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TL911
03-05-2013, 05:17 PM
Hi Beyonders,

I will keep it short and sweet. So I am building a new house in Calgary, and already have got pre-wiring done for 1CAT5 & 1RG6.

-Need 3 Exterior Camera's
-Must be Dome Camera's
-2 will be placed on the soffit on each side of the front garage. 1 Camera will be placed on the side of the house to monitor side access
-The camera's need to be 500 series or better
-I want to be able to access and view my camera's while away on vacation using a mobile device.
-I need a hand held display screen like one that i sawe at Visions. This would be placed in the master bedroom and used to view all 3 camera's

The usage of this camera is monitor anyone trespassing or intruding on the exterior of the house.

I do have a quote from Visions around the $2500 mark but it does not included the hand held devise that they have mounted and use in their office.

I need imput on making a decision asap. and also am open to recommendations and quotes if someone knows someone that does this type of work. Feedback is highly appreciated.

Thanks,

KeepItGully
03-05-2013, 05:37 PM
You should check out memory express. They recently got into this market.

TL911
03-06-2013, 09:50 AM
Originally posted by KeepItGully
You should check out memory express. They recently got into this market.

Thanks, I will drop by there at lunch and see what i can i get.

spike98
03-06-2013, 10:43 AM
Every couple of months a thread like this pops up and it becomes a decent thread with lots of good information. I'd suggest you search as this topic has been covered in depth.

frozenrice
03-06-2013, 11:37 AM
Are you building through a builder? Does your builder have a low voltage contractor? Sometimes those companies have systems and will work with your builder in getting it installed.

EK69
03-06-2013, 11:38 AM
Only thing I can add is I noticed u said cat5 cabling
Is it actually cat5? Or cat5e? Or cat6?

http://www.networkcablingdirectory.com/articles/structured-network-cabling-id_1151.htm

sputnik
03-06-2013, 12:17 PM
Hopefully you are getting at least CAT5e or CAT6. CAT5 is pretty outdated for a new build.

As for what to get.

If you want HD quality video for an exterior (-40C to +50C) camera you will be looking at about $600-800 per camera. You can get cameras for under $200 however their max resolution will be 640x480.

I would recommend getting something that is powered via PoE and is IP based. This saves you from having to run power or coax for the cameras and you can just run CAT5e/6.

D-Link has a decent camera here.

http://www.dlink.com/ca/en/business-solutions/ip-surveillance/business-ip-cameras/dome-cameras/dcs-6511-outdoor-hd-poe-day-night-vandal-resistant-fixed-dome-camera-with-ir-led

Then just connect them to a PoE switch and call it a day.

http://www.dlink.com/ca/en/business-solutions/switching/unmanaged-switches/desktop/dgs-1008p-8-port-gigabit-poe-unmanaged-switch

Inzane
03-06-2013, 01:44 PM
I would hope when most people mention Cat5 today they are really referring to 5e.

Can you even still buy Cat'5' today? :dunno:

When we built our house in 2007 it was prewired with 5e. No home builders or wiring installers now in 2013 should be using Cat'5' at this point.

TL911
03-06-2013, 02:27 PM
Spike98 -Thanks man, i will most certainly look up old threads to find more information. This camera stuff is all Greek to me.

KeepItGully - I did drop by Memory express at lunch and they have a wide range of stuff, all pre-order for the good stuff. But the problem is that i don't know how to hook up all of the stuff.

frozenrice- -I did talk to my builder (Excel) and with the illiterate reps they have, they told me that they didn't know and didn't offer any help at all. They told me to go through Vision's.

EK69, Sputnik, and Inzane - Sorry guys i didn't specify. Under the sheet that i signed and paid for it just states "Prewire" "Prewire for 1CAT5 & 1RG6" so I’m not sure if it’s the basic CAT5 or CAT5e? i wish i knew this before, i would have made sure it would be CAT5e. :banghead:

I’m still shopping around, most guys have quoted around the $1600 mark just for parts. but these are basic camera's that don't pan/tilt/zoom.

I'm willing to pay the price as long as the product and installation is good. But not willing to pay $7000 like one company quoted me.

Vision's is offering a "WIREPATH" system with 3 dome camera's. Has anyone heard of this system? or has input on it?

EK69
03-07-2013, 01:40 AM
Again I have no clue abt the camera part lol but u can look at the wires themselves they should say on it what it is. I know no body should be using cat5 anymore but I wouldn't be surprised if a builder is caught snaking cat5 vs the others to save some bucks

Cat6 is really what Should be used
Cat5e will work for gigabit too tho (will work with ur cameras better since u have more bandwidth to work with)

VWEvo
03-07-2013, 07:39 AM
Google Front line security here in Calgary. Christian ING is awesome with camera systems that are cost effective. At the very least have him check out your home and give you a fee options. He did somework ffor me and I can definitely vouch for him.

sputnik
03-07-2013, 08:10 AM
Originally posted by TL911
EK69, Sputnik, and Inzane - Sorry guys i didn't specify. Under the sheet that i signed and paid for it just states "Prewire" "Prewire for 1CAT5 & 1RG6" so I’m not sure if it’s the basic CAT5 or CAT5e? i wish i knew this before, i would have made sure it would be CAT5e. :banghead:

I would talk to the builder. Chances are they are using CAT5e.

There is really no price difference for a price of a box of 1000 feet of CAT5e, so they should be able to accommodate you given that you want to do PoE for some of the runs.

TL911
03-07-2013, 09:42 AM
Originally posted by EK69
Again I have no clue abt the camera part lol but u can look at the wires themselves they should say on it what it is. I know no body should be using cat5 anymore but I wouldn't be surprised if a builder is caught snaking cat5 vs the others to save some bucks

Cat6 is really what Should be used
Cat5e will work for gigabit too tho (will work with ur cameras better since u have more bandwidth to work with)

Thanks EK69. I will take a drive out this weekend and have a look at the wires. I have request quotes from a lot of companies, so let's see what comes in.

TL911
03-07-2013, 10:59 AM
Thanks VWEvo, I will definately get in touch with them and find out what they have to offer as well.

sputnik - Will go to my builder and ask them on Saturday. I'm sure its CAT5e but need to be 100% sure.

Thanks guys!

eblend
03-07-2013, 01:00 PM
Originally posted by TL911
Thanks VWEvo, I will definately get in touch with them and find out what they have to offer as well.

sputnik - Will go to my builder and ask them on Saturday. I'm sure its CAT5e but need to be 100% sure.

Thanks guys!

if you have access to the house and they already run some of the wiring, just look at the outer jacket of the wire and it will say Cat5e. I don't think one can buy cat5 anymore, so its most likely cat5e

Most places nowadays also wire telephone plugs using cat5e cabling, so one can convert a telephone plug into an Ethernet plug if wanted.

TL911
03-07-2013, 01:34 PM
Originally posted by eblend


if you have access to the house and they already run some of the wiring, just look at the outer jacket of the wire and it will say Cat5e. I don't think one can buy cat5 anymore, so its most likely cat5e

Most places nowadays also wire telephone plugs using cat5e cabling, so one can convert a telephone plug into an Ethernet plug if wanted.

Thanks eblend! i will check it out for sure!

AndyL
03-07-2013, 02:05 PM
You can still get CAT5 - at least a few sparkies still use it... I was at a new home build yesterday and decided to check, what they run for me - is still plain CAT5 (but yes, more commonly seeing 6 these days).

benyl
03-07-2013, 02:22 PM
Do yourself a favor and drop the RG6 and upgrade all wiring to CAT6a (STP).

TL911
03-07-2013, 02:35 PM
benyl- sorry man, it's already been done. Vision's has already run all the wiring for the camera's alomst 2 months ago

benyl
03-07-2013, 02:51 PM
That's a shame.

I ran a bunch of RG6 in my house that will never be used. With TELUS optik, everything runs over a Cat6a cable. It was a waste of money in retrospect.

TL911
03-07-2013, 03:27 PM
Originally posted by benyl
That's a shame.

I ran a bunch of RG6 in my house that will never be used. With TELUS optik, everything runs over a Cat6a cable. It was a waste of money in retrospect.

Damn, that sucks man. I hope that the samething doesn't happen to me

EK69
03-07-2013, 04:13 PM
I didn't mean to totally derail this thread :rofl:

jaylo
03-07-2013, 04:21 PM
I'd recommend this one, I can program it for you if you need assistance (I am currently using their wireless setup for my home)

Foscam Canada
www.foscamcanada.com

for the IP camera:
$434.99
Wireless IP CameraFI8905W(12mm lens) with IR-cut filterPOE IP Camera FI8905E(6mm lens) with IR-cut filter(wired only) (http://foscamcanada.com/web/index.php?page=shop.product_details&flypage=flypage.tpl&product_id=85&category_id=30&option=com_virtuemart&Itemid=107)

to monitor over internet:
$5.99
iPhone app "Foscam Pro"

your handheld device:
$399
iPad 16GB (or free if you already have a tablet)
$5.99
iPad app "Foscam Pro"

Notes:
- camera is controllable thru the Foscam Pro app.
- You can set up the camera so when the motion sensor is triggered it will take pictures and send it to your email
- has IR filter, picture quality is excellent
- has "night vision"

TL911
03-07-2013, 05:18 PM
Originally posted by jaylo
I'd recommend this one, I can program it for you if you need assistance (I am currently using their wireless setup for my home)

Foscam Canada
www.foscamcanada.com

for the IP camera:
$434.99
Wireless IP CameraFI8905W(12mm lens) with IR-cut filterPOE IP Camera FI8905E(6mm lens) with IR-cut filter(wired only) (http://foscamcanada.com/web/index.php?page=shop.product_details&flypage=flypage.tpl&product_id=85&category_id=30&option=com_virtuemart&Itemid=107)

to monitor over internet:
$5.99
iPhone app "Foscam Pro"

your handheld device:
$399
iPad 16GB (or free if you already have a tablet)
$5.99
iPad app "Foscam Pro"

Notes:
- camera is controllable thru the Foscam Pro app.
- You can set up the camera so when the motion sensor is triggered it will take pictures and send it to your email
- has IR filter, picture quality is excellent
- has "night vision"

What's the night vision like?
after reading about camera's online, I'm going to go with a PTZ (Pan-Tilt-Zoom) camera for the side of my house and the regular dome ones for the front, unless i can find one that is good shit. I'm looking for 540-600TVL

Man, these camera's are so advanced. It's a nightmare, trying to find one that is good and fits the budget

EK69
03-07-2013, 06:25 PM
another thing i thought about, make sure the cameras you get are worth actually getting cameras..

theres been random dash cam videos posted even on this forum with the resolution so crappy that even though something can be seen, it is not enough to identify anything (like the drive by egging thread with the white lancer... you cant make out the license plate even though its on camera...)

at least in the worst case scenario it'll at least be usable for evidence or something..

:dunno:

just looked at that dlink that was posted earlier..
1.3MP resolution... i wonder what the video would look like from that
will this be recorded somewhere or just a live feed?

AndyL
03-07-2013, 06:59 PM
1.3mp / advertised 720p - not really enough to ID anything, just to see what's going on...

But a lot of that has to do with compression, I have 2 different 1.3mp cameras, one you can ID a plate on the street, the other (30' away (facing same direction, same distance from the road)) not a hope...

TL911
03-08-2013, 09:30 AM
EK69 and AndyL - Thanks for the pointers guys. I want my system setup onto a DVR or NVR.

I went into Spy City last night and talk to the two reps there. It seems like they know their shit.

She recommended going with a NVR, because its digital oppose to analog.

She has a package that has the 1.3 mp, camera's (4) and NVR for $2100 and labor being $85/hr.

She did show me a 1.3 mp Camera installed in a convince store. The picture was quite clear and you could actually make out the people walking in. The downside to this was that it was during the day and she had no imagery for night vision.

EK69 - I did see the forum for the dash cam on the Lancer and another lancer coming and egging the poor guy's car. I hope 1.3 mp doesn't have quality like that, because its going to be impossible to find out the plates or even who's driving the car.

AndyL - My main concern is someone pulling into my driveway or parking on the street (30' away) and trying to vandalize my property. If you say 30' is poor quality, maybe i should upgrade to 2 mp?

Thanks for the help guys!

AndyL
03-08-2013, 09:50 AM
Just saying there's some big differences among what appear to be identical rated sensors. Like I said - 2 cameras, both 1.3mp, one I can easily read plates, one is pretty much useless... Now, that said - it's all about resolution, I've got 2.0mp cameras - that only produce 640x480 video, and 1.3mp that'll go 1280x720; the higher resolution is always better.

You don't need a dedicated NVR/DVR - best setup now is to tie it into a PC - use a NAS storage system for DVR purposes, and allow yourself to connect to view remotely.

TL911
03-08-2013, 01:57 PM
Originally posted by AndyL
Just saying there's some big differences among what appear to be identical rated sensors. Like I said - 2 cameras, both 1.3mp, one I can easily read plates, one is pretty much useless... Now, that said - it's all about resolution, I've got 2.0mp cameras - that only produce 640x480 video, and 1.3mp that'll go 1280x720; the higher resolution is always better.

You don't need a dedicated NVR/DVR - best setup now is to tie it into a PC - use a NAS storage system for DVR purposes, and allow yourself to connect to view remotely.

Thanks man, that was really helpful. I didn't know that you can use a NAS Storage system instead of buying a dedicated NVR/DVR. That could save me some coin.

with your 1.3mp's what are the distances that allows you to see the plates? They told me that the range is 45' but it's hard to believe that a 1.3mp camera will let you read a plate 45' away. I will opt for the best resolution camera and try to go with the best without distroying my wallet.

Is there a store where you bought your Camera's from?

wtf im nameless
03-08-2013, 02:24 PM
These won't fit your original budget, but if you want good picture and reliability, check out Axis, Panasonic and ClareVision cameras. That's pretty much all I use.

TL911
03-08-2013, 02:41 PM
Originally posted by wtf im nameless
These won't fit your original budget, but if you want good picture and reliability, check out Axis, Panasonic and ClareVision cameras. That's pretty much all I use.

Thanks man, I will have a look at the camera's and how much would i be looking at if i went with one of these camera's?

wtf im nameless
03-08-2013, 04:48 PM
Originally posted by TL911


Thanks man, I will have a look at the camera's and how much would i be looking at if i went with one of these camera's?

Budget roughly 1k per outdoor heated camera (non-ptz)
2k-4k for outdoor PTZ cameras
2k for an NVR

plus install, wiring, etc.

TL911
03-08-2013, 05:25 PM
Originally posted by wtf im nameless


Budget roughly 1k per outdoor heated camera (non-ptz)
2k-4k for outdoor PTZ cameras
2k for an NVR

plus install, wiring, etc.

Wow so i would be looking at roughly 8k :eek: that's a lot of coin, but it's the best out there! I just can't find the best deal out there.

wtf im nameless
03-08-2013, 05:48 PM
Originally posted by TL911


Wow so i would be looking at roughly 8k :eek: that's a lot of coin, but it's the best out there! I just can't find the best deal out there.

Just depends what you want.

If your main concern is quality of cameras, look at something like Axis, ClareVision or Panasonic.

If your main concern is value for the dollar but still want something reasonable, look at something like ICRealtime.

If your main concern is price, go pick up a system from Costco.

That gives you a range of like $2k to $8k. Anything below that is going to be total garbage and you most likely don't need anything higher end than that.

Alterac
03-08-2013, 10:53 PM
You also dont need a heated enclosure camera for our weather.. As long as its mounted to your house, (and under the eve's) you wont have a problem.

I ran my Vivoteck FD8134V's (720p, Outdoor, Vandal resistant, PoE, etc) for a couple winters now with no problems of snow buildup, or any operating problems.

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/760250-REG/Vivotek_FD8134V_H_264_MicroSD_SDHC_Card_Compact.html


this is just my optionion and experience.. ymmv.

Although I agree, spend as much as you can to get high resolution, the 1280x800 (wxga?) that the ones i have is alright, and decent for close objects.

In order to identify anything at a distance of over 10ft, you need super pixels :D


My next cams are going to be at least 2mp

AndyL
03-09-2013, 12:00 AM
All of mine are eBay dx or foscam. There's tons of software out there to eliminate a dvr, all you need is an awake computer connected to that network (which as I mentioned before in another thread - needs to be separate from your home network - video cameras especially with motion recording, chew bandwidth...)

I'm well under a grand, but I am a tinkerer - there's always gonna be something to "play with" as my wife would say.

TL911
03-11-2013, 11:36 AM
Thanks for the knowledge guys!

Wtf is nameless - I did have a look at the costco system and will not go for something like that. I'll have a look at the ICRealtime camera's and see if i can find something that works for me.

Alterac - I will not be going with a heat enclosed Camera now that you say that we won't need one for our Winters. I'm leaning towards a 1.3mp or 2mp Camera lens and going with an IP camera and that way like AndyL was saying i can eliminate a DVR.

AndyL-I will have a look on Ebay too, and see what i can find.

There are so many camera's out there, it's mind boggling. I have friday off, so i might hop into a lot of these security stores we have around town and try to find the best package unless i can find something online sooner.

I like the idea of going with an IP camera and digital stuff. I'll keep the blog updated on things i find and that way i can possibly get feedback on if it's good or garabage.

brandon
03-13-2013, 09:14 AM
I don't have time for a huge response right now but I will come back to this.

If you want cheap and efficient then go with a edge capable camera from either IQInvision or Axis and throw Exacq Edge on there with a NAS on your network.

Edge uses onboard removable storage (SD Cards) and has the VMS software built right in there to connect and view at any time.

MSRP on Exacq edge is around $200, IQInvision 7 Series 3mp Camera is around $600 and then pick up a cheap NAS device.

TL911
03-13-2013, 12:26 PM
Originally posted by brandon
I don't have time for a huge response right now but I will come back to this.

If you want cheap and efficient then go with a edge capable camera from either IQInvision or Axis and throw Exacq Edge on there with a NAS on your network.

Edge uses onboard removable storage (SD Cards) and has the VMS software built right in there to connect and view at any time.

MSRP on Exacq edge is around $200, IQInvision 7 Series 3mp Camera is around $600 and then pick up a cheap NAS device.

Thanks Bradon, I will have a look into this as well.

Stealth22
03-21-2016, 04:50 PM
Sorry for the bump...I thought it might be better than starting a brand new thread for this.

I was doing a bit of digging into cameras last year, and it's come off the back burner once again. Hopefully it doesn't get shelved this time around, but we'll see how it goes, lol.

I'm pretty much settled on the fact that I want to use 1080p IP cameras, each one wired to a PoE switch with a desktop/server running BlueIris. OR, alternatively, wired to a PoE enabled NVR. But regardless, if I'm going to do this, its going to be all network-based.

Here's my problem.

The house is wired with CAT5e to various rooms, but not the exterior. I can do all the camera research myself, I can get a friend to help physically install them (or pay someone to do it), and once all the wires are in, I can set the whole thing up myself.

What I can't do (go ahead and laugh at me if you want) is run the CAT5e/6 to various exterior locations.

Does anyone know who I can call to get an estimate on the wiring?

Thanks!

brandon
03-21-2016, 06:40 PM
Originally posted by Stealth22
Sorry for the bump...I thought it might be better than starting a brand new thread for this.

I was doing a bit of digging into cameras last year, and it's come off the back burner once again. Hopefully it doesn't get shelved this time around, but we'll see how it goes, lol.

I'm pretty much settled on the fact that I want to use 1080p IP cameras, each one wired to a PoE switch with a desktop/server running BlueIris. OR, alternatively, wired to a PoE enabled NVR. But regardless, if I'm going to do this, its going to be all network-based.

Here's my problem.

The house is wired with CAT5e to various rooms, but not the exterior. I can do all the camera research myself, I can get a friend to help physically install them (or pay someone to do it), and once all the wires are in, I can set the whole thing up myself.

What I can't do (go ahead and laugh at me if you want) is run the CAT5e/6 to various exterior locations.

Does anyone know who I can call to get an estimate on the wiring?

Thanks!

Realistically, the cat5 that is run for data in the rooms will have an entrance point coming from the floor rather than the ceiling. Which means you're still going to have to get in the addict and start splicing/connecting wire extensions anyways. It would be easier and far more reliable if you had someone run new lines from the basement.. There is plenty of people on kijiji you could find of you search cat5 installation.

As always with life.. You get what you pay for.

Stealth22
03-22-2016, 11:36 AM
Originally posted by brandon
It would be easier and far more reliable if you had someone run new lines from the basement.
Oh, that's exactly what I plan on doing. Last year, the original vendor that wired the house didn't seem too keen on doing it, although I only talked to them over e-mail.

Looking at a couple other vendors at the moment. I don't plan on trusting a random off Kijiji though. If I do this, it's going to get done right, or not at all.

Khyron
03-22-2016, 03:36 PM
Anyone up to date on the idea Hiki cameras currently? Some are saying the 2-3 mp are better than the newer 4s. Looking at one for the entrance/front door then a wider angle to capture the driveway/front yard. I have blue iris set up and POE switches but can't commit on the bloody cameras. :P

Stealth22
03-22-2016, 04:29 PM
Originally posted by Khyron
Anyone up to date on the idea Hiki cameras currently? Some are saying the 2-3 mp are better than the newer 4s. Looking at one for the entrance/front door then a wider angle to capture the driveway/front yard. I have blue iris set up and POE switches but can't commit on the bloody cameras. :P
Link? Doing parallel research into cameras while I figure out my wiring problem. :D

Khyron
03-22-2016, 09:42 PM
http://overseas.hikvision.com/en/Products_accessries_159_i5636.html
Turret 4MP - EXIR

http://overseas.hikvision.com/en/Products_accessries_159_i3668.html
Turret 3MP - EXIR

http://overseas.hikvision.com/en/Products_accessries_209_i4921.html
Mini Dome 3MP

Problem is there's so many freaking models. Ugh..

codetrap
03-22-2016, 09:47 PM
.

Sean7
03-23-2016, 08:13 AM
Hikvision cameras seem to be to the best price/performance you can get.
The new 4mp cameras have some of the lowest Lux ratings (0.01Lux @ (F1.2, AGC ON)) I could find, which provides better night vision characteristics. Make sure you do some research on what focal length you need for your application, ex: 2.8mm, 4mm, 12mm
You can order them on aliexpress/alibaba or amazon.com for ~$160 USD and get them shipped here. They aren't as cheap as they used to be with the dollar the way it is though.

Hikvision makes some very nice PTZ cameras with auto tracking etc. but for most users, this is overkill and not needed. You will play with it for the fist week, then you won't touch it unless you're showing someone the system. They start at around $800 USD and go up to ~$2k USD each.

Just make sure you get them with English firmware as the Chinese firmware can't be updated and the Date/Menus will be in Chinese.

There are some Canadian dealers for these cameras (mostly home automation wholesalers) but the prices are quite inflated unless you know someone who has a wholesale account with them. Plus side is, you will get a genuine english firmware version with warranty in most cases.

As far as the NVR, Hikvision makes a decent one that comes with PoE for ~$300 USD. Ex: http://www.amazon.com/HIKVISION-DS-7608NI-E2-8P-Network-Recorder/dp/B00VMNRZS4/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1458741330&sr=8-1&keywords=hikvision+nvr

This will provide 8 channels of PoE with recording however, these aren't the fastest processors so I'm not sure on the limits of megapixels with these as well, you are limited to using Hikvision monitoring software and Hikvision cameras.

Most people setup a PC and run Blue Iris software to manage the cameras along with a PoE switch. This has more management options, can run almost any camera, is scalable in the future if need be and is cheap if you have an old PC laying around.
Keep in mind if you have 12MP (4x3mp cameras) of recording going all the time, with some of the analytic options running (line crossing etc.) then it can take a lot of CPU power and you need quite a good PC (Core i7+). Most people just set them to record on movement only and around 10-15fps to keep the processing requirements down.

Stealth22
03-23-2016, 10:40 AM
Originally posted by codetrap
ipcamtalk forum. Lots and lots of advice there.
Originally posted by Sean7
[snip]
Thanks for the advice, guys, that helps!!

Got a guy coming out next week to survey the house for wiring, and waiting for replies from a couple others.

IF it turns out that the wiring isn't going to be possible for whatever reason, that limits my options pretty severely. In fact, it pretty much restricts me to wireless cameras only.

I was doing some reading on IPCamTalk, and the general consensus there seems to be that wireless cameras are complete pieces of crap, and should just be avoided completely, unless you want it just for looking at from time to time, not 24/7 recording. One of the users there also said that the Foscams are mostly junk, and to stick with Dahua or Hikvision (or Axis, if you're a real baller) whenever possible.

So I'm still going to run the CAT6 lines if I can, but if I can't, then is Powerline ethernet an option? Do those things even work outside?

And the other thing about the Hikvision cameras...how do you tell if the seller you're buying it from (particularly from Amazon) is giving you the 'real' North American version, or just a Chinese version with hacked firmware?

Aartech.ca seems to be a pretty reputable Canadian dealer for the Hikvision cameras, but like you said, Sean7, their prices are a tad inflated. I think a 3MP 1080p Hikvision from them was like $239 CAD.


EDIT: Are these Swann cameras from Costco any good?

http://www.costco.ca/Swann%E2%84%A2---1080p-2-Pack-HD-NVR-IP-Bullet-Cameras.product.100148894.html

The_Penguin
03-23-2016, 11:29 AM
Originally posted by Stealth22



EDIT: Are these Swann cameras from Costco any good?

http://www.costco.ca/Swann%E2%84%A2---1080p-2-Pack-HD-NVR-IP-Bullet-Cameras.product.100148894.html

I think those are re-branded Hikvision 2032s, same as the Memory Express Trendnet for $179.
Great cameras, but can be had cheaper from China, or some U.S. sellers

I got 3 from Nelly's in the U.S. and the rest direct from China (Ali express) for around $80.00 U.S.

Re chinese with hacked firmware, I have a bunch. No problem with them at all, You just have to be careful flashing firmware on them I.E. don't do it. But have never seen any compelling reason to need to upgrade them anyway.

Stealth22
03-23-2016, 01:08 PM
Originally posted by The_Penguin
I think those are re-branded Hikvision 2032s, same as the Memory Express Trendnet for $179.
Great cameras, but can be had cheaper from China, or some U.S. sellers

I got 3 from Nelly's in the U.S. and the rest direct from China (Ali express) for around $80.00 U.S.

Re chinese with hacked firmware, I have a bunch. No problem with them at all, You just have to be careful flashing firmware on them I.E. don't do it. But have never seen any compelling reason to need to upgrade them anyway.
That's what I figured...at least, they look like re-branded Hikvisions. The Costco ones are only 2MP though, which sucks. The thing I like about Costco is if anything goes wrong, they'll take the item back and give you a refund, no questions asked.

The Mem Ex one isn't a bad deal either, too bad they are out of stock.

I looked into Nelly's as well. The prices aren't too bad, and shipping is only $45 USD for 8 cameras. Even after the currency exchange and shipping, they're cheaper than Aartech.ca. And if you sign up at IPCamTalk, they offer a one-time 5% discount, which pretty much negates the shipping cost.

The only thing I'd be worried about is brokerage fees, because they ship by UPS. What was your experience with shipping from Nelly's?

Looks like the PoE cameras will be the easy part, lol. I just need to wait and see if I'll even be able to pull more CAT6 lines to the outside of my house. :(

The_Penguin
03-23-2016, 02:59 PM
I have heard you can mess the firmware of the Swanns and increase the resolution, but I'd just go with Hiks.
Nelly's was very co-operative. I emailed (Sean Nelson is who I dealt with) and asked, and they shipped US Postal for $35.00 This was back in July 2013.

Crazyjoker77
03-23-2016, 03:54 PM
Why all the hate for 2mp? That is 1920x1080 which I'm sure 90% of people are recording at. 3mp is 2048x1536 and generally the lower cameras have better night time/low light performance and less lag.

I picked up a LaView system on black friday from the states. It just rebranded Hikvision hardware with their own firmware. I wasn't initialy planning on using the DVR (rebranded hikvision 7608 w/8 poe)but after playing around with it I was sold that it was a good solution.

I've been extremely happy with it. I've got 6 3mp PoE bullet cams that I have set up to record 24/7 @1080. It can be viewed from any web browser, the phone app, or via HDMI out to a TV. I've got motion detection on just so it flags the timeline to make it easier to find events. I then have masks set about 1ft around windows and doors that will send me a email alert.

Stealth22
03-23-2016, 04:14 PM
Originally posted by Crazyjoker77
Why all the hate for 2mp? That is 1920x1080 which I'm sure 90% of people are recording at. 3mp is 2048x1536 and generally the lower cameras have better night time/low light performance and less lag.
No hate...I just assumed the 3MP may have a better sensor to record with at 1080p, which may have been an incorrect assumption.

If you don't mind me asking, how do you know that the lower cams have better performance? I'm completely new to IP cams, lol, so I'm still learning. :nut:

And good to hear about Nelly's customer service. I'll probably end up buying Hikvision cams from them, if the wiring pans out. I may try the Swanns too, actually. I don't plan to record at higher than 1920x1080...like I said, I just (incorrectly?) assumed the sensor in the 3MP was better.

Here's another dumb question...what are the pros and cons of building/using a PC with BlueIris for recording VS buying a Hikvision NVR from Nelly's? It looks like they've got one for ~$300 USD, which is cheaper than a PC. (As I'm typing this, I remembered Sean7 posted about that...so I guess the answer is a PC would be faster, plus you're not tied to Hikvision cams or Hikvision software?)

bobafixed
03-23-2016, 04:24 PM
I've just started my research on IP cameras and Hikvision has caught my attention.

The only thing I can't seem to find, are Hikvision cameras with builtin microphones. Does anyone have any experience with POE cameras with builtin mics?

The_Penguin
03-23-2016, 05:40 PM
Originally posted by Stealth22

No hate...I just assumed the 3MP may have a better sensor to record with at 1080p, which may have been an incorrect assumption.


Here's another dumb question...what are the pros and cons of building/using a PC with BlueIris for recording VS buying a Hikvision NVR from Nelly's? It looks like they've got one for ~$300 USD, which is cheaper than a PC. (As I'm typing this, I remembered Sean7 posted about that...so I guess the answer is a PC would be faster, plus you're not tied to Hikvision cams or Hikvision software?)

I love BlueIris. I have it running on my main i7 desktop which also does Sickbeard, Plex, and a few other tasks. I don't notice any probem running motion detection on 7 cameras at 720p 10fps. Even while editing photos in Lightroom/Photoshop
Occasionally I'll stop BlueIris if I need to recode a video or something.

I find 720p adequate for most needs. and 10fps seems like a decent tradeoff for performance.

It's also very flexible for configuration, different cameras, different settings, several profiles that can be scheduled. Motion detection zones, alerts, emails etc. I have no experience with the PVRs, but I bet they're not nearly as configurable.
Plus BlueIris supports a Metric shitload of camera models, up to 64 on one license if you have the horsepower.
I have a bunch of Hik 2032s, a few of the surprisingly good $25.00 Top-201s and even a Microsoft USB lifecam in the Den to spy on the dogs when we're out.

The plus side of a PVR, it's plug and play, set and forget, and I think they do POE as well.

codetrap
03-23-2016, 05:41 PM
.

The_Penguin
03-23-2016, 07:50 PM
Originally posted by Khyron
[

Problem is there's so many freaking models. Ugh..

I think the Turrets have an advantage over the bullets for night IR in that the light source is more offset from the lens so you don't get as many false motion events from bugs/dust particles reflecting right back into the lens.

I've heard that the domes can have some IR fogging, though some say it's not a big issue.

I don't think megapixels really matter, as 1080p should be the upper limit for motion detection/recording before you really start using CPU power and disk space. I believe the reason some people say lower megapixels are better, is the image is a bit cleaner, less noise, but again as long as you're capturing enough detail, it's not a photo contest :)

soupey
03-23-2016, 08:31 PM
LaView is garbage, the main DVR units for them crap out over time, or start having time sync problems.

https://www.amazon.ca/Security-Included-Recorder-Weatherproof-Outdoor/dp/B00TZWE140/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1458786547&sr=8-2&keywords=annke+security+camera

i picked this up off amazon for a cheaper PoE option that has really good image quality. set it up in my business. if you really want a live feed with it thats handheld u might be better off getting a tablet and connecting to the video system as needed. otherwise it has HDMI/VGA outputs for a monitor that you'd have to wire up. outside of that you'd just need a large hard drive to keep the footage stored.

Stealth22
03-24-2016, 10:52 AM
Originally posted by bobafixed
I've just started my research on IP cameras and Hikvision has caught my attention.

The only thing I can't seem to find, are Hikvision cameras with builtin microphones. Does anyone have any experience with POE cameras with builtin mics? I think you'll be hard pressed to find a decent camera with a mic in this price point...I could be wrong though. I thought I remember reading that some Hikvision cams have a sound input for an external mic, but I'm not sure. May have been something else.


Originally posted by The_Penguin
The plus side of a PVR, it's plug and play, set and forget, and I think they do POE as well. Yeah, some do, some don't. But I like the flexibility of BlueIris, plus you're not bound to only one brand of camera.

Building a new PC is going to be near $1000 though...I'll probably re-purpose my old one, or see if I can find a refurb model cheap somewhere.


Originally posted by codetrap
As for the wireless, you still have to get power to them. PoE is just another way to do it with a hardwired network connection. I would have gone PoE personally but I didn't want to have to drop more cash for some injectors or a PoE switch. I may one day, but not today.

The camera's I have are rebranded hikvision for sure, the interface is identical. Ok, good to know. If buying Hikvision cams from the States is going to be a sizeable difference in price, I might try a set of the Costco ones first. And yeah, wireless cams still need power, hence my preference to just feed one single CAT6 that can do both power and data.

Too bad Costco doesn't sell re-branded Hikvision dome cams. I like those cause they're vandal proof...or at least, more vandal resistant than a bullet cam. A bullet cam can be easily swivelled around with a stick. The dome cameras are a little more discreet (although not by much), and you can't turn them.

Sean7
03-26-2016, 01:45 AM
Originally posted by bobafixed
I've just started my research on IP cameras and Hikvision has caught my attention.

The only thing I can't seem to find, are Hikvision cameras with builtin microphones. Does anyone have any experience with POE cameras with builtin mics?

The Hikvision domes and mini-domes are available with a sound option (S) option at the end of the model number. These include an audio input/output and an alarm trigger IO I believe but for the domes you will have to wire in a microphone.

As far as I know the only ones that come with a built in microphone are the mini domes 2CD25x2 series but I can't confirm this until mine come in.

On a side note, it looks like Blue Iris supports hardware decoding on Intel CPUs with Quick Sync. So just look for a CPU with Quick Sync and it should bring down your CPU usage. There is talk that the developer is working on Nvidia hardware support, if that happens you won't need much of a CPU at all, just a video card so we will see.

Stealth22
03-29-2016, 11:25 AM
Just an update...looks like the wiring isn't going to be an issue. There's a cost, but its not terrible.

So I've been looking at the Hikvision models, and trying to decide where each camera should go, and what lens size to pick. Nelly's staff have been pretty helpful, and their prices are decent, even after the exchange rate.

I definitely plan to have them ship by someone other than UPS though. FedEx also charges brokerage fees, right? Is USPS going to be the way to go?

J.M.
03-29-2016, 11:40 AM
USPS will be the best way to go, you'll probably get charged tax but it shouldn't be a crazy amount.

Stealth22
03-29-2016, 07:27 PM
Anyone know if these cameras are rebranded Hikvision units?

http://www.costco.ca/Swann-3MP-Fixed-Lens-Dome-Camera---2-pack.product.100235617.html

These are cheaper than the ones from Nelly's in the States. But I can't tell if these would be compatible with BlueIris or not. I don't want to use an NVR, but there's no model number for me to Google. :(

Costco takes anything back no questions asked though...might be worth buying a pack and trying them out. Thoughts?

The_Penguin
03-29-2016, 09:16 PM
Originally posted by Stealth22
Anyone know if these cameras are rebranded Hikvision units?

http://www.costco.ca/Swann-3MP-Fixed-Lens-Dome-Camera---2-pack.product.100235617.html

These are cheaper than the ones from Nelly's in the States. But I can't tell if these would be compatible with BlueIris or not. I don't want to use an NVR, but there's no model number for me to Google.

A 3 year old post in a forum on Cam-it claims they're Hikvision, and can actually be flashed with Hikvision firmware, though I wouldn't risk it.
Same Costco number, though no guarantee that they wouldn't have change suppliers/models since then

Stealth22
03-29-2016, 10:29 PM
Originally posted by The_Penguin
A 3 year old post in a forum on Cam-it claims they're Hikvision, and can actually be flashed with Hikvision firmware, though I wouldn't risk it.
Same Costco number, though no guarantee that they wouldn't have change suppliers/models since then
Got a link? I remember finding one for bullets, but not for domes.

94CoRd
03-30-2016, 11:18 AM
Originally posted by The_Penguin


A 3 year old post in a forum on Cam-it claims they're Hikvision, and can actually be flashed with Hikvision firmware, though I wouldn't risk it.
Same Costco number, though no guarantee that they wouldn't have change suppliers/models since then

In the description; This camera can only be used in combination with Swann’s 3MP Network Video Recorders for cutting-edge IP surveillance in HD.

As long as a camera is IP - shouldn't it work with any type of nvr?

The_Penguin
03-30-2016, 05:23 PM
Originally posted by Stealth22

Got a link? I remember finding one for bullets, but not for domes.

Yep, you're right, it was bullets, but the Costco product number was the same as the ones you linked if I remember correctly.