 or he can start on April 3, 30lbs lighter after doing a juice fast. How exactly is that a recipe for failure?
Never said it was a failure. I already said for him to do the 60 days of this shit, lose the 40 lb, then go on a proper diet. You were the one quoting me first, nitpicking my words and tell me to stop just because I said he'll be missing nutrients (which he will). Btw, ground flax isn't a fruit or vegetable and it's not something he's taking now. And a LOT of people do find it tough to adjust to a juice diet; they feel weak/fatigued, hungry, and in some cases dizzy. It's been a month, and OP seems to be doing OK, so maybe it's working well for him for now.

So lay off, you basically agreeing with me anyways. :P

[FixedGear]

Originally posted by lint


he's lost 13 lbs, has energy, is working out and has minimal hunger and cravings. he must be doing something wrong

The problem is that this isnt all fat, and is probablly lots of muscle.

[lint]

Originally posted by FixedGear
The problem is that this isnt all fat, and is probablly lots of muscle.
very rarely is weight loss all fat without the help of pharmaceuticals. it isn't all muscle loss because carbs are protein sparing. the body has food for energy, why would it need to catabolize it's own tissue?

[Tej.S]

He had very minimal muscle mass to begin with, so he's gonna lose fat regardless. I know I'm against this whole juice diet BS, but it's working for him because of his weight. Personally, I prefer getting my food intake physically, but sometimes you gotta do what you gotta do. Doing this type of diet when you weigh much less and have a lower BF % would be f*cking hell. Also, if you had decent muscle mass, you would lose a lot of it since the body would be in a state where it would use anything for energy. On an end note, I just wanna say good luck OP, hopefully the excess weight that you wanna lose stays off at the end of your diet.

[Tej.S]

Originally posted by lint
the body has food for energy, why would it need to catabolize it's own tissue?

Please stop and take an anatomy and physiology class or get proper background knowledge of how the body works before stating facts like this.

[FixedGear]

Originally posted by lint

very rarely is weight loss all fat without the help of pharmaceuticals. it isn't all muscle loss because carbs are protein sparing. the body has food for energy, why would it need to catabolize it's own tissue?

Because there is a caloric deficit, which is why one is losing weight. The issue is that carbs will increase blood sugar levels and limit fat loss. If the goal is to lose fat, not just weight (muscle), you need to try to eliminate carbs while eating lots of protein (and all of this low fat). There has been known for decades.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ketogenesis
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ketosis

[Tej.S]

Lol fixed, that's a very notable common myth. You only cut out carbs once you're a low BF% or it's becoming hard to lose weight/BF with a high carb intake. Wiki isn't a very credible source, do research on conducted studies. Also, I can reassure this fact from self experience. Would it surprise you that on my current diet, my carb intake is higher than my protein intake and I've been losing weight and shedding BF%? Strong common misconception is strong.

[FixedGear]

I've got a msc and a phd and I think Wikipedia is one of the best general references that has ever existed. It's peer-reviewed and is exceptionally credible in my eyes. :dunno:

Anyways, back on topic but both RFL and Atkins diets are based on ketogenesis, really. I'm not as familiar with Atkins, but RFL certainly does have a cat 3 for overweight/obese folks. The only real diff between obese and lean folks is how much protein per pound to eat, how long to do the diet, and how many refeeds or cheats.

[lint]

Originally posted by FixedGear
Because there is a caloric deficit, which is why one is losing weight. The issue is that carbs will increase blood sugar levels and limit fat loss. If the goal is to lose fat, not just weight (muscle), you need to try to eliminate carbs while eating lots of protein (and all of this low fat). There has been known for decades.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ketogenesis
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ketosis

that's certainly one way to lose weight. high carb, low fat diets also work. keto diets typically include periods of refeeding/carb reloading in order to reset hormone levels which can be down regulated due to low carb intake, which also slows fat loss

[FixedGear]

Originally posted by lint


high carb, low fat diets also work.

Well technically any caloric diet will cause weight loss (it's an energy budget), but a low carb low fat diet would work even better as it induces fatmetabolism.

[lint]

Originally posted by FixedGear
Well technically any caloric diet will cause weight loss (it's an energy budget), but a low carb low fat diet would work even better as it induces fatmetabolism.

not every diet works for every person. even Lyle McDonald has admitted as much on his forums to address those who have tried RFL without success. and we aren't talking about optimal diet and lifestyle. we're talking about the approach that the op is taking to jump start life changes, the vehement opposition by many about why its a bad idea, supposed side effects, without really understanding the complex nature that is the human body.

[Tej.S]

Originally posted by FixedGear


Well technically any caloric diet will cause weight loss (it's an energy budget), but a low carb low fat diet would work even better as it induces fatmetabolism.

I'm sorry, I owe you an apology because you're somewhat correct. A keto diet would also be very effective if one was high in BF% and minimal muscle mass. I say that Wiki is garbage because as you mentioned, it's peer reviewed so it doesn't come straight from researchers who have done factual scientific studies. Although a lot information from wiki is usually correct, you'd be surprised at much BS is on there.

I would never recommend a low fat diet because you need fats to maintain hormone balance, more specifically your testosterone. Lint is correct with the refeed bit to regulate levels as well. I would also never recommend a keto diet to someone with a weak mindset since your main nutrition comes from a high source of protein and fats. Eventually your body would adapt to the low carbs, but getting there can be tough for many people.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but OP has lost about 13lbs in about 20 days? Here's some food for thought: My friends and I regularly go to the gym and we signed my friend's little brother(17 yrs old) up for a month. He's 5'10 and his starting weight was 215lbs. I personalized a diet plan for him which was high in carbs, moderate in protein(1g per lb of bodyweight), and moderate/high in fats(I believe he's taking in 45~g of fats). It's been eight days and he's lost 10~lbs(give or take .5). Did I mention he can eat whatever the f*ck he wants? His flexible diet, combined with a high intensity workout routine and low rate cardio(walking on an incline) 1-2 times per week yielded optimal results for him. So at the end of the day, Results > Broscience. If I wasn't chasing dentistry as a career path, I would have definitely considering become a nutritionist(or maybe even a proper PT :clap: ).

[JRSC00LUDE]

update?

[EK69]

Originally posted by JRSC00LUDE
update?
i was also wondering what happened with this :dunno:

[GS430]

OP is too busy fucking bitches and getting money because of all the weight he's lost.

:bigpimp:

[FixedGear]

I'm guessing he withered away to a bag of fat (no muscle) and died.

[Tej.S]

Originally posted by FixedGear
I'm guessing he withered away to a bag of fat (no muscle) and died.

LOL so mean.

[Super_Geo]

Originally posted by FixedGear
I'm guessing he withered away to a bag of fat (no muscle) and died.

Great input, champ :rolleyes:

[FixedGear]

well, my theory has thus far not been disproven. :rofl:

[403ep3]

Originally posted by GS430
OP is too busy fucking bitches and getting money because of all the weight he's lost.

:bigpimp:

this happened

[Tej.S]

Originally posted by 403ep3


this happened

I can confirm, I am bitches and money.

[JRSC00LUDE]

Originally posted by Tej.S


I can confirm, I am bitches and money.

So......... OP gets you and is fucking you?

Nice!

I guess. :dunno:

[Tej.S]

Not sure if srs, are you unaware JRS?